Chuns Posted December 13, 2015 Share Posted December 13, 2015 Does anybody know anything about the floors used in Motorhomes? I ask because I want to fit a different table to my 2015 Adria, and need to fix it to the floor. I was going to bolt it through, but there is a chassis member in the way, so I am thinking about self-tappers, or threaded inserts. If I drill, and break through the floor I can seal it with mastic where I can get to it, but not where I can’t, for example in the upside-down top-hat section of the chassis. So to crystallise my thoughts, does anybody have an idea of the likely thickness (not keen on drilling a test hole), and what material? In a mock up I have found a conventional M8 machine screw driven into heavy marine ply more than strong enough, but I fear that even though the loads are light they may be too much for lightweight boards. My very last resort would be to bond the base of the table to the floor, or am I wrong to be reluctant to do that? Any insight will increase my knowledge 100%, so thanks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian Kirby Posted December 13, 2015 Share Posted December 13, 2015 You really need to find out what construction Adria uses. As with anything motorhome, there is usually no such thing as a motorhome anything that can reliably be assumed to apply to all motorhomes. AFAIK, almost all will be some kind on sandwich construction with light joists capped top and bottom by ply, possibly GRP on the underside. The gaps between the joists will be filled with some form of insulant, often expanded polystyrene. The ply will be just thick enough to span between the joists without perceptible deflection underfoot. Bolting through, unless you can guarantee bolting through a joist (which, the joists being of minimal size would weaken them), would be liable to distort both upper and lower layers, and compress the insulant. The table leg would therefore be unlikely to be rigid. Not, I think, a viable option. But, if the van is double floored, and the upper "false" floor is sufficiently robust, you may get away with it. Screwing to the upper ply layer of a sandwich floor would IMO invite disaster, as i would seriously doubt that the ply is sufficient to hold a screw against the probable stresses. Sorry. But just my opinion: as above, you really need to find out from Adria exactly what you would be dealing with. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AndyB Posted December 13, 2015 Share Posted December 13, 2015 I've got a 2015 Adria as well and I'm very impressed with the build quality and last thing I'd do as drill a hole in the double floor as who knows what lies within, pipes, cables, heating ducts etc. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RubyExsis Posted December 14, 2015 Share Posted December 14, 2015 Sorry, I have no idea re your floor construction or what your table base/ leg is. Could you use a metal baseplate (3mm thick) about 300mm square or oblong that could be screwed to the floor to dissipate the loading and take the strain. Then locate the table base/leg to a fixing that is attached to the baseplate. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chuns Posted December 14, 2015 Author Share Posted December 14, 2015 Thanks, Brian, for a most helpful post. Second time I've asked for help on this Forum, and second time your answer has been informative and knowledgeable. Thank you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chuns Posted December 14, 2015 Author Share Posted December 14, 2015 Thanks, Ruby, that is more or less the area I was in with my thoughts. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brom Posted December 14, 2015 Share Posted December 14, 2015 Just a thought - if you're wanting to install a removable table, without cutting a hole in the floor (as with a Fiamma socket), there is the alternative of a SEQUOIA mount. We've come across it once on a test van, and found it just a little waffy, but it might do your job? Or, of course, you could use a Fiamma table on a post, and one of those plastic, easily-removable tripods, then it's totally free-standing, with no interference to the motorhome's floor. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian Kirby Posted December 15, 2015 Share Posted December 15, 2015 Chuns - 2015-12-14 11:06 PM Thanks, Ruby, that is more or less the area I was in with my thoughts. I still urge caution. Tables in motorhomes inevitably impede progress around the van, and occasionally get leaned upon while squeezing past, or when trying to reach to the back of a cupboard above. These loads will be either lateral against, or eccentric to, the table top, and will then be magnified through the nice long lever of its leg, to place considerable loads on the fixing points. If those fixings are only into the flooring ply, which may be only 6mm or so thick, it is likely they will at some point fail. The only remedy, in the absence of knowledge of the actual flooring material, would be a base plate of such size that it a) reduces the resultant load to the minimum practically achievable, and b) allows the number of fixings to be increased, so that the load on each is reduced so far as practically possible. However, for the table to remain comfortably rigid in use, we are now considering a large, thick, and so heavy, base plate. It should also be borne in mind that a fixed table needs to be able to resist the stresses involved should the van be involved in an accident. Having the accident would be bad enough, having a table complete with its leg break free to continue on its pre-accident path would only make the consequences worse. I would still find out what the floor construction actually is, and then decide whether or not, and if relevant how, to proceed based on that knowledge. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tracker Posted December 15, 2015 Share Posted December 15, 2015 We have been using one of these in several vans now for a few years and it works well being movable, stable and not needing any holes other than for where you store the leg plus you can use it outdoors, although you may need a shorter leg, and when you sell the van you take it all with you! http://www.thecaravanshop.co.uk/motorhome-accessories/fiamma-table-legs/fiamma-tripod/prod_268.html Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chuns Posted December 17, 2015 Author Share Posted December 17, 2015 An update for those who kindly showed an interest, and gave opinions... There is a double floor where I want to fit the table pedestal, made of 15mm ply. Although soft and light, this will easily accept the likely loads it will endure, the mountings are 8mm, spaced at around 250mm diameter. Getting to it is another matter - I pulled the fresh water tank out, only to find supportive webs in the way, so no backing plate, or nuts and washers. However I found some 8mm spring toggles, like you use with plasterboard, and they should suffice. I'm going to dwell on it for a while. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flicka Posted December 17, 2015 Share Posted December 17, 2015 Hi Chuns - what model Adria do you have ? Our coachbuilt Adria Sport has a raised floor where the table sits & is 3" or 4" above the main (lower insulated) floor with a void between which houses heating ducts, fresh water pipe & cables. I would be reluctant to secure any table mount through the upper floor only & to bolt through both upper & lower floor would risk damage to the services in between. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pepe63xnotuse Posted December 18, 2015 Share Posted December 18, 2015 I'm inclined to agree that, unless you can fully access the underside, so as to fit a decent sized backing plate(and maybe braces back to existing structure?), then I'd probably leave well alone. ...and I certainly wouldn't be drilling blind into a section boxed in by webs. (Does the van have an existing table mount? if so, can you see underneath, to see how or if they've "beefed" theirs up?) If not, my concern with just fixing through the floor skin alone, just using toggle fixings, is that until you've actually drilled through and started to tighten them, you've no real idea of how sturdy a fixing you'll get....and it's a bit late at that point :-S If you are hell bent on installing a fixed table point, is there anyway you could use one of the swan-neck mounts that fixes to something like a seat/cupboard base? (but again, as long as you can access to brace and strengthen behind). example- http://www.olearymotorhomes.co.uk/swing-out-leg-kit-anodised-chrome-colour-1470-p.asp Either way, on such a new van I'd need to be really sure that what I was going to do was going to be 100% successful... and an "improvement" that, when it comes time to sell, wouldn't impact negatively on it.. :-) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian Kirby Posted December 18, 2015 Share Posted December 18, 2015 Alternatively, can you take out the raised portion of floor to work on it? If you could, you could then modify it as necessary to stiffen it, and install the table leg base and fixings with access to both sides before re-fixing in place. Otherwise, I agree that it is probably best left alone, Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chuns Posted December 18, 2015 Author Share Posted December 18, 2015 Thanks again for the thought-provoking inputs. The Adria is a Coral Plus 670 SL, and the raised floor skin is in the seating area behind the two cab seats. The issue with the standard table is that it projects too far towards the centreline, and makes passing through from the cab seats difficult. I'm sure the design philosophy is to have it big enough for four, but we are resolutely two, and would prefer more space. I have roughly located where the base will be, and it nicely straddles a fore-and-aft web, so there is local stiffening. My next job it to use some more accurate locating procedures. I'm swayed by the arguments to leave well alone from a structural view, though from a resale angle the original table would be refitted, and the holes filled by blanking plugs, hidden under the original carpet, which we have replaced with a more durable, and sensibly coloured one. I have a plan B, and that is to have made a smaller version of the existing table, which hangs from a rail on nearside wall, and would use all existing fittings. So I'm going to mull it over further, which gives a neat intro for a joke about mulled wine. Instead I'll wish you all the best for Christmas, and the New Year. P Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pepe63xnotuse Posted December 18, 2015 Share Posted December 18, 2015 Chuns - 2015-12-18 12:34 PM The issue with the standard table is that it projects too far towards the centreline, and makes passing through from the cab seats difficult. I'm sure the design philosophy is to have it big enough for four, but we are resolutely two, and would prefer more space. P Hi again.. So....this repositioning will be for "tweaking" the position of the OE mount, rather than for creating an additional table option?... Could you not look into sourcing a different table and/or upper sliding/rotating gear that would slide out of the way..? Or sourcing (or having made?) a cranked/off-set pedestal?.one that'd fit into the existing base?.. Or if it's only to move it a few inches, maybe a(stainless steel?) "off-set" plate? One that would pick up on the existing floor holes, whilst mirroring them at the other end with threaded fixing studs ? (you could perhaps try that out first with a plywood mock up?) Or.. after all that, would it still be in the way anyway? If it would be, as it's a newish van, is this something that you may just get used to?...:-S Even if we assume that any repositioned mount would be strong enough, personally, blanked with grommets or not, I still wouldn't like the idea of having/ leaving a second batch of fixing holes in the floor. :-S Anyway, have yourself a good Christmas... :-D Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian Kirby Posted December 18, 2015 Share Posted December 18, 2015 Chuns - 2015-12-18 12:34 PM..............................I have a plan B, and that is to have made a smaller version of the existing table, which hangs from a rail on nearside wall, and would use all existing fittings...................... Have you considered caravan breakers? Rail mounted tables are not that unusual, and you may well be able to find one that is an acceptable match and in good condition. I assume you can transfer the rail mountings and leg from your existing table. Then when you want to sell, just put mountings and leg back onto the original table top. Should be much simpler and cheaper, though you may have to spend a while searching for the "right" table top. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
goldi Posted December 18, 2015 Share Posted December 18, 2015 Hi there chuns, I had a similar notion to move my table , However due to my concern about stability / momentum in accident I was able to move it half the distance I wanted and I then bought a new table top from a supplier to order in Norfolk. Anyway this is a good time to mull anything over. Merry Christmas everyone. norm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flicka Posted December 20, 2015 Share Posted December 20, 2015 Hi Chuns I have sent you a PM Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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