Bulletguy Posted September 2, 2012 Author Share Posted September 2, 2012 robertandjean - 2012-09-02 4:07 PM Bullet Guy, our remark about commenting on smoking whilst enjoying a glass of vino overlooking the Meuse was clearly light hearted but must spell out things more in future. Yes we do enjoy, when in France a small glass of red wine before our evening meal; it is true that drinking alcohol in excess is stupid and no better than smoking but understand that medical opinion is that one glass of red wine every other day or so is beneficial to health. On the other hand just one puff is not! But enough of all this, not bothered if alcohol is banned the true pleausures in life involve travelling in our motorhomes to destinations like the aire here at Mouzon on the Meuse. (Italics)Yes I believe you! Likewise I also enjoy a beer when in any other country outside UK as I can relax outdoors, even inside in some countries, with a beer and ciggie. Used to be a crazy drinker ('shorts') when younger but saw what was happening and got away from it. Now i'm content with a couple of beers but drink zero alcohol if driving the following day when in any foreign country. Back home in UK my general consumption of alcohol amounts to no more than two litres......a year, often less. Like yourselves I also enjoy travelling though mostly outside the UK as I find it relaxing to be away from what I feel is an oppressive regime like lifestyle with folk forever preaching to others about what they should or should not do. Considering i've spent the majority of my touring in ex-Eastern bloc countries, that may seem strange, but for older people having spent years living under Communism, the control freakery exercised by the Stasi who encouraged family members to spy on each other, they know only too well the misery of living under a Dictatorship. And through all those years of Cold War, we in the West (particularly UK and the USA) banged on about the "evils of Communism". Somehow I don't think we learnt very much. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian Kirby Posted September 2, 2012 Share Posted September 2, 2012 Bulletguy - 2012-09-02 11:39 AM...................My Father died from cancer 18mths after retiring at 65. He never smoked one cigarette in his entire life. A cousin of mine, also a non-smoker, never even saw his 21st birthday and died from cancer. A very close friend of mine who gave up smoking thirty years ago is now battling the same cancer which killed my Father. Currently in the UK it's seen as 'trendy' to snipe at smokers and smoking. The same people who then go and 'shoot themselves in the foot' by indulging the pleasures of drinking alcohol, apparently oblivious to the damage alcohol causes. Alcohol can cause cancer (it's recently been medically proven so is now open knowledge), but apart from cirrhosis of the liver, causes untold misery to millions of people who suffer at the hands of alcoholics in the family home, not to mention the number of people killed by idiots drink driving. .............................. Oh, come off it BG! You must have known your post would stir up the hornets, otherwise, why did you post it? Your main complaint was that the state is nannying you, or seeking to, or may seek to, or some such. The clear implication of which to me is that you should be free to smoke where, and when, you see fit. Well, broadly you are, the only restrictions are over smoking where your smoke may harm others, which seems to me completely reasonable. The contention that smoking, and so-called passive smoking, cause and/or contribute to, serious health problems (not limited to cancer), is growing, has been clearly stated for over 50 years, is well researched, extensively peer reviewed, and seems to me pretty much irrefutable. Seeking to present yourself as some kind of public benefactor, because you choose to smoke, and may thereby save us the cost of supporting you in your dotage, while those of us who don't become spongers, is just a bit rich! Then, there are these poor souls you cite in support of you point of view, who died of (unspecified) cancers having never smoked. Where have you been? Cigarette smoke is not the only carcinogen in the environment. Others have been exposed to radioactivity at work and contract cancer for that reason. Many more have been exposed to asbestos fibres without realising it. Radon gas in people's homes can cause cancers. There are many other causes, including sunlight and diesel exhaust fumes. So, arguing that smoking is not necessarily so bad, because you can get "cancer" from in other ways, hardly convinces. However, I'll admit it is a novel variant on the old, "my granny smoked 40 a day for 80 years, died at 90, and reckoned it was only the fags that kept her going", line of argument. :-) One can die in all manner of ways, some self inflicted, some inflicted by others, some accidental. Die we all must, but most seem to prefer life, at least while it remains pleasurable to be alive. Most seek to distance themselves, within reason, from things that are demonstrably harmful, and most are grateful to be told where risks to health lie, as that they can avert them if they so wish. Your tirade against the "nanny state" merely seeks to shoot the messenger because, in time honoured fashion, you don't like the message. Where is the substance in the argument that because one thing is harmful, and another can be harmful, both are equally harmful? I'm sorry, that is chop logic. One is a known harm in pretty much any quantity: the other a harm if indulged to excess. So, drink in moderation, and the result is somewhere around benign. Where then is the harm? Such exaggerations do not enhance a point, they destroy it. I don't much care what you do, but complaining about advice that something you like is bad for you, instead of being grateful to be told, seems to me rather mean spirited. You don't have to accept the advice. You can still smoke. So, why complain? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bulletguy Posted September 2, 2012 Author Share Posted September 2, 2012 Brian Kirby - 2012-09-02 5:05 PM Oh, come off it BG! You must have known your post would stir up the hornets..... I don't much care what you do, but complaining about advice that something you like is bad for you, instead of being grateful to be told, seems to me rather mean spirited. I posted a link. The 'hornets' flew in after. I don't need anyone telling me what they think is "bad" for me and as you 'don't much care what I do'....you can come down from your Pulpit. Why it could possibly be seen as 'mean spirited' for not being 'grateful', simply beggars belief apart from the sheer pomposity of what you say. Your 'argument' lost all validity long back when descending to make personal snipes regarding an incident which occurred nine months ago (which could, and has, happened to other people as well). One day the same may happen to you and your remarks will come back to haunt you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest pelmetman Posted September 2, 2012 Share Posted September 2, 2012 The Nanny state requires healthy worker ants to provide for its insatiable appetite for tax ;-)...........and if we're all good little worker ants with no bad habits, then Nanny won't have to make us better and we can keep on providing tax for nanny :D Stuff you nanny..........................I'm a bone idle hedonist >:-) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brock Posted September 2, 2012 Share Posted September 2, 2012 There is irrefutable evidence that smoking is bad for you. So are most things in life in one shape or another. Just look at the skeletal injuries suffered by those trying to keep fit. I tend to avoid socialising with smokers now. I don't believe for one moment that smokers will lose sleep over that. I do not, though, believe we should ban smoking. As people have said on this site, once you do that, where do you stop? We will build a sterile life which will not provide any immunity to the nasty bacteria in life. I'm also against the continual rise of tax on tobacco. It's often the poor that smoke. The Paralympics have shown that we are one of the most tolerant countries in the world and both Olympics suggest we are one of the most admired. Let's be glad we can have a debate without Government intervention and let us be tolerant to those who want a different lifestyle. Carry on smoking, but respect the smoke free areas, please. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Colin Leake Posted September 2, 2012 Share Posted September 2, 2012 robertandjean - 2012-09-02 4:07 PM Bullet Guy, our remark about commenting on smoking whilst enjoying a glass of vino overlooking the Meuse was clearly light hearted but must spell out things more in future. Yes we do enjoy, when in France a small glass of red wine before our evening meal; it is true that drinking alcohol in excess is stupid and no better than smoking but understand that medical opinion is that one glass of red wine every other day or so is beneficial to health. On the other hand just one puff is not! But enough of all this, not bothered if alcohol is banned the true pleausures in life involve travelling in our motorhomes to destinations like the aire here at Mouzon on the Meuse. I read the advice about drinking one glass of red a day. Being a loving husband I drink two. One for myself and one for the wife who is a none drinker. She seems to be doing well on it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
747 Posted September 2, 2012 Share Posted September 2, 2012 As per usual I am reading posts on this forum with a raised eyebrow. People got on much better in our grandparents day because they did not have the leisure time, the access to information, or the aspirations to wealth. They did not have a Nanny State either. Why don't you just let people lead their lives the way that they want? They know all about the perils of Tobacco, Alcohol etc., they are not children, so why the need to abuse them. Your lifestyle puts you in the top few percent of the Billions that inhabit this Planet of ours and all you do is moan and bitch instead of thanking your lucky stars for what you DO have. It is well known that Rats are intelligent and thrive in communities.... until that community gets too overcrowded and then they get stressed and turn on each other. Some of you are showing underlying stress at your community members and are turning on them. Of course you may be under the impression that your very important view will be followed by the offenders. In fact ...... YOU ARE THE NANNY STATE with your diatribes to healthy living. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian Kirby Posted September 2, 2012 Share Posted September 2, 2012 Bulletguy - 2012-09-02 6:07 PM...............Your 'argument' lost all validity long back when descending to make personal snipes regarding an incident which occurred nine months ago (which could, and has, happened to other people as well). One day the same may happen to you and your remarks will come back to haunt you. Yes, I know it was rather cruel, but it was not a snipe, it was a quite clear and open criticism of what I still see as a double standard. No one told me of the risk was the tenor of those earlier posts, but when told of the risks in smoking, you apparently object. I think sweeping criticisms of the state as nannying generally cheap, unthinking, and lacking balance. So, in terms, I said so. That is my reaction to what you wrote. You are right, I may well be robbed some day, and I have not claimed that I shall not. It is a risk we take when we travel, wherever we travel. It will be my problem, my fault, and I shall have to live with it. I appreciate that it came as a shock to you, and I sympathise. But your reaction still sits oddly to me alongside your attitude to health warnings against smoking. Clearly you see no contradiction, so there is little point in trying to persuade you otherwise. Good day, and safe travels. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gwendolyn Posted September 2, 2012 Share Posted September 2, 2012 Yes, Nanny State has deprived us of much. Fancy bringing in the Truck Acts. And as for the Factory Acts - outrageous to stop children under 9 from working, and to limit 9 to 16 year olds to working only 16 hours a day. And Nanny stopped little boys from going up chimneys; helped us Dig for Victory; rationed our food; FORCED the post war children to have free clinic orange juice, and jabbed needles into us to stop us getting the ailments that our great grandparents enjoyed so much. Frightful deprivation of liberties. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nowtelse2do Posted September 2, 2012 Share Posted September 2, 2012 Gwendolyn - 2012-09-02 10:09 PM Yes, Nanny State has deprived us of much. Fancy bringing in the Truck Acts. And as for the Factory Acts - outrageous to stop children under 9 from working, and to limit 9 to 16 year olds to working only 16 hours a day. And Nanny stopped little boys from going up chimneys; helped us Dig for Victory; rationed our food; FORCED the post war children to have free clinic orange juice, and jabbed needles into us to stop us getting the ailments that our great grandparents enjoyed so much. Frightful deprivation of liberties. And being encouraged to smoke so the taxes received could help pay for some of the above. Dave Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gwendolyn Posted September 2, 2012 Share Posted September 2, 2012 nowtelse2do - 2012-09-02 10:43 PM Gwendolyn - 2012-09-02 10:09 PM Yes, Nanny State has deprived us of much. Fancy bringing in the Truck Acts. And as for the Factory Acts - outrageous to stop children under 9 from working, and to limit 9 to 16 year olds to working only 16 hours a day. And Nanny stopped little boys from going up chimneys; helped us Dig for Victory; rationed our food; FORCED the post war children to have free clinic orange juice, and jabbed needles into us to stop us getting the ailments that our great grandparents enjoyed so much. Frightful deprivation of liberties. And being encouraged to smoke so the taxes received could help pay for some of the above. Dave Oh yes. I was forgetting that poster campaign - "Your Country Needs You To Smoke". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest pelmetman Posted September 3, 2012 Share Posted September 3, 2012 Gwendolyn - 2012-09-02 10:57 PM nowtelse2do - 2012-09-02 10:43 PM Gwendolyn - 2012-09-02 10:09 PM Yes, Nanny State has deprived us of much. Fancy bringing in the Truck Acts. And as for the Factory Acts - outrageous to stop children under 9 from working, and to limit 9 to 16 year olds to working only 16 hours a day. And Nanny stopped little boys from going up chimneys; helped us Dig for Victory; rationed our food; FORCED the post war children to have free clinic orange juice, and jabbed needles into us to stop us getting the ailments that our great grandparents enjoyed so much. Frightful deprivation of liberties. And being encouraged to smoke so the taxes received could help pay for some of the above. Dave Oh yes. I was forgetting that poster campaign - "Your Country Needs You To Smoke". That reminds me ;-).............must get our chimney swept............anyone got a small child I can borrow? :D Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nowtelse2do Posted September 3, 2012 Share Posted September 3, 2012 pelmetman - 2012-09-03 8:14 AM That reminds me ;-).............must get our chimney swept............anyone got a small child I can borrow? :D Might be able to help you Dave, must warn you though he smokes :-D Joking apart, anyone, including myself should now be aware of health issues through smoking. There is enough evidence that it does harm people but some of us seem to be immune (for now) and it does not effect us, so we look at it in a different light and it becomes a bit of red flag being waved when something we have done for most of our lives is now in the sights of the ban everything brigade. I personally have cut down by two thirds, not because I thought it was harming me but from pressure off my family mainly due to their concerns for me and because I don't want to be a bad impression on my granddaughter. The main drawback has been that I got irritable very easy and my wife took the brunt of that, but now I'm use to the smaller amount smoked that phase has now passed. The other thing is I put on quite a bit more weight, so now I'm being told to loose weight, I don't think I'm winning no matter what I do *-) I think I've met my faults more than halfway but lets face it, we don't live in a perfect world and we never will. Dave Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bulletguy Posted September 3, 2012 Author Share Posted September 3, 2012 nowtelse2do - 2012-09-03 6:52 PM Joking apart, anyone, including myself should now be aware of health issues through smoking. There is enough evidence that it does harm people but some of us seem to be immune (for now) and it does not effect us, so we look at it in a different light and it becomes a bit of red flag being waved when something we have done for most of our lives is now in the sights of the ban everything brigade. Well now they want you to cut down on that nasty unhealthy habit of drinking tea. Only a matter of time before they start sticking pictures of penises on packs of tea. *-) *-) http://uk.lifestyle.yahoo.com/tea-drinking-men-prostate-cancer-risk-male.html Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest pelmetman Posted September 3, 2012 Share Posted September 3, 2012 nowtelse2do - 2012-09-03 6:52 PM pelmetman - 2012-09-03 8:14 AM That reminds me ;-).............must get our chimney swept............anyone got a small child I can borrow? :D Might be able to help you Dave, must warn you though he smokes :-D Joking apart, anyone, including myself should now be aware of health issues through smoking. There is enough evidence that it does harm people but some of us seem to be immune (for now) and it does not effect us, so we look at it in a different light and it becomes a bit of red flag being waved when something we have done for most of our lives is now in the sights of the ban everything brigade. I personally have cut down by two thirds, not because I thought it was harming me but from pressure off my family mainly due to their concerns for me and because I don't want to be a bad impression on my granddaughter. The main drawback has been that I got irritable very easy and my wife took the brunt of that, but now I'm use to the smaller amount smoked that phase has now passed. The other thing is I put on quite a bit more weight, so now I'm being told to loose weight, I don't think I'm winning no matter what I do *-) I think I've met my faults more than halfway but lets face it, we don't live in a perfect world and we never will. Dave Well done for cutting down Dave ;-).............Me I've never smoked nor any of my brothers or sister, which is somewhat surprising considering our parents smoked like chimneys, and we had a tobacconist's as part of my Dads hairdressing shop 8-).......... The trouble with Nanny State she always lectures, whilst conveniently forgetting her own vices *-).... As for which way to die 8-)...................When I see the life my Old Man has had since he retired, I'm not convinced 10 years of ill health is something to look forward too :-S ....................neither do I want to pop my clog's with a fortune in the bank *-).....................Which is why I've chosen the path I have..............Although Sue does her best to make me behave sensible :D...... I'd rather go early in one piece than have my mind go before me :-S...............Although given my pork pie and cheap wine habit.................I think my bodies in the lead (lol) (lol) (lol) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nowtelse2do Posted September 3, 2012 Share Posted September 3, 2012 Bulletguy - 2012-09-03 7:11 PM nowtelse2do - 2012-09-03 6:52 PM Joking apart, anyone, including myself should now be aware of health issues through smoking. There is enough evidence that it does harm people but some of us seem to be immune (for now) and it does not effect us, so we look at it in a different light and it becomes a bit of red flag being waved when something we have done for most of our lives is now in the sights of the ban everything brigade. Well now they want you to cut down on that nasty unhealthy habit of drinking tea. Only a matter of time before they start sticking pictures of penises on packs of tea. *-) *-) http://uk.lifestyle.yahoo.com/tea-drinking-men-prostate-cancer-risk-male.html Paul, it must be true because the research was done over a 37yr period with Scotish men and we all know thats all they can drink. :D Dave Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest pelmetman Posted September 3, 2012 Share Posted September 3, 2012 nowtelse2do - 2012-09-03 7:53 PM Bulletguy - 2012-09-03 7:11 PM nowtelse2do - 2012-09-03 6:52 PM Joking apart, anyone, including myself should now be aware of health issues through smoking. There is enough evidence that it does harm people but some of us seem to be immune (for now) and it does not effect us, so we look at it in a different light and it becomes a bit of red flag being waved when something we have done for most of our lives is now in the sights of the ban everything brigade. Well now they want you to cut down on that nasty unhealthy habit of drinking tea. Only a matter of time before they start sticking pictures of penises on packs of tea. *-) *-) http://uk.lifestyle.yahoo.com/tea-drinking-men-prostate-cancer-risk-male.html Paul, it must be true because the research was done over a 37yr period with Scotish men and we all know thats all they can drink. :D Dave Not quite sure why you'd put a picture of a willy on a packet of tea or anything else :-S...................As for the tea scare *-).............who funded it?.......the coffee council *-)....................To use that well hackney'd phrase..........Lie's...... dam lie's and statistics..........I'd best stick to the cheap wine :D Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nowtelse2do Posted September 3, 2012 Share Posted September 3, 2012 My tea is ok because they are tea bags, filter tips you see :-D penises on the packet must mean its the frothy kind, deadly stuff that :D be warned Dave Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest pelmetman Posted September 3, 2012 Share Posted September 3, 2012 nowtelse2do - 2012-09-03 8:10 PM My tea is ok because they are tea bags, filter tips you see :-D penises on the packet must mean its the frothy kind, deadly stuff that :D be warned Dave My old man will only allow 1 teabag for 3 cups of tea 8-) ......................and I thought I was tight (lol) (lol) (lol) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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