Brambles Posted April 28, 2014 Share Posted April 28, 2014 Got myself a set of four 215/R70 15 Q Agilis camping tyres from Autoteilestore, market place seller on Amazon, for £433.92 delivered which I thought was a very good price. Local Garage will fit for £15 per tyre which seems Ok. Arrived this morning. Date code 0414 which is Ok Well chuffed, and have Schrader bolt in valves as per orginal fitted coming from Auto4 who have specially ordered them for me (box of 10). I know I could have bought the new alligator high pressure valves but I wanted same as already fitted as served me well. Actually have found they wipe clean and come up shiny, could have just fitted new 'o'ring seals but new ones on order now. What I will do with 5 spare ones I do not know...sell on Ebay maybe. Tyres came in 3 days by DPD tracked and in perfect condition. Gosh I love the smell of new rubber!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LordThornber Posted April 28, 2014 Share Posted April 28, 2014 Proper tyres, I won't have anything less. Good choice. Kwik Fit currently doing 4 fitted by their mobile fitter for £470 inc valves and old tyre removal so not much in it really. It's where I got my last set. Martyn Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Airstream Posted April 28, 2014 Share Posted April 28, 2014 Hi, Should be lots around now that Swift are fitting Chinese tyres as standard Ray Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brambles Posted April 28, 2014 Author Share Posted April 28, 2014 LordThornber - 2014-04-28 8:57 PM Proper tyres, I won't have anything less. Good choice. Kwik Fit currently doing 4 fitted by their mobile fitter for £470 inc valves and old tyre removal so not much in it really. It's where I got my last set. Martyn I could not get a quote online or find Agilis camping on Kwikfit site so gave up on them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sshortcircuit Posted April 29, 2014 Share Posted April 29, 2014 My Michelin camping tyres are being replaced after 45000 miles so have done very well. You appear to have a good deal but I could not get a realistic price on Michelin so am giving Hankook a try as I do not buy a "name". Will wait and see. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derek Uzzell Posted April 29, 2014 Share Posted April 29, 2014 Brambles An English-language Schrader catalogue can be downloaded from here http://tinyurl.com/nwmjyhg From your reference to "O-ring seals" I assume you will have opted for the 65765-68 valve shown at the foot of Page 13. When I was looking for clamp-in tyre valves for my Transit's wheels I contacted Schrader(UK) who gave me a set of 10 valves, but these were the S-4298-2 type shown on Page 14 (though 'mine' had a metal cap). The across-flats width of those valves' tightening-down nut would have made it tricky to fit them to my motorhome's wheels so I chose instead to use the Alligator valve (bought via Auto4) shown here http://tinyurl.com/kqu9oh4 (It's interesting to note the significant difference in the nut tightening torque for the Schrader O-ring valves (12-15Nm) to that of the Schrader valves with a stepped base-seal (3-6Nm), and the variation generally in nut tightening torque recommendations.) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LordThornber Posted April 29, 2014 Share Posted April 29, 2014 Brambles - 2014-04-28 10:38 Pm I could not get a quote online or find Agilis camping on Kwikfit site so gave up on them. It's a postcode driven system they operate for supplying so it's possible they'd nothing available in your location. On my quote, the Agilis was the only tyre on the premium section, says it all for me really. Martyn Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derek Uzzell Posted April 29, 2014 Share Posted April 29, 2014 LordThornber - 2014-04-29 7:58 AM Brambles - 2014-04-28 10:38 Pm I could not get a quote online or find Agilis camping on Kwikfit site so gave up on them. It's a postcode driven system they operate for supplying so it's possible they'd nothing available in your location. On my quote, the Agilis was the only tyre on the premium section, says it all for me really. Martyn You might want to consider that a) Michelin no longer has the contract with Fiat to supply the Italian SEVEL factory with 'camping-car' tyres for chassis destined for coachbuilt motorhome conversion (Continental "VancoCamper" tyres are now factory-fitted) and b) "VancoCamper" performed significantly better than Michelin's "Agilis Camping" when pro-mobil magazine carried out comparative testing last year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Airstream Posted April 29, 2014 Share Posted April 29, 2014 Derek Uzzell - 2014-04-29 8:33 AM LordThornber - 2014-04-29 7:58 AM Brambles - 2014-04-28 10:38 Pm I could not get a quote online or find Agilis camping on Kwikfit site so gave up on them. It's a postcode driven system they operate for supplying so it's possible they'd nothing available in your location. On my quote, the Agilis was the only tyre on the premium section, says it all for me really. Martyn You might want to consider that a) Michelin no longer has the contract with Fiat to supply the Italian SEVEL factory with 'camping-car' tyres for chassis destined for coachbuilt motorhome conversion (Continental "VancoCamper" tyres are now factory-fitted) and b) "VancoCamper" performed significantly better than Michelin's "Agilis Camping" when pro-mobil magazine carried out comparative testing last year. Unless you buy a Swift Ray Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brambles Posted April 29, 2014 Author Share Posted April 29, 2014 Derek Uzzell - 2014-04-29 7:52 AM Brambles An English-language Schrader catalogue can be downloaded from here http://tinyurl.com/nwmjyhg From your reference to "O-ring seals" I assume you will have opted for the 65765-68 valve shown at the foot of Page 13. When I was looking for clamp-in tyre valves for my Transit's wheels I contacted Schrader(UK) who gave me a set of 10 valves, but these were the S-4298-2 type shown on Page 14 (though 'mine' had a metal cap). The across-flats width of those valves' tightening-down nut would have made it tricky to fit them to my motorhome's wheels so I chose instead to use the Alligator valve (bought via Auto4) shown here http://tinyurl.com/kqu9oh4 (It's interesting to note the significant difference in the nut tightening torque for the Schrader O-ring valves (12-15Nm) to that of the Schrader valves with a stepped base-seal (3-6Nm), and the variation generally in nut tightening torque recommendations.) Hi Derek, you assume correct. It is 65765-68, -68 meaning box of ten. Schrader UK put me onto Auto4 who could order at discount from Schrader and probably sell cheaper which indeed turned out to be correct. Instead of 34.76 +vat + delivery, was 19.76+ 5 delivery + vat. These are the same as OEM fitted. Cheaper metal clamp ins had as you mention have problems in positioning of the nut flats and clearance. I went for original type, because there are no questions as to form fit or function. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brambles Posted April 29, 2014 Author Share Posted April 29, 2014 LordThornber - 2014-04-29 7:58 AM Brambles - 2014-04-28 10:38 Pm I could not get a quote online or find Agilis camping on Kwikfit site so gave up on them. It's a postcode driven system they operate for supplying so it's possible they'd nothing available in your location. On my quote, the Agilis was the only tyre on the premium section, says it all for me really. Martyn Ahhh! Never thought or noticed about post code area. I know some tyre dealers alter prices for different regions to remain competative. I remember buying tyres for one of my cars and got a price ftom ATS Euromaster...way too expensive for me in Dundee. I was next in Leominster a few days later and decided I really needed tyres and popped into ATS Euromaster there and they were far cheaper. I also asked Watson Tyres???? in Hereford , think it is called ETB tyres across from Sainsburys I always have called them Watsons tyres rightly or wrongly, and they were even cheaper so bought them there and then. Derek will know where I mean. Miss my jaunts to Leomister and Hereford to visit late Inlaws. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derek Uzzell Posted April 30, 2014 Share Posted April 30, 2014 Airstream - 2014-04-29 9:22 AM ...Unless you buy a Swift Ray Ray Do you know which DMACK tyre Swift fits to motorhomes, please? In August 2013 Swift announced that "...Swift has sealed a deal with DMack, who supply tyres for the FIA World Rally Championship. This off-road pedigree will be passed on to all Swift, Sprite and Sterling caravans and Swift motorhomes for 2014, meaning you'll have even more grip on muddy pitches." I understand that DMACK's "EcoXtra" pattern is fitted to the caravans http://www.dmacktyres.com/dmack-ecoxtra-car-tyre http://caravanchannel.proboards.com/thread/7197/swift-mack-tyres but this is a 'car' tyre and would be unsuitable for motorhome usage. The background to DMACK is given here http://www.telegraph.co.uk/finance/businessclub/10719615/Top-tyres-for-the-wheels-of-fortune.html The Swift advertising leaflet included with the latest issue of MMM shows a Kon-Tiki 669 tandem-axle model and mentions the DMACK tyres. Now, if one bought an equivalent Auto-Trail motorhome, the tyres would be 225/75 R16 CP specification (probably Continental's "VancoCamper") and, whether or not one thinks 'camping-car' tyres are over-priced/over-hyped/unnecessary, I doubt if anyone would be put off by the Auto-Trail being fitted with that type of tyre. In fact, I'd suggest that potential buyers who are 'tyre literate' would see the fitment of CP-marked tyres from Continental (or Michelin) as a significant plus and would expect them to be fitted to a new Fiat-based coachbuilt motorcaravan. While the DMACK tyres Swift motorhomes will be shod with in 2014 may turn out to be marvellous, they will not have the historical background of the Continental/Michelin tyres that have been developed for motorhome usage (and their Chinese origin won't help either). This makes them an unknown quantity and, personally, I don't care for unknown quantities when it comes to tyre choice. Presumably Swift negotiated a 'good deal' with DMACK but, if I were considering forking out £70k+ for a Kon-Tiki and noticed it had DMACK tyres (rather than 'proper' motorhome tyres from Continental or Michelin) I know I wouldn't be overjoyed. Although there have been problems in the past obtaining 'camping-car' tyres (the Michelin ones in particular) It also needs to be asked how easy it would be to obtain replacement tyres for a DMACK-equipped Swift should they be needed quickly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robinhood Posted April 30, 2014 Share Posted April 30, 2014 ....whilst I'm probably wrong, despite some of the wording around indicating the contrary, my interpretation was that the DMack tyres are/would be used on the caravan range only. The logistics of installing them in-the-line at the Sevel factory for a small, selective set of chassis would be interesting to say the least, whereas changing them in the UK after they had been fitted with standard, factory-fit tyres would be nonsensical. I have seen odder things happen, though! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Billggski Posted April 30, 2014 Share Posted April 30, 2014 Interestingly, auto trail have a fair number of new steel wheels and camping tyres for sale. I assume they sell them off when the buyer specifies alloys and they fit their own (dmack) tyres. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brambles Posted April 30, 2014 Author Share Posted April 30, 2014 The all new Mack Motorhome tyre, never get stuck on a wet campsite ..... ever again.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derek Uzzell Posted May 1, 2014 Share Posted May 1, 2014 Billggski - 2014-04-30 9:57 AM Interestingly, auto trail have a fair number of new steel wheels and camping tyres for sale. I assume they sell them off when the buyer specifies alloys and they fit their own (dmack) tyres. Did you mean to write "auto trail" as it is Swift that are (apparently) claiming to be fitting DMACK tyres to motorhomes for 2014? Auto-Trail's current advertising indicates that 'camping car' tyres (presumably Continental VancoCamper) continue to be used on their motorthomes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robinhood Posted May 1, 2014 Share Posted May 1, 2014 Derek Uzzell - 2014-04-30 9:06 AM Now, if one bought an equivalent Auto-Trail motorhome, the tyres would be 225/75 R16 CP specification (probably Continental's "VancoCamper") and, whether or not one thinks 'camping-car' tyres are over-priced/over-hyped/unnecessary, I doubt if anyone would be put off by the Auto-Trail being fitted with that type of tyre. In fact, I'd suggest that potential buyers who are 'tyre literate' would see the fitment of CP-marked tyres from Continental (or Michelin) as a significant plus and would expect them to be fitted to a new Fiat-based coachbuilt motorcaravan. While the DMACK tyres Swift motorhomes will be shod with in 2014 may turn out to be marvellous, they will not have the historical background of the Continental/Michelin tyres that have been developed for motorhome usage (and their Chinese origin won't help either). This makes them an unknown quantity and, personally, I don't care for unknown quantities when it comes to tyre choice. Presumably Swift negotiated a 'good deal' with DMACK but, if I were considering forking out £70k+ for a Kon-Tiki and noticed it had DMACK tyres (rather than 'proper' motorhome tyres from Continental or Michelin) I know I wouldn't be overjoyed. I'm still sceptical about such a fitment being made to motorhomes. The 2014 Swift Motorhome handbook contains the following: Motorhome Tyre Specifications Customers should note that your Motorhome is fitted with “Camper Tyres”. Camper tyres meet a specific “CP” (Camping Pneu) standard for tyres on Motorhomes. The Camper tyres on a Motorhome (unlike a commercial van) are designed to carry a significantly higher load for the majority of their life and even when stationery for greater periods of time unlike a van which typically loads and unloads. As a result Camper tyres have stiffened side walls to withstand the increased payloads and pressure on them, this extra reinforcement also gives better vehicle stability on the rear with the heavier rear axle loads typical on a Motorhome. The tyres are also designed to improve mileage (wear) and offer better grip off road. When replacing your tyres we only recommend the fitment of CP or Camper Tyres. ....of course, DMack may have a CP tyre (though I doubt it). I still think the fitment will only apply to caravans - where the chassis is delivered to the Swift factory sans-tyres/wheels). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brambles Posted May 1, 2014 Author Share Posted May 1, 2014 http://caravanchannel.proboards.com/thread/7197 Failing Dmack tyre on caravan mentioned on this linked forum. Does not look good for Dmack tyres. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derek Uzzell Posted May 1, 2014 Share Posted May 1, 2014 Robinhood - 2014-05-01 10:13 AM Derek Uzzell - 2014-04-30 9:06 AM Now, if one bought an equivalent Auto-Trail motorhome, the tyres would be 225/75 R16 CP specification (probably Continental's "VancoCamper") and, whether or not one thinks 'camping-car' tyres are over-priced/over-hyped/unnecessary, I doubt if anyone would be put off by the Auto-Trail being fitted with that type of tyre. In fact, I'd suggest that potential buyers who are 'tyre literate' would see the fitment of CP-marked tyres from Continental (or Michelin) as a significant plus and would expect them to be fitted to a new Fiat-based coachbuilt motorcaravan. While the DMACK tyres Swift motorhomes will be shod with in 2014 may turn out to be marvellous, they will not have the historical background of the Continental/Michelin tyres that have been developed for motorhome usage (and their Chinese origin won't help either). This makes them an unknown quantity and, personally, I don't care for unknown quantities when it comes to tyre choice. Presumably Swift negotiated a 'good deal' with DMACK but, if I were considering forking out £70k+ for a Kon-Tiki and noticed it had DMACK tyres (rather than 'proper' motorhome tyres from Continental or Michelin) I know I wouldn't be overjoyed. I'm still sceptical about such a fitment being made to motorhomes. The 2014 Swift Motorhome handbook contains the following: Motorhome Tyre Specifications Customers should note that your Motorhome is fitted with “Camper Tyres”. Camper tyres meet a specific “CP” (Camping Pneu) standard for tyres on Motorhomes. The Camper tyres on a Motorhome (unlike a commercial van) are designed to carry a significantly higher load for the majority of their life and even when stationery for greater periods of time unlike a van which typically loads and unloads. As a result Camper tyres have stiffened side walls to withstand the increased payloads and pressure on them, this extra reinforcement also gives better vehicle stability on the rear with the heavier rear axle loads typical on a Motorhome. The tyres are also designed to improve mileage (wear) and offer better grip off road. When replacing your tyres we only recommend the fitment of CP or Camper Tyres. ....of course, DMack may have a CP tyre (though I doubt it). I still think the fitment will only apply to caravans - where the chassis is delivered to the Swift factory sans-tyres/wheels). Yes, I'm also wary of the idea that DMACK tyres are being fitted to Swift motorhomes. However, the intention to do this was mentioned in 2013 and the motorhome part of the "Swift 50" insert in MMM cross-refers the tyres on a Swift motorhome chassis to the statement "DMACK tyres offer excellent wear and performance characteristics. Road noise is also minimised." As reduced road noise would be academic for caravans and Dick Cormack (whose company DMACK is) mentions targeting the light-truck market, there is the possibility that the information has credence. If any forum member participates on Swift Talk, it might be useful if they could raise the matter there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brambles Posted May 1, 2014 Author Share Posted May 1, 2014 I think what has happened is the original news release/article was about Dmack and Duvalay (spelling) mattresses being used on caravans and Motorhomes in 2014. However whoever has rewitten the topic has not picked up ONLY duvalay applied to motorhomes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve928 Posted May 1, 2014 Share Posted May 1, 2014 Exactly. It seems to be quite clear to me. Swift website states that "DMack tyres will be fitted to all tourers". I've never heard a motorhome being referred to as a tourer. The tyre in question, the EcoXtra' is a car tyre. Checking on the DMack webiste they don't make any tyre in an X2/50 motorhome size or loading. Time to put this one to bed? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derek Uzzell Posted May 2, 2014 Share Posted May 2, 2014 Steve928 - 2014-05-01 2:40 PM Exactly. It seems to be quite clear to me. Swift website states that "DMack tyres will be fitted to all tourers". I've never heard a motorhome being referred to as a tourer. The tyre in question, the EcoXtra' is a car tyre. Checking on the DMack webiste they don't make any tyre in an X2/50 motorhome size or loading. Time to put this one to bed? In the 45-page glossy "Swift 50" advertising leaflet distributed with the latest issue of MMM magazine, Pages 28 and 29 are dedicated to the "Anatomy of a Swift motorhome: Exterior design". There is a photo of a fully-converted Kon-Tiki 669 with ten features highlighted (eg. 7 = "Locker access to garage storage"). There is also a photo of the same model in pre-conversion form showing the bare chassis and with a further ten features highlighted. Feature 8 refers to the wheels, saying "Stylish British-made alloy wheels complement the 669's body styling", while Feature 9 unarguably refers to the tyres and says (as I pointed out above) "DMACK tyres offer excellent wear and performance characteristics. Road noise is also minimised". The advertising leaflet devotes a lot of space to Swift caravans, but the only reference to DMACK tyres is on Pages 28/29 that cover a Kon-Tiki motorhome. There is no other mention in the leaflet of DMACK tyres, nor that they are being fitted to Swift caravans (though it's evident from on-line comments that they are). While it's unlikely that DMACK tyres are currently being fitted to Swift motorhomes (which is why I asked Ray (Airstream) if he was certain that his 'Chinese tyres' statement (DMACK tyres are Chinese-made) was correct), but it's a bit more complicated than Chris Jefferies just getting his wires crossed in the August 2013 "Caravan Times" article. The Foreword to the "Swift 50" leaflet is by Swift's Chairman Peter Smith and the leaflet's editor is John Sootheran (Managing Editor at Warners Group Publications). For the reference to occur on Pages 28/29 of the leaflet somebody must have provided the information that Swift motorhomes now have DMACK tyres. I can't see this being 'known' by the Warners people involved in constructed the leaflet and the logical conclusion must be that the information was provided by Swift. As the information is probably wrong, it's intriguing that it has managed to slip through the leaflet's proof-reading stage when (to anyone who is motorhome- and tyre-literate) the DMACK statement immediately raises questions. As it's clear that some people (justifiably) believe Chinese-made tyres are now being fitted to Swift motorhomes, rather than let the matter slide it would be better to ask Swift to confirm or deny the DMACK-related statement on Pages 28/29 of the "Swift 50" leaflet. Then there would be no need for guesswork. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
davidmac Posted May 2, 2014 Share Posted May 2, 2014 Hi, looking on the DMACK website they do not make a tyre either by size or load rating that an be used on a motorhome Regards David Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve928 Posted May 2, 2014 Share Posted May 2, 2014 davidmac - 2014-05-02 4:06 PM Hi, looking on the DMACK website they do not make a tyre either by size or load rating that an be used on a motorhome Regards David Is there an echo in here? :-D Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derek Uzzell Posted May 3, 2014 Share Posted May 3, 2014 The information on the DMACK website was the first thing I checked before posting on April 30. However, the fact that the site does not indicate that DMACK is marketing such tyres in the UK does not automatically prove that DMACK could not supply Swift uniquely with 'motorhome-suitable' tyres. DMACK's Chinese manufacturing partner (Shandong Yongtai) produces light-truck tyres under a number of brand names and (in principle) it would take little effort to 're-badge' an existing appropriate product as a "DMACK" tyre that Swift could use. Rather than continue to speculate, I have e-mailed Swift for a Yes-or-No answer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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