Truma Combi 4 gas/electricity options

[tf756]

Thanks Colin - I will be back for more advice once we get the van!

[WildBill]

The electric element came as standard on our van so we didn't have this dilemma. Like some others have stated, I find the electric element useful in keeping the van from getting too cold and the boiler dumping if there is a snap frost when away from it. I have it hooked up at home and flick the switch in the garage if there is going to be a frost. Saves a drain down etc. Also, if on hook up, I use 240v on the boiler as I am already paying for it and save my gas.

I am sure that whatever choice you make will be the right one for YOU. Good luck with your new van.

 

[Rayjsj]

My comment is about selling the van when the time comes, This 'Upgrade' is not a readily fitted one by a buyer of the van secondhand. Whilst I agree with Eddie about accessories not 'Adding' value, they do make a van easier to sell.

For Me, if looking for a Particular Van, and found one Had the Electric Heater option, and a second one Didn't, I would definately pick the one 'With It' and would even (sorry Eddie) pay a premium for it.

I don't look on an Electric Element to a Heater as an 'Accessory' but an essential. Ray

[Retread24800]

With a PVC I would have thought that an up grade to the 6kW version would have been better value for money.

[Derek Uzzell]

Retread24800 - 2012-04-28 12:14 AM

 

With a PVC I would have thought that an up grade to the 6kW version would have been better value for money.

 

I would have thought the opposite.

 

A Combi-6 has a 3-phase gas-burner outputing 2000W, 4000W or 6000W, whereas a Combi-4 has a 2-phase burner outputing 2000W or 4000W. The fan-unit is, however, the same for both appliances. Consequently, it will only be in the initial stage of heating up a very cold motorhome that a Combi-6 will have an advantage over a Combi-4 - both will be able to move the same volume of air at maximum fan-speed, but the air from the Combi-6 will be hotter.

 

If a motorhome has a large internal volume a Combi-6 makes sense as, in cold weather, the appliance will need to run for quite a while at maximum output to raise the vehicle's internal temperature to an acceptable level, at which point the heater will shift progressively to a lower burner-stage and fan speed according to the temperature chosen by the user. However, if a Combi-6 is used in a PVC (which will inevitably have a limited internal volume) the heater's 6000W stage will be operational for only a very short period of time before the 4000W burner-stage is selected.

 

LeisureShopDirect offers Truma Combis at the following prices

 

4 --- £1359

6 --- £1572

4E - £1677

6E - £1899

 

So (buying retail) it would cost £213 to 'upgrade' from a 4 to a 6 (where all you really get is a 3-stage gas-burner instead of a 2-stage one), or £318 to go from a 4 to a 4E (where you gain a 230V air/water heating facility).

 

I believe there are logical arguments for choosing a Combi-4 to Combi-4E upgrade for a PVC, but paying, say, £200 to upgrade from a Combi-4 to a Combi-6 would be very difficult to justify financially in my view.

[Guest JudgeMental]

the 6 in a panel van is really over the top

[Retread24800]

So the next time you cannot switch on the 1.8Kw Electric element to back up the 4KW output from the Combi 4 you will curse the day that you opted for that, the OP clearly stated that he spends a lot of time off EHU and thus the extra capacity can only come from LPG, and given the lower insulation of many PVC's against Coachbuilts heating capacity is not something you want to be short of a any time.

[Guest JudgeMental]

well it was snowing when we overnighted in Navarra on our way down here and pretty miserable through France......we had the low wattage blow heater on, and no problem, perfectly comfortable. Nowhere as well insulated as our double floored Euramobil, but certainly no less comfortable or warm......

[colin]

Retread24800 - 2012-04-28 12:43 PM

 

So the next time you cannot switch on the 1.8Kw Electric element to back up the 4KW output from the Combi 4 you will curse the day that you opted for that, the OP clearly stated that he spends a lot of time off EHU and thus the extra capacity can only come from LPG, and given the lower insulation of many PVC's against Coachbuilts heating capacity is not something you want to be short of a any time.

 

Proboly best if some one who owns a 636 answered ;-)

The combi 4 is well up to heating this fully insulated van.

[Retread24800]

colin - 2012-04-28 2:52 PM

Retread24800 - 2012-04-28 12:43 PMSo the next time you cannot switch on the 1.8Kw Electric element to back up the 4KW output from the Combi 4 you will curse the day that you opted for that, the OP clearly stated that he spends a lot of time off EHU and thus the extra capacity can only come from LPG, and given the lower insulation of many PVC's against Coachbuilts heating capacity is not something you want to be short of a any time.

Proboly best if some one who owns a 636 answered ;-) The combi 4 is well up to heating this fully insulated van.

 

Double floor, under floor heating, 35mm of foam in the walls and roof? I think not. Probably OK for 3 seasons but not in the winter with temperatures down below -15°C overnight.

 

[JamesFrance]

A 4 kilowatt output is plenty to quickly heat the volume of a panel van. It is the amount of air being heated which matters, not the level of insulation which will just alter how often the heater needs to run at maximum output.

 

4 kilowatts is all we need to keep our house warm and it can be cold in winter here in France.

[Guest JudgeMental]

Retread24800 - 2012-04-28 3:05 PM

colin - 2012-04-28 2:52 PM

Retread24800 - 2012-04-28 12:43 PMSo the next time you cannot switch on the 1.8Kw Electric element to back up the 4KW output from the Combi 4 you will curse the day that you opted for that, the OP clearly stated that he spends a lot of time off EHU and thus the extra capacity can only come from LPG, and given the lower insulation of many PVC's against Coachbuilts heating capacity is not something you want to be short of a any time.

Proboly best if some one who owns a 636 answered ;-) The combi 4 is well up to heating this fully insulated van.

 

Double floor, under floor heating, 35mm of foam in the walls and roof? I think not. Probably OK for 3 seasons but not in the winter with temperatures down below -15°C overnight.

This is plain daft...where did OP say he intended going Sking or winter camping. what is the percentage of deep winter users on this forum? I would hazard a guess at 10%-20% at most. A 3 season van perfectly adequate for most usage, and many coachbuilts just about mange this as well........also you can get winterised panel vans as well but what is the point unless required...your right in one respect, I do miss the heated double floor for bathroom visits during the night. and in a previous van, we had Alde central heating and wet water underfloor heating as well..true luxury..(van was good for minus 35 deg)Now? I just wear me socks in bed if cold.......simples! :D

[Derek Uzzell]

Retread24800 - 2012-04-28 12:43 PM

 

So the next time you cannot switch on the 1.8Kw Electric element to back up the 4KW output from the Combi 4 you will curse the day that you opted for that, the OP clearly stated that he spends a lot of time off EHU and thus the extra capacity can only come from LPG, and given the lower insulation of many PVC's against Coachbuilts heating capacity is not something you want to be short of a any time.

 

I believe you may be under the impression that the 230V side of a Combi-E can be used to supplement the appliance's maximum output available from gas operation - that a Combi-4E could produce an output of 5800W (4000W from gas + 1800W from 230V) and a Combi-6E could produce 7800W (6000W from gas + 1800W from 230V). This is not the case.

 

When a Combi-E operates in 'mixed' mode, the most powerful of its gas-burner stages is not used. So a Combi-4E (with a 2-stage burner providing 2000W or 4000W) will only provide a maximum output of 3800W in 'mixed' mode (2000W from gas + 1800W from 230V), while a Combi-6E (with a 3-stage burner providing 2000W, 4000W or 6000W) will only provide a maximum output of 5800W (4000W from gas + 1800W from 230V). So neither of these gas/230V heaters, when operating in 'mixed' mode, will produce as much heat output as when operating on gas alone.

 

I think Truma's preceding gas/230V air/water heater - the C-6002EH - operated differently and (at least in principle) had a potential output of 7800W (6000W from gas+ 1800W from 230V).

 

 

[tf756]

Well, I have now been told by our inefficient salesman that the vans on order all have the Combi4E (gas/electric operation) anyway! End result is that I have learnt a lot from this thread and now want an LPG system, so more expense!

 

Tony

[colin]

Retread24800 - 2012-04-28 3:05 PM

colin - 2012-04-28 2:52 PM

Retread24800 - 2012-04-28 12:43 PMSo the next time you cannot switch on the 1.8Kw Electric element to back up the 4KW output from the Combi 4 you will curse the day that you opted for that, the OP clearly stated that he spends a lot of time off EHU and thus the extra capacity can only come from LPG, and given the lower insulation of many PVC's against Coachbuilts heating capacity is not something you want to be short of a any time.

Proboly best if some one who owns a 636 answered ;-) The combi 4 is well up to heating this fully insulated van.

 

Double floor, under floor heating, 35mm of foam in the walls and roof? I think not. Probably OK for 3 seasons but not in the winter with temperatures down below -15°C overnight.

Well we've only slept in the van in -3c, but in this instance we used a 500w oil heater to give a bit of warmth and that was 'clicking' in and out so not on 100%. Have also used the 500w heater overnight when temp dropped to -6c, we where not in van so all I can say is the truma dump valve didn't open.

[Rayjsj]

tf756 - 2012-04-28 7:20 PM

 

Well, I have now been told by our inefficient salesman that the vans on order all have the Combi4E (gas/electric operation) anyway! End result is that I have learnt a lot from this thread and now want an LPG system, so more expense!

 

Tony

 

sensible dealer, doesn't want someone 'not buying' , because of a lack electric heating, even if it doesn't get used that often. Ray

[Colin Leake]

We had the 6E fitted to our last motorhome and only used the gas option once after a very cold night when I had failed to leave the electric heating on a low thermostat setting. We used the gas and electric option giving a total output of 7.8KW. Sounded like Concord taking off but it certainly heating the motorhome up impressively quickly!

 

Our current AutoTrail has the 4E fitted in a compartment in the garage. I've fitted a clothes rail in there to enable use to hang wet clothes to dry. If we have the heating running on a low setting overnight the clothes and boots etc are well dry by the morning. It also keeps the bed above the garage warm. Bit like having underfloor heating for the bed.

 

Off topic I know but talking about keeping warm at night we purchased a splendid product at the Exel show that I can best describe as being two duvet covers that zip together to form like a giant double sleeping bag. It has a low tog duvet in one section and a high tog one in the other so that it can be turned one way or the other to suite the weather. Also unlike a sleeping bag the duvets can be taken out and the covers easily washed.

[Amanda]

Up unitl now we have always used the heating on the electric setting only because what's the point of having electric hook up if you don't use it?

 

However on our last trip out we didn't have electric and had to put the heating on gas. Wow what a difference. Its quicker to heat up and much warmer. And the water seemed to get a lot hotter too. Or is it that it takes so much longer to heat up? Was beginning to wonder if the theromstat on the hot water tank was wrong but obviously not.

 

We too leave the heating on a low seating overnight and its lovely to get up in the night (its an age thing) and find the van warm. Makes going back ot sleep so much easier.

 

Electric heating? Whats the point? From now on I can see us using the gas heating much more, especially if this rotten weather continues!!! (lol)