Citroen versus Fiat engines

[Tony M]

Brian,

An excellent summary of the insurance options open to anyone considering importing. Many thanks for that and also to Derek and Simon for the valuable information.

Things have changed so much since my last import and having read about the lengthy delays suffered by several people whilst dealing with the DVLA it has brought it home to me that all paperwork must be checked and rechecked before submitting.

 

Tony

[Brabander]

I have been following this topic with some interest as I have owned vans with Ford 2.2, Peugeot 2.2 and Fiat 2.3 engines and I was interested in the various opinions about these various engines.

 

However I now feel that I have to put in my pennies worth about the subject of importing vehicles.

There is an unacceptably large difference between pre tax UK dealer prices and those in countries such as Belgium, Germany and the Netherlands.

This difference is not reflective of any differences in specifications.

I do however not believe that motorhome dealers in the UK are any more greedy than those in other European countries.

The price difference reflects the higher prices charged in the UK by base vehicle manufacturers.

Larger motorhome manufacturers in Europe (such as the Hymer group) can naturally source base vehicles at lower prices than small UK manufacturers but you will also find that companies in Italy and Slovenia also pay much lower prices.

It is no secret that most vehicle manufacturers find the UK market extremely profitable, after all Landrovers and Jaguars built in the UK cost a lot less in Germany and the Netherlands!

 

I purchased a Hobby motorhome from a UK dealer last year and the discounted price I paid was still about the same a the standard dealer price from a German dealer in EUROS!

I have just taken possession of a new Mercedes V class from our local dealer and the price of the same spec vehicle would have been lower in Germany in Euros ie the price in Germany was 40% lower.

I have, in the past, purchased a new car in the Netherlands with a net saving of £10k.

However, because of laziness/convenience etc I have not done so again.

 

Perhaps if we all started to purchase our vehicles on the continent manufacturers might be forced to change their UK pricing policy.

After all that happened in for example the Netherlands and Belgium where vehicle prices used to be higher than in Germany. When people started crossing to border manufacturers were forced to react.

 

I am all for supporting local dealers but we are currently taken for a ride, not by the dealers but by their principals.

[Brian Kirby]

Brabander - 2015-11-28 8:57 PM.................................The price difference reflects the higher prices charged in the UK by base vehicle manufacturers................................

I was told a few years back by Burstner UK that the difference in price paid for a Ducato platform cab in RHD form was £500 higher than for the same spec in LHD form. I took this at face value, as I had no way of veriyfing the statement. However, my informant was adamant that the figure was correct. Clearly higher RHD base vehicle costs would explain some of the difference, but I somehow doubt that could explain the whole difference. After all, if that were the whole explanation, with the differences in dealer prices between (most) continental made motorhomes in UK those for the same motorhomes on the continent being as they are, the LHD base vehicles would have to be supplied by Fiat at zero cost! Surely not?

 

There is a higher delivery charge on imports, but these charges vary by country in any case, and we have to accept that a) you can't get that many motorhomes on a low-loader, and b) crossing those 25 miles of Channel always add to our costs. So, some more cost due to transport, but still a long way short of explaining the full difference.

 

It may well be the the UK converters are paying over the odds for bases compared to continental converters, but even then the price differential seems too great for this to be the whole reason. I seem to remember Nick Fisher saying that the "fleet" price for a plain vanilla Ducato was somewhere near £12,000. (Sorry if I'm remembering wrong, Nick :-)). That is approximately the difference between If the catalogue price in £ for a given imported motorhome in UK, compared to the price in € for the same motorhome on the continent. Somewhere, somehow, when these vehicles are imported to, or are made in, the UK, the price magically rises by more than can be attributed to base vehicle pricing differences.

 

My guess, and it is purely that, is that it has rather more to do with "opportunity pricing". UK manufacturers scarcely export, and the designs that appeal in UK are not, generally those that appeal elsewhere. The importers, on the other hand, generally sell their vans into the whole EU market, so can gain much higher volume discounts and, having much higher volumes, can afford to invest more in production economies. They export "doctored" versions of a selection of their vans to UK, and price them against home produced products. The UK is a bit of a captive market when it comes to sales (those 25 miles of Channel again!), so the product can be priced to the maximum the UK buyer will pay. The buyer profile is "mature", mainly home owning, reasonably well off, close to retirement, and looking for "freedom" after a lifetime's employment graft. That "dream" is dangled, and we big, fat, trout take the fly! :-)

 

In short, I think our relatively low volume production (which I'm pretty sure is also less labour efficient), and the fact that so few of us seem aware of how munch cheaper these vehicles are on the continent, means that importers can price to UK expectations and net a vary attractive profit into the bargain. After all, why should they sell for less than we have become accustomed to paying? Companies of the scale of Hymer hardly need the volume of their UK sales, so there must be some other incentive for them to court our RHD business. Then add in the sheer instability of Sterling versus the Euro, and you have the perfect smokescreen to hide the true scale of the price differences.

 

Now, if UK manufacturers could only re-group into one or two decent sized companies, and then set out to break into the continental market with a really good, well designed, well made, efficiently produced, range of LHD vans at appealing prices, while squeezing the importers on price at home, we might see some real shift in home market pricing. Oooh, a pig just flew past my window! :-D