keninpalamos Posted November 27, 2015 Share Posted November 27, 2015 Tracker - 2015-11-21 10:07 PM It is a shame that the petition's originator did not take the time or trouble to get his facts and spelling correct before starting the petition. I've signed it anyway - not that it will make any difference in our lifetime. If enough signatures are added to reach10,000 and there is a Government response, it will no doubt be as before, passing the buck firmly back to local authorities by saying that they already have the powers to create Aires / Stellplatz etc and that it is not Government policy to compel local authorities in such matters as to do so could be seen as undemocratic given that most voters do not own a motorhome, or some such similar waffle ! Ditto. Democracy? :D Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
keninpalamos Posted November 27, 2015 Share Posted November 27, 2015 Bulletguy - 2015-11-26 5:54 PM Brock - 2015-11-26 5:11 PM So the question is why are we affected by groups of 'travellers' setting up camp on large plots of land and yet this doesn't seem to be a problem with Aires etc on the Continent. Solving the problem might make it easier to compel Councils to provide Aires in the UK; in fact they may not need compelling. Good point though i believe Councils are obliged by law now to provide sites for travellers. I was just about to suggest maybe rather than p*ssing in the wind with petitions and 'being nice', we'd be better off sticking a few rolls of chrome tape on the van, shove a bin lid on the roof, net curtains and plastic flowers in the window. Job done. Park wherever you like.Though at just 5.5mtrs i'd need my van stretched as well. :D Does make you wonder why the travelling community love migrating here so regularly. Maybe it's due to the damp dull climate and gloomy grey sky? Er! that's my 'van you have just described, outrageous! :-D Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PJay Posted November 27, 2015 Share Posted November 27, 2015 Bulletguy - 2015-11-26 5:54 PM Brock - 2015-11-26 5:11 PM Does make you wonder why the travelling community love migrating here so regularly. Maybe it's due to the damp dull climate and gloomy grey sky? Maye they do not have PASSPORTS?? You do get travellers in France, but being such a large country they have more space to roam . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pepe63xnotuse Posted November 27, 2015 Share Posted November 27, 2015 I've always put the main reason for the presence of "Travellers" in the UK, down to our close/easy proximity to Ireland....or is that just too obvious... If the Irish and UK landmasses switched places, then France would be getting more of 'em...? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bulletguy Posted November 27, 2015 Author Share Posted November 27, 2015 pepe63 - 2015-11-27 10:01 AM I've always put the main reason for the presence of "Travellers" in the UK, down to our close/easy proximity to Ireland....or is that just too obvious... If the Irish and UK landmasses switched places, then France would be getting more of 'em...? That....and the fact British are easily conned because they believe they must pay! Rathkeale is the travelling communities main 'base' in Ireland. They own the entire town and it's easily spotted by the 'high end' motors blasting around and 13 year old girls teetering around on their Louboutins with fake tans and boobs busting out. :D Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ham Posted November 27, 2015 Share Posted November 27, 2015 Yes it is a statuary law that all councils in the UK now have to provide a site for travellers. But that does not include us motorhomes. Yes there is a travelling community in France and I have come across aires were they are but they are quickly moved on. They do pop up on sites. 2 Years ago on the campsite in Langre. I was asked to help a group of Irish Travellers who were on the site they had spotted my satellite dish and they had a big one free standing and could not get an Irish channel, as the Gaelic cup final was on Because there was no tarmac work in Ireland they had come across to France to look for work and there was 15 vans in total on site No I did not accept the offer to tarmac my drive but did accept a drink off them Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bulletguy Posted November 27, 2015 Author Share Posted November 27, 2015 ham - 2015-11-27 4:55 PM Yes it is a statuary law that all councils in the UK now have to provide a site for travellers. But that does not include us motorhomes. Yes there is a travelling community in France and I have come across aires were they are but they are quickly moved on. They do pop up on sites. 2 Years ago on the campsite in Langre. I was asked to help a group of Irish Travellers who were on the site they had spotted my satellite dish and they had a big one free standing and could not get an Irish channel, as the Gaelic cup final was on Because there was no tarmac work in Ireland they had come across to France to look for work and there was 15 vans in total on site No I did not accept the offer to tarmac my drive but did accept a drink off them There is also a community of Roma gypsies in Romania and parts of Bulgaria. Easy to tell apart as they tend to be darker skinned from their Indian heritage. I think we began using the term 'gypsy' incorrectly believing they originated from Egypt. They are polar opposite to our Irish 'travellers' though, living quite poorly and basic but are friendly enough. I spent a night parked up on a bit of land with some in Romania and though only a couple of them had a basic grasp of some English, they were fine with me staying there. They suffered terribly under Nazism and remain a persecuted minority today. During medieval times in UK we killed them as Christians believed they were Witches and had made the nails used to crucify Jesus. Yes really!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ham Posted November 27, 2015 Share Posted November 27, 2015 Thats what I like about travel, you get a different perspective on life and the people you meet, Sadly we hear the Bad side of life and the misgivings that come with it. MY Welsh Gran taught us, give and forgive has you never know who you'll meet and someday may need thier helping hand.So I tread lightly when talking to politicians about Aires. There will be a time when they will agree with us Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
derek pringle Posted November 28, 2015 Share Posted November 28, 2015 hi all, Do you not know of any 'motorhoming' politicians. Surely do no harm to have a 'man on the inside'. cheers derek Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
747 Posted November 28, 2015 Share Posted November 28, 2015 derek pringle - 2015-11-28 8:52 AM hi all, Do you not know of any 'motorhoming' politicians. Surely do no harm to have a 'man on the inside'. cheers derek Any of those will have been hoovered up by the CC or C&CC lobbyists and put on a nice retainer (as long as they do as they are told). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
keninpalamos Posted November 28, 2015 Share Posted November 28, 2015 rupert123 - 2015-11-23 2:29 PM Who the hell cares, we have a way of doing things and most euro countries do to. I never hear this stuff about say Switzerland, Austria, Croatia etc where aires are non existent. The UK has a massive range of campsites from cl's up to very expensive private sites. The real problem is not places to stay but people who are to hard up or to mean to use them, I doubt many motor home users are that hard up so just unzip your wallets. My family have always been hard working but hard up and as I was the youngest I had to wear "hand me down" clothes and as the others were all girls it wasn't very nice. *-) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derek Uzzell Posted November 28, 2015 Share Posted November 28, 2015 Brock - 2015-11-26 5:11 PM So the question is why are we affected by groups of 'travellers' setting up camp on large plots of land and yet this doesn't seem to be a problem with Aires etc on the Continent. Solving the problem might make it easier to compel Councils to provide Aires in the UK; in fact they may not need compelling. There seems to be a general belief amongst UK motorcaravanners that ‘aires’ in Continental Europe remain unaffected by ‘travellers’ - this is not the case and never has been. Despite there being a legal framework in France compelling communities over a certain population threshold to provide permanent sites for travellers, camping-car aires are still occasionally occupied by ‘gens du yoyage’. In fact, in a recent French motorhome magazine, there was a letter from a French mayor apologising that this had happened in his town and saying that, despite consulting with the regional authority and the police, he had been told that the travellers could not be immediately moved on. There are also regular complaints in French motorhome magazines about height barriers being added to public car parks and about parking/traffic restrictions specifically targeting motorhomes. Such measures are often successfully challenged legally, but even then some sort of restriction normally results subsequently. In a recent issue of “Le Monde du Camping-Car” was a letter from a resident of Donville-les-Bains in Normandy stating that it had been highlighted at a Donviille public meeting about new traffic-management plans that residents there had complained about motorhomes parking along the sea-front where signage indicated this was forbidden. At the meeting the mayor also said that Donville traders’ livelihood did not depend on motorcaravanners. It is hare-brained to think that a network of parking/service areas dedicated to motorhomes could be introduced throughout the UK merely because there are other countries that have such a network. The French ‘aires’ network has been able to establish, grow and flourish, but the reasons it could do this are geographic, historic and cultural, and are applicable to France and not valid in this country. And even when a country has an ‘aires’ network, that doesn’t mean that everybody there likes this and that every community is keen to encourage motorcaravanners to visit. Rather than sign silly on-line petitions that cite ‘foreign’ motorhome parking networks as precedents and use ill-informed statements to justify their introduction in the UK, it would be much more sensible to request local authorities to follow the lead of some Welsh local councils that have chosen to encourage motorhome owners to visit their towns by advertising that officially-sanctioned overnight parking is available. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Muswell Posted November 28, 2015 Share Posted November 28, 2015 Derek Uzzell - 2015-11-28 9:58 AM Brock - 2015-11-26 5:11 PM So the question is why are we affected by groups of 'travellers' setting up camp on large plots of land and yet this doesn't seem to be a problem with Aires etc on the Continent. Solving the problem might make it easier to compel Councils to provide Aires in the UK; in fact they may not need compelling. There seems to be a general belief amongst UK motorcaravanners that ‘aires’ in Continental Europe remain unaffected by ‘travellers’ - this is not the case and never has been. Despite there being a legal framework in France compelling communities over a certain population threshold to provide permanent sites for travellers, camping-car aires are still occasionally occupied by ‘gens du yoyage’. In fact, in a recent French motorhome magazine, there was a letter from a French mayor apologising that this had happened in his town and saying that, despite consulting with the regional authority and the police, he had been told that the travellers could not be immediately moved on. There are also regular complaints in French motorhome magazines about height barriers being added to public car parks and about parking/traffic restrictions specifically targeting motorhomes. Such measures are often successfully challenged legally, but even then some sort of restriction normally results subsequently. In a recent issue of “Le Monde du Camping-Car” was a letter from a resident of Donville-les-Bains in Normandy stating that it had been highlighted at a Donviille public meeting about new traffic-management plans that residents there had complained about motorhomes parking along the sea-front where signage indicated this was forbidden. At the meeting the mayor also said that Donville traders’ livelihood did not depend on motorcaravanners. It is hare-brained to think that a network of parking/service areas dedicated to motorhomes could be introduced throughout the UK merely because there are other countries that have such a network. The French ‘aires’ network has been able to establish, grow and flourish, but the reasons it could do this are geographic, historic and cultural, and are applicable to France and not valid in this country. And even when a country has an ‘aires’ network, that doesn’t mean that everybody there likes this and that every community is keen to encourage motorcaravanners to visit. Rather than sign silly on-line petitions that cite ‘foreign’ motorhome parking networks as precedents and use ill-informed statements to justify their introduction in the UK, it would be much more sensible to request local authorities to follow the lead of some Welsh local councils that have chosen to encourage motorhome owners to visit their towns by advertising that officially-sanctioned overnight parking is available. Exactly Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John J Thompson Posted November 28, 2015 Share Posted November 28, 2015 ham - 2015-11-27 4:55 PM Yes it is a statuary law that all councils in the UK now have to provide a site for travellers. UK authorities do provide sites for "Travellers" who wish to become static, but there is little provision for the itinerant Traveller. There are 6 Aires in Northern Ireland. These are not being over run by the travelling community. Where problems occur these are dealt with. These have been provided with funding from the local authorities, or the NT, in conjunction with the NI Tourist Board. This came about by long term discussions with the authorities not petitions. An active group composed of individuals and clubs pursued this, not just individuals. More involvement and less keyboard warriors are what is needed if we are to persuade the authorities. I know from personal experience that entering into discussions with the authorities could work, if there is support on the ground locally to back it up. There are 250,000 registered Motor Caravans in the UK, but little forthcoming support. The cost of providing such facilities is not cheap. I have figures from two of the NI authorities involved indicating that the provision was between £50,000 and £150,000. The Borne terminal was not the biggest cost, Planning and site works were the greater part. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rupert123 Posted November 28, 2015 Share Posted November 28, 2015 Derek Uzzell - 2015-11-28 9:58 AM Brock - 2015-11-26 5:11 PM So the question is why are we affected by groups of 'travellers' setting up camp on large plots of land and yet this doesn't seem to be a problem with Aires etc on the Continent. Solving the problem might make it easier to compel Councils to provide Aires in the UK; in fact they may not need compelling. There seems to be a general belief amongst UK motorcaravanners that ‘aires’ in Continental Europe remain unaffected by ‘travellers’ - this is not the case and never has been. Despite there being a legal framework in France compelling communities over a certain population threshold to provide permanent sites for travellers, camping-car aires are still occasionally occupied by ‘gens du yoyage’. In fact, in a recent French motorhome magazine, there was a letter from a French mayor apologising that this had happened in his town and saying that, despite consulting with the regional authority and the police, he had been told that the travellers could not be immediately moved on. There are also regular complaints in French motorhome magazines about height barriers being added to public car parks and about parking/traffic restrictions specifically targeting motorhomes. Such measures are often successfully challenged legally, but even then some sort of restriction normally results subsequently. In a recent issue of “Le Monde du Camping-Car” was a letter from a resident of Donville-les-Bains in Normandy stating that it had been highlighted at a Donviille public meeting about new traffic-management plans that residents there had complained about motorhomes parking along the sea-front where signage indicated this was forbidden. At the meeting the mayor also said that Donville traders’ livelihood did not depend on motorcaravanners. It is hare-brained to think that a network of parking/service areas dedicated to motorhomes could be introduced throughout the UK merely because there are other countries that have such a network. The French ‘aires’ network has been able to establish, grow and flourish, but the reasons it could do this are geographic, historic and cultural, and are applicable to France and not valid in this country. And even when a country has an ‘aires’ network, that doesn’t mean that everybody there likes this and that every community is keen to encourage motorcaravanners to visit. Rather than sign silly on-line petitions that cite ‘foreign’ motorhome parking networks as precedents and use ill-informed statements to justify their introduction in the UK, it would be much more sensible to request local authorities to follow the lead of some Welsh local councils that have chosen to encourage motorhome owners to visit their towns by advertising that officially-sanctioned overnight parking is available. What a spot on post this is. The travellers in France have not just caused problems on aires, much like our own they just pitch up and camp anywhere. Two years ago they parked up in winter ski lift car parks causing chaos. The Midi lift out of Chamonix had them and the small ski station of Praz sur Arly, no doubt many others but I had personal experience of this lot. They managed to stay most of the winter and were only tossed of in March, I think the CRS moved them off in the end, like ours they left a tip behind them. Anyone who has been to Burgundy or Champagne areas at grape picking time will also have noted hordes of them. The vineyard owners have taken to providing temporary camps now which has largely sorted it out so no doubt they at least provide a useful function picking grapes but wonder how many holiday pickers they have put off? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John J Thompson Posted November 28, 2015 Share Posted November 28, 2015 Brock - 2015-11-26 5:11 PM Anyone who has been to Burgundy or Champagne areas at grape picking time will also have noted hordes of them. The vineyard owners have taken to providing temporary camps now which has largely sorted it out so no doubt they at least provide a useful function picking grapes but wonder how many holiday pickers they have put off? An itinerant workforce was the traditional travelling lifestyle. This has been the way for centauries. The locals and landowners knew these regular travelling visitors and welcomed them. The local police also knew them and any signs of trouble were dealt with at source. They provided the temporary workforce they needed when they needed it. Most of this work has now dried up or has been taken over by workers from other countries. My GGGranffather used to overwinter "Irish Tinkers" on his land in County Durham ( Circ1850 to1910). There is a family story where they help him build a cart one winter in the house, Then they had to demolish a wall to get it out.. Descendants of these travellers later sold carpets door to door and my mother always bought from them when they were in the area. Londoners often did this type of "holiday" work as well in the hop fields. Why should "Travellers" put off the holiday pickers. Live and let live. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rupert123 Posted November 28, 2015 Share Posted November 28, 2015 John J Thompson - 2015-11-28 11:02 AM Brock - 2015-11-26 5:11 PM Anyone who has been to Burgundy or Champagne areas at grape picking time will also have noted hordes of them. The vineyard owners have taken to providing temporary camps now which has largely sorted it out so no doubt they at least provide a useful function picking grapes but wonder how many holiday pickers they have put off? An itinerant workforce was the traditional travelling lifestyle. This has been the way for centauries. The locals and landowners knew these regular travelling visitors and welcomed them. The local police also knew them and any signs of trouble were dealt with at source. They provided the temporary workforce they needed when they needed it. Most of this work has now dried up or has been taken over by workers from other countries. My GGGranffather used to overwinter "Irish Tinkers" on his land in County Durham ( Circ1850 to1910). There is a family story where they help him build a cart one winter in the house, Then they had to demolish a wall to get it out.. Descendants of these travellers later sold carpets door to door and my mother always bought from them when they were in the area. Londoners often did this type of "holiday" work as well in the hop fields. Why should "Travellers" put off the holiday pickers. Live and let live. I would suggest the work done you are talking about is long dead, what is the point of living in the distant pass, as pleasant as this would be in some instance's. I have no means of knowing if the travellers' put people off but they certainly put me off from staying anywhere near them. The owners sites provide water and waste bins but still manage to look like the local tip, why would anyone else go near them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian Kirby Posted November 28, 2015 Share Posted November 28, 2015 Bulletguy - 2015-11-25 10:44 PM.....................Never been in a traffic jam yet on any Autobahn which i use when needing to get from A to B quickly. .................. Then you are very lucky, or selective, in the autobahnen you use. We encountered substantial re-construction works on a number of autobahnen last year, that were causing extensive delays, and not a few off autobahn diversions. The Germans were up in arms about it, mainly because it resulted from long deferred maintenance that was itself a consequence of Germany having overspent on re-unification. Not relevant to aires, but it is definitely not the case that autobahnen are generally free from roadworks and delays. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian Kirby Posted November 28, 2015 Share Posted November 28, 2015 Derek Uzzell - 2015-11-28 9:58 AM Brock - 2015-11-26 5:11 PM So the question is why are we affected by groups of 'travellers' setting up camp on large plots of land and yet this doesn't seem to be a problem with Aires etc on the Continent. Solving the problem might make it easier to compel Councils to provide Aires in the UK; in fact they may not need compelling. There seems to be a general belief amongst UK motorcaravanners that ‘aires’ in Continental Europe remain unaffected by ‘travellers’ - this is not the case and never has been. Despite there being a legal framework in France compelling communities over a certain population threshold to provide permanent sites for travellers, camping-car aires are still occasionally occupied by ‘gens du yoyage’. In fact, in a recent French motorhome magazine, there was a letter from a French mayor apologising that this had happened in his town and saying that, despite consulting with the regional authority and the police, he had been told that the travellers could not be immediately moved on. There are also regular complaints in French motorhome magazines about height barriers being added to public car parks and about parking/traffic restrictions specifically targeting motorhomes. Such measures are often successfully challenged legally, but even then some sort of restriction normally results subsequently. In a recent issue of “Le Monde du Camping-Car” was a letter from a resident of Donville-les-Bains in Normandy stating that it had been highlighted at a Donviille public meeting about new traffic-management plans that residents there had complained about motorhomes parking along the sea-front where signage indicated this was forbidden. At the meeting the mayor also said that Donville traders’ livelihood did not depend on motorcaravanners. It is hare-brained to think that a network of parking/service areas dedicated to motorhomes could be introduced throughout the UK merely because there are other countries that have such a network. The French ‘aires’ network has been able to establish, grow and flourish, but the reasons it could do this are geographic, historic and cultural, and are applicable to France and not valid in this country. And even when a country has an ‘aires’ network, that doesn’t mean that everybody there likes this and that every community is keen to encourage motorcaravanners to visit. Rather than sign silly on-line petitions that cite ‘foreign’ motorhome parking networks as precedents and use ill-informed statements to justify their introduction in the UK, it would be much more sensible to request local authorities to follow the lead of some Welsh local councils that have chosen to encourage motorhome owners to visit their towns by advertising that officially-sanctioned overnight parking is available. I also agree with this. Excellent post Derek. When folk debate "aires" in UK, I suspect most mean England. To generalise: England has scarce land that is very expensive - France is the opposite. So the cost to a community of providing an Aire CC in France is relatively far lower than would be the case in most of England. As further evidence of this, consider that in many towns in France parking is free, whereas in England, free parking is a relative rarity. English local authorities have been encouraged to introduce "managed" parking, partially because population and traffic densities are so high leading to demand exceeding supply, and partially because with our high property prices we are less inclined to move house, and "prefer" instead to commute over long distances, and partly because the income generated keeps council tax lower than it would otherwise be. So, parking has become a cash cow, and in many places is just that. Now consider the impact on council income of providing for motorhome parking. How many car parking places would have to be abandoned to make space for, say, 6 motorhomes? We can just squeeze into two bays at a French super, but more realistically sterilise 4. I reckon one motorhome parking bay, realistically sized, would require roughly the same space as 2.5 car parking bays. So, to answer my own question, 15 car parking bays. Would motorhomers be happy to pay 2.5 times the cost per hour to park (to compensate for the lost car parking revenue) as they would pay had they arrived by car? I has me doots! :-) I seem already to hear the cries of "unfair discrimination". Other than in a few places where land costs are relatively low, and the desire (and expectation) for tourist income high, hoping that a network of aires will be provided across England is, IMO, indulging in sheer fantasy. Dream on! Regarding itinerants in France (and elsewhere), they are not limited to settling on aires and other car parks. They also take over municipal sites in substantial numbers, subvert the electrics to their needs, make endless use of hot water in facilities blocks, and cold water for continually washing their vehicles and caravans. They are generally very organised, very well off, and are unlikely to touch anyone else's property - because they know that if anything goes missing they will be the first suspects. Dog, crap, and own doorstep, in any order you like! :-D Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave Gomersall Posted November 28, 2015 Share Posted November 28, 2015 When people are on about 'travellers' spoiling it for everyone, do they mean them people who empty their black waste etc in AONB such as Bamburgh Castle leading to the area being made unsuitable for motorhomes? Or do they mean people who congregate in one area and block the pavements etc such as in Scarborough? Or do they mean people who avoid paying their fair share of taxes such as many self-employed people and large companies? Or do they mean people who live full time in motorhomes and not buy them to decorate their drives or block off their streets. Perhaps we shouldn't throw too many stones! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PJay Posted November 28, 2015 Share Posted November 28, 2015 On local radio to-day "Travellers have broken into a site designated for Xmas Park and Ride in Poole. I guess they want to do their Xmas shopping as well!! PJay Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bulletguy Posted November 28, 2015 Author Share Posted November 28, 2015 derek pringle - 2015-11-28 8:52 AM hi all, Do you not know of any 'motorhoming' politicians. Surely do no harm to have a 'man on the inside'. cheers derek 747 - 2015-11-28 8:59 AM Any of those will have been hoovered up by the CC or C&CC lobbyists and put on a nice retainer (as long as they do as they are told). PMSL :D :D :D :D ........but in a nutshell, sadly bang on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bulletguy Posted November 28, 2015 Author Share Posted November 28, 2015 Derek Uzzell - 2015-11-28 9:58 AM There seems to be a general belief amongst UK motorcaravanners that ‘aires’ in Continental Europe remain unaffected by ‘travellers’ - this is not the case and never has been. You'd think so wouldn't you yet in my time of touring i've yet to see ONE traveller family on an Aire. However in 2009 i stopped on a really nice campsite at Flossenburg in Germany. My 'neighbour' was a very pleasant German chap touring alone with a small caravan and we remain friends to this day. Behind us was a very large caravan, three cars and a Mercedes van. I couldn't quite figure if there was one family or two with this huge caravan, but Peter (my German 'neighbour') told me they were "Zigeuners", a German derogatory term for gypsy. They often stay long term on campsites, then attempt to 'do a runner' to avoid payment. This actually happened at another site i was on Campingplatz "Am Liepnitzsee" at Wandlitz near Berlin in 2008. The woman who owns the site already knew she had a 'problem camper' and she told me they'd been there two months. Two massive caravans, Mercedes vans and a pick up truck. They left during the time i was there and the site owner had already locked the barrier down. An argument broke out over what they owed and the next thing the local Police turned up to sort 'em out! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bulletguy Posted November 28, 2015 Author Share Posted November 28, 2015 Dave Gomersall - 2015-11-28 2:18 PM When people are on about 'travellers' spoiling it for everyone, do they mean them people who empty their black waste etc in AONB such as Bamburgh Castle leading to the area being made unsuitable for motorhomes? Or do they mean people who congregate in one area and block the pavements etc such as in Scarborough? Or do they mean people who avoid paying their fair share of taxes such as many self-employed people and large companies? Or do they mean people who live full time in motorhomes and not buy them to decorate their drives or block off their streets. Perhaps we shouldn't throw too many stones! The irony is..........some motorhomers seem to relish throwing stones at other motorhomers! We really are our own worst enemy at times and far from united! *-) :'( Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bulletguy Posted November 28, 2015 Author Share Posted November 28, 2015 Brian Kirby - 2015-11-28 12:17 PM Bulletguy - 2015-11-25 10:44 PM.....................Never been in a traffic jam yet on any Autobahn which i use when needing to get from A to B quickly. .................. Then you are very lucky, or selective, in the autobahnen you use. The only time i would have done was in 2011 when heading for Rugen......but i'd called in to visit my German pal at Sulingen and he told me the Autobahn south of Hamburg was down to single lane traffic due to repairs so best avoid. I simply re-routed. Sometimes local knowledge beats the internet! The second time was 2013 when heading toward Bavaria i noticed huge 'lakes' of water either side of the Autobahn. I stopped on a site in Austria and the owner told me that section of Autobahn had been closed due to flooding after a heavy downpour. I missed that by just two days. :D Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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