david lloyd Posted May 2, 2012 Share Posted May 2, 2012 Hi everyone Just had the renewal quote for our home/contents and travel insurance which is all with Comfort (plus the motorhome) as they are all tailored to suit. By that I mean Comfort, having insured the van, tailor a house insurance for more unoccupancy than the standard household policy we used to have. The standard with Halifax is 60 days PER YEAR and we are looking for a single trip of at least 90 days possibly 120. We also took their bolt on travel insurance as (with pre-existing medical conditions) we were finding it not just expensive but sometimes impossible to get elsewhere. The latest quote is not bad compared to last year but we intend to overwinter longer so, naturally, it is going up due to the higher risk. I know these things can be quite subjective but, before we settle on this one, where do you insure and are they competitive? David Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Tracker Posted May 2, 2012 Share Posted May 2, 2012 Without knowing the cost it is difficult to compare! Comfort insure our van for about £280 a year including recovery etc and the house and contents are with Liverpool Victoria at about £160 which includes up to 60 days away which is enough for us, although it was only by comparison and negotiation that we were able to secure those prices. When I asked, LV told me that they will extend the time away period on request but they would 'probably' increase the premium - I don't know by how much as it depends on their perception of the increased risk at the time? Travel insurance we gave up on as it became more and more expensive due to a few mainly age related health issues between us which don't cause us any real issues but seem to bother the insurers and for the last few years we have travelled without it. However we are becoming increasingly uncomfortable with not having the health and repatriation part of travel insurance so we would be very interested in an all in one package if it were affordable. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest JudgeMental Posted May 2, 2012 Share Posted May 2, 2012 "affordable health insurance" surely an oxymoron. its cheap enough when healthy and scandalous later when you really need it. my kids can go around the world backpacking for a year for £30 each. My consulatant added one blood presure tablet, so that tipped me over the 3 (1 2 0r 3 or more). Insurer withdrew world wide cover and would only cover for Europe for 55 days at a time.so as we are going to India for Christmas my insuance for this year has effectivily doubled from last.....because of one tablet *-) BUT I can still travel, which is the important thing.... rant over :D if two of you travelling and wife can drive (normally men pass first:-S) have the decency to pop your clogs in bed, and Mrs can cover you with a duvet, leave a window open and drive home like the wind.......would like to see what the french cops make of that! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest JudgeMental Posted May 2, 2012 Share Posted May 2, 2012 Soooo French police stop Mrs Tracker and search van...Ah! Hah! wot iz sis hiding in zee bed Mrs trakor? Mon bon dieu! il est mort Mr Trakor!........Now Mrs Tracker being a nurse would probably just shrug and want to get on her way, get home before banks close, so she cant start spending the tight wads money....... (Sorry david i always do this cant help having an imagination but at least your thread gets bumped :D) question being will Peter come to the funeral 8-) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Tracker Posted May 2, 2012 Share Posted May 2, 2012 Stop it Eddie - don't give Mrs Tracker any more ideas! She certainly does not need anyone's help in disposing of our kid's inheritances! Peter at my funeral - yeah right! Mind you he is so uptight at times perhaps we will all be going to his - perish the thought! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
david lloyd Posted May 2, 2012 Author Share Posted May 2, 2012 Talking of mortality my brother in law suffered a heart attack a couple of years ago in Majorca which resulted in him having a quadruple bypass, three weeks in intensive care in a (lovely) Spanish hospital and then an air ambulance home to begin his recovery. The cost? In the region of £25k. Fortunately, he did have travel insurance taken out at the time of booking the package holiday (although he may have some difficulty in that regard now!) and that covered the whole cost. Like Tracker we have considered not insuring, and I know that many people do not have travel insurance, but the ramifications can be quite considerable. So, as we are at least being offered travel cover, it is probably best we carry on until such time as the insurers deem us to be too much of a risk!! This years home and contents and travel with Comfort came in at £379.05 which was less than our old insurer (without travel) but their standard terms are, as I mentioned earlier, 60 days unoccupancy PER YEAR - we would exceed that through the summer months in this country never mind the winter trip. To extend it to 90 days per trip Comfort want £471 and for 120 days it goes up to £526. The problem with trying to find a comparator, I guess, is that it is so dependent upon your individual circumstances and health. I do like having our motorhome/house/contents and travel insurance all in one place. However, if anyone has had quotes less than this for their house/contents and travel I wouldn't be averse to trying them for a quote. David Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest JudgeMental Posted May 2, 2012 Share Posted May 2, 2012 Well David back on topic...I would think trying to find one insurer to cover all areas probably difficult, and maybe more expensive? Medical Travel hard enough with pre existing Motorhome and breakdown no stress as for household, I will watch topic with interest, as if wife takes redundancy we will have to sort this issue out as well as we intend to travel more for a couple of years.... Don't know what line you are in, but as wife in education we find that UIA are very good. They even cover our expensive e bikes when most companies don't want to know http://www.uia.co.uk/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnnerontheroad Posted May 2, 2012 Share Posted May 2, 2012 Have a look at C&CC they do 180 days for home insurance http://www.clubcareinsurance.co.uk/p/home-insurance Dave Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian Kirby Posted May 2, 2012 Share Posted May 2, 2012 David Do you have the latest versions of the Comfort insurance booklets? I ask, because we recently discovered that ours were woefully out of date as we had not automatically been sent new booklets when the conditions had changed. Ours still dated from pre-Aviva days, and the new conditions on the health package are both more onerous, and much less clear, than were the Norwich Union versions. In fact, my personal view is that some now stink, and I think could possibly be open to challenge under unfair contract terms legislation! I have some outstanding, and currently unresolved, queries, especially over the health insurance with Comfort, so cannot say more, but if your conditions on both are not dated (I think) 2011, it may pay you to get the latest versions before paying on the assumption that no new booklet means no changes to the conditions. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest 1footinthegrave Posted May 2, 2012 Share Posted May 2, 2012 I only realised just a few weeks ago that our home insurance covers us for a maximum trip duration of 45 days, just as well nothing happened when we were away for 10 weeks last year. ( Must read the small print in future) Our current insurers ( Co-op ) said they would not even quote us if leaving the house unoccupied for longer than this. Although I have not looked into this suggestion I was told the only way round this would be to have house sitters, and of course an agreement to confirm the arrangement and prior agreement with your insurer. Not sure if this would help anyone, or has anyone any experience of going that route ?. Also found goodtogo by far the cheapest for health insurance for us old farts with pre-conditions. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
david lloyd Posted May 3, 2012 Author Share Posted May 3, 2012 Judge - thanks for that. I am in the process of getting a quote from UIA - but as I was doing so their power went off!! Johnnerontheroad - thanks to you. I have had quotes from both clubs now and they are quite high in comparison plus they will go up higher as they would be referred for medical assessment. So have left them out for now. Brian - again many thanks for the info. I have checked my booklet and although it came in 2010 it is the Aviva policy. But it may be worth me asking if the conditions have changes since we got ours. David Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest JudgeMental Posted May 3, 2012 Share Posted May 3, 2012 david lloyd - 2012-05-03 10:45 AM Judge - thanks for that. I am in the process of getting a quote from UIA - but as I was doing so their power went off!! Johnnerontheroad - thanks to you. I have had quotes from both clubs now and they are quite high in comparison plus they will go up higher as they would be referred for medical assessment. So have left them out for now. David what length of time do they allow when travelling? as i have not a clue, as someone normally at home... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
david lloyd Posted May 3, 2012 Author Share Posted May 3, 2012 JudgeMental - 2012-05-03 11:06 AM david lloyd - 2012-05-03 10:45 AM Judge - thanks for that. I am in the process of getting a quote from UIA - but as I was doing so their power went off!! Johnnerontheroad - thanks to you. I have had quotes from both clubs now and they are quite high in comparison plus they will go up higher as they would be referred for medical assessment. So have left them out for now. David what length of time do they allow when travelling? as i have not a clue, as someone normally at home... It is apparently, variable as they have limited our quote to 90 days unoccupancy (following the medical assessment) and some will not accept relatives 'looking in' on the property to extend the time stating it has to be occupied outside of the limit. C&CC gave a really competitive quote on House/contents but their travel insurance was £102 EACH and limited to 91 days at a time. CC quoted £240 for standard travel policy (which does include breakdown) but that was before referring us for medical assessment........................................................... Think we may just stay with Comfort. David Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest 1footinthegrave Posted May 3, 2012 Share Posted May 3, 2012 Hello David, forgive me for asking but what exactly would a medical assessment have to do with house insurance, I assumed a medical assessment would only be relevant to a travel health insurance. ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
david lloyd Posted May 4, 2012 Author Share Posted May 4, 2012 1footinthegrave - 2012-05-03 6:12 PM Hello David, forgive me for asking but what exactly would a medical assessment have to do with house insurance, I assumed a medical assessment would only be relevant to a travel health insurance. ? Hi, yes, it may not have been clear in the post above but taking any of the separate house/contents insurance was dependent on getting a quote also for travel/health insurance. It was that part that would be referred for medical assessment - and I have a fairly good idea that may result in a higher quote than that given!! Most insurance companies I contacted have them as separate policies but the Comfort travel insurance is an optional extra to their house/contents policy. We already have that and only need inform them of any material changes to our health status but taking any new one with someone else will result in a new medical assessment and, as a consequence, they invariably increase the premium from the initial quote given due to the pre-existing conditions we both have. David Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest 1footinthegrave Posted May 4, 2012 Share Posted May 4, 2012 Thanks for that, you may want to give this company a shot for pre-existing conditions for travel insurance, most competitive I have found. http://www.goodtogoinsurance.com/?gclid=CKaRnNmk5q8CFcYOfAodmE5SPQ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian Kirby Posted May 4, 2012 Share Posted May 4, 2012 david lloyd - 2012-05-04 9:49 AM................Hi, yes, it may not have been clear in the post above but taking any of the separate house/contents insurance was dependent on getting a quote also for travel/health insurance. It was that part that would be referred for medical assessment - and I have a fairly good idea that may result in a higher quote than that given!!......................David Hi David Just to be clear on the above, is it your understanding that in order to benefit from Comfort's extended unoccupancy periods on home/contents you had to take out their associated travel insurance extension? What I am asking is, to your understanding, if you had purchased a separate travel/health package, either from Comfort or elsewhere, would you then have been stuck with just the standard unoccupancy period? If this is/was the case, it seems to me wholly unreasonable as the risks on extended unoccupancy have nought to do with your health. Just as an aside, have you noted how much of the travel package is, in fact, irrelevant to what we, as motorhomers, generally require. All that stuff about cancellation costs, for example? It seems really to be a travel insurance package with health as a major bolt-on, rather than a traveller's health insurance package. I haven't asked, but wonder if sections can be selectively omitted with some benefit to the premium? Funny clauses? How about this (policy document dated 01.2012). "What is not covered 1. Any claim for a medical condition if any Insured person has travelled against the advice of a Doctor or would be travelling against the advice of a Doctor if they had taken such advice." Requires some degree of clairvoyance, methinks! :-( (Note also, not "their Doctor", just "a Doctor". The clause, as written, makes no provision for second opinion, relies on post hoc assessment (who is ever wrong after the event?), and seems to leave the choice of doctor entirely to Aviva.) Fair or unfair? Offers? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flicka Posted May 4, 2012 Share Posted May 4, 2012 Brian Kirby - 2012-05-04 12:33 PM Funny clauses? How about this (policy document dated 01.2012). "What is not covered 1. Any claim for a medical condition if any Insured person has travelled against the advice of a Doctor or would be travelling against the advice of a Doctor if they had taken such advice." Requires some degree of clairvoyance, methinks! :-( (Note also, not "their Doctor", just "a Doctor". The clause, as written, makes no provision for second opinion, relies on post hoc assessment (who is ever wrong after the event?), and seems to leave the choice of doctor entirely to Aviva.) Fair or unfair? Offers? Not necessarily "Unfair", Brian. (being devil's advocate) The clause could be deemed to be "Unfiar" if you are not made aware, prior to accepting their Insurance & it is "Imposed" by a party with a greater strength. Hence the reason to get hold of the Policy wording before Acceptance of their quote. However, as more & more Insurers are reluctant to supply a full copy of the Policy Terms & Conditions prior to you accepting their offer, it could then be inferred to be IMPOSED & therefore give grounds to challenge their clause as "Unfair" The problem arising is that in the event of a Claim, you have more than enough problems to deal with, without having to spend time challenging "Unfair Terms & Conditions" via the Insurance Obudsman. The difficulty (for any individual) is that, detailed analysis of Insurance Policy Clauses, tend to be very similarly worded & become "accepted industry standards" by the Insurance Obudsman. So, "Unfair", morally YES, (Contractually - not necessarilly) but we all know what has happened to morals in the Financial Services Industry of late. >:-( Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian Kirby Posted May 4, 2012 Share Posted May 4, 2012 Perfectly true, John, if the policy document was made available with the quote, and one knowingly signed up for it (or signed without reading it), it would be one's own fault. However, it just caused me to ask myself what, actually, is being insured. Not arguing with your logic, just thinking aloud. The first point, ".................person has travelled against the advice of a Doctor........" is entirely fair and reasonable. For a doctor to have given such advice one must have consulted the doctor, and the doctor must have been aware of whatever condition, and its potential consequences, to give such advice, and any such advice must have been given prior to travelling. So, clear breach if one ignores the advice. QED. However, it is the second point that gave me pause. "........would be travelling against the advice of a Doctor if they had taken such advice". This point can only apply after the event. You have been stricken with whatever, of which you had no prior knowledge (which is, of course, why you had not previously consulted your doctor). "A doctor" (presumably the one now treating you, but there is no definition to this effect) is then asked, in effect, "had you known earlier what you now know, would you have advised this person against travelling"? What is the doctor supposed to say? Assuming s/he is the doctor now treating you, s/he knows what you did not previously know or suspect. How can s/he then say, "I would not have advised against travel, because I do not think I could have diagnosed this condition before it manifested"? S/he might, but would risk placing their professional competence in doubt in so doing. That seems to me pretty much to leave her/him bound to say, as a doctor, "had I been consulted, I should definitely have advised a person with this condition not to travel". It is generally expected that one will consult a doctor when one feels, or suspects, that one is ill, and one did not because one had no such feeling or suspicion. How then can it be reasonable to ask a doctor to conjecture his/her opinion based on a hypothetical consultation that, under the circumstances, could not have taken place? In essence, the logic of this clause appears to be that all "Insured persons" should ask their doctors for a medical check up before travelling, posing the question, "is there any reason why I should not drive my motorhome on holiday"? Can that really be what they mean? This is Aviva, after all, so not a backstreet operation, and not short of legal advice. I believe the English language is sufficiently versatile that it is possible to write clearly what one means. When large multi-national corporations with copious legal advice at their disposal write what is, at best, ambiguous, I assume it is because that is exactly how they intended to write it, intending the ambiguity to work to their advantage and not (in this case) to their insureds' advantage. This is just one of several clauses that leave Aviva almost unassailable grounds to reject claims, should they so choose. Others may well do likewise, I haven't yet read theirs, though I think I may have to settle down to do so in the near future! :-( But, even so, I don't think that is an acceptable excuse for lacing their contract with clauses that, IMO, virtually negate the concept of insurance. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flicka Posted May 4, 2012 Share Posted May 4, 2012 I fully agree with sentiments based on your scenario, Brian. What I think they mean is (although it does not say so) :- "Someone who has a known pre-existing Medical Condition, who deliberately chooses not to consult a Doctor, knowing a Doctor would advise against travel." IMO a clause written to cover one eventuallity, introduced no doubt to close a loophole , but not thought through to identify the full effect of it's wording. Perhaps a referral to the "Plain English Society" , would be appropriate. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest JudgeMental Posted May 5, 2012 Share Posted May 5, 2012 Has come to my attention that many of the long stayers down here in Spain depend only on NICC card (old E111) And then have a policy for repatriation on death, these policies seem very popular and may be termed ex pat insurance, but I have not looked into it as don't intend to move down here.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian Kirby Posted May 5, 2012 Share Posted May 5, 2012 flicka - 2012-05-04 11:04 PM I fully agree with sentiments based on your scenario, Brian. What I think they mean is (although it does not say so) :- "Someone who has a known pre-existing Medical Condition, who deliberately chooses not to consult a Doctor, knowing a Doctor would advise against travel." IMO a clause written to cover one eventuallity, introduced no doubt to close a loophole , but not thought through to identify the full effect of it's wording. Perhaps a referral to the "Plain English Society" , would be appropriate. Precisely, John. It's just such a shame an organisation the size of Aviva doesn't employ someone with your command of English! Or do they? But then, why not let him/her write the clause. Hmmmmmmmmmm! Puzzle that, isn't it? What a dreadful cynic I am! :-D Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest 1footinthegrave Posted May 5, 2012 Share Posted May 5, 2012 Ah plain English, wouldn't that be a huge leap forward. I recently looked into a policy and the terms and conditions ran to 52 pages, I kid you not. 8-) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
david lloyd Posted May 5, 2012 Author Share Posted May 5, 2012 Brian Kirby - 2012-05-04 12:33 PM david lloyd - 2012-05-04 9:49 AM................Hi, yes, it may not have been clear in the post above but taking any of the separate house/contents insurance was dependent on getting a quote also for travel/health insurance. It was that part that would be referred for medical assessment - and I have a fairly good idea that may result in a higher quote than that given!!......................David Hi David Just to be clear on the above, is it your understanding that in order to benefit from Comfort's extended unoccupancy periods on home/contents you had to take out their associated travel insurance extension? What I am asking is, to your understanding, if you had purchased a separate travel/health package, either from Comfort or elsewhere, would you then have been stuck with just the standard unoccupancy period? If this is/was the case, it seems to me wholly unreasonable as the risks on extended unoccupancy have nought to do with your health. Just as an aside, have you noted how much of the travel package is, in fact, irrelevant to what we, as motorhomers, generally require. All that stuff about cancellation costs, for example? It seems really to be a travel insurance package with health as a major bolt-on, rather than a traveller's health insurance package. I haven't asked, but wonder if sections can be selectively omitted with some benefit to the premium? Funny clauses? How about this (policy document dated 01.2012). "What is not covered 1. Any claim for a medical condition if any Insured person has travelled against the advice of a Doctor or would be travelling against the advice of a Doctor if they had taken such advice." Requires some degree of clairvoyance, methinks! :-( (Note also, not "their Doctor", just "a Doctor". The clause, as written, makes no provision for second opinion, relies on post hoc assessment (who is ever wrong after the event?), and seems to leave the choice of doctor entirely to Aviva.) Fair or unfair? Offers? Sorry Brian, my being unclear again...... It wasn't the insurance companies that insisted on the two being linked just that prior to joining Comfort we had completely separate house/contents cover from a stand alone travel/health policy from a different company. The travel insurance we had became quite expensive (if they would give cover at all) with pre-existing conditions and some insuarnce companies will not extend the unoccupany limit from their 'normal' limit. sS, as we had moved to Comfort for the van insurance (and I recall you originally gave me the tip that they also provided the bolt on health cover) we sought a quote from them but it was dependent on having household cover with them. Their house and contents cover was actually better (and cheaper) than our existing insurer plus they would give the travel/health cover as a bolt on. That is how it came about. What I was trying to get over was that, if we decided to change to any other house/contents insurer we would also need either their or another insurers travel/health insurance and that was proving more difficult. So, in effect, the Comfort house insurance and travel insurance have become inextricably linked (for us) but the unoccupany limits do seem to be the same for both policies - i.e. house and contents are covered for the same period away as the travel insurance. As regards the irrelevent clauses or benefits applied to the travel policy we still feel things like cancellation costs can be useful. As an example, we have always booked our return tunnel crossing in advance and sometimes some sites so, if anything untoward were to happen, we would be able to claim under certain circumstances. It would, however, be interesting to see if a 'pick and mix' approach would reduce overall premiums. David Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian Kirby Posted May 5, 2012 Share Posted May 5, 2012 Thank you David, my misunderstanding. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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