bikey Posted June 20, 2013 Share Posted June 20, 2013 Dear all, Has anybody else had problems with a towed car snaking with a aframe? We are towing a Smart car using a Chris cox a frame . Turned corner and front wheels of car violently wobbled side to side. Any help would be greatly appreciated. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mike B. Posted June 20, 2013 Share Posted June 20, 2013 Never had a problem towing a C1 with a Towbars-2Towcars A-frame. Never heard of a snaking problem with anyone going forward on here but maybe someone has Mike Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bolly1965 Posted June 20, 2013 Share Posted June 20, 2013 is this happeneing all the time or just a one off? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bikey Posted June 21, 2013 Author Share Posted June 21, 2013 Hi all, happened once in may, towed for 200 miles with no problem, and has just happened again at slow speed after turning a corner, car in neutral and has semi auto gearbox, was wondering if the car was trying to engage a gear? I really have no idea any help would be appreciated Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keithl Posted June 21, 2013 Share Posted June 21, 2013 Have you asked Chris Cox? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bikey Posted June 21, 2013 Author Share Posted June 21, 2013 Hi Chris Cox appears not to be around now but I do not think it is a frame problem I believe it is a problem with the car. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mike B. Posted June 21, 2013 Share Posted June 21, 2013 There was a problem with towing early Smart cars in neutral but I believe they rectified this on later models. It was not recommended at all to tow one as it affected the gearbox I think.. Is yours a new one or an early model? May be an idea to ask at the dealers where you bought the Smart if there is a problem towing your model Mike Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brambles Posted June 22, 2013 Share Posted June 22, 2013 Hi, Might be worth getting the Smart car steering checked for any worn joints. The wheels should castor correctly but like a supermarket trolley if there is any wear then wheel wobble can start. Also get the tracking checked. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
neilmac Posted June 22, 2013 Share Posted June 22, 2013 Does sound like the car's steering may not be self centering easily so would agree that the steering should be examined. Soft tyres could cause some drag in this respect too - does it drive correctly when not being towed? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bikey Posted June 22, 2013 Author Share Posted June 22, 2013 Hi all, thanks for your help, the smart is a 2008 1000cc semi auto box, serviced 3 months ago and mot but will get the steering checked, it seems to drive fine solo. , Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brambles Posted June 22, 2013 Share Posted June 22, 2013 It could also just be a case of straighting up too fast after a corner and the steering self centering over shoots and oscillates. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
docted Posted June 22, 2013 Share Posted June 22, 2013 Are you sure steering lock was unlocked both times? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DJP Posted June 22, 2013 Share Posted June 22, 2013 Hi It will ONLY happen when you turn a very tight corner and the Smart is on full lock or almost. When you have started to straighten up the van the steering on the Smart does not return or follow the path it is being taken. The only solution is when the Smart starts to snake or wag the back end of the van is to stop the whole outfit and start off again slowly, then the Smart car will start to follow the van as normal. It happened a lot to us when we had the Smart. A bit frightening the first time it did it, but a simple stop and slow restart sorts it out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bikey Posted June 22, 2013 Author Share Posted June 22, 2013 Hi all, thanks for your replies, as its happened to others i am not quite so worried now, would be interested to here if the problem has occured with other cars ie c1 aygo or other or is it just a smart car problem because of the narrow wheel base, am thinking of changing the car as we now need 4 seats. any suggestions on the best car to tow, motorhome is a arto 21ft long with 2.8jtd powerplant. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mike B. Posted June 22, 2013 Share Posted June 22, 2013 bikey - 2013-06-22 7:51 PM Hi all, thanks for your replies, as its happened to others i am not quite so worried now, would be interested to here if the problem has occured with other cars ie c1 aygo or other or is it just a smart car problem because of the narrow wheel base, am thinking of changing the car as we now need 4 seats. any suggestions on the best car to tow, motorhome is a arto 21ft long with 2.8jtd powerplant. We tow a C1 (Aygo) with a 2.8 Ducato and never had a problem with it. Our problem was with the overhang on the van it is easy to catch the front of the car if turning too tightly but soon stopped that! Our van is 7m and tows fine. Did have same problem with Bike trailer so problem was me not car! Mike Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DJP Posted June 23, 2013 Share Posted June 23, 2013 bikey - 2013-06-22 7:51 PM Hi all, thanks for your replies, as its happened to others i am not quite so worried now, would be interested to here if the problem has occured with other cars ie c1 aygo or other or is it just a smart car problem because of the narrow wheel base, am thinking of changing the car as we now need 4 seats. any suggestions on the best car to tow, motorhome is a arto 21ft long with 2.8jtd powerplant. We have had 2 Smarts, first on on a 52 plate second on a 10 plate, Fiat 500, Honda Jazz. and a Matiz. The only car that did have the problem was the 10 plate Smart.. All behind a 8.7mtr tag axle van. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mickydripin Posted June 23, 2013 Share Posted June 23, 2013 Hi I have a Toyota aygo and it is great I do not know it is there I have to keep looking in my rear camera to make sure I have a CI Carioca 694 with a 2.3 Fiat engine The only thing I make sure is to check and check everything two or three times before I move off that everything has been hooked up right. Mike. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brambles Posted June 24, 2013 Share Posted June 24, 2013 DJP - 2013-06-23 3:19 PM bikey - 2013-06-22 7:51 PM Hi all, thanks for your replies, as its happened to others i am not quite so worried now, would be interested to here if the problem has occured with other cars ie c1 aygo or other or is it just a smart car problem because of the narrow wheel base, am thinking of changing the car as we now need 4 seats. any suggestions on the best car to tow, motorhome is a arto 21ft long with 2.8jtd powerplant. We have had 2 Smarts, first on on a 52 plate second on a 10 plate, Fiat 500, Honda Jazz. and a Matiz. The only car that did have the problem was the 10 plate Smart.. All behind a 8.7mtr tag axle van. I am the opposite opinion and the fact it has happened to others whilst driving and the cure being to slow to a stop and start off again quite worrying. It shows there is someting inherently unstable about the set up with Smart Cars of a certain ilk. Indeed I would be worried if it can start to snake without knowing the cause and finding a fix. If it was an isolated case then there is hope there is an actual fault which can be repaired such as a worn joint. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tonyishuk Posted June 24, 2013 Share Posted June 24, 2013 Maybe a silly question but do cars on A frames need a rubber bungie cord on the steering wheel to aid self centering ? Rgds Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tonyfletcher Posted June 25, 2013 Share Posted June 25, 2013 Hi, Maybe completely different, but I encountered a similar thing recently. In my case I am convinced that it was the road itself with the grooves made by HGV's. The track width on the motorhome is wider than the car. therefore at some point there could a case that the towed vehicle is in the grooves whilst the Motorhome isn't and vice versa. Again in my opinion this could cause a 'snaking' feeling as each vehicle hopped in and out of the grooves I inspected all the tyres and couplings..All were ok Further down the road the feeling stopped Hope this gives you something to cross off the problem list before an expensive garage visit Cheers Tony *-) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mike B. Posted June 25, 2013 Share Posted June 25, 2013 tonyishuk - 2013-06-24 10:26 AM Maybe a silly question but do cars on A frames need a rubber bungie cord on the steering wheel to aid self centering ? Rgds Well the C1 doesn't but don't know about Smart cars Mike Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
euroserv Posted June 25, 2013 Share Posted June 25, 2013 I have never read about this problem, nor encountered it myself before today. If you think about it; the whole concept of dragging something that can steer where it likes behind your motor-home is absolutely stupid and inherently hazardous. You will scrub the hell out of your front tyres and will put a great deal of stress on mechanical components. What on earth are you all thinking? These devices should be illegal, and thankfully are in some (strangely) more enlightened countries. A towed vehicle should either be completely controlled by the towing vehicle (like a draw-bar) or have it's steered axle lifted off the ground. Anything that tries to get around the laws of physics will fail; and that is not safe. And while I am on the subject; your 2.3 or 2.8 engine is NOT going to live long and prosper if you are dragging your world and your car along behind you! Your clutch is NOT going to last very long, and you will be the first to bemoan it's 'short life'. Physics folks; physics! Hey, ho; that's just my opinion though.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tonyfletcher Posted June 25, 2013 Share Posted June 25, 2013 Hi In relation to scrubbing tyres, mine have been on the vehicle for nearly 30k recorded miles. It has been on the back of the Motorhome a further 10k miles, so the scrubbing theory does not add up. As for the Centralising of the car this is done automatically (providing the steering lock is off). The only way that a vehicle wanders is if there is some mechanical defect with the car (tracking etc) Not suggesting that anyone should do this but you may have taken both hands off the steering wheel at some point and noticed the vehicle drives in a straight line. Towing a car behind must be safer than a caravan, at least you have a wheel on each corner. I thought a Draw Bar still needed the steering wheel lock off to allow the wheels to turn? Tony (?) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
neilmac Posted June 25, 2013 Share Posted June 25, 2013 euroserv - 2013-06-25 3:32 PM If you think about it; the whole concept of dragging something that can steer where it likes behind your motor-home is absolutely stupid and inherently hazardous. Probably why a motor car is designed with a castor angle built in to its steering mechanism - which results in the car naturally steering straight ahead or wherever it is pulled in a forwards direction. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RogerC Posted June 25, 2013 Share Posted June 25, 2013 Just come back from Norfolk Broads....round trip of around 450 miles on A roads and motorways with our 2004 Smart Brabus Coupe on an Armitages A frame and had no problems at all. We also 'A' framed it all the way back from W Yorkshire with no problems. I don't know about other years but our Smart doesn't have a steering lock (in answer to the comment earlier in the thread). As for the 'physics physics...ban them' comment.....ain't you a ball of fun :-( Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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