purple princess Posted January 2, 2013 Share Posted January 2, 2013 Sorry folks, I'm aware I'm on the motorhome section but its always much busier and I wondered if anyone had any good advice. Whilst our Bailey caravan is in the dealership for a service and some warranty work its "had an accident"!!!! After servicing it has been put in their compound, the following morning their staff have found that it has "made its way" right across the compound and has been found nose to nose with another caravan!!!! It has a large hole under the gas locker storage and the dealership have said they will be putting this right by putting a new front on (its now been with them since Nov 9th as Bailey didn't have a front panel ready!). Does anyone know if there could be damage to any other parts such as the a frame or the chassis, its a Bailey caravan at the Bailey dealership but we really don't know if there's anything else we can do??? Any advice would be very appreciated :)) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mel B Posted January 2, 2013 Share Posted January 2, 2013 Oh dear, your poor 'baby' ... I bet you weren't best pleased! >:-( You could try to insist on it being examined by an independent professional caravan repairer/engineer (not sure if the RAC or AA do this) to check that is all done perfectly and nothing else has been damaged - the dealership should pay for this of course. If you are a member of the Caravan Club it might be worth making a phone call to them for advice as this is one of the perks of membership, in fact they may have someone they can recommend to do the check for you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flicka Posted January 2, 2013 Share Posted January 2, 2013 Well - on the positive side the dealer appears to accepted his liability & is offering to replace the whole panel rather than a repair to the damaged panel. Fully agree with Mel's comment, but would add that preferably the work should also be checked by an independant surveyor on completion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian Kirby Posted January 2, 2013 Share Posted January 2, 2013 Might be worth checking what body repair expertise and facilities the dealer has, and whether Bailey approve them for such work, before they start. It will need some degree of skill, and possibly specific training to do well, so it is worth finding out whether the dealers workshop has staff with the appropriate skills and training. They have no option but to accept liability, as the van was in their sole care at the time of the damage, however caused. However, it will be considerably cheaper for the dealer to do the repairs themselves, which will cost them only parts and their own labour, than for them to have to foot the bill for someone else, possibly more competent, to do the work, and then have to pay the full commercial rate for labour. Being a cynic, that might be an incentive for them to take on something they can't really handle. Have you examined your van closely, to be sure nothing else has been damaged? As it seems the front took the impact, I would look carefully inside the gas locker for any signs of distortion, possibly to the bulkhead between locker and van interior, inside the van for damage to furniture in the vicinity of the impact area - remembering that items such as sofas may been have moved back to impact on furniture at their opposite end, and also all around the front panel where it joins the van walls and, if possible, the roof, since the panel may have distorted on impact and sprung back, possibly pushing such other elements out of shape in the process. Look for ripples in the side walls, especially around the forward windows or external locker openings. Try opening and closing all internal locker and cupboard doors near the front, lift all front seat bases to check if the bind, and look inside seat base lockers: just generally take your time and have a long, slow, check that the damage is limited to what is at first obvious. Like motorhomes, caravans tend to be very lightly built, and any body damage is prone to cause knock-on damage to adjoining areas. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hawcara Posted January 3, 2013 Share Posted January 3, 2013 I think the Caravan Club legal advice is a very sound suggestion. It may also be worth reminding the dealer that we are now into a new season and you require the van, that time is now of the essence and you would like a completion date for the work. Will be interested to hear how this all turns out. :-D Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AliB Posted January 3, 2013 Share Posted January 3, 2013 Is the dealer NCC (National Caravan Council ) approved? Although the NCC is primarily a trade organisation they do have a consumer section if you think you are being unfairly treated. http://www.thencc.org.uk/Con_Advice/Concilliation.aspx The NCC also work in conjunction with the CC and C&CC. http://www.approvedworkshops.co.uk/approved-touring-caravan-motorhome-servicing Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest JudgeMental Posted January 3, 2013 Share Posted January 3, 2013 Hawcara - 2013-01-03 9:28 AM I think the Caravan Club legal advice is a very sound suggestion. It may also be worth reminding the dealer that we are now into a new season and you require the van, that time is now of the essence and you would like a completion date for the work. Will be interested to hear how this all turns out. :-D Yes I agree but surely your insurers should be your first contact.... I once had a 4x4 truck (base vehicle for demountable camper) damaged while in for service on rear quarter...garage very apologetic, lent me a vehicle while repair was made. when I returned to pick it up very nice job I said but you have repaired the wrong side ( there was slight damage on other rear side) they where not very happy..but I ended up with a totally pristine truck :-D Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
afandy Posted January 3, 2013 Share Posted January 3, 2013 If it was my Caravan...I'd be ringing up Bailey the manufacturer to see if they could do it first.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ips Posted January 3, 2013 Share Posted January 3, 2013 I am very particular about were i park and what garage or dealer i trust my vehicles with. I would have been devastated if this happened to me and If it was a newish van would have demanded a replacement. Probably wouldn't get one but would certainly have tried. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wooie Posted January 3, 2013 Share Posted January 3, 2013 ips - 2013-01-03 12:53 PM I am very particular about were i park and what garage or dealer i trust my vehicles with. I would have been devastated if this happened to me and If it was a newish van would have demanded a replacement. Probably wouldn't get one but would certainly have tried. I think it`s safe to assume that it is quite new because " purple princess " does say it was in for a service and some warranty work so i imagine it`s under 3 years old. ( Not sure how long warranty is on caravans ) I`d certainly be looking for " Something More " than just a repair so as to compensate for the stress and worry that the owner is needlessly going through. Maybe some " Extras or possibly Free Servicing " if they feel they could trust the garage again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest JudgeMental Posted January 3, 2013 Share Posted January 3, 2013 it dont hurt to kick up a fuss and ask, but insurance only entitles you to be put back into the position you were in before the damage/claim.... I would demand extra payment as a damaged/repaired item must suffer when it comes to resale. buying used I would always ask if it has been damaged/repaired and if you fib and it is discovered...Oh lordy IPS "devastated" a bit strong dont you think?lol accident do happen you know.... :-D Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
purple princess Posted January 4, 2013 Author Share Posted January 4, 2013 Thank you all for your great advice. Yes Mel, I wasn't best pleased although I do appreciate accidents happen. In response to some of the comments our caravan is three years old, and is with the most reputable dealership (having won many awards)there is in the area. They are registered with the NCC, CC and CCC. They have a Bailey (and long list of others) approved workshop. Thats really just made it a little harder for us. (had it happened anywhere else these are the guys you'd send for) We do think they are more than capable of the repair, but, even after saying that sometimes there are more to these things than meet the eye. I think the advice to inspect inside sounds like really good advice. We are going to go back and take more pictures of the underside of the caravan and check for cracking etc. Our concern is the A frame (as this was the impact point with the other caravan. Whilst I don't think the dealership would try to "fob us off" I'm not sure how we check that the damage was only the front panel. (Any A frame ideas gratefully received) We'd also really like to know(but guess we never will) why after a"gold standard service" did it manage to make its way right across their gravelly uneven compound that is only on a slight slope!!!! Thanks again everyone :)) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
purple princess Posted January 4, 2013 Author Share Posted January 4, 2013 A couple of other things, we are CCC members, not Caravan Club. I've looked at teh info trom the CCC but can't find a legal department. Also we haven't contacted our insurance as we are quite sure that although we haven't made a claim they will still register it as such. Also does anyone know if things like this are registered with CRIS, we are now wondering if our caravan has just been seriously devalued???? :( Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest JudgeMental Posted January 4, 2013 Share Posted January 4, 2013 I'm sorry but the point of insurance is to take care of everything properly...... they will get their accessors/ engineers involved to look after your interests. *-) Seems like your more concerned with hiding the facts of this accident :-S Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
purple princess Posted January 4, 2013 Author Share Posted January 4, 2013 I'm not concerned with hiding the facts of the accident, the opposite of that. (I wouldn't have posted on here if I wanted to hide it) I'm just rather upset that none of this is our fault, we had taken it to the best place (we thought) available for work and are very concerned that a: we won't know whether there are any underlying problems with the caravan and b: this could result in costing us a lot of stress and money in the future! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest JudgeMental Posted January 5, 2013 Share Posted January 5, 2013 I really don't get this.......it could well be a right off if the impact was on A frame with enough force to need front of van replacing, caravan chassis are not that strong. has the dealer put it on a chassis jig and issued a report? only way to tell is for an engineer to inspect which means contacting your insurance. It's a no fault claim so what are you worried about..instead of all the guess work let your insurer represent you, it's what you pay them for *-) You need your head examined leaving it all in the hands of the dealer that caused the damage in the first place. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wooie Posted January 5, 2013 Share Posted January 5, 2013 purple princess - 2013-01-04 9:50 PM We'd also really like to know(but guess we never will) why after a"gold standard service" did it manage to make its way right across their gravelly uneven compound that is only on a slight slope!!!! Thanks again everyone :)) I would imagine that it`s quite simple really. " They Didn`t Put The Handbrake On " and then all it would take would be a gust of wind and it`s been rather windy recently and the " Large Slab Sided Box On Wheels " which is also quite light considering their size of it would quite happily " Trundle Across " the compound. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian Kirby Posted January 5, 2013 Share Posted January 5, 2013 JudgeMental - 2013-01-05 9:16 AM I really don't get this.......it could well be a right off if the impact was on A frame with enough force to need front of van replacing, caravan chassis are not that strong. has the dealer put it on a chassis jig and issued a report? only way to tell is for an engineer to inspect which means contacting your insurance. It's a no fault claim so what are you worried about..instead of all the guess work let your insurer represent you, it's what you pay them for *-) You need your head examined leaving it all in the hands of the dealer that caused the damage in the first place. Sorry, but I don't think this is necessarily sound advice, Eddie, or quite fair. First, AFAIK, there is no such thing as a "no fault" claim. Remember that famous insurance dictat, "it is a no claim bonus, not a no blame bonus". If you register a claim, your "risk profile" will be liable to alter, so even if no actual payout were made, your next premium could be raised as a consequence. Why should purple princess bear that cost? However, I do think it may be wise to seek advice from the insurer (as opposed to filing a claim) as to what to do under these circumstances. It is the dealer who has to accept legal liability (because the caravan was in their care), so it is the dealer's option whether they claim on their insurance, or bear the repair cost themselves. There may be access to legal advice under caravan, car, or household insurance policies. An independent assessment of the damage would be wise, especially as it now seems the A frame may have been subject to an impact. I'm sure either the CCC technical, or legal, advisory service (Legal Call: Legal Call is a free legal advice helpline for members. This free service from RAC, provides members with a free legal advice helpline 24 hours a day, seven days a week. You can call for advice on most private legal matters, not just limited to camping and caravanning related issues (some exclusions apply). Call 0845 130 7688) will know the whereabouts of an independent assessor, whose costs should be accepted by the dealer. Failing that, Bailey could always dispatch one of their "engineers" to the dealership to inspect and report. Photos would be very wise, and should be sent to Bailey and the insurer (under their guidance) to illustrate the scope of the damage. Presumably the other 'van was also damaged, so there must be some potential for dispute if the owner of that 'van is dissatisfied with eventual repairs - or was told the fault was purple princess's! Best to cover all the possibilities, I think. Given the description of the circumstances and the compound, it sounds a little as though a) the handbrake had not been applied and b) there was sufficient wind to move the van downslope. Alternatively, it may have been an attempted theft that went wrong and was abandoned. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest JudgeMental Posted January 5, 2013 Share Posted January 5, 2013 in my experience and frequent claims insurance has never changed when involved in a no fault claim...are you suggesting they pay for an engineers assessment themselves..plain daftm and as soon as they contact CCC or home insurers for legal advice, they will ask have you contacted your insurers...This is just cloaking and dishonest *-) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian Kirby Posted January 5, 2013 Share Posted January 5, 2013 Don't think honesty is the issue. This is not car insurance, but trailer (caravan) insurance where, AFAIK, there is not the same obligation to notify damage. More like house insurance. So, it is at the owners discretion whether or not they claim for damage repairs. However, the cost of any independent inspection should be borne by the dealer, as part of the overall repair cost, because the accident arose when the van was in the dealer's sole care. No need for purple princess to pay a penny, and may be entitled to some compensation for loss of use if repairs are protracted beyond a "reasonable" time. That is why I also attached the CCC legal helpline details. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest JudgeMental Posted January 5, 2013 Share Posted January 5, 2013 and why I asked has it been put on a chassis jig and evidence/report given....its the first thing that should be done before repair undertaken *-) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian Kirby Posted January 5, 2013 Share Posted January 5, 2013 I am happy to endorse your Lordship's advice. :-D Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest JudgeMental Posted January 5, 2013 Share Posted January 5, 2013 Brian Kirby - 2013-01-05 5:37 PM I am happy to endorse your Lordship's advice. :-D DAMN your insolence sir!!!! a POX on your weekend!!!! *-) ( :D ) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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