gadjo Posted July 25, 2014 Share Posted July 25, 2014 Hi everybody I've got a shurflo pump fitted my Autotrail and while it has never been what you'd call powerful just lately it has become what only can be described as pathetic... the water dribbles out of the taps and the shower while good at first soon drops off... I clean the filter once a year so sort of know that's ok. I am now contemplating fitting another pump like for like but maybe with more PIS maybe 35-40 my question is will be this ok BTW if any one has any suggestions as to how I can increase the pressure of the existing pump please feel free to advise :-D Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest pelmetman Posted July 25, 2014 Share Posted July 25, 2014 Plenty of pressure with my Shurflo, and there was with the previous one until it packed up..............Possibly a impeller fault? :-S....................I found mine quite easy to swap over for a new one...............and I'm not mechanically gifted :D............... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tracker Posted July 25, 2014 Share Posted July 25, 2014 Shurflo pumps have, or used to have, a good reputation for durability and reliability but nothing lasts forever. Before lashing out on a new pump have you checked all your pipework for obstructions, kinks and deposited grot inside at low points and the water pick up inside the tank. The pump diaphragm is also suspect and even a minute pin prick hole can severely reduce efficiency as can even a minute air leak on any of the joints and connections including the filter bowl which can crack if over tightened? Have you Googled Shurflo pumps with your pump model number as some are pressure adjustable? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian Kirby Posted July 25, 2014 Share Posted July 25, 2014 If you know the pump model, follow this link http://tinyurl.com/lemowpw Service kits are available. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derek Uzzell Posted July 26, 2014 Share Posted July 26, 2014 The SHURflo pump normally fitted is one from the “Trail King” range that includes several pressure and flow-rate variants. http://www.leisureshopdirect.com/caravan/water/shurflo_pumps/shurflo_trail_king_pump_series__spare_parts.aspx It should be anticipated that a SHURflo pump fitted to a 2008 Auto-Trail motorhome should provide adequate water-pressure at the outlets. If yours has never done this, there’s the possibility that a low-pressure pump was originally fitted in error. As Tracker advises, any obstruction in the water system on either side of the pump will inevitably limit the flow-rate to the outlets. An air-leak between water-tank and pump will cause spluttering at the outlets, while a water-leak between pump and outlets should soon become evident. I don’t know if Auto-Trail fits a non-return valve ‘upstream’ of the pump but, if they do, a malfunctioning valve could severely restrict the flow. I don’t think there’s anything magical you can do to increase the power of your existing pump that would allow it to sidestep an external problem (eg. a kink in a water-supply hose). If investigation proves that the problem lies with the pump itself, you’ll need to decide whether replacing a 6-year-old pump makes better financial sense than attempting to repair it. (I’d also be a mite wary of choosing a higher-pressure pump than the one Auto-Trail factory-fits. A water system built around a 30psi pump may not happily tolerate a 40psi replacement.) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robinhood Posted July 26, 2014 Share Posted July 26, 2014 .....one further thing that (given the symptoms) is not a prime suspect, but is worth pursuing. Is the pump "pulsing" or rapidly cycling on and off? There will be a pressure switch incorporated in the system (most likely in the head of the pump, protected by a diaphragm). If this is incorrectly adjusted (in this case to switch off at too low a pressure), then the pump will both "cycle" with the tap(s) open, and the water pressure will never reach the optimum. As the diaphragm ages, any symptoms of poor adjustment tend to get worse. There is (usually) an adjustment on the pressure switch, but getting the correct "sweet spot" on the setting (such that it switches both on an off at the appropriate pressures) is a bit of an art. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rayjsj Posted July 26, 2014 Share Posted July 26, 2014 As an aside to all of the above, I had 'Pulsing' on my 2012 Autorail Shurflo pump from new, I had a 'Nature- pure' water filter and tap, fitted inline for when we picked up the new van. Whether this caused the imbalance ? I don't know, but I realised that the 'Pulsing' was going to wreck the pump very quickly, I tried the adjustments in the Shurflo manual, but the pulsing continued, SO, I fitted a Shurflo accumulator tank (not cheap). And that fixed it. Before fitting a new pump, I would consider getting a diaphragm refurb kit as mentioned above. Good luck. Ray Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
George Collings Posted July 26, 2014 Share Posted July 26, 2014 Here is a pic of a stripped Shurflo pump, the model is selected to match the operating pressure of the component it serves. Fitting a high pressure one might cause problems. The black unit at the top is the end cover incorporationg the inlet and outlet pipes and housing for the pressure switch at the back. the the tiny dot in the middle communicates with a small diaphram that operates the switch. The clear component is the filter screwed on the inlet pipe. The filter is in two halves with the gauze filter inside. the halfs join with a bayonet type fitting. To the right is the black valve carrier with one of its flexible rubber saucer shaped valves showing , the others are at the back. Next down is the main three chambered flexible white diaphragm sitting on its housing. Below is the swash plate. It fits over the end of the motor in a ball race that is at an agle to the motors shaft. The plate does not rotate but wobbles to operate the diphragm. Below that is the 12V motor. From memory the pump operation pressure range is on it but if not the Shurflo wesite should give it from the pump serial or type number. The valves and to a lesser extent diphragm get tired and inflexible after several years in use and efficincy falls off. Parts are availiable but the difference in price between them and a new pump hardly makes rebuilding worthwhile. Also you still have the old motor as a spare. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derek Uzzell Posted July 27, 2014 Share Posted July 27, 2014 I notice that gadjo complained in 2010 about the poor performance of his Auto-Trail’s SHURflo pump http://www.outandaboutlive.co.uk/forums/Motorhomes/Motorhome-Matters/shurflo-pump/20826/ A couple more observations... This 2011 MotorHomeFacts thread http://www.motorhomefacts.com/ftoptitle-102673-how-to-test-my-autotrail-apache-shurflo-2095204112-pump.html suggests that Auto-Trail MAY fit a non-return valve in the water-feed to the pump, while this Auto-Trail advert http://www.autotrail-online.co.uk/interiors/plumbing/pump-shurflo-7-ltr.html suggests that Auto-Trail MAY fit a 20psi pump (though the photo appears to show a 30psi pump!) The norm for SHURflo pumps fitted to less-than-huge motorhomes is probably a 7litre/30psi model and this should provide a flow-rate and pressure that I believe most people would find perfectly adequate for showering. (Certainly that was the case with my Hobby motorhome that had a 7litre/30psi SHURflo pump.) As will be seen from this webpage SHURflo’s inlet-filter design has now been revised from the type shown in George’s photo. http://www.thecaravanshop.co.uk/waterpumps/accessories/shurflo-water-pumps/cat_16.html Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gadjo Posted July 28, 2014 Author Share Posted July 28, 2014 hey guys thank you all for taking the time to reply 2010 was it really that long ago just shows time flies when you are having fun, I think its a case of I will get round to that jobt and there you go before you know it 4 years have gone by. But like I said its always been a bit lack lustre anyway looks like I've got some food for thought and some sound practical advice and a bit of checking to do Not sure what the PSI is of the pump fitted so will have to check, if in the end it means buying a new pump so be it if its going to improve things vans in storage so not always convenient to get there and do those little jobs anyway thanks again guys will keep you posted George Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derek Uzzell Posted July 29, 2014 Share Posted July 29, 2014 George Your first check should be that the pump can suck water from the tank adequately. I believe your Cheyenne’s water-tank is external and (as I mentioned above and Tracker advised in 2010) if Auto-Trail has fitted a non-return valve between the pick-up point in the tank and the pump (not uncommon when an external tank is involved) that valve may be the root cause of the problem and could well explain why water-flow has always been poor. (Did you raise this with the dealer from whom you bought your motorhome during the vehicle’s warranty period? If so, what were you told?) It’s stating the obvious, but, if there’s an obstruction of some sort between the tank’s water pick-up and the pump, water-flow is bound to be affected and replacing the pump won’t change this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gadjo Posted July 29, 2014 Author Share Posted July 29, 2014 hmm yes all that makes perfect sense Derek, however with my limited knowledge of the workings of the plumbing systems fitted to motor homes I wouldn't know what a 'return vale' looks like never mind where to start looking to find the thing.....any advice about that would be appreciated as well!!!! the lack of knowledge and the reluctance to start fiddling about with things I don't really understand probably explains why I'm still banging on about it 4 years later!!! To be honest Derek I don't think I did mention it to the dealer at the time...........more fool me eh!!! would probably be more astute now but hey-ho it was my first motor home....nothing to compare it to, just wanting to get out and use it etc. etc. hindsight's a wonderful thing!!! I did have a quick look yesterday and can only really see the pipes going to and from the pump the rest sort of disappear into the wood work.....literally!!! .. turned the screw on the bottom a few times but this made no difference to the flow so re set it back to where it was.....the pumps is a 20 psi just for info... like I say any advice about what the return valve might look like and where I might start looking for it would be welcome. thanks again for taking the time to reply it is appreciated George Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derek Uzzell Posted July 29, 2014 Share Posted July 29, 2014 Non-return valves come in various designs (GOOGLE-search on “caravan non return valve images”) and - if one is fitted - it will be in the water-hose on the input-side of the water pump and (probably) quite close to the pump. This forum thread refers http://www.outandaboutlive.co.uk/forums/Motorhomes/Motorhome-Matters/water-pump-help-needed/29841/ It has to be said though that a 20psi pump is a mite measly and, even if the rest of the water system were in finest order, you should not expect a ‘power shower’. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gadjo Posted July 30, 2014 Author Share Posted July 30, 2014 Hi Derek and all who have responded thank you I have a 'man' coming to look at the pump next week as, frankly, I have no idea what I'm looking at so thought it best to get someone who does before the motorhome floods or some other disaster befalls me :-S he does come recommended so should be ok....we'll see I did contact autotrail via their web site, they got pretty quickly and basically said replace the pump... will let you know how I get on TTFN George Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gadjo Posted July 30, 2014 Author Share Posted July 30, 2014 Hi Derek and all who have responded thank you I have a 'man' coming to look at the pump next week as, frankly, I have no idea what I'm looking at so thought it best to get someone who does before the motorhome floods or some other disaster befalls me :-S he does come recommended so should be ok....we'll see I did contact autotrail via their web site, they got pretty quickly and basically said replace the pump... will let you know how I get on TTFN George Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gadjo Posted August 11, 2014 Author Share Posted August 11, 2014 morning all the guy who came took one look at it and confirmed the pressure was crap and the pump was running on far longer than it should, about 30 seconds so we spent 4 hours going through all the pipe work, we replaced the pump and took out all the return valves,there were 2 and one was really awkward to no avail!!! so because we'd checked everything inside the van we finally looked at the water intake pipe under the van and found this was squeezed and twisted to with a millimetre of its life at the top of the tank so the water wasn't getting to the pump effectively. It was like trying to suck water through a squashed straw... and we only found this after taking off the insulation around the pipe near the top of the tank. The pipe looked as though it had been twisted and squeezed when fitted during the building of the van!!! He sorted the pipe so it was open and free flowing and hey presto all works brilliantly now the pumps almost silent and runs for about 3 seconds so no more pathetic showers and dribbling water for us The guys name is Chris Burke (Caratech) he is mobile and will visit you at home or at storage he mainly works in the Hull, East Riding of Yorkshire and North Lincolnshire area, but I think he will travel further as he was talking to a customer in Sheffield his number is 07799 764997. Thanks to all who helped and for the suggestions. There really is no quick way to do it and it really was a process of elimination anyway hope this may be of use to anyone who may be suffering the same problem cheers George Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tracker Posted August 11, 2014 Share Posted August 11, 2014 gadjo - 2014-08-11 11:15 AM The pipe looked as though it had been twisted and squeezed when fitted during the building of the van!!! He sorted the pipe so it was open and free flowing and hey presto all works brilliantly now the pumps almost silent and runs for about 3 seconds so no more pathetic showers and dribbling water for us Glad you have it sorted at last and it was not the pump after all - I am not in the least surprised at the cause as I have come across similar pick up pipe issues and blockages before with water starvation - which is why I mentioned it on 25th July! You might find you need to fill the tank more often now though as you will probably use more water! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bulletguy Posted August 12, 2014 Share Posted August 12, 2014 My pump has just packed up......thankfully didn't happen while i was out of the UK but still a pain in the proverbial. Could cope without a morning brew but going without a shower 'n shave more than a couple of days was just not on. Surprising really how you take it for granted it will kick in each time you switch on. Mine appears to be a two fold problem though. The evening before the pump went, i spotted water seeping from the case mount (where it sits flush to the bodywork) of the Carver heater unit......which was a bit of a mystery as the pump wasn't even on! I discovered it wasn't pumping the following day when i came to have a shower. Mine is also a SurFlo 20psi model. The pump powers up but get no water. A/S told me it's almost certainly the diaphragm. As for the heater (Carver Cascade 2)......that looks like another job! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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