neilmac Posted December 16, 2015 Share Posted December 16, 2015 No pepe, I wouldn't call that Smart car treatment as normal. There was absolutely no attempt to reverse it properly, just brute force. I was referring to tyre scrub as had been mentioned regarding my efforts on video. Tyre scrub/slip itself allows any stress being built up within any components to release (or stay within the limits of the tyres adhesion to the road surface) so it's not actually a bad thing at all :-) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pepe63xnotuse Posted December 16, 2015 Share Posted December 16, 2015 neilmac - 2015-12-16 12:46 PM No pepe, I wouldn't call that Smart car treatment as normal. There was absolutely no attempt to reverse it properly, just brute force. No, I don't think finesse featured high up on the driver's CV... :-D Can I ask, as an experienced "A-Framer", do you feel that the above was solely down to the ham-fistedness of the driver?...or is it also the case that, with such a "stubby" car, there's always the chance that the front wheel are just going to please themselves which way they align..? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
neilmac Posted December 16, 2015 Share Posted December 16, 2015 pepe63 - 2015-12-16 1:29 PM Can I ask, as an experienced "A-Framer", do you feel that the above was solely down to the ham-fistedness of the driver?...or is it also the case that, with such a "stubby" car, there's always the chance that the front wheel are just going to please themselves which way they align..? Well, I haven't tried a-framing a Smart but I can say that it takes a while of practicing to realise that steering input from the motorhome has to be VERY slight. Too much makes the car's front wheels heave to the side and the only way to correct that is to pull forward again and have another go. The clip with the smart car clearly shows IMO that the motorhome driver wasn't even trying to do it right. I can't stress enough that it comes down to practice, practice and more practice :-) The road surface makes a difference too. Try the same manoeuvre on gravel and it's much harder - well I can't do it anyway..... The bottom line is that if the motorhome driver can't do the procedure whether down to the steering geometry of the car or ability then it only takes moments to disconnect anyway. Uncouple from the towbar, disconnect wiring and brake-away cable and in my case, unclip the braking device from the brake pedal and drive/manoeuvre the car separately - another procedure to practice so that it can be done quickly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
audiseller Posted December 16, 2015 Share Posted December 16, 2015 Muswell - 2015-12-16 11:41 AM If you have 4 wheels, one at each corner, it is impossible to move a vehicle in a curve without either (a) wheels that can swivel or (b) tyre scrub. Summed up in one sentence. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rayjsj Posted December 16, 2015 Share Posted December 16, 2015 audiseller - 2015-12-16 4:27 PM Muswell - 2015-12-16 11:41 AM If you have 4 wheels, one at each corner, it is impossible to move a vehicle in a curve without either (a) wheels that can swivel or (b) tyre scrub. Summed up in one sentence. As I spend 99.98% of the time going fowards , and the wheels are not pointing in the wrong direction when reversing (that much I can see with my 2 rear view cameras) And my tyres are not wearing out pre- maturely, why would I be bothered? I drive the car every day, so would notice anything untoward in its steering, and unusual tyre wear. Anything smaller than a Yaris would not be any use to us, with a disabled wife and 2 dogs.So cannot comment on Smart cars. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lancepar Posted December 17, 2015 Share Posted December 17, 2015 (?) Two Collies in a Smarty fit a treat..... B-) http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c214/lancepar/Smart%20Car/cornwall---hils-pics-003_zpsvh9ssgtb.jpg Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rayjsj Posted December 17, 2015 Share Posted December 17, 2015 The Fella on the left looks to be an old one ? I have 2 Labradors, both big girls. would be a tight sqeeze. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PeteH Posted December 18, 2015 Share Posted December 18, 2015 Hi Took this from another thread I posted some time back. and is my Personal view on "A" frames:- As someone who started caravanning circa 1970. And went to a R-V, when they told my wife she should no longer travel long distances without regular breaks, May I say:- I have "Toaded" all over the USA, 15000+miles in fact. Where the practice is universally accepted. I have never been able to understand the "European Phobia" against the practice. But then, That`s Europe!. (Stupidity personified IMHO). The pro`s and cons are well known, and as (allegedly) free persons we can make educated choices according to our will. There are known arguments for and against the practice. Having recently returned to the use of a Motor-home, after a 3 year break during which we had a Caravan, that which we discarded largely because neither myself nor my (disabled) wife could sit comfortably in the Seating, whereas now we have a "Captains" chair each with a leg-rest (side bench). I tow an old Punto on "A" frame. AND IT WORKS FOR US!. It is however a Grey area. having (unlike "Dolly" Frames) never been tested in the law courts. BTW, I Know from experience that my (now) rig is far quicker to set -up than a Caravan!. Unless or until they are the subject of a "test" case (as happened with "Dolly" frames) then the legality is not an issue. Any debate as to the "technical" aspect of use is just that, a debate!. BTW. US Style "tow dollys" are completely reversible!. I know, I brought a Rental car from Florida to Texas on a "U-Haul" one, Behind the R-V when we Bought It!, It is also IMHO an even better device than an "A" frame but has been judged as "legal only for the recovery of disabled vehicles" by the Courts Circa 1975ish. IF, I decide in the future to go back to Spain, as we did for many years prior to choosing the USA. I would likely buy a Smart and Trailer it, JUST to avoid the hassle of being "pulled" by Spanish "plod" (3 times). Someone makes (made) a trailer with a folding Draw bar, and that would take up the least space on site. ( one guy I know, put plywood base on the trailer and used it for a Gazebo, to Barbecue in / on!). Pete Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony Jones Posted December 19, 2015 Share Posted December 19, 2015 Well! It's been many months since I last looked in on this forum, but some things never change. The old "A-frame" debate STILL rumbles on! I've not looked further down the front page yet - are people still talking about friend's neighbour's friend's brother, who was gassed in their motorhome, as well? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rayjsj Posted December 20, 2015 Share Posted December 20, 2015 Hello Tony, Nice to have you back from the dark side! No not much changes, a few of the vindictive characters have left (or been pushed). I am still standing up for the A- frame corner, but only for use in the UK. Have you got the week off for Christmas ? Thought it would be your busiest time ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony Jones Posted December 20, 2015 Share Posted December 20, 2015 I can always make time for old friends Ray! Glad to hear that some of the trolls have trolled off. They've definitely not come over to PMG - we wouldn't have 'em there! So ... all friendly and helpful here these days then? Maybe I'll look in a bit more often! Thanks for the welcome Ray, happy Christmas to you and yours. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PJay Posted December 20, 2015 Share Posted December 20, 2015 two Days running TONY. Good to see you over here again. Bit quiet on your other forum, mainly you and the mods posting. Shame really. At least we get plenty of posts on here, even if some people are controversial, still get some good posts Happy Christmas to you and yours. PJay PS even MelB has come back recently PJ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony Jones Posted December 20, 2015 Share Posted December 20, 2015 Hi Pauline, good to see you're still around - and Mel B too, one of the few I've had the honour to meet personally! Anyone heard from Michele lately? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Barney123 Posted March 2, 2016 Share Posted March 2, 2016 Hi Tony, I have sent you a PM. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Geeco Posted March 2, 2016 Share Posted March 2, 2016 There is an interesting general article on AFrame towing in the current issue of imotorhome.com.au see issue 89.Cheers, Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derek Uzzell Posted March 3, 2016 Share Posted March 3, 2016 The magazine containing the article Gary mentions can be downloaded from here http://www.imotorhome.com.au/emagazine I guess it’s worth saying that Australian motoring regulations regarding A-framing differ from the UK’s and those of other EU countries. The latest issue of MMM magazine (April 2016 - Pages 18 and 19) has a couple of letters about A-framing. One of these mentions being fined €250 in Spain. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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