chas Posted August 10, 2006 Share Posted August 10, 2006 Without being an alarmist, how happy are you with ferry sailings in the light of todays main story of police stopping a possible terrorist plot of blowing up U.K. planes? I have often thought how easy it could be to drive on to a ferry with a vehicle pack with explosives, suicide bombers dont care about themselves. Years ago at Dover they used to ask you if you had turned off your gas supply, but they dont now, and the drive through security area, they just seem to ask you where have you come from and where are you going ! Now I dont know what might be going on in the background on port security, hopefully a lot, but a plane can hold 200 people, but a ferry can hold up to 1000 or more, and the long distance ones from U.K. to Spain are well away from land and help. As I say we cannot be put off by terrorists, but ferry ports which of cause affects motorhomers , are they doing enough and showing they are doing enough to give us a little more peace of mind. chas Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest starspirit Posted August 10, 2006 Share Posted August 10, 2006 And the tunnel? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bognormike Posted August 10, 2006 Share Posted August 10, 2006 a big bang on a ferry isn't going to cause much damage in relation to a plane - it's not as if it's 30,000 feet in the air. Let's see how many people are charged after this, and then how many are brought to the courts. I suspect this may be used to deflect attention away from Israel / Lebanon. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest starspirit Posted August 10, 2006 Share Posted August 10, 2006 A big bang in the tunnel would make a lot of mess and a lot of publicity? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MOTORHOMER Posted August 10, 2006 Share Posted August 10, 2006 On our return from Dunquerke recently at checkin at 5 in the morning we were asked where we had come from. We said your carpark outside the booking office. We were then asked if we had checked under our vehicle that morning before driving round to check in. George had as he had to close the fresh water tap as we had offloaded the fresh water to allow for the wine etc we bought in Auchan. I never gave it a thought. They then turned to me & asked if I had checked the bunks. No bunks just the two beds we slept in. Oh what about the space above the cab. My reply no room for anyone there its full of our own stuff. Oh was the reply. No mention of the loo space. That would have been difficult as well. We only have a panel van conversion . Only enough room for us let alone anyone trying to hide. Our passports were taken & scanned. On board we were told that once all vehicles are loaded & the passenger access locked the vehicles are all security checked how I dont know. Arrival in UK. Just drove off. No one around anywhere. Motorhomer Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
enrico Posted August 10, 2006 Share Posted August 10, 2006 Very good point at ferry terminals and the tunnel. How they could check every vehicle thoroughly at both places would be an impossibility.A ferry or a train would never leave.How many hours would it take to check just one vehicle.Take an example of a lorry fully loaded with 20 tons of baked beans.How does anyone know whats in each can and its the same principal with a motorhome,shampoos,cleaning agents etc. I`m only pleased I`m not going on either this year but we can`t allow the terrorists to beat us so surely we must carry on as best we can. If I was booked to go on either a ferry or the tunnel then I would go.Who knows if the roof is going to fall in on me as I`m typing this?Phew thank god I`m still here (!) (!) (!) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chas Posted August 10, 2006 Author Share Posted August 10, 2006 Hi Bognormike-At 30000 ft you would not know anything about it, a big bang on the ferry is not going to cause much damage! I wonder what the souls on the Titanic would have thought of that. chas Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bognormike Posted August 10, 2006 Share Posted August 10, 2006 Chas I think you'll find that the Titanic was hit by an Iceberg in the middle of the Atlantic, not a subject of terrorist attack; The point I was trying to make was that a small amount of explosives on a ferry isn't going to cause as much damage as a similar one on a plane at 30,000 feet - it's normally terminal in the air, less so on a huge lump of steel travelling at 20knots, so not as much impact for the perpetrators' "cause". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mel B Posted August 10, 2006 Share Posted August 10, 2006 I sincerely hope that no-one finds out what the effect of such actions are, doing our bit to keep ourselves safe on ferries generally like turning off the gas would be a start. For those who leave keep their gas turned on whilst on ferries, what would you do if it did cause a fire? Quite apart from the problems that would come your way, legally, financially etc, the biggest problem you would face is living with your own conscience, especially if your actions caused others to face difficulties - eg their cars/caravans/motorhomes etc were destroyed in the process. Also, why should other's put themselves at risk to put out the fire that you've inadvertently caused. It would feel bad enough if you caused a fire by accident, but purposely leaving your gas on when you know you shouldn't, and especially those who leave their fridges running, would deserve all the trouble they would get as far as I'm concerned. As a pet owner I have no choice but to leave my dogs in the motorhome whilst travelling on ferries, knowing that some p*****k could have left his gas/fridge on nearby doesn't make this any easier. Also, it's smelly and polluted enough on the vehicle decks without the additional fumes etc from fridges. Stepping of soap box now ... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Dwight Posted August 10, 2006 Share Posted August 10, 2006 I think you will find that security on the Ferries is fairly tight, they might appear to have a lassafier attitude but!!!!!!!!!!!!!! why do think we are not allowed on the car deck. Once coming back with a caravan we locked it up etc. When we got home oily footprints on the carpet how come says we.. Talking to a friend who was heavily involved in the Tunnel project, said immigration/customs. Dont think that because you have locked your vehicle that is secure to all, theycheck all vehicles contents etc. Today we have dogs, machines, that can smell and alert handlers to different smells. We have a kennels near us who train Spaniels for sniffer work they are fantastic. As someone said whats the effect of blowing up a ferry, much more dramatic a plane or large building with lots of people around. This issue is so large that we have not the space on the forum for it. Just out of interest at work today our security has gone through the roof. If I was paranoid I would not come to work tomorrow. David Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
olley Posted August 10, 2006 Share Posted August 10, 2006 [QUOTE]Mel B - 2006-08-10 5:41 PM As a pet owner I have no choice but to leave my dogs in the motorhome whilst travelling on ferries, knowing that some p*****k could have left his gas/fridge on nearby doesn't make this any easier. Also, it's smelly and polluted enough on the vehicle decks without the additional fumes etc from fridges. Stepping of soap box now ... [/QUOTE] Strong words, why is my gas fridge going to cause a fire? does yours? If you think its that dangerous then I assume you must turn it off at night? The biggest cause of vehicle fires are Electrical, but do you turn off your battery isolator when you go on the ferry? (If you even have one) eurotunnel have recently agreed to allow fixed gas tanks for domestic use only to go on the tunnel, but not LPG vehicles powered, why? what is the logic behind that. very often these regulations are made by ill informed insurance companies, and people take them as gospel. Olley Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mel B Posted August 10, 2006 Share Posted August 10, 2006 Olley Read a previous posting by me on the subject of a fire in our motorhome and you'll understand where I'm coming from. Having a fire caused by a gas leak isn't fun I can assure you and you simply can't know whether or not your gas installations are totally safe so in my book, where sensible to do so, safety always has to come first. So long as a fridge isn't opened it will keep the contents cold for a long time. Mel B Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
olley Posted August 10, 2006 Share Posted August 10, 2006 Hi mel no problem with turning the fridge off its just i can't see a overriding reason to do so. Yes gas fires are nasty, ditto for electrical, and a gas leak can be dangerous, but all my pipework is under the van, and as LPG is heavier than air it would go down not up to the fridge. I think what would be interesting is to find official figures for ferry fires and their causes. The only thing I can find was give in a parlimentary reply http://www.publications.parliament.uk/pa/cm199091/cmhansrd/1991-07-02/Writtens-1.html This list's 7 serious fires between 79-88 but not their cause. Some I would expect were ferry engine fires as here in 2002 http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/1998063.stm Olley Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Terrytraveller Posted August 10, 2006 Share Posted August 10, 2006 I have actually seen a fire jump from a pilot light to a fracture in a gas pipe a few inches away from the pilot light. I think its downright dangerous to leave a fridge alight on the ferry. You are sure you had no gas leaks when you checked before your journey, but what about the pothole you struck, or braking fiercely during your journey to the ferry port, can you really be sure your gas system is as gas tight after a journey? Why do you need to have the fridge on, the food won't defrost for the couple of hours the fridge is off anyway. There is no food shortage on the other side of the water, I expect everyone carries dry rations as well. If the sea crossing is rough or the ferry rolls, is it possible for liquid lpg to enter the system, there has been alot of talk today of liquid explosives, is not lpg one of those? I really do feel it's mean for people not to turn their gas supplies off, right or wrong - I think I am more valuable than a couple of pork chops! Regards Terry Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Geoff Bell Posted August 10, 2006 Share Posted August 10, 2006 Am I being stupid, but don't most motorhome fridges also work on 12v so why not run off the battery when travelling and presumably off the leisure battery when on the ferry. That what I do. Why would you want to use up your gas anyway. I,ve a feeling I,m missing something here. Apologies but I am a relative newcomer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Terrytraveller Posted August 10, 2006 Share Posted August 10, 2006 Hi Geoff, I think you will find 99.9% of campingcar fridge work on either 240vac, gas or 12vdc only when the engine is running. There are some compressor fridge/freezers that do run on 12vdc from the leisure battery, but these are the exception rather than the rule. Regards Terry Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Geoff Bell Posted August 10, 2006 Share Posted August 10, 2006 So now I know, obviously when on the ferry the fridge is not working when switched to 12v but then as mentioned on other posts most fridges in good order will stay cold for the duration of most ferry crossings. It isn't necessary to switch over to gas and take the risk. You learn something every day. What exactly are you strapped in TT in your photo. Racing car , light aircraft or staright jacket. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Dwight Posted August 10, 2006 Share Posted August 10, 2006 Hi Geoff, Ther was a thread a couple of weeks back on Fridges running on 12v. mine certainly do's. The issue being on the previous thread was battery going flat within a few hours, all very technical. Recently on holiday ours ran overnight on 12v on two occasions without a flat battery. I was also told years ago that a fridge will run on gas if there is only the smell left it uses so little. We always turn the gas off before we move off site, better safe than sorry. David Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chas Posted August 10, 2006 Author Share Posted August 10, 2006 Hi David- you seem to think that it could be possible for the vehicles to be opened up on the car decks to check what may be in them, perhaps from a tip off, but I just cant see that being practical with the amount of vehicles being carried. I think that the reason no one is allowed on the car deck after setting sail is to prevent any theft taking place, and leaving the ferry company open to claims. There seems to be the idea that O.K avery small package of explosive in an aircraft could ,and would cause a disaster. That a large ferry would only have a bang and a small fire, think along the lines of a vehicle with that type of explosive filling 6 suitcases ! The point of the original question was, are you happy with the security of ferrys and ports and could more be done to screen vehicles, O.K. it might slow things down a little, but airline passengers now accept this as a thing of the times. chas Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
colin Posted August 10, 2006 Share Posted August 10, 2006 [QUOTE]chas - 2006-08-10 1:42 PM Hi Bognormike-At 30000 ft you would not know anything about it, a big bang on the ferry is not going to cause much damage! I wonder what the souls on the Titanic would have thought of that. chas[/QUOTE] It would be easier on the mind to think that an explosion on an aircraft kills everybody instantly, but I'm afraid it dosn't work like that. Even on the space shuttle they didn't all die till it hit the deck and inflight explosions don't come much bigger than that. When you are thinking about how evil the people are who do this sort of thing just remember they haven't 'just' killed people but the last few moments of there life will have been absolute terror, same goes for victims of bombings on ground, they don't all die instantly, but who's going to tell a relative that? I know this posting is a real downer but I think it needs saying Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chas Posted August 10, 2006 Author Share Posted August 10, 2006 Hi Colin- you probably are right, and it certainly is a upsetting topic, but the original question was are we, as motorhomers who use the ferrys, perhaps several times a year, happy with ferry and port security, knowing as we do how fanatical these people are. chas Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Terrytraveller Posted August 10, 2006 Share Posted August 10, 2006 Hi Geoff, It's a Ka13 and I am off for my first solo flight, the instructor reckoned I was too dangerous to fly with and said I should go up by myself!!! Have a look at http://www.cotswoldgliding.co.uk/ , they do daily/weekly course's as well as trial flights, and there are electric pitches available(sometimes) for those on a course or a flight. There is a good aerial view of the site and camper emplacements on the web page, they also advertise in MMM. We can all drive a camper at fifty knots - can't we? so you can drive a glider - no problem, and I can guarantee that after every ground run and take off - you will return to earth (lol) Regards Terry Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vixters other half Posted August 10, 2006 Share Posted August 10, 2006 As a frequent traveller both by air and ferry, I would like to alay some fears regarding security, based on my own experience. Just because you dont see armed guards, barbed wire and guard dogs doesn't mean there is no security, good security is not always apparent. use your common sense when travelling - you are more likely to be the target of an illegal immigrant than a martyr. But most of all dont let the threat stop you from doing what you want - the terrorist will have won then. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Geoff Bell Posted August 10, 2006 Share Posted August 10, 2006 Whilst we are all on a downer, without making light of the subject and 9/11 aside, terrorism is an extreemley inefficent means of killing people. and the chances of you being a victim are minute. However it is a very efficient means of causing chaos, upheavel and terror.They need the media to spread the news and in 2006 it travels the world in seconds. More people die of the common cold or mrsa. Sleep well in your motorhomes tonight. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bjphillips Posted August 15, 2006 Share Posted August 15, 2006 Having sailed from Plymouth recently on 2 occasions my M/H was breifly searched on the outward journey & we were asked several questions about what we had on board & where we were going etc.On the return we were waved straight through!!! We were questioned the same when going across to Roskoff on our motorbike but allowed straight through on our return,maybe they thought we were returning illegal asylum seekers!!! (lol) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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