petethebiker Posted June 5, 2012 Share Posted June 5, 2012 hi A serious question now. Does anyone know if there is a legal requirement, for a dealer or private individual, to ensure that the appliances fitted in the motorhome are safe to use?ie. as in the case of houses, the builder/ developer MUST provide suitable gas/electic certs to show that all is safe to use pete. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vindiboy Posted June 5, 2012 Share Posted June 5, 2012 Your going to get a lot of guesses here from the campfire Lawyers and my guess is YES any seller should make sure all things are SAFE , as for reliable that is another story. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BGD Posted June 5, 2012 Share Posted June 5, 2012 Do you mean at the time that they are/were fitted, or forever (or what shorter period than forever?) afterwards? Specifics would be helpful.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
petethebiker Posted June 5, 2012 Author Share Posted June 5, 2012 hi at the time of purchase ONLY, is the the sellers or buyers responsability to ensure the appliances are safe to use? afterwards of course it is it up to the purchaser to ensure regular checkups. i am just trying to establish if it would be up to me to ensure if they were safe to use or should the dealer be obligated by law to see they are safe to use at the time the cash is handed over. much like an mot i guess. it only is good at the time of testing. it's just as we are buying our first rv and i wanted to make sure things are ok before i hand over any more money than the deposit. he has said they are ok but then he would would he not? pete Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Tracker Posted June 5, 2012 Share Posted June 5, 2012 If you buy privately the seller is not deemed to be an expert so it is up to you to provide your own expert to see if everything works. A dealer is regarded as an expert and as such everything must work when you buy from a dealer - but some are better than others and it still pays to ensure everything works before accepting ownership and leaving their premises. If you have any doubts any competent caravan or motorhome service business should be able to check it all for you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BGD Posted June 5, 2012 Share Posted June 5, 2012 Basically as Rich has said: if a private sale then (except in some very rare circumstances such as criminal fraud) it's always "caveat emptor" ( buyer beware). If buying from private seller, DO NOT relay on the seller saying to you that everything works fine. TEST IT YOURSELF before you part with your-hard-earned. If something doesn't work when you get the MH home, you've got no real comeback, as how do you try to prove in any civil court what he did/did not say? At the very least, try to get something in writing from the seller listing the equipment in the MH, with a statement from him that all items are working, dated and signed by him, and if possible witnessed too. If buying from a dealer, you have a little more protection, both under Common Law, and under the Sale of Goods etc Act. But still, it seems to me MUCH better to actually test all the kit in the MH, and get some written statement from the Dealer confirming exactly which items are in it and that they all work. If the Dealer says he hasn't tested them, then get him to do so. If a dealer warranty is offered, READ IT. Then read it again, so that you fully understand it's limitations. There's always another buying trick you can try, and that is the retention. It's used a lot in business-to-business contracts. I assume Dealers are desperate to sell stock. So haggle hard, agree your final price, and only right at the end of the process, just as signatures are about to go on documents, explain that you are sure that all his glowing reports on the reliability of this MH ( that he's never ever used!) are true, and thus he will of course be happy for your requirement to retain 5% of the purchase price, payable 14 or 28 days after the rest of the purchase money, and payable subject to everything continuing to work fine for that trial period. The dealer sales rep will of course wail and gnash his teeth and wave his arms around. But you just might get the concession if he's short of his sales target. You can always try the "walk away" to see if it really is a deal breaker for him....'cos there's no shame in getting to your car to leave, then turning round if that walk-away hasn't achieved any extra, and then saying "well, OK then". Much better to have a bit of the purchase price still in your possession if owt goes wrong in the days after buying, than be begging a dealer who now has all your money to put things right at his cost.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flicka Posted June 5, 2012 Share Posted June 5, 2012 BGD's strategy is frequently used in business, especially where new Plant or Technology is concerned. However, if you follow this option, there are a couple of points to consider. A) the Dealer may want to insert a "Retention of Title" clause, DON'T . (!) B) if you intend to travel immediately after collection, get the Dealer to insert a clause stating that any/all of the retention monies can be used to rectify any fault by ANY Dealer / Authorised repairer, during the period. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian Kirby Posted June 7, 2012 Share Posted June 7, 2012 Tracker - 2012-06-05 5:12 PM If you buy privately the seller is not deemed to be an expert so it is up to you to provide your own expert to see if everything works...................... Except in a case where the seller knows, at the point of sale, of a defect that could be injurious to the buyer. He is then legally obliged to point this out to the buyer under his general "duty of care". However, a private civil case for damages would I think then have to be brought against the seller, and it would require proof of his prior knowledge to succeed (unlikely to be easy!). I'd guess that to succeed, you'd also have to have suffered actual and demonstrable loss or injury as a direct consequence of the defect. Sale of Goods etc Acts provisions do not, AFAIK, apply under any circumstances with private sales. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Tracker Posted June 7, 2012 Share Posted June 7, 2012 Brian Kirby - 2012-06-07 11:57 AM Tracker - 2012-06-05 5:12 PM If you buy privately the seller is not deemed to be an expert so it is up to you to provide your own expert to see if everything works...................... Except in a case where the seller knows, at the point of sale, of a defect that could be injurious to the buyer. He is then legally obliged to point this out to the buyer under his general "duty of care". However, a private civil case for damages would I think then have to be brought against the seller, and it would require proof of his prior knowledge to succeed (unlikely to be easy!). I'd guess that to succeed, you'd also have to have suffered actual and demonstrable loss or injury as a direct consequence of the defect. Sale of Goods etc Acts provisions do not, AFAIK, apply under any circumstances with private sales. Exactly Brian - which is why I didn't mention it and complicate the situation! The burden of proof needed plus the legal procedures and cost make seeking any legal redress impractical other than in probably unlikely extreme cases of loss or injury and if any buyer is unable or unsure of the workings of a motorhome it would be best to buy from a reputable and well established dealer where there is redress and a reasonable chance - but no guarantee - not even on a new van - that all will be in good working order. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flicka Posted June 7, 2012 Share Posted June 7, 2012 Regarding a "Private Sale", think in terms of the MOT "Only valid on day of issue" Regarding the "Sale of Goods Act" & due care by the Seller, if a fault manifested itself when driving away after purchase then you would have a good case, but may still face a legal bill. Once it has been parked up after arriving home possibilities diminish drastically. Treat as if you are at the mercy of the Seller's conscience. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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