flyboyprowler Posted December 12, 2014 Share Posted December 12, 2014 I don't know if this has been covered before, but has anyone had a remap done on their motorhome engine. I am told that the remap for our 180 BHP 3 liter engine will boost the power to 210 BHP, and also that fuel consumption will be improved by at least 10%, and the engine will run smoother. The cost here in Spain is €250.00 and the work is guaranteed. Are there any drawbacks, like will the insurance company need to know, and are there any detriments to the van? Thanks all, Ainsley Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spospe Posted December 12, 2014 Share Posted December 12, 2014 One point often not mentioned is that most (if not all) extended warranty firms will not cover you if you have any re-mapping done. I have used Warranty Direct in the past and they certainly made a point of stating that any such work would not be covered. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flyboyprowler Posted December 12, 2014 Author Share Posted December 12, 2014 spospe - 2014-12-12 6:31 PM One point often not mentioned is that most (if not all) extended warranty firms will not cover you if you have any re-mapping done. I have used Warranty Direct in the past and they certainly made a point of stating that any such work would not be covered. Yes, thanks for that, but I don't have an extended warrantee to worry about. The company here, will return the motor to standard free of charge, and refund the money if we are not happy with the improvement. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derek Uzzell Posted December 13, 2014 Share Posted December 13, 2014 I believe you own a Le Voyageur LVX 850 motorhome. This is a fairly large, reasonably heavy vehicle, but it’s definitely not an obese monster! I do wonder why, with the horsepower and torque provided by its 3-litre motor, there’d be a need for another 30bhp, particularly as re-mapping the motor might impact unpredictably on the operation of the automatic transmission that I presume the vehicle has. With an auto-box in the equation “at least 10%” improvement in fuel consumption would be crystal-ball gazing, but if you trust the Spanish company €250 is cheap enough for a re-map. Insurance providers will want to be informed about ‘performance increasing’ modifications. Some providers may be prepared to accept a modest re-map without increasing the insurance premium; others will demand a surcharge. You’d be wise to check with your provider before going ahead. Personally, I wouldn’t have it done but, if you decide to go ahead, who is going to stop you? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keithl Posted December 13, 2014 Share Posted December 13, 2014 flyboyprowler - 2014-12-12 5:42 PM The company here, will return the motor to standard free of charge, and refund the money if we are not happy with the improvement. But will that mean a return trip to Spain? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hymer1942 Posted December 13, 2014 Share Posted December 13, 2014 Why would you want to remap a Merc?? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Den Posted December 13, 2014 Share Posted December 13, 2014 When we sold our LeVoyaguer 950, Colin whom purchased it , had it remapped. Colin was sure it added 2-3 mpg and certainly boosted the power. We followed him in our new LeVoyaguer 850, he pulled away from junctions and islands, when we both had to spot down. Power wise they go like scalded cats anyway and whe I drove his remapped 950 it did make a difference. The V6 is a smooth engine regardless of remapping, it made no difference. Den. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flyboyprowler Posted December 13, 2014 Author Share Posted December 13, 2014 Den - 2014-12-13 3:31 PM Power wise they go like scalded cats anyway and whe I drove his remapped 950 it did make a difference. The V6 is a smooth engine regardless of remapping, it made no difference. Den. Forgive the query, but are you saying that the remap did or didn't make a difference, and did Colin achieve the improved fuel consumption? I agree that the motor in its current state is smooth and powerful enough for general travelling. I have been using Diesel Rhino for a while now, and again the engine seems to run smoother, but there is not any significant fuel saving. We are based mostly in Spain, and the company who would do the remap here are a franchise, I believe, of a UK company run and staffed by Brits. Thank you all for the feedback, Ainsley Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Billggski Posted December 13, 2014 Share Posted December 13, 2014 Cost in the UK is about £240(inc vat), I'd feel safer having it done over here as it would be easier to sort. Does the €250 include tax and a rolling road dynotest (essential or the figures are just fiction)? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flyboyprowler Posted December 13, 2014 Author Share Posted December 13, 2014 Yes I think it does, but good point, and I will ask if I do decide to go ahead. We are mostly based in Spain, so over here would be the better option for me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Den Posted December 14, 2014 Share Posted December 14, 2014 It's a funny story. Colin purchased our 950, and our last break before giving it over was to the Peterborough show with Colin in his 850 . While there it had it remapped and I drove it back. So I drove it there unmapped and drove it home remapped. Did I notice a difference " NO NOT REALLY ". It was always well loaded Would I have it done , NO Save your money and treat the wife. There was no change in smoothness of running. Colin thought it was doing 2-3 miles more mpg. I'm not convinced, We have had 3 LeVoyageurs and always very pleased with all aspects, not really with the economy though. Our last levoyageur 850 ( now with bill at Hayes For sale ) is a manua , that is 3-4 mpg better. I tried performance fuel, no change. All our holidays are to the south of France and to our apartment in Almoradi. Economy for me is important, some will say to hell with the economy , you only live once. Well it does matter to me, that why we are down sizing slightly. Enjoy your MH, you have a fine specimen, with a fantastic back up from the factory. Hope this is of some help Den Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
George Collings Posted December 14, 2014 Share Posted December 14, 2014 If availiable torque is increased you should be able to stay in the higher gears longer improving fuel economy. If you use the extra power out put to accelerate or climb hills faster you are burning fuel faster and MPG wiil suffer.How fast do want to cruise ? 3.5 + tons is a lot vehicle to play with at 85mph plus. The troubel with burning more fuel is increases the heat load on every component. Rushing up mountains using max power for many minutes if not hours might just toast a piston crown. I was asked if the old 1980s 208 MBs with about 85 bhp were underpowered? . My answer was there is no such thing as an underpowered MB van but there were impatient MB van drivers. Its a leisure vehicle, whats the point of rushing uphill surely you are there for the view. But then each to his own. The only time I want more than my 102 hp VW Lt has is when trying to match speeds on a motorway on sliproad . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flyboyprowler Posted December 14, 2014 Author Share Posted December 14, 2014 Den - 2014-12-14 4:33 PM So I drove it there unmapped and drove it home remapped. Did I notice a difference " NO NOT REALLY ". It was always well loaded Would I have it done , NO Save your money and treat the wife. There was no change in smoothness of running. Den Thank you Den for that, it helps with the decision making. We are really happy with our 850, both in performance and comfort. The remapping question came up recently so I decided to have a look as economy especially is important to me. Not sure if there is an economy remap available without the performance hike! My only real problem is the perennial payload problem. This got me to the verge of selling, but SVtech are upgrading the weights by 220kgs which will make life on the road easier. Thanks again, Ainsley Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
George Collings Posted December 15, 2014 Share Posted December 15, 2014 Ainsley. The economy remap lies in your right foot. The first line of my previous posting applies. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StuartO Posted December 15, 2014 Share Posted December 15, 2014 Den - 2014-12-14 3:33 PM ....So I drove it there unmapped and drove it home remapped. Did I notice a difference " NO NOT REALLY ".... Subjective judgements of performance impact are likely to be unrelaible and so if you decide to have your engine re-mapped or chipped, you should go to a repurable company and get a dynamometer test which will prove that power/torque has been improved by measuring before and after. Buying a quick so-called remap from someone at the motorhome show sounds a bit risky to me. You can't really know whether he did anything at all without a dynamometer printout, even if he did connect a laptop to your MH's system socket and press a few keys. You can buy a lead which connects to that socket on EBay for under £20 and you can probably buy software which will give some impression that something is happening. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Corky 8 Posted December 15, 2014 Share Posted December 15, 2014 I thought about having our 09, 2.3 Merc Sprinter remapped , But when I enquired at the Merc Commercial service Garage who have serviced my last Merc motorhome and who will undoubtedly Service this one having had nothing but great service from them ,the Technician (mechanic to you and me) he told me in no uncertain terms not to do it, he went into how Mercedes develop their engines to run at their most efficient when leaving the factory, he also said would you not think if Mercedes could get and Publish better Torq and MPG,s out of their engines whilst keeping them durable for long usage they would do so, these firms who Chip /remap have to cut corners somewhere, and he has seen evidence of holed pistons and blown engine which were remapped. That was enough to put me off, and I'm happy to go along with those who work on them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StuartO Posted December 15, 2014 Share Posted December 15, 2014 Corky 8 - 2014-12-15 8:27 PM ...the Technician (mechanic to you and me) he told me in no uncertain terms not to do it, he went into how Mercedes develop their engines to run at their most efficient when leaving the factory, he also said would you not think if Mercedes could get and Publish better Torq and MPG,s out of their engines whilst keeping them durable for long usage they would do so, These firms who Chip /remap have to cut corners somewhere, and he has seen evidence of holed pistons and blown engine which were remapped. That was enough to put me off, and I'm happy to go along with those who work on them. You are perfectly entitled to be convinced in that way yourself but I don't think you should claim that it is any more than the opinion of one mechanic who is mercedes trained but as a service technician rather than an engine desgin engineer and also has a vested interest in toeing the MB party line. Of course a manufacturer will not endorse modifications like remampping. But manuafacturers map their engines primarily to optimise them in relation to emission regulations these days and that will inevitable to the decrement of performance and maybe also fuel economy. They also often use the very same engine with different mapping, developing different power for different commercial applications. It won't always be sensible or safe for a MH owner to remap an engine to get more power and torque but sometimes it will be a perfectly safe and sensible thing to do, especially for motorhomers who tow fairly heavy trailers for example. If you take engineering advice from a good source and keep your feet on the ground about how you use the extra power, not simply to go faster in a vehicle not shaped or weighted for speed, then having a motorhome remapped can be a useful thing to do. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Billggski Posted December 15, 2014 Share Posted December 15, 2014 When the original BMW mini came out the cooper had 115bhp, the one model had 90 bhp. Both engines were identical apart from the settings on the ecu. The cooper did 42mpg, the one did 43mpg. They both had the same warranty. However the cooper was six insurance categories higher, and had a cool badge on the back. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flyboyprowler Posted December 15, 2014 Author Share Posted December 15, 2014 George Collings - 2014-12-14 5:50 PM If availiable torque is increased you should be able to stay in the higher gears longer improving fuel economy. If you use the extra power out put to accelerate or climb hills faster you are burning fuel faster and MPG wiil suffer.How fast do want to cruise ? 3.5 + tons is a lot vehicle to play with at 85mph plus. The same point was made by the remap company, and certainly if the loud pedal is used too enthusiastically then with or without a remap, then consumption will suffer. I also think that Mercedes are rightly proud of their engines, BUT a theoretically knowledgeable friend thinks that the recommended service schedules for the engine are unrealistic, and that to leave 20000+ miles between any service is not right. However that said, do you follow the manufacturers schedule, or add the odd extra oil change in, especially when a lot of motor-homes only get used rarely. It's a conundrum! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Muswell Posted December 15, 2014 Share Posted December 15, 2014 StuartO - 2014-12-15 9:02 PM If you take engineering advice from a good source. Like the person who sells the remap? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StuartO Posted December 16, 2014 Share Posted December 16, 2014 Muswell - 2014-12-15 11:02 PM StuartO - 2014-12-15 9:02 PM If you take engineering advice from a good source. Like the person who sells the remap? Good point, which is why I wouldnl't do it just for fun - or off the cuff at a motorhome show in a field with no dynamomter tests. So you do your homework first and find a proper expert workshop and pay what it costs. Removable plug-in chipping devices might be a low risk way of sucking it and seeing, but I suspect they are much more hit and miss. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Muswell Posted December 16, 2014 Share Posted December 16, 2014 There is no doubt that remapping can give more power and better fuel economy, under some conditions, but what the companies that offer it do not mention is what it does to emissions. AFAIK the diesel MOT only tests for smoke and it is unlikely that a remapped vehicle would fail on that but you can bet your bottom dollar it would fall outside the parameters of the EU ratings for the nasty gasses. That may or may not bother you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StuartO Posted December 16, 2014 Share Posted December 16, 2014 Muswell - 2014-12-16 9:34 AM There is no doubt that remapping can give more power and better fuel economy, under some conditions, but what the companies that offer it do not mention is what it does to emissions. AFAIK the diesel MOT only tests for smoke and it is unlikely that a remapped vehicle would fail on that but you can bet your bottom dollar it would fall outside the parameters of the EU ratings for the nasty gasses. That may or may not bother you. Again a good point, important if you are one of those who think we are in process of murdering the planet and we in first world countries should therefore all be taking drastic steps to minimise our personal emissions and carbon footprint because so many others are failing to do so. At least your own conscience can then be clear. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
George Collings Posted December 16, 2014 Share Posted December 16, 2014 Now there is a coincidence, The MB Technician like me mentioned piston trouble. Now if you tow a trailer and you go uphill faster due to the remap its possibly toasted piston time. More fuel = more heat and hotter pistons. I just love the way the temp gauge on my bog standard van stays the same after half an hour flat out in third gear up a mountain and then rapidly drops going down the other side. Its a comfort with a 17 year old 80,000 miler a thousand miles from home. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flyboyprowler Posted December 16, 2014 Author Share Posted December 16, 2014 OK, so white flags out, Betsy can stay as she is, and I will put the money towards the extra diesel we will use. I still think the Diesel Rhino fuel additive makes the engine smoother, but as yet the possible 10% fuel improvement hasn't shown its face! Thanks to all for all the input. Ainsley Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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