To work or not to work, that is the question

[nightrider]

Sadly I have come to the conclusion that a lot o my fellow Brits who are on the dole do not want to work, why is that?

[Guest pelmetman]

Its the benefit of a benefit culture Malcolm ;-)...............If you pay people to sit on their backsides ........they'll sit on them until they're too fat to work *-)

 

 

[AliB]

It's hard work just reading Chatterbox - and I don't get paid for it. Only halfway through the Bradford post and as yet have not learned anything about Bradford.

[Guest pelmetman]

AliB - 2013-05-13 10:42 AM

 

It's hard work just reading Chatterbox - and I don't get paid for it. Only halfway through the Bradford post and as yet have not learned anything about Bradford.

 

You'd better not start on the "RIP Maggie" thread Alistair ;-)........................Its now 19 pages long (lol) (lol)

[antony1969]

knight of the road - 2013-05-13 9:08 AM

 

Sadly I have come to the conclusion that a lot o my fellow Brits who are on the dole do not want to work, why is that?

 

Bloody hell Malc , I thought I was resident dunce . Its only taken seventy plus years to work that out ;-) well done you .

[Guest pelmetman]

antony1969 - 2013-05-13 3:53 PM

 

knight of the road - 2013-05-13 9:08 AM

 

Sadly I have come to the conclusion that a lot o my fellow Brits who are on the dole do not want to work, why is that?

 

Bloody hell Malc , I thought I was resident dunce . Its only taken seventy plus years to work that out ;-) well done you .

 

You can understand why businesses would rather employ eastern europeans *-)

[AliB]

pelmetman - 2013-05-13 12:41 PM

 

AliB - 2013-05-13 10:42 AM

 

It's hard work just reading Chatterbox - and I don't get paid for it. Only halfway through the Bradford post and as yet have not learned anything about Bradford.

 

You'd better not start on the "RIP Maggie" thread Alistair ;-)........................Its now 19 pages long (lol) (lol)

 

Thanks for the warning. I think I'll try Caravan Chat.

[nowtelse2do]

Malc, we both live in the same area as you know. You live at the other end of the valley from me and our towns have had the same problem now for a long time, the decline of the cotton industry and in our immediate area the shoe and slipper manufacturing, all gone, not one of them are left, why? because the companies closed them down and outsourced to Africa, Pakistan, India, Vietnam and the Philippines. Even these places are now loosing out to China,

 

Before that the shoe and slipper trade went to Italy and Portugal, now most of it has gone from there. So that leaves a lot of people who have not been able to find work. When I started work you could leave one job in the morning and start in another in the afternoon. At the moment Morrison's are opening a new store, nearly 900 people applied for just over 100 vacancies, So it shows that the majority do want work although I know quite a few that are happy to hold their hand out for benefits.

 

Dave

[Tracker]

nowtelse2do - 2013-05-13 9:26 PM

At the moment Morrison's are opening a new store, nearly 900 people applied for just over 100 vacancies, So it shows that the majority do want work although I know quite a few that are happy to hold their hand out for benefits.

 

Or could it be that several hundred only applied because the job centre told them too or risk losing benefit?

 

There is a big difference between applying for a job and wanting one and so many people have had lots of time to perfect their interview techniques to present themselves as unsuitable for any work.

[colin]

I'm guessing we all know people who would rather be collecting benifits off the state than work, but quite how many of the unemployed this is I don't know. The stats say that 2/3 of all claimments find work within 1 year so it's not the majority, and of the remaining 1/3 I don't know how many will actively avoid work.

What I do know is that the largest social payments from the government go to pensioners, but don't worry the present government is actively working to reduce this by increasing the age at which pensions are being paid, it's only a matter of time until we are expected to work until we drop. I can remember being told at school that more and more work would be done by robots and automation and we would have shorter working weeks and retire at an early age, wonder what happened about that.

[Guest 1footinthegrave]

knight of the road - 2013-05-13 9:08 AM

 

Sadly I have come to the conclusion that a lot o my fellow Brits who are on the dole do not want to work, why is that?

 

Perhaps your conclusion is wrong, see what Mandelson has finally admitted.

 

Labour sent out ‘search parties’ for immigrants to get them to come to the UK, Lord Mandelson has admitted.

In a stunning confirmation that the Blair and Brown governments deliberately engineered mass immigration, the former Cabinet Minister and spin doctor said New Labour sought out foreign workers.

 

He also conceded that the influx of arrivals meant the party’s traditional supporters are now unable to find work.

 

'I think we have to realise that the entry of migrants to the labour market is hard for people who are finding it very difficult to get jobs, or to keep jobs :-(

 

Perhaps we should all realise that also, not everyone is a scrounger that finds themselves out of work, I'm guessing many on here worked during a time of almost full employment, it is very different now, and quite frankly really gets my goat these kinds of sweeping statements that everyone is on the dole through choice, do you never hear of the people who have sent hundreds of job applications in, with not even a reply, no of course you haven't, because that does not fit your stereotype >:-(

 

Finally from well researched figures

 

The official count of unemployed people – anyone who is actively looking for work and is available to start immediately if hired – is 2.68 million That is around six people for every vacancy in the country. Even using the smaller group of just those currently claiming jobseeker's allowance, there are four jobseekers for each place. One million people aged 16-24 are currently looking for work.

 

Whichever measure is used, there are nowhere near enough vacancies to enable everyone currently looking for a job to find one, that is a simple indisputable fact.

[Guest 1footinthegrave]

1footinthegrave - 2013-05-14 6:07 AM

 

knight of the road - 2013-05-13 9:08 AM

 

Sadly I have come to the conclusion that a lot o my fellow Brits who are on the dole do not want to work, why is that?

 

Perhaps your conclusion is wrong, see what Mandelson has finally admitted.

 

Labour sent out ‘search parties’ for immigrants to get them to come to the UK, Lord Mandelson has admitted.

In a stunning confirmation that the Blair and Brown governments deliberately engineered mass immigration, the former Cabinet Minister and spin doctor said New Labour sought out foreign workers.

 

He also conceded that the influx of arrivals meant the party’s traditional supporters are now unable to find work.

 

'I think we have to realise that the entry of migrants to the labour market is hard for people who are finding it very difficult to get jobs, or to keep jobs :-(

 

Perhaps we should all realise that also, not everyone is a scrounger that finds themselves out of work, I'm guessing many on here worked during a time of almost full employment, it is very different now, and quite frankly really gets my goat these kinds of sweeping statements that everyone is on the dole through choice, do you never hear of the people who have sent hundreds of job applications in, with not even a reply, no of course you haven't, because that does not fit your stereotype >:-(

 

Finally from well researched figures

 

The official count of unemployed people – anyone who is actively looking for work and is available to start immediately if hired – is 2.68 million That is around six people for every vacancy in the country. Even using the smaller group of just those currently claiming jobseeker's allowance, there are four jobseekers for each place. One million people aged 16-24 are currently looking for work.

 

Whichever measure is used, there are nowhere near enough vacancies to enable everyone currently looking for a job to find one, that is a simple indisputable fact.

 

But when Costa Coffee advertised for three full-time and five part-time baristas to staff a new shop in the Mapperley area of the city, the company never could have imagined it would get 1,701 applicants in two months, some with 10 to 15 years' experience in retail behind them

[antony1969]

1footinthegrave - 2013-05-14 6:07 AM

 

knight of the road - 2013-05-13 9:08 AM

 

Sadly I have come to the conclusion that a lot o my fellow Brits who are on the dole do not want to work, why is that?

 

Perhaps your conclusion is wrong, see what Mandelson has finally admitted.

 

Labour sent out ‘search parties’ for immigrants to get them to come to the UK, Lord Mandelson has admitted.

In a stunning confirmation that the Blair and Brown governments deliberately engineered mass immigration, the former Cabinet Minister and spin doctor said New Labour sought out foreign workers.

 

He also conceded that the influx of arrivals meant the party’s traditional supporters are now unable to find work.

 

'I think we have to realise that the entry of migrants to the labour market is hard for people who are finding it very difficult to get jobs, or to keep jobs :-(

 

Perhaps we should all realise that also, not everyone is a scrounger that finds themselves out of work, I'm guessing many on here worked during a time of almost full employment, it is very different now, and quite frankly really gets my goat these kinds of sweeping statements that everyone is on the dole through choice, do you never hear of the people who have sent hundreds of job applications in, with not even a reply, no of course you haven't, because that does not fit your stereotype >:-(

 

Finally from well researched figures

 

The official count of unemployed people – anyone who is actively looking for work and is available to start immediately if hired – is 2.68 million That is around six people for every vacancy in the country. Even using the smaller group of just those currently claiming jobseeker's allowance, there are four jobseekers for each place. One million people aged 16-24 are currently looking for work.

 

Whichever measure is used, there are nowhere near enough vacancies to enable everyone currently looking for a job to find one, that is a simple indisputable fact.

 

 

Onefoot nobody has said everybody on the dole are dossers , just as nobody has said all Muslims are underage sexual predators , but to deny that a problem exists in both cases is madness .

[Guest pelmetman]

Just found it in the Express 8-)

 

Lord Mandelson: Labour sent search parties to entice migrants

 

LORD Mandelson came under fire last night for boasting about how Labour encouraged millions of immigrants to flock to Britain.

 

By: Macer HallPublished: Tue, May 14, 2013

7Comments

Lord Mandelson has joked over the huge influx of migrants in the UK

 

The former Labour Cabinet minister joked that in 2004 the Tony Blair government not only welcomed people to work but sent out search parties to find migrants because of staff shortages in some economic sectors.

 

Tories seized on his outburst as a confession that Labour had allowed Britain’s border controls to spiral out of control.

 

Lord Mandelson’s remarks were made to Labour activists at a weekend conference.

 

Annual net immigration soared by 65 per cent in 2004 after EU border controls with eastern Europe were relaxed.

 

Overall the figure quadrupled during Labour’s time in office with a total net influx of ­2.2million between 1997 and 2010.

 

Ed Miliband has neither the courage nor the conviction to face up to Labour’s undeniable litany of failures on immigration

Grant Shapps

Conservative Party chairman Grant Shapps said: “Peter Mandelson’s candid admission that Labour were purposefully letting immigration spiral out of control when in government is yet another damning indictment on their record on immigration.

 

“Yet Ed Miliband has neither the courage nor the conviction to face up to Labour’s undeniable litany of failures on immigration and refuses to back our new Immigration Bill.”

 

Speaking at a conference organised by Labour’s Progress group, Lord Mandelson said: “The issue of immigration is more economic than social. The problem has grown during the period of economic stagnation over the past five, six years, because in 2004 when as a Labour government we were not only welcoming people to come into this country to work, we were sending out search parties for people and encouraging them, in some cases, to take up work in this country because we were almost, a sort of full employment economy.

 

“The situation is different obviously now. We have to just realise and just take cognisance that the entry to the labour market of many people of non-British origin is hard for people who are finding it very difficult to find jobs, who find it hard to keep jobs. For these people immigration tends to loom large in their lives and in their worlds.

 

“Now that is an inescapable fact and we have to understand it, address it, engage with people in discussion about it.”

 

Labour faced more controversy over immigration last night when Gordon Brown, who once called for “British jobs for British ­workers”, accused the Tories of implementing the border control policies once demanded by the anti-immigration campaigner Enoch Powell.

 

In a speech in Scotland, the former prime minister said: “A party which was once pro-Europe is now anti-Europe.

 

“A party which was once anti-Powellite on ­immigration is now becoming very close to being Powellite on that issue.

 

Well that explains why the Poles gave Blair an award *-).................I wonder if Labour supporters will still stand by their party now they know how they were stabbed in the back.............maybe its time for the lemmings to turn >:-)

[Guest 1footinthegrave]

antony1969 - 2013-05-14 8:41 AM

 

1footinthegrave - 2013-05-14 6:07 AM

 

knight of the road - 2013-05-13 9:08 AM

 

Sadly I have come to the conclusion that a lot o my fellow Brits who are on the dole do not want to work, why is that?

 

Perhaps your conclusion is wrong, see what Mandelson has finally admitted.

 

Labour sent out ‘search parties’ for immigrants to get them to come to the UK, Lord Mandelson has admitted.

In a stunning confirmation that the Blair and Brown governments deliberately engineered mass immigration, the former Cabinet Minister and spin doctor said New Labour sought out foreign workers.

 

He also conceded that the influx of arrivals meant the party’s traditional supporters are now unable to find work.

 

'I think we have to realise that the entry of migrants to the labour market is hard for people who are finding it very difficult to get jobs, or to keep jobs :-(

 

Perhaps we should all realise that also, not everyone is a scrounger that finds themselves out of work, I'm guessing many on here worked during a time of almost full employment, it is very different now, and quite frankly really gets my goat these kinds of sweeping statements that everyone is on the dole through choice, do you never hear of the people who have sent hundreds of job applications in, with not even a reply, no of course you haven't, because that does not fit your stereotype >:-(

 

Finally from well researched figures

 

The official count of unemployed people – anyone who is actively looking for work and is available to start immediately if hired – is 2.68 million That is around six people for every vacancy in the country. Even using the smaller group of just those currently claiming jobseeker's allowance, there are four jobseekers for each place. One million people aged 16-24 are currently looking for work.

 

Whichever measure is used, there are nowhere near enough vacancies to enable everyone currently looking for a job to find one, that is a simple indisputable fact.

 

 

Onefoot nobody has said everybody on the dole are dossers , just as nobody has said all Muslims are underage sexual predators , but to deny that a problem exists in both cases is madness .

 

I'm sure there are more than enough under age White girls to go round, :-S

 

but are there more than enough jobs. In a utopian world if every vacancy was filled it would still leave around 2.2 million without a job,that's a fact that is undeniable.

 

And it stands repeating 1701 people applied for 3 full time, and 5 part time jobs in Nottingham, that leaves 1693 still looking.

:-S

[nowtelse2do]

Tracker - 2013-05-13 10:18 PM

 

nowtelse2do - 2013-05-13 9:26 PM

At the moment Morrison's are opening a new store, nearly 900 people applied for just over 100 vacancies, So it shows that the majority do want work although I know quite a few that are happy to hold their hand out for benefits.

 

Or could it be that several hundred only applied because the job centre told them too or risk losing benefit?

 

There is a big difference between applying for a job and wanting one and so many people have had lots of time to perfect their interview techniques to present themselves as unsuitable for any work.

 

That might be the case Rich but on the whole I think I'd sooner have about £250 (less deductions) in my pocket than whatever job seekers allowance is. The problem is that with no manufacturing jobs for unskilled labour, there is no work ,no matter whether you want a job or not.

 

To quote Colin, I also remember them saying we wouldn't need to work because robot's would be doing all the work, problem is all the robot's will be out of work before to long if things don't buck up. I wonder what they will spend their benefits on, oil and grease..!!!

 

Dave

 

[Guest 1footinthegrave]

You can live like a king on £65 a week JSA. about the amount of half a tank of diesel, or half a tyre on your motorhome. There but for the grace of God comes to mind.

 

Funny thing is there's rarely a rant on here about the likes of Richardson of the co-op bank that is now in deep crap, but he's been given 3.6 million quid to piss off. No JSA for him eh.

[antony1969]

There are obviously legitimate unfortunate folk unable to get a job in the line of work they would like and there are a lot of folk who do not care about working and it seems a lot of them live in Huddersfield .

Don't think anybody could live like a king on sixty five quid but you can live on it with careful planning , like our grandparents had to do every week every year . Sixty five quid may not buy beer an Xbox game or the latest trainers or phone but the essentials I think so .

[Guest pelmetman]

The new growth industry is self employment, as they were saying on the news yesterday, many companies are outsourcing work rather than employing staff ;-)...............

 

I've been doing it for years...........no troublesome employment regulations.........no being a unpaid social worker...............no redundancy costs........no pension costs......... :D

[Guest 1footinthegrave]

antony1969 - 2013-05-14 12:24 PM

 

There are obviously legitimate unfortunate folk unable to get a job in the line of work they would like and there are a lot of folk who do not care about working and it seems a lot of them live in Huddersfield .

Don't think anybody could live like a king on sixty five quid but you can live on it with careful planning , like our grandparents had to do every week every year . Sixty five quid may not buy beer an Xbox game or the latest trainers or phone but the essentials I think so .

 

Oh do come on, you seem like an intelligent bloke, don't fall for the Daily Mail crap, or IDS bulls**t. Better still add up your weekly outgoings, I live in a modest flat, and that amount after essential services, not Xboxes would leave me with £38 quid a week,but I guess they could all live on potato soup.

 

Back in the last recession in I think the eighties, the economy was on its knees, virtually everyone in our cul-de-sac was out of work through no fault of their own, except for one bloke who ironically worked at the job centre, and another couple who worked for the housing department. My wife and I had two small children to support, it was nothing short of horrific. The memory of that time still haunts me, you need to have experienced that level of despair first hand as we did.

 

Yes there are some that go out thieving, drug users, and the like, but this idea of everyone being like that is an affront to thousands, I'm only too happy not to be one of them,mind you I'm in my late sixties and done my nigh on 48 years of van,truck and bus driving, perhaps that's what folk should focus on,and count their blessings. ;-)

[RogerC]

1footinthegrave - 2013-05-14 12:43 PM

antony1969 - 2013-05-14 12:24 PMThere are obviously legitimate unfortunate folk unable to get a job in the line of work they would like and there are a lot of folk who do not care about working and it seems a lot of them live in Huddersfield .Don't think anybody could live like a king on sixty five quid but you can live on it with careful planning , like our grandparents had to do every week every year . Sixty five quid may not buy beer an Xbox game or the latest trainers or phone but the essentials I think so .

Oh do come on, you seem like an intelligent bloke, don't fall for the Daily Mail crap, or IDS bulls**t. Better still add up your weekly outgoings, I live in a modest flat, and that amount after essential services, not Xboxes would leave me with £38 quid a week,but I guess they could all live on potato soup.Back in the last recession in I think the eighties, the economy was on its knees, virtually everyone in our cul-de-sac was out of work through no fault of their own, except for one bloke who ironically worked at the job centre, and another couple who worked for the housing department. My wife and I had two small children to support, it was nothing short of horrific. The memory of that time still haunts me, you need to have experienced that level of despair first hand as we did.Yes there are some that go out thieving, drug users, and the like, but this idea of everyone being like that is an affront to thousands, I'm only too happy not to be one of them,mind you I'm in my late sixties and done my nigh on 48 years of van,truck and bus driving, perhaps that's what folk should focus on,and count their blessings. ;-)

 

Very true....as an Airman (junior rank) in the RAF in 1975 living in Married quarters (which we paid rent for in case anyone thinks otherwise) we were faced with the choice of paying the electricity bill or paying the car road tax and MoT.  Being on an RAF base in the middle of nowhere transport was essential but the car had to go and swiftly.  I took it to a 'Joe Blogs' car sales place 20 miles away...sold it and walked home. After that I think we left the base only 3 or 4 times in the next 12 months due to lack of private and public transport.  During that time both my wife and myself worked additional jobs picking sugarbeet and other crop picking jobs, whatever we could get just to make ends meet.  I count our blessings I was able to better myself over the years and have a supporting family.  Those that make the effort to find employment should be supported.  However those that 'work the system' in order to not work should be in the position I was in in 1974........no luxuries, no x box, no bling mobile phone, no fancy Nike trainers etc etc all paid for by the state. 

 

[antony1969]

1footinthegrave - 2013-05-14 12:43 PM

 

antony1969 - 2013-05-14 12:24 PM

 

There are obviously legitimate unfortunate folk unable to get a job in the line of work they would like and there are a lot of folk who do not care about working and it seems a lot of them live in Huddersfield .

Don't think anybody could live like a king on sixty five quid but you can live on it with careful planning , like our grandparents had to do every week every year . Sixty five quid may not buy beer an Xbox game or the latest trainers or phone but the essentials I think so .

 

Oh do come on, you seem like an intelligent bloke, don't fall for the Daily Mail crap, or IDS bulls**t. Better still add up your weekly outgoings, I live in a modest flat, and that amount after essential services, not Xboxes would leave me with £38 quid a week,but I guess they could all live on potato soup.

 

Back in the last recession in I think the eighties, the economy was on its knees, virtually everyone in our cul-de-sac was out of work through no fault of their own, except for one bloke who ironically worked at the job centre, and another couple who worked for the housing department. My wife and I had two small children to support, it was nothing short of horrific. The memory of that time still haunts me, you need to have experienced that level of despair first hand as we did.

 

Yes there are some that go out thieving, drug users, and the like, but this idea of everyone being like that is an affront to thousands, I'm only too happy not to be one of them,mind you I'm in my late sixties and done my nigh on 48 years of van,truck and bus driving, perhaps that's what folk should focus on,and count their blessings. ;-)

 

I'm self employed , my missus till last year also self employed so I know only too well the despair of wondering where the next penny is coming from , will the phone ring or is anybody coming in the shop today . That's something we have lived with for a long time with no state help at all during very lean times .

I say again that in my view sixty odd quid a week would be enough as was the intention with benefits to see you through . Now if your going to go buy packs of frozen burgers , frozen chips , ready made meals and the likes no it isn't going to last .

Again I say that not everybody is fiddling the system but there are a lot .

P. S many thanks for saying I'm intelligent , normally its thicko , nazi etc etc .

[Guest 1footinthegrave]

I'm pretty sure along with Labours now confessed engineering of flooding the UK with immigrants, as is now acknowledged " to rub peoples noses in diversity" they would have also known they would effectively be sentencing many to either a life on sickness benefits, or the dole, as happened to many in the coal and steel industries a couple of decades ago when all those industries collapsed, and the same thing has in my view been repeated in the last ten years with an over supply of labour.

 

I am passionate about this as I have in my family a son-in-law who quite literally has left no stone unturned to get a position, he is a reserve firefighter, but currently the only full time job he has been able to get is a cleaning supervisor on a holiday park, and that is only to the end of the summer season. No doubt he'll find himself back on the merry-go-round of failed applications, no replies, as has been the case for quite some time, and no doubt be written off by some that do not know him as a dosser when they see him at home during the day without knowing the facts.

 

You being self employed as you say face similar uncertainty, but when I read comments, some no doubt from cushy public sector employees, one of whom on here said he "retired" due to stress in his early forties, and others happy to crow about "packing it in" in their early fifties, like a pal of mine, another public sector worker on "ill health" retirement, while at the same time crowing about everyone "choosing" not to work really rattles my cage.

 

I've just had a look on our local job centre vacancies, there are 34. I'm not sure how many are registered as unemployed in our locality, but you can bet your bottom dollar it's more than 34.

 

[Guest pelmetman]

antony1969 - 2013-05-14 3:26 PM

P. S many thanks for saying I'm intelligent , normally its thicko , nazi etc etc .

 

You've fooled him Antony (lol)..............and just to cheer you up its p*ssing down here 8-)

[Guest 1footinthegrave]

pelmetman - 2013-05-14 6:31 PM

 

antony1969 - 2013-05-14 3:26 PM

P. S many thanks for saying I'm intelligent , normally its thicko , nazi etc etc .

 

You've fooled him Antony (lol)..............and just to cheer you up its p*ssing down here 8-)

 

I think he's mistaken the attributes normally applied to myself. :D oh and Islamophobic . >:-)

 

mind you these latest lot sentenced in Oxford for sexually assaulting young under age White girls doesn't help my phobia.