Frank McAuley Posted November 26, 2012 Share Posted November 26, 2012 I refer to above. With two motorhomes I have encountered problems with both devices and unfortunately whilst in other jurisdictions. In trying to avoid problems in the future I have been doing some research and quite by chance came upon a service "offering to remove " the DPF (not sure about the EGR) and reprogramme the ECU . Does anybody have any experience of this procedure or any advice concerning it? Tyou. 8-) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest pelmetman Posted November 26, 2012 Share Posted November 26, 2012 I had my ABS on the works van removed by my garage chap as it was cheaper than replacing it.............If its not there then the MOT bod can't fail you on it :D Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trooper Posted November 26, 2012 Share Posted November 26, 2012 It's a bit foolish to remove abs from a vehicle, it's possibly the biggest advance on safety on road vehicles, It's even getting on motorcycles. In the event of an accident which involved skidding the person who removed it could be blamed for any Injuries and damage, I would be a bit worried if I had done it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hallii Posted November 26, 2012 Share Posted November 26, 2012 The DPF (Particle filter) and EGR (Exhaust Gas Recirculating valve) are both fitted by the manufacturers to ensure they meet various emissions standards. Both can be removed, the on board computer may throw up a fault but that may or may not be able to be cleared. I would regard both as service items, albeit long term service items but thay will need replacing at some stage. Why modify an engine to defeat the manufacturers settings? You would not be allowed to do this in many European States and it may become the same here in the UK. The particle filter is simply replaced with length of pipe/fittings, the egr can be blanked off with a simple metal plate, but have regard to the possibility of fault codes being generated and the engine not performing as it was designed to do. H Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tracker Posted November 26, 2012 Share Posted November 26, 2012 The DPF in particular can be a pain in the particulars if you don't do enough fast miles to regenerate it and my solution, which isn't much help to the OP unfortunately is to buy a pre DPF Euro 4 engined van and a petrol hybrid car? There is no way I'm going to buy any diesel engined vehicle with a DPF all the while the makers are using their customers experiences to develop this unproven, and some might say misguided, technology whilst failing to take responsibility for the failings in their own design and application by repairing or replacing all failures because the owner drives too slow. Have you ever heard anything more outrageous than that?? Sorry Dave - but driving without ABS on cost grounds is bl%%dy stupid and irresponsible as far as I am concerned. ABS is one of the best safety aids you can get on any vehicle as well you would know if ever you have to stop in anger from 60 mph on a wet motorway or from 30 mph outside a school or from 20 mph on black ice. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kelly58 Posted November 26, 2012 Share Posted November 26, 2012 My sons Vauxhall Vans EGR valve was causing problems so we turned it 180 degres which blocked off the exhaust port this has given increased performance better fuel economy and cured the problem. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jhorsf Posted November 27, 2012 Share Posted November 27, 2012 I wonder if you told the insurance company you removed the ABS? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derek Uzzell Posted November 27, 2012 Share Posted November 27, 2012 jhorsf - 2012-11-27 6:05 AM I wonder if you told the insurance company you removed the ABS? What makes you think the vehicle was insured? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rayjsj Posted November 27, 2012 Share Posted November 27, 2012 I thought the original OP was talking about 'Non-safety ' related items, ie DPF and EGR, the 'stupid' idea of disconnecting ABS is a distraction. The other related topic is when you get your Catalytic Converter stolen, can you just stick a Stainless steel pipe in it's place ? I have an elderly neighbour who bought a new Diesel mini-car, mainly because of the very good MPG and nil Road tax, he has had nothing but trouble over the last 18 months, so much so that he has had to sell it (at a loss). He has been told that HE isn't driving it correctly ?? he has been driving for 60 years !! If these DPF filters do NOT work during normal driving (ie these are ' town' cars, so normal should mean, low,slow mileage). then they should not be fitted in the first place. I see NO reason, why they shouldn't be removed, and would remove mine, if it could be done without 'upsetting' the ECU, same goes for the 'Cat' and the 'EGR' . Just 'pushing out' Emission control' equipment without properly testing it under ALL conditions is not acceptable. Ray Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BGD Posted November 27, 2012 Share Posted November 27, 2012 We just bought a motorhome, at just one quarter the price of a new one, that has had utterly no problems whatsoever at any time with its DPF getting blocked up, nor with its EGR valve not working properly. Neither has it ever had, or will it have, its ludicrously-expensive-to-replace catalytic converter stolen. It's from 2001, on the Fiat 2.8 JTD base, so doesn't suffer from having any of those expensive, unreliable gizmos. :-D Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest pelmetman Posted November 27, 2012 Share Posted November 27, 2012 jhorsf - 2012-11-27 6:05 AM I wonder if you told the insurance company you removed the ABS? The ABS was an optional extra that I paid to have fitted ;-).........along with the semi auto box.......both of which I have now had removed *-).......As far as the insurance goes its now a bog standard 1999 Tranny :D........apart from the aircon which doesn't work either *-) Incidentally Horace hasn't got ABS :D..............although I am thinking of having power steering fitted B-) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest JudgeMental Posted November 27, 2012 Share Posted November 27, 2012 BGD - 2012-11-27 11:03 AM We just bought a motorhome, at just one quarter the price of a new one, that has had utterly no problems whatsoever at any time with its DPF getting blocked up, nor with its EGR valve not working properly. Neither has it ever had, or will it have, its ludicrously-expensive-to-replace catalytic converter stolen. It's from 2001, on the Fiat 2.8 JTD base, so doesn't suffer from having any of those expensive, unreliable gizmos. :-D But unfortunately compared to a modern van it's like driving a tractor.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest pelmetman Posted November 27, 2012 Share Posted November 27, 2012 Seeing the problems that are only just starting to emerge with these DPF and EGR gizmo's, and bearing in mind that the average motorhome sits on the drive 95% of the time ;-) I predict that they about to become the new "Juddergate" :D................Mind you it will probably help the resale value of pre gizmo vehicles B-) Only the other day the mechanic in my garage said if I was ever to sell the works van he'd like to buy it, because as he said they can be fixed easily and CHEAPLY ;-).......Just had the 3rd gearbox fitted in 136k miles *-)..............£360 quid including a new clutch............that's dam near the price of a Fiat wing mirror (lol) (lol) (lol) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nowtelse2do Posted November 27, 2012 Share Posted November 27, 2012 DPF and EGR were brought in because of the EU green polices of reducing pollution from diesel engines as quickly as possible. The engine manufacturers asked for more time than they were given so DPF, EGR and Ad-Blue were the quickest results for euro 3,4 and 5. Haven't a clue what will be needed for euro 6 engines, (iron-lung maybe) if so watch your weights. :-D Dave Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BGD Posted November 27, 2012 Share Posted November 27, 2012 JudgeMental - 2012-11-27 12:21 PM BGD - 2012-11-27 11:03 AM We just bought a motorhome, at just one quarter the price of a new one, that has had utterly no problems whatsoever at any time with its DPF getting blocked up, nor with its EGR valve not working properly. Neither has it ever had, or will it have, its ludicrously-expensive-to-replace catalytic converter stolen. It's from 2001, on the Fiat 2.8 JTD base, so doesn't suffer from having any of those expensive, unreliable gizmos. :-D But unfortunately compared to a modern van it's like driving a tractor.... Happy with driving my old tractor Eddie.........runs just fine, and at least it keeps going.............and the other 30 grand saved can go towards fuel and wine etc, not on Main Dealer prices for repair/replacement DPF's, EGR's and Cats............... :D Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave Newell Posted November 27, 2012 Share Posted November 27, 2012 pelmetman - 2012-11-27 12:23 PM Seeing the problems that are only just starting to emerge with these DPF and EGR gizmo's, and bearing in mind that the average motorhome sits on the drive 95% of the time ;-) I predict that they about to become the new "Juddergate" :D................Mind you it will probably help the resale value of pre gizmo vehicles B-) Only the other day the mechanic in my garage said if I was ever to sell the works van he'd like to buy it, because as he said they can be fixed easily and CHEAPLY ;-).......Just had the 3rd gearbox fitted in 136k miles *-)..............£360 quid including a new clutch............that's dam near the price of a Fiat wing mirror (lol) (lol) (lol) Hmmm really? 1999 vintage would have the old "banana" 2.5 diesel lump, clutch for this motor is between £50 and £120. MT754 5 speed gearbox second hand on Ebay is generally around £120 plus, new would be a lot more than that, doesn't leave a lot for labour (Autodata quotes 2.3 hours to replace the clutch so assuming £40 ph about a ton). So it would appear that you have had a clutch and second hand box fitted. assuming the last box was also second hand the fact its had three boxes in 136K is irrelevant. D. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest pelmetman Posted November 27, 2012 Share Posted November 27, 2012 Dave Newell - 2012-11-27 3:29 PM pelmetman - 2012-11-27 12:23 PM Seeing the problems that are only just starting to emerge with these DPF and EGR gizmo's, and bearing in mind that the average motorhome sits on the drive 95% of the time ;-) I predict that they about to become the new "Juddergate" :D................Mind you it will probably help the resale value of pre gizmo vehicles B-) Only the other day the mechanic in my garage said if I was ever to sell the works van he'd like to buy it, because as he said they can be fixed easily and CHEAPLY ;-).......Just had the 3rd gearbox fitted in 136k miles *-)..............£360 quid including a new clutch............that's dam near the price of a Fiat wing mirror (lol) (lol) (lol) Hmmm really? 1999 vintage would have the old "banana" 2.5 diesel lump, clutch for this motor is between £50 and £120. MT754 5 speed gearbox second hand on Ebay is generally around £120 plus, new would be a lot more than that, doesn't leave a lot for labour (Autodata quotes 2.3 hours to replace the clutch so assuming £40 ph about a ton). So it would appear that you have had a clutch and second hand box fitted. assuming the last box was also second hand the fact its had three boxes in 136K is irrelevant. D. Bill as follows ;-) Clutch kit....................£93.94 Oil..............................£12.00 Something?...............£10.00 Can't read his writing :D Gearbox.....................£120.00 Yes its a second hand one again, but the last one lasted 5 years B-) Labour.......................£125.00 Total .........................£360.94 I am just keeping the van ticking over until we manage to sell up, so there's little point in changing it or spending a lot on it :-S Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian Kirby Posted November 27, 2012 Share Posted November 27, 2012 Rayjsj - 2012-11-27 10:44 AM I thought the original OP was talking about 'Non-safety ' related items, ie DPF and EGR, the 'stupid' idea of disconnecting ABS is a distraction. The other related topic is when you get your Catalytic Converter stolen, can you just stick a Stainless steel pipe in it's place ? I have an elderly neighbour who bought a new Diesel mini-car, mainly because of the very good MPG and nil Road tax, he has had nothing but trouble over the last 18 months, so much so that he has had to sell it (at a loss). He has been told that HE isn't driving it correctly ?? he has been driving for 60 years !! If these DPF filters do NOT work during normal driving (ie these are ' town' cars, so normal should mean, low,slow mileage). then they should not be fitted in the first place. I see NO reason, why they shouldn't be removed, and would remove mine, if it could be done without 'upsetting' the ECU, same goes for the 'Cat' and the 'EGR' . Just 'pushing out' Emission control' equipment without properly testing it under ALL conditions is not acceptable. Ray On cars, cats and DPF's are fail items if not present at the MoT on vehicles originally fitted with them. However, on LCV's, which are the base vehicles for most motorhomes, it seems at least the cat can be substituted by a "de-cat tube", which is just a straight through pipe, and a lot cheaper than a new cat. It seems the above MoT rule does not apply to LCVs. It also seems that removal of the cat does not generally result in the emissions test failing. So, it might be worth replacing a stolen cat with a de-cat tube and getting the test done early. If it passes, no cat required. If it fails, a cat must be re-installed, but it seems in most cases in won't fail. I don't think city cars are necessarily sold on the assumption that mileage will be low. It is the size of the car that makes it a city car. The guidance for keeping a DPF happy is that it needs an occasional burst of speed to get the DPF hot enough to regenerate. Low mileage would not prevent that, it just means some of the miles need to be at higher speed. No vehicle thrives on continual low mileage and slow, stop start, driving. Most show their appreciation of a good dose of welly by emitting a cloud of crud from the exhaust, which is in any case what you need to do on your way to the MoT. These are just new driving techniques that have to be learnt as vehicles evolve. I knew people who double de-clutched with synchro gearboxes, because they couldn't adapt their habits to take advantage of change. To coin a phrase, the past is a different vehicle! :-) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest peter Posted November 27, 2012 Share Posted November 27, 2012 The thing that causes a lot of bad running and limp home mode, is the MAP (manifold absolute pressure) Sensor, which will shut down the turbo when faulty/dirty. It gets covered in the crud that the EGR sends into the manifold. It is very easy and cheap to either clean or replace. My wifes diesel corsa was really running rough, so I checked the EGR vave and it was working fine, but the MAP sensor was manky, so I replaced it for £15 and it now runs fine. Modern diesels do need a good thrashing every now and then or they do crud up the EGR and MAP sensor. See here. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Diesel_particulate_filter Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
crinklystarfish Posted November 28, 2012 Share Posted November 28, 2012 Given ready access to dealers and diagnostic equipment then I'd personally try to keep my emission gear / sensors / ecu in as standard a state as possible. The further away from areas supported by main dealerships I went / the dirtier the fuel I encountered, the more I'd be looking to junk as much as possible. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derek Uzzell Posted November 28, 2012 Share Posted November 28, 2012 pelmetman - 2012-11-27 12:23 PM Seeing the problems that are only just starting to emerge with these DPF and EGR gizmo's... EGR-valves have been fitted to Ford Transits going right back to the Mark 3, so your own Travelhome probably has one (unless someone has removed it of course). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ips Posted November 28, 2012 Share Posted November 28, 2012 DPF filters are a real pain. My ford kuga suffers from DPF warning light coming on every few weeks and I dont do short journeys and I do give it a good thrashing. In for service next week with garage chap under instruction to sort it cos its driving me mad also feels like power at low revs is down so I suspect the thing is clogged. have had a forced regen carried out and have had numerous attempts to cure with DPF additive but no joy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest pelmetman Posted November 28, 2012 Share Posted November 28, 2012 Derek Uzzell - 2012-11-28 9:57 AM pelmetman - 2012-11-27 12:23 PM Seeing the problems that are only just starting to emerge with these DPF and EGR gizmo's... EGR-valves have been fitted to Ford Transits going right back to the Mark 3, so your own Travelhome probably has one (unless someone has removed it of course). If it has it certainly won't be operated by a computer that's for sure ;-)...................what is a EGR anyway? :-S Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derek Uzzell Posted November 28, 2012 Share Posted November 28, 2012 pelmetman - 2012-11-28 10:37 AM ...what is a EGR anyway? :-S EGR is described here - you'll see from the "In diesel engines" section that EGR systems have their drawbacks http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Exhaust_gas_recirculation Using a blanking plate to replace a failed EGR-valve is a common ploy. This is an example http://compare.ebay.co.uk/like/110906041451?var=lv Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest pelmetman Posted November 28, 2012 Share Posted November 28, 2012 Very interesting Derek ;-)............So if I have one?.....and I have it removed.......I'll get better performance and mpg B-) Where should I look for it? :-S Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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