Fiat Engine Power booster

[spartan3956]

Ive seen advertised an Electronic box which connects between the ECU and injectors which alters the fueling. claims to give 25BHP more. Has anyone fitted one and are they any good.

[Clive]

A colleague has had a box of tricks fitted from about 1 day old to his Murvi Morello. It certainly reduces the amount of gear changing required and increases the top crusing speed to well above the legal limit in the UK. Many companies offer these black boxes. for example Toph Technik in the UK (Email : info@toph.co.uk) list Fiat and Hymer amongst their portfolio. The most well known is probably Van Acken. Of the people I know who have these boxes they all remove it before taking the vehicle to the dealer for servicing!. I hope they have informed their insurance companies. One additional word of caution. If you make the vehicle go better then think about the handling, transmission and brakes as well. A few years back I had a Land Rover Disco "breathed on". But I ended up also fitting some stiff anti-roll bars back and front and a military clutch as a brand new standard clutch would slip under the increased torque. If you want to maintain your "Green" credentials then you should not go down this route because new vehicles are made to tight emission standards. The MOT test standards are a lot lower to cater for older vehicles. These engine boosters do put in more fuel to get more power out and consequently are unlikely to pass the original emission requirements applicable to the vehicle when new. The emissions will be closer to that for the MOT. But nothing like the emissions from the A380 Airbus! It does improve the fun! Food for thought? Good luck

[Don Madge]

After having the Van AAken smart Box (http://tinyurl.com/dvala) fitted to my Timberland in April 2005 I decided to do a fuel consumption check on a 4200 mile trip around the Iberian Peninsula. We normally cruise at about 90/100 KPH (usually the van is fully loaded 3300kgs) and with the cruise control set we found that we did not have to change down for the hills which we would have expected to have change down on before the box was fitted. I tried to keep an accurate check when refueling, It's difficult at times when you are trying to fill the tank right to the brim. The 4200 miles on the continent returned the following:- Overall 33.08 MPG Best 36.25 MPG Worse 27.73 MPG On a previous trip to France (1400 mile) before the Smart box was fitted our overall MPG was 30.34. I must point out the smartbox was fitted for convenience rather than fuel economy. We have got to the stage in life now where we don't charge about anymore, well not often anyway, we also practice defensive driving. We have both found that our reactions are not what they used to be. I have been driving world wide since 1952 and Maureen since 1967. We consider the smart box money well spent. We use the van a lot (41,200miles in three years) mainly on the continent. I spoke to my insurers before the work went ahead and they were quite happy. Safe travelling Don

[jointerjohn]

I had aTorqtech box fitted at one of the summer 05 shows peugot 2.0ltr hdi elddis 400 There was quite a good all round improvement i covered about 4000 mls same benefits more power less gear changing probably better fuel economy, never really made any serious comparisons, traded it in december 05 for a auto trail 2.8ltr, now trying to sell it any one interested.jointerjohn@hotmail.co.uk

[Derek Uzzell]

Not wholly relevant to the UK market, but the April 2006 issue of the French magazine "Camping-Car" published two articles on upping the power of motorcaravan engines. The main piece related to vehicle-specific work by a specialist named Bruno Fochesato, involving plugging in a lap-top computer to the engine management system and adjusting individual settings. The company Fochesato Electronics was said to have received the blessing of the vehicle manufacturers involved and, as a consequence, a motorhome owner's insurance would not be affected. (I think the logic of this is that the technique employed doesn't so much 'boost' the power of a motor but fine tunes each motor's settings so that it performs at its optimum level.) Because this is 'hands-on' work rather than 'bolt-on' it's not cheap. Three prices were quoted - 920, 1190 or 1375 euros - depending on the model of vehicle involved. An independent before-and-after ISO 9001-conformant test was carried out on a McLouis Yearling fitted with a Fiat JTD 2.8 127bhp motor. Overall power increased by 38bhp (127 to 165) and torque by 76Nm (300 to 376). The 0 to 100km/h time fell by 4.2 seconds and there were significant reductions in the 'single gear' acceleration figures (eg. 30-60km/h (3rd gear) -17%, 60-100km/h (4th) -21%, 80-110km/h (4th) -24%, 60-100km/h (5th) -29%). Fuel consumption fell as follows: Motorway driving (average speed 110km/h) -10.86% Main-road driving (average speed 70km/h) -5.85% Town driving (average speed 20km/h) -14.22% Average overall reduction -10.53% The second article referred to a "Power System" 'black box' that simply plugged into a motor's existing wiring. The data indicated that claimed BHP and torque gains were slightly inferior to those achieved by the Fochesato method, but the price (460 to 760 euros according to application) was significantly less. No independent testing was done, but the amended settings produced by the Power System module were said to remain within the vehicle manufacturers' allowable tolerances.

[colin]

The power boosters I have seen give there own garantee, but I can't help but think if your engine goes wrong then both sides will just blame each other and you will be out of pocket. As for insurance, for a 2.8 this would be based on 127bhp which is the book figure a 38bhp increase would I think be viewed as tuning by insurance company so I would get it noted on insurance.

[Mel B]

I wonder how long these tuned engines last? It would be interesting to see if after a good few years they wore out much sooner due to their being used nearly to their maximum level. As for our van, it's a 2.3 JTD low profile and it goes like the proverbial sh*t of a sh*vel!!! I have to keep reminding my husband that he's not in a sports car, there's no way I'd let him have it tuned or tweaked!!!

[spartan]

Thanks for all your informative replies. I was somewhat sceptical with regard to the units but ive come to the conclusion that they are worth the extra BHP but better still the torque developed. I intend to tow a large motorcycle on a trailer and want the added advantage of having a bit more power especially when encountering hills. I think you have to be sensible with these units and service the engine regularly and not to drive at excessive speeds. Mind you towing will reduce that anyway abiding to the reduced speed limits. Thanks again for your input i have no intention of anyone messing with the ecu unit, i will go with the extra fuelling these units do. If it doesnt work well i can always disconnect it. Pete

[spartan]

I have been informed by a well respected engine technician that these units are ok and dont harm the engines in anyway he has used them in the past. So im off to get one and will report back with my findings. Thanks for the input and sources. Pete

[RonB]

Spartan If your Fiat has a 2.8 engine, and has the normal gear ratio set up, have you considered fitting Fiats 'short fifth' gear cog instead of the standard one? This replaces Fiats notoriously high fifth gear to sit approx midway between the existing forth and fifth gears. Its fitted to my vehicle and makes a lot of difference, overcoming all of Fiats lack of power in top, without any down side. Its increasingly being fitted by motorhome manufacturers including all Burstners down to 4000kg I believe. Its also Fiat warranted so overcomes all the notes of caution usually associated with 'improvements'. Its a simple job (no engine dismantling) and overall cost should be under £300, parts and labour.

[spartan]

Thats a new one on me, I do find the 5th gear a bit tall to retain at speeds near 40 to 45 and my vacum cruise control has a tendancy to drop out when climbing steep hills. showing the engine hasn`t enough torque to pull in that gear. It never faulters in 4th or higher speeds. It does appear that 5th is lower than a 1 to 1 ratio Ill try the power booster first which shouldnt affect the MPG as much as reducing the gear ratio. Many thanks for your information. Peter

[Don Madge]

[QUOTE]RonB - 2006-06-04 10:00 PM Spartan If your Fiat has a 2.8 engine, and has the normal gear ratio set up, have you considered fitting Fiats 'short fifth' gear cog instead of the standard one? This replaces Fiats notoriously high fifth gear to sit approx midway between the existing forth and fifth gears. Its fitted to my vehicle and makes a lot of difference, overcoming all of Fiats lack of power in top, without any down side. Its increasingly being fitted by motorhome manufacturers including all Burstners down to 4000kg I believe. Its also Fiat warranted so overcomes all the notes of caution usually associated with 'improvements'. Its a simple job (no engine dismantling) and overall cost should be under £300, parts and labour.[/QUOTE] Ron, There has been many observations on the Fiat lower 5th. There was a thread on the old forum (I don't know how to find it) and I think it came to the conclusion that the ideal 5th woul be half between the two. I have a pal in Germany who has the lower 5th and he is not happy doing a long trip on the autobahn with it, noise I think. I'm usually doing 50ish when I go into 5th gear. With the Van Aaken smart box I can hold 90/95ks up hill and down dale. Don

[RonB]

Spartan/Don A great deal will depend on the weight being pulled of course and the vehicles profile. Our previous Burstner 747 also had the short fifth and, due to its weight and a front end like a barn door, the modification was a great improvement. On the other hand something like a panel van will not benifit so much because the Fiat high top is not such a problem in the first place. We presently cruise around the 60mpg mark pulling 4000kg and have not noticed any increased noise to speak off - the increase in revs is only around 500 difference at any given speed in top so will not have much noise effect until your really trying to burst a gut. I have also found that the fuel consumption is almost identical on a before and after basis, no doubt because one no longer has to rev 4th gear to destruction to be able to hold on to 5th.

[Mel B]

I seem to recall that you should never contemplate using 5th gear below 50 mph as, if memory serves me well, it could be part of the reason why so many of them fail - ie using them prematurely. Similarly when reducing speed, don't let it labour, change down.

[spartan]

Your probably very near the mark. I do check on the rev counter to see what the engine is doing and change down to 4th before excessive load on the engine. My cruise control kicks out as the engine vaccum depleats. I think the early 5th gears failed due to a lubrication design fault in the gearbox after running in 5th gear for long periods. It was basically starved of oil. Pete

[Don Madge]

[QUOTE]spartan - 2006-06-08 11:03 PM Your probably very near the mark. I do check on the rev counter to see what the engine is doing and change down to 4th before excessive load on the engine. My cruise control kicks out as the engine vaccum depleats. I think the early 5th gears failed due to a lubrication design fault in the gearbox after running in 5th gear for long periods. It was basically starved of oil. Pete [/QUOTE] Pete, I think the dreaded "Fiat Fifth" was was sorted before the latest Ducato model came onto the market. Don

[enrico]

After running 4 different franchise garages for over 20 years I can tell you that if you upgrade your engine through either the ECU or an upgrade chip and the vehicle is still under warranty your warranty will be invalidated.The manufacturers can now tell through their own technology whether anything has been added in the past via the ECU.Don`t forget it is a computer and they are wondrous things,they tell you allsorts.You have been warned!! :'(

[spartan]

Thanks for the warning Looks like i will have to wait 6 months then or forego the warranty Pete

[enrico]

Pete (spartan) Very wise move.Once your vehicle is out of warranty and provided it is set up correctly it will not damage either your engine or gearbox but get your emissions checked as they may exceed the MOT standards.This is one reason why the manufacturers don`t "soup" up the engines in the first place.Also check your brakes and suspension can carry the extra torque.It should be ok if your only lifting it up 25bhp.I also advise you to then get it serviced by a reputable independent garage as they are much cheaper.Provided you get your service book stamped and keep the invoices, when you come to part exchange it you will NOT lose any value even though the garages tell you otherwise.Believe me this is correct. ps.Don`t forget to tell your insurance company.This will cost you a little extra,however you`ll have made the saving on the servicing.This should pay for it,hopefully. Good luck and let me know how you get on along with anyone else who is or has done this. :-) :-)

[spartan]

Enrico, Im quite sure the brakes and suspension are up to the task and the emissions will be standard for the MOT test as the unit wont be functional. in fact it wont be on the vehicle. I will tell the insurance as the loss would be too great to consider if you give them a get out clause. Not disrepect to you ,as for the servicing im fortunate as a qualified mechanical engineer and never allow any mechanic how ever good they proport to be touch my beloved vehicle. My evidence that due to a broken finger and a deceased clutch i was forced to go to a garage. one spigot bearing one U/s speedo cable later, i repaired it myself properly. They are on the time clock and im not . plus i hate paying vat on every dab of grease they use. I will report my findings good or bad. Pete

[javorb]

i sell tuning units mostly on ebay check my ebay shop and my feedback look under ebay shop name `diesel tuning units` my username is javorb31101966 i can give you reassurance that these units do not cause any abnormal wear on your engine cheers john

[javorb]

your warranty should not be invalidated as a tuning unit only remaps the fuelling and does not go outwith your fuel pump limits ,it only changes your top speed possibly by 2-3mph due to the torque ,unless you are driving your caravanette like a f1 car you will not cause any excessive engine wear /brakes etc ,you obviously dont understand how a tuning unit works even with your 20 years experience ,there are also a lot of main dealers offering hp increases to their car/vans/motorhomes ,so they would not offer hp increases and not cover warranties

[enrico]

Javorb One of the garages that I ran did "soup" up their engines to increase power on a lot of Rover 75 diesels as they where sluggish.When the manufacturer found out about it (he did this by reading an ECU) all the vehicles that had been souped up had their warranties invalidated! This was a very costly exercise indeed so your comment about other dealers doing it holds no water whatsoever.I can assure you I understand it far more than you obviously do and I wouldn`t want anyone to fall into the same trap. Whilst I appreciate you may have a living to make do not sell these items onto any unsuspecting people UNLESS of course you put it in writing on your company letter headed paper that in the event of your warranty being invalidated due to one of these items being added to the ECU then you will cover the remaining period of the warranty as if it was a manufacturers warranty. I warn everyone to beware! I was caught,don`t be as foolish as I was.