BikerBarry Posted May 31, 2015 Share Posted May 31, 2015 Our 2007 2.3 litre Ducato panel van conversion with 6 speed gearbox has a problem in selecting reverse gear. Basically it wont with the engine running unless the gear stick is moved all the way across to 5th or of 6th gear position then back again over to reverse, when it slips into gear without problems. Switch the engine off and it will select reverse without problem every time. There is no crunching of cogs to engage any of the gears with the engine running - it just wont go in reverse without the previously mentioned messing about with the stick. Before taking it to our local Fiat dealer I'd like to now if anyone else has had anything similar, and I wondered if Nick from Eurohire might have an opinion on the potential cause. It could very well be the linkage, but then again, it may not............... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kevina Posted May 31, 2015 Share Posted May 31, 2015 I have the same problem on a 2008 van with the same engine/gearbox. It is intermittent, and my get round is to pop it into first then try again. Very occasionally 1st is the same; having a look at the linkage is on my "to do" list. I haven't noticed that it is any different with the engine off. (Have had the gearbox judder fix) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kevina Posted May 31, 2015 Share Posted May 31, 2015 I've been out to test your "engine off" observation. With the engine off it will easily go into reverse without having moved from a "not engaging" position; well noticed. Furthermore, if reverse is repeatedly engaging ok with my foot continuously depressing the clutch and I then release the clutch (whilst in neutral) before trying again it will not engage. Nevertheless, I would say I can engage reverse first time about 75% of the time. So will wait to hear what the experts say, still hoping it is the linkage. Kev Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wints Posted May 31, 2015 Share Posted May 31, 2015 Had a similar fault with a Volvo V40. A small plastic bit in the gear linkage had worn, and the repair was approx £30 fitted at the main dealers. This was a common fault on this car, and well documented on the net. I'd look on the fiat website to see if there's any info there. Hope it's an easy and cheap repair. Allen Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brambles Posted June 1, 2015 Share Posted June 1, 2015 It is most likely the gear selector shaft into the gearox needing lubricated. Its very easy to do if you can crawl under the vehicle, be a contortionist to hold both a torch and work one handed to clean shaft and and apply a little grease. I think it is 6th/5th gear which has the shaft extended out of box from memory. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
euroserv Posted June 1, 2015 Share Posted June 1, 2015 Although the selector shafts on the top of the box and the pivot mounted on the engine mount can become stiff this will be the same whether the engine is running or not. You don't say what mileage you have covered but it's very unlikely to be in the hundred thousand arena so wear is unlikely too. The only thing that changes when the engine is running is that the flywheel is spinning so it all points to the clutch I am afraid. You need to take this to either a clutch/gearbox specialist or pay a premium and get the Fiat dealer to help you decide what to do. Nick PS it's Eurotruck, not Eurohire. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kevina Posted June 1, 2015 Share Posted June 1, 2015 Thanks Nick, mine has done 46,000 miles but this problem did start probably about 10,000 miles ago. Our clutch probably gets more use than most as we do a lot of mountains. Never had any clutch slip and gearchange on all other gears is slick. I don't know if it is related or not but once the gearbox gets hot it does sound a bit noisy, this stops when the clutch is depressed. (You can only notice this when stopped on tickover). Kev Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gmacz Posted June 1, 2015 Share Posted June 1, 2015 Any changes to the gearbox oil, ie oil change etc. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kevina Posted June 1, 2015 Share Posted June 1, 2015 We had a new alternator last year (8000 miles ago) and to do this they have to take off the drive shaft which loses a bit of oil. I know they topped it up as they spilt it all over the gearbox! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
euroserv Posted June 1, 2015 Share Posted June 1, 2015 kevina - 2015-06-01 4:17 PM Thanks Nick, mine has done 46,000 miles but this problem did start probably about 10,000 miles ago. Our clutch probably gets more use than most as we do a lot of mountains. Never had any clutch slip and gearchange on all other gears is slick. I don't know if it is related or not but once the gearbox gets hot it does sound a bit noisy, this stops when the clutch is depressed. (You can only notice this when stopped on tickover). Kev This does suggest a clutch clearance problem. A noise that goes away when the clutch is pressed is normally indicative of a thrust release bearing issue. These vehicles have a concentric slave cylinder that combines the clutch hydraulic control with the release bearing. If there is a problem with the bearing or the clutch plate springs are deteriorating this may be the cause of the noise and the difficulty in engaging gears. You really will need to take it to an expert for diagnosis. I would probably get the clutch hydraulics bled to start with and see if it makes any difference. If there is air present, the box will have to come off anyway to replace the slave cylinder but it should give an idea for not too much money. The master cylinder which is behind the clutch pedal will need to be checked for a leak also. No leaks, means no air and this points to a clutch. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BikerBarry Posted June 2, 2015 Author Share Posted June 2, 2015 Thanks for the analysis and suggestions. Ours has had all the mods done (gearbox, clutch, engine mounting and clutch slave cylinder pipe/damper etc) fitted some 50,000 miles ago. Total mileage is nearly 70,000. Since then there has been an intermittent judder on uptake of the clutch in both first and reverse. There was no pattern to the fault, though it mainly occurred when cold, and as it was intermittent Fiat refused to either acknowledge its existence or investigate the cause. The intermittent nature of this has become much more frequent recently but it still comes and goes. The refusal to select reverse has also changed from being infrequent to almost every time. As for the intermittent juddering in 1st and reverse my own suspicion is that the damper device fitted to the slave cylinder fluid pipe is sticking, but Fiat refused point blank at the time this was fitted to discuss its construction and the role it played. Maybe it's time to seek help from a gearbox specialist. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gmacz Posted June 2, 2015 Share Posted June 2, 2015 I had problems with 5th gear as well, all other gears fine. Done the strip and clean of selectors and still the same. Changed the oil for something thinner and no problems winter or summer since. 5th gear slips in nicely now and cold gearbox not a problem. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
euroserv Posted June 2, 2015 Share Posted June 2, 2015 That is a good point. Although it's a bit 'clutching at straws' really; is it possible that the gearbox oil is the wrong type? It would be a relatively cheap option to get it drained and try with the correct, fully synthetic oil in there.... At least cheap compared to removing the gearbox anyway. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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