Guest 1footinthegrave Posted April 19, 2012 Share Posted April 19, 2012 Yes I know, maybe it should be in chatterbox, but......................................... Two things have got me thinking today, and how these are linked to be of concern / interest to many of us, let me explain. I have a friend who is currently roaming round southern France, keeping me up to speed by email on his travels. One thing he mentioned today is his astonishment at finding new height barriers springing up in France, something that in the UK personally drives me nuts. To hear that this appears to be happening more and more in France is to me at least very depressing news. No doubt some will be equally depressed about the ongoing saga with the Abu Qatada bloke who has an army to protect his human rights, and now is likely to sue the government for wrongful arrest, so here's the point. I know of and have met quite a few wheelchair users of Motorhomes, that are denied access to more and more parking areas due to the use of height barriers. It would be interesting if law abiding citizens would get the same weight of attention as Abu if they were to attempt to bring about a case under the EHRC as quite clearly the use of height barriers effectively discriminates against their "rights" to park where able bodied people can. Of course this is not just limited to M/homes, many adapted vehicles for wheelchair users do not fit under height barriers either. So what do others think, do you think there would be a case to answer, and if so is anyone up for it. ;-) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest pelmetman Posted April 19, 2012 Share Posted April 19, 2012 Unless those wheelchair users are murdering terrorists ;-)................then I doubt our honorable legal profession will be interested :D....................as there's no money in it *-) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
malc d Posted April 19, 2012 Share Posted April 19, 2012 1footinthegrave - 2012-04-19 9:52 PM .............. as quite clearly the use of height barriers effectively discriminates against their "rights" to park where able bodied people can. Of course this is not just limited to M/homes, many adapted vehicles for wheelchair users do not fit under height barriers either. So what do others think, do you think there would be a case to answer, and if so is anyone up for it. ;-) I reckon that there's no case to answer. Height barriers discriminate against the height of vehicles, not the people in them. Able bodied people can't park their motorhomes there either, so where is the discrimination ? If a disabled person turns up in a car they can get in, same as everyone else. :-| Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest ChrisB Posted April 19, 2012 Share Posted April 19, 2012 malc d - 2012-04-19 10:10 PM I reckon that there's no case to answer. Height barriers discriminate against the height of vehicles, not the people in them. Able bodied people can't park their motorhomes there either, so where is the discrimination ? If a disabled person turns up in a car they can get in, same as everyone else. Disabilities and mobility problems come in many forms. Whilst it's true that many disabled people are able to travel in a "normal" car others are unable to leave their (often specially adapted) wheelchair and require wheelchair accessible vehicles. Many of these vehicles have lowered floors and/or raised roofs. My adapted vehicle is just over 2m high and will normally just squeeze under 2m barriers, but not 1.8m which is becoming common. As it happens I couldn't drive into a parking area yesterday because of the 1.8m height barrier, but a very helpful attendant opened and closed this for me (I regret to say this is the exception rather than the rule as others have refused, but normally no-one is around anyway ). Not sure if I would have received the same treatment trying to park my adapted motorhome - but to be honest I probably would not have tried as it was a city centre carpark not really suited to motorhomes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest 1footinthegrave Posted April 19, 2012 Share Posted April 19, 2012 As I said, many adapted vehicles for wheelchair users do not fit under height barriers either. So that's why I wonder if there may be a case to answer.The legislation seems quite clear that disabled people that are wheelchair users should not be discriminated against, surely that would include their use of an adapted vehicle to park where able bodied people can park. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest ChrisB Posted April 19, 2012 Share Posted April 19, 2012 1footinthegrave - 2012-04-19 10:38 PM As I said, many adapted vehicles for wheelchair users do not fit under height barriers either. So that's why I wonder if there may be a case to answer.The legislation seems quite clear that disabled people that are wheelchair users should not be discriminated against, surely that would include their use of an adapted vehicle to park where able bodied people can park. I've no argument with this view! If only it was that simple. Many acts of discrimination are the result of lack of thought and understanding of the needs of the disabled (particularly wheelchair users). This should not be the case given the "Equality" legislation and it's obvious to most that height barriers will discriminate more against WAVs than normal family vehicles. As far as I am aware no-one has yet tested this in the courts (note to self: more research needed). Chris ( ;-) at least it also discriminates agains many 4x4s) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
crinklystarfish Posted April 20, 2012 Share Posted April 20, 2012 The Disability Discrimination Act and other similar legislation is often used to bring cases, it's just that they are usually mundane and not really capable of whipping up a public frenzy, and hence selling papers. I doubt there'd be a case to answer in the case of height barriers. It could be similarly argued that all car manufacturers discriminate against people with disabilities in the first place because they don't make cars big enough to hold a wheelchair. What the other chap's case highlights, more than anything, is that we are governed by idiots, presiding over a shambolic system that rewards the undeserving whilst penalising the decent and reasonable. Bringing it full circle, how come many of the motability users I see are perfectly capable of walking from their free car to the shop to use my money to buy more of the cigs and pies that have made them into the benefit-dependent wheezing lardtubs that they are? Oh yeah, governed by idiots, presiding... Absolutely no offence intended to people who genuinely need assistance with mobility. Much offence intended to the exploitative and work-shy - and the idiots who encourage it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pepe63xnotuse Posted April 20, 2012 Share Posted April 20, 2012 crinklystarfish - 2012-04-20 9:38 AM....Bringing it full circle, how come many of the motability users I see are perfectly capable of walking from their free car to the shop to use my money to buy more of the cigs and pies that have made them into the benefit-dependent wheezing lardtubs that they are?Oh yeah, governed by idiots, presiding...Absolutely no offence intended to people who genuinely need assistance with mobility. Much offence intended to the exploitative and work-shy - and the idiots who encourage it.--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- (lol) ..THIS thread is showing potential!... (lol)(Oops! I c*cked up somewhere,when quoting Crinkly'..?! hence the line :$ ) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest 1footinthegrave Posted April 20, 2012 Share Posted April 20, 2012 My guess is the average motability user does not have a burning desire to blow us up though, unless of course some of Abu's mates are motability users, you can bet your life that hook bloke was, and considering they seem to know how to get rented houses at £1600 a month paid for them, I'm guessing loads of them probably are. >:-) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest ChrisB Posted April 20, 2012 Share Posted April 20, 2012 crinklystarfish - 2012-04-20 9:38 AMBringing it full circle, how come many of the motability users I see are perfectly capable of walking from their free car to the shop to use my money to buy more of the cigs and pies that have made them into the benefit-dependent wheezing lardtubs that they are?Oh yeah, governed by idiots, presiding...Absolutely no offence intended to people who genuinely need assistance with mobility. Much offence intended to the exploitative and work-shy - and the idiots who encourage it.But you are (unintentionally) causing offence to the many disable people who look "healthy" but have an underlying mobility or health problem which prevents them walking more than a few yards - and not necessarily the obese.In any case, as has been mentioned on this forum a number of times, the issuing of Blue Badges is now centralised and subject to review for current holders - so you will shortly be reassured that any badge holder is deserving.There have always been a minority who abuse the concession (mainly it would seem by family members and carers of the disabled). I can honestly say that I would never mis-use the Blue Badge - it is far too valuable to risk its loss.If you suspect that someone is not entitled to a disabled parking space then please challenge them (politely). The genuine holder will not mind as what you are doing is ultimately in their interest. But be prepared for a mouthful of abuse from others who will usually "only be a minute" and there are "other disabled places available". White van man, drivers of expensive cars, and boy racers are normally the worst offenders. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest JudgeMental Posted April 20, 2012 Share Posted April 20, 2012 fair bit af abuse of system down here in Benidorm with many registered disabled that appear in better condition then yours truly :-D and conversations with long term stayers supports this.....more mobility buggies then you have ever seen in your life. But I do think poor old Abu and height barriers a bit of a stretch even for my imagination :D It must be the UK weather...24 deg here in Benidorm :-D Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Retread24800 Posted April 20, 2012 Share Posted April 20, 2012 Can someone explain why all the replies so far passively accept the imposition of height barriers? I guess its because you have no voice that actively promotes the right to free circulation and parking, certainly the 'clubs' that you all join act against your interests to actively promote their interests. For entry into public spaces height barriers are illegal here, their use must be restricted to acting as a warning that vehicles cannot enter say a parking because the height available is restricted i.e. an underground car park. Recently several coastal communes have been taken to court after issuing a commune wide ban on parking for motor-homes, any bye-law that discriminates similarly is illegal here. bans on parking must be in tightly specified areas where there is a proven need to stop parking, Perhaps to limit congestion, and might also be restricted to the season, i.e. ban applies during the summer only. Bans because the residents do not like the look of motor-homes or for other similarly spurious reason are similarly illegal. see here Le Comité de liason du Camping-Car Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
malc d Posted April 20, 2012 Share Posted April 20, 2012 Retread24800 - 2012-04-20 3:29 PMCan someone explain why all the replies so far passively accept the imposition of height barriers?I guess its because you have no voice that actively promotes the right to free circulation and parking, certainly the 'clubs' that you all join act against your interests to actively promote their interests. I wouldn't expect the clubs to promote the parking of motorhomes OFF sites.Turkeys don't vote for Xmas. ;-) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest 1footinthegrave Posted April 20, 2012 Share Posted April 20, 2012 "Can someone explain why all the replies so far passively accept the imposition of height barriers?" Probably because most of us have given up fighting the system, or perhaps I should have put height barriers as the topic for the thread. :-( Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
malc d Posted April 20, 2012 Share Posted April 20, 2012 1footinthegrave - 2012-04-20 4:22 PM "Can someone explain why all the replies so far passively accept the imposition of height barriers?" Probably because most of us have given up fighting the system, or perhaps I should have put height barriers as the topic for the thread. :-( Another good reason for motorhome holidays in France ! ;-) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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