Gas-Lo System

[Dave Newell]

Vandaemon - 2012-11-30 4:41 PM

 

Just a technical question -

 

are there non-return valves on the filler entry on the cylinder itself and/or on the filler point on the van skirt.?

 

Can a full cylinder be disconnected and removed from the filler hose in the gas cupboard ?

 

Thanks

 

Alan

 

 

Yes, yes and yes.

 

D.

[trickydicky]

hi, we have had LPG since we started motorhoming 5 years ago and have never carried adaptors !!! if needed,the garages have always had a variety of adaptors behind the counter.

[Derek Uzzell]

JudgeMental - 2012-11-30 5:05 PM

 

So if I have this correctly, you are recommending warming the gas bottle on a BBQ type device? 8-)

 

There's discussion about gas-bottle/gas-locker heating in these earlier forum threads

 

http://www.outandaboutlive.co.uk/forums/Motorhomes/Motorhome-Matters/Propane-versus-Butane-for-MH-heating-/26378/31/

 

http://www.outandaboutlive.co.uk/forums/Motorhomes/Motorhome-Matters/DIY-heated-gas-locker-/2803/?posts=16

 

Borel used to offer a "chausson thermique" into which the base of a gas-bottle could be fitted where it would be warmed by the motorhome's blown-air system:

 

http://accessoires-camping-car.fr/produit.php?cat=25&souscat=63&pid=3450

 

This product no longer seems to be available, but Borel now markets a "ceinture chauffante" that wraps round the gas reservoir and heats it electrically. A potential downside of this is that a 220V power-supply is required. There's a photo towards the foot of this webpage:

 

http://www.borel.fr/index.php/gpl-vehicule-loisir.html

 

It shouldn't be too difficult to produce a DIY gas-bottle warmer using 12V heating cable, or using a pet/motorcycle heating pad. Whether the result would be considered 'safe' might be questionable though.

 

 

[Derek Uzzell]

trickydicky - 2012-11-30 9:40 PM

 

hi, we have had LPG since we started motorhoming 5 years ago and have never carried adaptors !!! if needed,the garages have always had a variety of adaptors behind the counter.

 

Each to his/her own but, as LPG filling adapters hardly cost a fortune and Sod's Law says that, sooner or later, you'll come across a garage that hasn't got one, it seems a peculier choice not to carry them. In my case I must carry an adapter when filling in the UK as I use an unmanned LPG pump. And, when I'm abroad, I certainly don't want to be wasting time trying to cadge the loan of a suitable adapter from a service-station attendant.

 

(There's a wide range of adapters shown on the following webpage and I note that replacement O-rings (mentioned earlier by George Collings) are also offered.)

 

http://www.autogasshop.co.uk/lpgautogas-filling-adapters-1-c.asp

[lennyhb]

Uncle Bulgaria - 2012-11-30 3:27 PM

 

Hello Iain,

 

I'm using a single, 11 Kg cylinder Gaslow. I have had no problems refilling in Europe. I carry the now normal set of 3 adaptors. A few weeks ago I raised a thread on Hints & Tips titled "Probane/Butane mixtures at low temperatures". Amongst the helpful responses was one form Derek Uzzell that described how the LPG sold in different European countries comprise a mixture of Propane and Butane in different proportions. Derek provided the following breakdown;

 

"This is my understanding of the 'mix' of European autogas.

 

LPG Composition (% by volume) as Automotive Fuel in Europe

 

Country Propane:Butane

 

Austria 50:50

Belgium 50:50

Denmark 50:50

France 35:65

Germany 90:10

Greece 20:80

Ireland 100:0

Italy 25:75

Netherlands 50:50

Spain 30:70

Sweden 95:5

United Kingdom 100:0

 

The higher the percentage of propane in the mix, the lower the ambient temperature that the gas will continue to vaporise at."

 

The point to note is that if you refill your Gaslow cylinder in Spain, Italy or Greece, the contents of your cylinder might be predominantly butane which, I believe, does not boil off at temperatures near or below freezing. I have had ice form on the outside of my Gaslow cylinder when demanding peak gas supply for the heating after a freezing night. So if you use your motorhome for trips during the cold parts of the winter there is a possibility that you might experience problems if the content of your cylinder is mainly butane.

 

Have a look at the thread on the Hint & Tips section for advice from folk more knowledgeable than me.

 

Richard.

 

My understanding is the Propane/Butane mix varies dependant of the time of year and the Propane content is increased during the colder months.

I always try to fill up in the UK although more expensive I like to know I have 100% propane on board.

[maggyd]

cerro - 2012-11-30 7:37 PM

 

I am in the process of fitting the gaslow system in my van, but I find it difficult to fit the filler out side the vehcle it can be done but with great difficuty on my van. my question is if I fit the filler in my rear boot locker between the bottles low down as stated in the instructions will I have difficulty when filling in france as Im told they dont like it.

 

 

We have just recently had a bottle fitted at Auto-Gas Carlton miniot, the fitter didnt want to drill through our new van so fitted the filler underneath on a bracket, it looks very neat it has a square cover.

[Derek Uzzell]

lennyhb - 2012-12-01 11:26 AM

 

My understanding is the Propane/Butane mix varies dependant of the time of year and the Propane content is increased during the colder months.

I always try to fill up in the UK although more expensive I like to know I have 100% propane on board.

 

This thread on the GAS-IT website states that "countries like Italy" (whatever that means!) make a seasonal alteration of the butane:propane ratio of their autogas.

 

http://www.gasit.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?tid=36&pid=58#pid58

 

(Obviously, in the UK, this won't happen as our autogas is (near enough) 100% propane.)

 

I've no idea which EU countries make the seasonal alteration just mentioned but, as autogas is intended as a vehicle fuel, a highish butane content will not necessarily be significant in cold weather provided that a vehicle's LPG conversion takes this factor into account.

 

Where a high butane percentage may well matter is when autogas is being used in a leisure vehicle to fuel 'domestic' appliances. That Borel warns of potential cold weather problems when using French autogas suggests that France may not increase the propane percentage in winter.

[Guest JudgeMental]

Dave Newell - 2012-11-30 8:15 PM

 

Vandaemon - 2012-11-30 4:41 PM

 

Just a technical question -

 

are there non-return valves on the filler entry on the cylinder itself and/or on the filler point on the van skirt.?

 

Can a full cylinder be disconnected and removed from the filler hose in the gas cupboard ?

 

Thanks

 

Alan

 

 

Yes, yes and yes.

 

D.

 

yeah but! there can be a litre of gas in the filling hose if you disconnect it..comes as a bit of a surprise I can tell you! It was Dave who explained this to me as I thought the non return valve had failed

 

we also have our filler mounted through floor and fixed to van sill. drill an additional whole and sleeve it, and not through the floor vent *-)

[Mel B]

maggyd - 2012-12-01 11:48 AM

 

We have just recently had a bottle fitted at Auto-Gas Carlton miniot, the fitter didnt want to drill through our new van so fitted the filler underneath on a bracket, it looks very neat it has a square cover.

Maggy - don't suppose you could post a picture could you ... I've mounted ours in the gas locker but it means opening the rear door and the locker door to fill which isn't a major problem but if it's hissing it down it could be fun! :-S

[cerro]

Thank you for your helpfull replys, Iv just priced a 1.6m connecting hose up with a view to fitting a bracket under neath the van out side £60 to £70 anyone know a safe but cheaper alterative.

[Cliffy]

cerro - 2012-12-01 10:48 PM

 

Thank you for your helpfull replys, Iv just priced a 1.6m connecting hose up with a view to fitting a bracket under neath the van out side £60 to £70 anyone know a safe but cheaper alterative.

 

Our filler point is inside the gas locker, it is fitted through a piece of 90deg angle screwed to the bottom of the locker so no need to drill the van side. You only need a little bit of room to get the bracket in.

 

I just have to open the locker door to gain access to it.

[Derek Uzzell]

cerro - 2012-12-01 10:48 PM

 

Thank you for your helpfull replys, Iv just priced a 1.6m connecting hose up with a view to fitting a bracket under neath the van out side £60 to £70 anyone know a safe but cheaper alterative.

 

The £60-£70 price you've quoted suggests that this is a 'kit' comprising a filler-hose (possibly braided stainless steel) and a filler-inlet. An example is shown here:

 

http://www.outdoorbits.com/gaslow-filling-kit-white-15m-4100-p-686.html

 

If you just want a filler hose, cheaper ones are advertised here:

 

http://www.autogasshop.co.uk/lpg-filler-hose-45-c.asp

 

and, if you want to mount the filler-inlet beneath the vehicle, some products that you might use are shown here:

 

http://www.autogasshop.co.uk/lpg-tank-external-fillers-41-c.asp

 

There's also a wide range of products advertised on the GAS-IT website that you could choose from to match your requirements:

 

http://www.gasit.co.uk/index.php?act=viewCat&catId=26

[Guest JudgeMental]

Mel B - 2012-12-01 9:43 PM

 

maggyd - 2012-12-01 11:48 AM

 

We have just recently had a bottle fitted at Auto-Gas Carlton miniot, the fitter didnt want to drill through our new van so fitted the filler underneath on a bracket, it looks very neat it has a square cover.

Maggy - don't suppose you could post a picture could you ... I've mounted ours in the gas locker but it means opening the rear door and the locker door to fill which isn't a major problem but if it's hissing it down it could be fun! :-S

 

You need a long fill hose. Drill hole through floor (don't use vent). Sleave to protect hose.You can buy a galvanised right angle bracket from gasit etc...Just drill and use self tapping screws to fit against sill seam.

Fit your filler to bracket...job done.

[Brian Kirby]

JudgeMental - 2012-11-30 5:05 PM

 

So if I have this correctly, you are recommending warming the gas bottle on a BBQ type device? 8-)

You could, if you had the to work the BBQ! But then, it seems you wouldn't really have a problem. I suppose you could try charcoal, but, in either event, I think I'd stand well back! :-D

 

Or, you could simply decamp to lower altitude for a while (where it should be warmer), or manoeuvre the van so the side with the gas locker is in the sun.

 

Ultimately, if winter camping in extreme conditions, the only solutions will be to buy, and use, a propane cylinder, or to get to somewhere warmer until the high butane mix has been used.

[maggyd]

Mel B - 2012-12-01 9:43 PM

 

maggyd - 2012-12-01 11:48 AM

 

We have just recently had a bottle fitted at Auto-Gas Carlton miniot, the fitter didnt want to drill through our new van so fitted the filler underneath on a bracket, it looks very neat it has a square cover.

Maggy - don't suppose you could post a picture could you ... I've mounted ours in the gas locker but it means opening the rear door and the locker door to fill which isn't a major problem but if it's hissing it down it could be fun! :-S

 

 

Yes Ill have a go Mel :-D you might have to p.m me with how to show you though!!

[maggyd]

Mel B - 2012-12-01 9:43 PM

 

maggyd - 2012-12-01 11:48 AM

 

We have just recently had a bottle fitted at Auto-Gas Carlton miniot, the fitter didnt want to drill through our new van so fitted the filler underneath on a bracket, it looks very neat it has a square cover.

Maggy - don't suppose you could post a picture could you ... I've mounted ours in the gas locker but it means opening the rear door and the locker door to fill which isn't a major problem but if it's hissing it down it could be fun! :-S

 

 

 

 

[maggyd]

maggyd - 2012-12-02 11:41 AM

 

Mel B - 2012-12-01 9:43 PM

 

maggyd - 2012-12-01 11:48 AM

 

We have just recently had a bottle fitted at Auto-Gas Carlton miniot, the fitter didnt want to drill through our new van so fitted the filler underneath on a bracket, it looks very neat it has a square cover.

Maggy - don't suppose you could post a picture could you ... I've mounted ours in the gas locker but it means opening the rear door and the locker door to fill which isn't a major problem but if it's hissing it down it could be fun! :-S

 

 

 

I sent pic to myself and it still was to large how do I reduce it again?

 

 

[maggyd]

 

 

>:-

 

SORRY FOLKS

[Mel B]

Maggy's fill point:

[Guest JudgeMental]

mine *-) ( :D )

[cerro]

Derek, I spoke to a few people and it was just the hose not the kit one was £92 but the cheapest I have come up with is £49.99 Just for the HOSE

[Guest JudgeMental]

1.2 £20

 

1.5 £3 more

 

http://www.gasit.co.uk/index.php?act=viewProd&productId=49

[K9GYN]

Is there any reason why the in locker filler cannot be fixed to the locker ceiling?? If I do this then I would only need a 0.5m hose and it is above the drop vent

[cerro]

Its not stainless. and like I said the cheapest is £49.00 upwards. ring them up and ask!!!!!!

[Derek Uzzell]

K9GYN - 2012-12-03 3:34 PM

 

Is there any reason why the in locker filler cannot be fixed to the locker ceiling?? If I do this then I would only need a 0.5m hose and it is above the drop vent

 

Welcome to the Out&AboutLive forums.

 

I can't think of any particular technical reason why you shouldn't attach an LPG filler-point to a motorhome gas-locker's ceiling, wall or floor. However, wherever you put the filler-point, it should be easily accessible when the bottle needs to be filled. This is something you'd need to consider carefully.

 

If the plan is not to have a remote filler-point external to the locker (which would avoid the need to open the motorhome's gas-locker door at the refilling stage), you might consider not using a filler-hose at all. Gaslow (and other refillable-bottle suppliers) offers a 'direct fill' adapter that attaches to a bottle's inlet. For example

 

http://www.gaslowdirect.com/epages/cyujrhdmmu67.sf/en_GB/?ObjectPath=/Shops/cyujrhdmmu67/Products/01-4400

 

If the design of your motorhome's gas-locker is such that you'll need to use a filler-hose+filler-point for easy bottle refilling, then that's what you'll need to do. But, if you can access the bottle's inlet easily with the LPG pump-gun, why not use a direct-fill adapter, avoiding the extra complication of a hose+bracket+filler-point arrangement and saving a few quid as well?