tonyg3nwl Posted December 21, 2011 Share Posted December 21, 2011 Hi, my van is just out of warranty, (october) and a damp test has shown up an apparent water leak somewhere around the offside lounge window. This has been happening for a week or so and water dribbles down from the sill down the wall to floor level where there is slight evidence of rust on the staples holding the wall panel at the bottom. I cannot find the entry point at present but as the van was parked at a slight sideways lean towards the offside, all the recent rain drains down off the roof and over the window. I thought at first it was getting in through the rubber seal at the top of the window and running down inside the the window, but I can't find any dampness at or around the top of the window, and only see the slight pooling of water on the window sill before it spills over and down the wall. I have temporarily sealed along the top and down the window sides with Gaffa tape externally to see if that will stop it, but this morning i found another wet patch again collected on the sill. In frustration, I have now arranged for it to go in to Webbs fo tracing and hopefully fixing the leak, and it is likely that the window will have to be removed and resealed, Unless they can find a different entry point higher up. I can't find any signs of damp anywhere above window level with my cheapo damp tester,..I'm hoping they may have a better one. At present I carry out a daily check to mop up what little seems to be getting in, and have put the van on levelling blocks to throw water off the roof from a different point. Has anyone any helpful suggestions?? tonyg3nwl Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Tracker Posted December 21, 2011 Share Posted December 21, 2011 Presumably the leak existed whilst the van was in warranty and maybe if you speak to the supplying dealer and to Swift they might be prepared to help you - after all it would be very good PR for them. Are you sure that it is not a faulty or damaged rubber seal, and that the window catches are properly adjusted holding it tightly closed? It could be argued that an item as expensive as a motorhome with a design life of many years should not fail in this way and there might be an issue with goods not being of merchantable quality but that is road I would not want to explore until all else fails. Personally I would not build up my hopes but it has to be worth a shot surely? Stable door and all that - but if anyone has a van nearing the end of it's warranty period now might be as good a time as any to get it thoroughly checked out? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bob b Posted December 21, 2011 Share Posted December 21, 2011 As water can 'travel' from the point of entry, I'd check windows & vents, ect away from where you think its entering. It may be that the water is travelling along wiring or cladding behind the interior panel before appearing inside. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dshague Posted December 21, 2011 Share Posted December 21, 2011 put your problem on here swift seem to help .http://www.swift-talk.co.uk/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derek Uzzell Posted December 21, 2011 Share Posted December 21, 2011 Assuming that the water is leaking through the window-to-bodywork joint, I suggest you've got two choices:- 1. The 'craftsman' approach that (as you mentioned originally) would be to remove the window and reseal it. 2. The DIY approach comprising meticulously cleaning the join/gap (all round the window) between window and bodywork, carefully masking each side of the join/gap and then using a product like Fernox LS-X to produce a tidy seal. Worked for me with my Herald that had a similar problem to yours. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian Kirby Posted December 21, 2011 Share Posted December 21, 2011 Tony Sorry to hear of your problem. I assume you bought from Todds? If so, the first logical step is to return the van to them, as you have arranged to do. If you did not buy from Todds, I would suggest you notify the supplier about the leak, advising them you are taking the van to Todds for evaluation. The seller is liable, whatever the warranty says. I would suggest you try to get a cover over the van until it goes to Todds as you need to reduce any damage as far as you can. This is not just for cosmetic reasons but because, if you do have to resort to legal measures, you need to show that you have done everything you can to mitigate the resulting damage. Since the van is only just out of warranty, and since 3 years is a relatively short water ingress warranty (many now offer 5/6 years), it should be that the dealer and the manufacturer together will adopt a constructive attitude, and share the cost of repair between them. That is where I think I would start with Todds. There is a large joint between the roof proper and the overcab fairing, right above the centre of the O/S side window. Leakage from there seems at least one candidate. Lets hope not! The only other logical candidate that I can see seems to be the head section of the (presumably) top-hinged side window. This sits above the rubber window surround, and is usually of extruded aluminium, screwed to the side of the van. There will be a concealed timber head section above the window opening, behind the (presumably) aluminium sheet side wall. The window head section is usually screwed through the side wall sheet into this timber, and will have a sealant backing, or possibly a neoprene or similar sealing gasket. These sections tend to stand proud of the side wall, forming a small ledge, so trapping a fillet of water in the angle between the side wall, and the top of the head section. Poor sealing at this point, exacerbated by daily and seasonal thermal movement, and vibration while travelling, seem the most probable source of ingress. If a small gap has opened it will almost "suck" the water in, due to capillary attraction. If this is all that has happened removal of the window, and all traces of the old sealant, and replacement with new sealant and re-fixing of the window should be all that is required. It will then need a bit of gentle heat, or dehumidification, inside the van to dry the area out as quickly, but gently, as possible. It may be desirable to remove the whole of the rubber inner window surround, re-fixing the catches direct to the underlying timber, to aid drying. Then, when all is properly dry, maybe in spring, refit the rubber surround. Hope this helps. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derek Uzzell Posted December 22, 2011 Share Posted December 22, 2011 Brian Kirby - 2011-12-21 7:13 PM ...I assume you bought from Todds? For "Todds", read "Webbs"? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tonyg3nwl Posted December 22, 2011 Author Share Posted December 22, 2011 Hi everyone. Thanks for the responses. to Brian, the van was purchased via Webbs at Warminster, and is booked back in to them for the earliest appointment possible bearing in mind Xmas break. It goes in on 6th Jan. re suggestions regarding Swift, unfortunately the van was on of the last Autocruise builds, so I don't think Swift come into the warranty picture. In a call to Webbs, the workshop manager sounded very optimistic without stating a firm promise of a warranty repair, but I felt that it was a favourable hint. Regarding a cover, I have made numerous phone calls looking for someone who has a stock item, without success..again XMAS closedown hasn't helped. I can't find anyone with any stock of the right size The van requires a cover including bike rack of 21 ft 6 length (on x250 peugeot base) regarding the suggestion that the cab/main body roof join might be suspect, I, too think that might be a possibility as the join is directly above where the water first appeared, but there is no evidence via the damp test meter showing on the inside of any lockers. It remains a possibility however. As mentioned originally, I have attempted to seal around the window externally with Gaffa tape which might help, but am reluctant to start stripping out the inside fittings to gain access to window removal myself, preferring to leave it to professional repairers. Whilst I am not totally thick, I might be accused of causing more damage and making it worse. I will report back in due course when /if it is finally solved.. Thanks again for the various comments. tonyg3nwl Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keithl Posted December 22, 2011 Share Posted December 22, 2011 Tony, Could you ask Webbs if they can store it inside until they are able to start the repairs? As their workshops will probably be closed for the extended break they may be able to accommodate you. Worth a try? Keith. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Peter James Posted December 22, 2011 Share Posted December 22, 2011 can you dissolve a little washable (water based) ink to colour a canful of water and pour it over to see where the leak is coming in? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian Kirby Posted December 22, 2011 Share Posted December 22, 2011 Yep, apologies, Webbs it was! I had just been looking at a pic of a similar year van on Todds website to get some idea of what we were talking about. Daft! :-) Have you tried proper builders' merchants Tony? One of those cheap reinforced blue polythene jobs would do it, or even two, if you can't get one large enough. Join with gaffer tape. Some of the merchants sell (or at least used to sell) 1000 gauge polythene sheet on a roll. Often used for damp proof membranes beneath concrete slabs. Not too costly. Agricultural suppliers for polythene tunnel enclosures? The polythene covers degrade, and get ripped by winds, so have to be replaced. We're not talking long term storage here, just keeping it reasonably dry for a couple of weeks to mitigate any further damage, and to give a chance for it to begin drying out. Rolls of gaffer tape and a few lengths of strong cord to hold it all down. You may have to push Webbs "tears button", over their responsibility for what they sold you. Under consumer legislation they remain responsible, but with diminishing liability, for six years so, depending on what is wrong and how complex the repair may be, they should either say forget it if they are really nice, or absorb a portion of the cost if they consider the total repair is outside the "forget it" cost bracket! From what you said about Autocruise/Swift, do I assume there would have been no come back on Swift in any case, or did Swift agree to underwrite Autocruise's warranty liabilities when they took them over? If the latter, they could earn themselves a bit of goodwill by contributing. Webbs should be pushed to involve them if it gets expensive. In effect, it should be a part of the liability they took on. Three years is a pretty measly water ingress warranty in any case. I could keep a van dry for three years just using plasticine! :-) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nightrider Posted December 22, 2011 Share Posted December 22, 2011 There are two types of tracer dye that you can buy, Florozine which is green in colour bought from a good plumbers or builders supply company for tracing leaks on broken drains, or you can buy a tracer dye that I use to prevent overspray when spraying fertilizer or weed killer, add just a tiny drop to water in a small spray bottle and that will show where water is penetrating, it is blue in colour and water soluble, the blue colour goes away shortly after, have used it myself on a van, very good too Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
graham Posted December 22, 2011 Share Posted December 22, 2011 Swift do seem to be taking a very tolerant approach to problems of this sort. However I believe this only applies to vans produced by the Swift group. My understanding at the time of the take over was that they would accept no responsibility for warranty on pre Swift Autocruise vans. Webbs have a good reputation and I expect they will help. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jhorsf Posted December 22, 2011 Share Posted December 22, 2011 Another quality Swift product Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian Kirby Posted December 22, 2011 Share Posted December 22, 2011 jhorsf - 2011-12-22 6:54 PM Another quality Swift product But it wasn't. It was a pre-takeover Autocruise, so Swift aren't implicated in the fault. However, it was produced so close to the takeover, and their three year water ingress warranty is so laughably mean, I would argue they have a moral obligation to assist with the repair. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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