Mobil 1 Fully synthetic Oil in Ducato

[enodreven]

Hi, Does or has anyone used Mobil 1 fully Synthetic oil in there 2.8 JTD and did it make any difference Brian

[Bill Ord]

I used Mobil 1 in my last 2.8 JTD Did it make a difference, I don't know. But in a total of 48,000 miles I never needed to top up between oil changes and I had 100% reliability. I buy my oil in France where it is much cheaper, about £21 for 5litre. It seems difficult to get the 5 litre cans here. Good oil is the cheapest mainainance you can do so I never skimp on it. I'll use Mobil 1 again in my present van once it's out of warranty, I could ask the dealer to put my oil in but I'm not as trusting as all that. Bill Ord

[Mel E]

I think the best oil to use is that recommended by the engine manufacturer - it will be in the Handbook. A totally equivalent oil from another maker will be just as good. Many new engines specify either a wholly synthetic or semi-synthetic oil. Older engines will still typically have been specified with mineral oil. The reason is that modern engines are built with increasingly tight tolerances and need thinner but as protective an oil as possible. Using a wholly synthetic oil in an older engine - built to much looser toerances - will under-lubricate the moving parts - it's a bit like putting water rather than treacle in, if you get the simile. Doubltless an engine expert will be able to give a much clearer explanation?

[Clive]

I,m not an expert in tribology but have had a dabble in this field. Mobil 1 is the most expensive of the full synthetic oils I know of. Its top quality and top price. Amsol is anothet well respected name. There are only a small number of manufacturers who make synthetic lubricants so many of the lesser known brands come from the same sources. I ran a tuned up diesel in a Landrover for 14 years and it always ran on full synthetic oil, initially Mobil 1 but later I saved lots of cash by buying Halfords own brand when they had their annual half price sale. It then worked out at the same price as a good mineral oil. Full synthetic oils come into their own with cold environments. Their viscosity changes little with temperature, like knats pee when its freezing. Engines start so much easier. I run my Merc Sprinter based motorhome on Halfords full synthetic. Motorcyclists should be wary though if they have bikes with wet clutches, they will slip unless they fit stronger springs! Full synthetic oils have a much longer molecular life. If you can keep it clean (and sample checked) it can extend oil changes to several years. HGV,s have special oil filters to remove soot etc for this reason. Hope that waffle helps

[enodreven]

Hi, At last i found the contact number for Mobil Tech ? for the UK, albeit i think you get put through to somewhere in Europe, apprantly it is suitable albeit if anyone is thinking of useing it ring i would suggest they ring Mobil themselves on 0800 085 7420 just to double check

[Brian Kirby]

Perhaps obvious, but whatever the oil, it is well worth changing the oil filter at the same time as the oil. 

With extended service intervals I think this is now more or less standard practice, but 'vans with more frequent service intervals may have a recommendation to skip the filter change at intermediate changes.

Our 'vans tend towards much lower annual mileages than their makers envisaged.  Nevertheless, I think all filters should be replaced, irrespective of mileage, and irrespective of the recommendations in the service chart, at least annually.  No point in filling the negine with premium oil and then contaminating that with gunk from an old filter, or ingesting other gunk via the combustion chamber from a choked air filter.

Regards

[Clive]

Modern engines also use a centrifugal filter to remove soot and carbon deposits from the oil. This needs to be taken apart and thoroughly cleaned out before its gets full. Up to this point they are very efficient.

[colin]

I don't know specificaly about ducalto engine, but have used synthetic in astra engines for many years, it is much better on very cold mornings whilst engine is warming up. Have used Halfords in past but last couple of years have used vauxhall branded as this was cheaper! Synthetic and semi-synthetic is availible in many different grades, the market having been driven by classic car owners wishing to use such oil. In my personnel opinion extended service intervals might be bad for long term motorhome care, I would never go more than 1 year between oil changes, and I don't think many oil companies recomend this either ( but then they wouldn't would they? )

[enodreven]

Hi, I have noticed on a number of occasions both with cars I have owned and on friends tha a lot of the service agents are using semi-synthetic oil and when you check the manufactures litriture it quite often states that the extended servicing can only be maintained if fully synthetic is used, also if you look at the Selenia WR oil that is reccomended for the JTD engine it recomends the following "Replacement should be as indicated by Fiat. Changes are advised up to 20,000 Km on cars with direct injection engines and up to 10,000 Km on cars with indirect injection engines" The problem is that to the best of my knowledge 18000 mile intervals are given for the Ducato ? this is far in excess of the 20,000km shown above ?? how does that work ? you can see the specification of the Selenia WR at the following site http://www.flpoland.pl/www_eng/oleje/engine_wr.htm Brian

[colin]

This seems to be the case with many manufacturers, IMHO they are keeping the fleet operators happy knowing vans will be passed on before a problem arises. Ten year old campervans are not their worry.

[Brian Kirby]

All well and good.  However, the Ducato maintenance requirement is for service at 12 months, or 18,000 miles (or whatever) whichever comes soonest.  Generally, motorhomes don't do anything like 18,000 miles per year, so the concern about 18,000km/miles is, perhaps, just a little academic.  That may be a problem for a few of us, otherwise, just get it serviced once per year.  Oh, and if you have cab air-con, make sure that is checked as well.

Regards

[enodreven]

[QUOTE]Brian Kirby - 2006-06-30 8:29 PM

All well and good.  However, the Ducato maintenance requirement is for service at 12 months, or 18,000 miles (or whatever) whichever comes soonest.  Generally, motorhomes don't do anything like 18,000 miles per year, so the concern about 18,000km/miles is, perhaps, just a little academic.  That may be a problem for a few of us, otherwise, just get it serviced once per year.  Oh, and if you have cab air-con, make sure that is checked as well.

Regards

[/QUOTE] Brian While you may see it as academic, as you quite correctly point out there may be some people who do cover a greater milage and that is why i raised the question, how does the manufacturer square these points ?

[colin]

Not sure about latest ducato, but I think it will go same as Morvano/Master 24 months/24,000miles this is not good for long term relibility

[enodreven]

Hi, Colin That seems unbeleivable as even Mobil 1 Extended Performance only quote the following "Mobil 1 Extended Performance formulas are designed specifically for today's longer service intervals and are guaranteed to protect for up to 15,000 miles or one year". I think you are proberbly right in your earlier suggestion that once its out of warrantee they arn't interested ? I was also under the impression that some well know oils that are being used should be changed every 6mths See their we site http://www.mobil1.com/USA-English/MotorOil/Oils/Mobil_1_Extended_Performance_FAQs.aspx#FAQs2

[Derek Uzzell]

I'm with Mel E on this. Vehicles are not pets, they are machines. In my opinion, unless a manufacturer specifies that a motor needs a fully synthetic oil like Mobil 1, attempting to give a motor 'a treat' by deliberately choosing that oil instead of the oil-type recommended by the manufacturer is most unlikely to have any beneficial effect on a motor's longevity or performance. I've never heard of a case where a motor developed oil-related problems and the diagnosis was that an oil should have been used with a higher specification than that recommended in the vehicle's handbook. The important thing is to ensure that the oil used is not lower than the recommended specification. If a vehicle's handbook says that 0W-40, 5W-30 or 10W-60 oil to a particular specification should be used, then that's what I shall use, and I'm not really concerned who makes it or whether it turns out to be semi- or fully-synthetic. As I've no reason to think I know better than the vehicle manufacturer I won't put (say) 0W-40 oil in a motor if the handbook recommends 5W-30. I've driven lots of vehicles lots of miles and the only oil-related problem I've ever encountered had nothing to do with the type of oil and everything to do with there being not enough of it in the motor!

[colin]

Maybe I should expand on my earlier post. As I said I don't know about ducato engine, but the reason I ran astra's on synthetic oil was because of a known lubrication problem with some vauxhall's of its age, GM had underspecified the oil for use in UK and on some engines this meant overreving and/or stalling on very cold mornings the cure was to use synthetic oil. Ford have had a similier problem on their later chain cam engines, they where tested on synthetic oil but early models specified standard oil as well as synthetic oil, because of a small hole to chain ( shades of early pinto here) there could be oil starvation to chain on very cold mornings if the hole had any muck in it, leading to chain failure. New models have a larger hole and specify synthetic oil. P.S. I also run a T25 that I run on standard oil as synthetic would be a waste

[Derek Uzzell]

The only vehicle I've deliberately chosen Mobil 1 for was my Mk 2 16-valve VW Golf GTi. These had smallish high-revving engines with big power outputs for their day and there was a tendency for owners to thrash them unmercifully (not me of course!) VW tuning firms (in the UK particularly GTi Engineering at Silverstone) began to recommend the then-new Mobil 1 oil to cope with this treatment. (In fact VW main agents offered Mobil 1 as an option when the 16V Golfs were serviced. You actually bought the oil over the counter and then handed it back for the mechanic to put in the car.) Some MK 2 16-valve GTis had an enormous appetite for oil, but mine used none. I mentioned this to GTi Engineering who said "You're not driving it properly." My next car was an even high-revving Toyota GTI but I've no idea what oil was used in this as it never used any oill between main-agent services and I sold it before the warranty expired.

[icelander]

As 6 months has passed since a last post on this thread - My best friend has purchased a little used 2005 JTD with 2.0 engine. Can anyone advise on Fiat engine oil - semi or full synthetic please and could a Duckhams Q 10/40 synthetic based oil green colour API SL/CF ACEA A3/B3 be safely used? As I have just found some FOC

[Brambles]

[QUOTE]icelander - 2007-02-23 4:04 PM As 6 months has passed since a last post on this thread - My best friend has purchased a little used 2005 JTD with 2.0 engine. Can anyone advise on Fiat engine oil - semi or full synthetic please and could a Duckhams Q 10/40 synthetic based oil green colour API SL/CF ACEA A3/B3 be safely used? As I have just found some FOC[/QUOTE] semi- synthetic 10/40 Acea B3 is required under normal conditions. The Duckhams will be fine as it meets the required specifcations. Incidently all duckhams oils are green , it's their tradmark. Going back to earlier posts and some points made. Not many realise oil filters actally often get clogged well before the oil needs changing and it is beneficial to change the oil filter between services. I just change the whole lot , oil and filter twice as often as recommended and sometimes more. Now, airfilters, I do not change them too often. reason is an airfilter does not actually reach it's peak filtration properties until it has done about 5000 miles and some dirt has built up on it. So if you change it too often you could actually be letting finer particles of dirt into the engine. J.

[icelander]

Thanks Brambles And flushing oil is it really needed. I have used some in the past in some vehicles but not in others - I just hate the thought of residues of flushing oil remaining Rob

[Brambles]

With modern oils and regular changes there is not need to use flushing oils. I agree residues of flushing oil would worry me. The only time flushing oil is really needed is if the engine is really clogged up with tarnish and carbon deposits. Lack of changes in some cars or lots of short trips can cause condensation to build up and you get an emulsion in the rocker cover. Then Flushing oil is useful to disolve the emulsion and flush it out. But if you get that problem the oil should be changed more often. The other thing with flushing oil is in an older engine it can loosen a lot of carbon and muck that then floats around and before getting trapped by the filter and can do a lot of damage to the soft metal bearings - better left well alone and just do regular oil changes which will slowly disolve the dirt. Another point is using full synthetic like Mobil1 in an older engine never been treated to such luxury is the amazing cleaning power of mobil1, it may loosen dirt over time and can cause more damage than good so best to stick to what has always been used in the engine. If you really want to flush out more of the old oil left in oil ways then drain the oil, put in a litre of good oil, run the engine on tick over and redrain, then change the oil filter and refill. Just my pennies worth etc, Jon.