tasman Posted February 17, 2016 Share Posted February 17, 2016 I have a van conversion and would like to know what reasons there might be for not using two vehicle specific scissor jacks to level the van? I appreciate I might need some sort of plate to spread the weight on the ground and might need to level in stages to avoid distortion. My thinking is that one extra jack would take up less space than a set of levelling blocks, I will still need chocs but overall there could be a saving in weight as well. Any thoughts ?? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tracker Posted February 17, 2016 Share Posted February 17, 2016 Why not - if it works for you go for it ? Personally, faffing about under the van on often wet or mucky ground to locate and wind up jack(s), and then down again when moving is not something that I find all that appealing! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rayjsj Posted February 17, 2016 Share Posted February 17, 2016 Scissor jacks are not designed to take the weight of a van plus people walking about inside the van, far safer on chocks, using the normal suspension. I wouldn't trust even 2 scissor jacks. My scissor jack weighs more than a set of chocks anyway. I agree with Tracker, I used Fiamma jacks as rear steadies, on a coach built with large overhang, what a faff, especially when it's hissing down. Go for chocks or park somewhere level. Less hassle. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tracker Posted February 17, 2016 Share Posted February 17, 2016 Rayjsj - 2016-02-17 11:47 AM park somewhere level. Less hassle. That's our favoured solution too Ray - and a heck of a lot easier it is with a panel van than with a gurt big coachbuilt! To be fair the OP was not suggesting jacking the van up - just taking enough weight for stability and/or level - neither of which has ever bothered us much as long as the cups don't slide off the table and neither of us rolls out of bed! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tall_Mike Posted February 17, 2016 Share Posted February 17, 2016 Thought about this, initially scoffed at the idea of levelling - Until one night we stopped over, certainly not level - Kitchen sink wouldn't drain, not sure that the water pump worked brilliantly, fridge etc - even the floor just felt plain weird, don't think the human body is equipped to live on a slope. Decided at that point that something needed to be done. http://forums.outandaboutlive.co.uk/forums/images/emoticons/icon_rolleyes.gif So we went out and bought a good pair of ramp, ramps slot together in their own bag, don't take up masses of room. the ramps have got "steps" so it's relatively simple to drive up them to a level, - Managed to drive off the back edge of one but fortunately no damage resulted, find them easy to use, not sure why I would want to mess around with jacks, heavy, cumbersome, probably need some kind of under plate, and be fitted correctly under the van so as not to break anything - Simply work out with a Spirit level which side or end of the van the ramps need to go under and drive onto them, job done. Even better to find a level pitch with hard standing though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derek Uzzell Posted February 17, 2016 Share Posted February 17, 2016 I’ve recently bought these levelling ramps (£21.45 including postage) http://tinyurl.com/jan2lqg and more details here http://www.towsure.com/milenco-mgi-midi-t2-levellling-ramps For me these should be large/wide/high enough to handle any slope I would realistically consider parking my motorhome on. (I also have a pair of Milenco “Quatrro” ramps (very bulky and I don’t like the ‘aggressive' shape of their upper surface) and a pair of traditional narrowish wedge-shaped ramps that are often too small to be effective.) If the intention is to ‘level' a motorhome, rather than just ‘stabilise’ it (as Ray does), consideration needs to be given as to how scissor-jacks would be used in practice. Levelling ramps go beneath the motorhome’s tyres and no upwards load is placed on the vehicle itself. If jacks were used to level a motorhome, the jacks will (obviously) produce loadings and - to avoid damage - the jacks should be carefully positioned at the points prescribed by the vehicle manufacturer to accept a jack when a wheel is to be changed. Using common-or-garden scissor-jacks to lift the front of a motorhome, say, 10cm (easily and quickly achieved with a pair of largish levelling ramps) will require a LOT of effort, never mind the loads being placed on the ground and the vehicle, and (as tasman has realised) jacking should be gradual. Scissor-jacks are evidently popular for levelling/stabilising American RVs as they offer a much cheaper alternative to an ‘on-board’ levelling system. But the jacks used are heavy duty and RVs tend to sit in place for longish periods. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cleddytanhouse Posted February 17, 2016 Share Posted February 17, 2016 I purchased a couple of hydraulic jacks from Screwfix for, I think around £15.00. They do what I want and may be worth considering. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derek Uzzell Posted February 18, 2016 Share Posted February 18, 2016 Chris I believe you own a recent Auto-Trail Tracker. Surely you aren’t using Screwfix bottle-jacks to level your motorhome when touring and parking on a slope becomes unavoidable? The Screwfix jacks have a smallish base-area and an even smaller top. On any sort of soft surface they would require something (eg. a board) under them to stop them sinking in and there would be no firm mechanical’ attachment to the vehicle being lifted. Even used to ‘stabilise’ a motorhome (rather than jack it up) the same potential limitations would apply. Tasman’s original inquiry involved obtaining a second scissor-jack matching the one supplied wth the vehicle that forms the basis of the van conversion. The limitations of this approach are mentioned (need for ‘spreaders' and gradual lifting) but the only obvious merit in the idea I can see is the potential to save a little space. It’s doubtful that any scissor-jack supplied with a commercial vehicle will weigh less than a pair of good-size levelling ramps. Ray refers to Fiamma jacks. These come in sets of 4 and in plastic or aluminium http://www.agentfiamma.co.uk/fiamma-level-systems-and-jacks/?sort=&page=2 but they are intended only for stabilising the vehicle and not to lift it. Might be helpful if you said what you use your Screwfix jacks for. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ken the kontiki Posted February 18, 2016 Share Posted February 18, 2016 We also use 2 x 8 tonne bottle jacks on the front of our Kontiki tag on the odd occasion that levelling blocks and scaffold boards fail to give us enough lift at the front on sloping pitches. Once the MH is up on the levelling blocks and the front needs to go up more, the bottle jacks are used to lift the body on the suspension but only to take the travel out of the springs and coils. At no time do the wheels leave the ground and yes, we use a block either side of the bottle jack. Been doing it this way for a few years now and it works for us. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cleddytanhouse Posted February 18, 2016 Share Posted February 18, 2016 I do use a wide timber block under the base of the jack, which is only used on the proper jacking point on the chassis. I do not raise the wheels off the ground, I simply add a little height if required, over and above what the ramps may provide. The MH wheels are chocked to prevent any movement. I have only had to use the jacks twice and they have worked to provide better levelling and also a steadier van in the wind. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bolero boy Posted February 18, 2016 Share Posted February 18, 2016 cleddytanhouse - 2016-02-18 9:22 AM I do use a wide timber block under the base of the jack, which is only used on the proper jacking point on the chassis. I do not raise the wheels off the ground, I simply add a little height if required, over and above what the ramps may provide. The MH wheels are chocked to prevent any movement. I have only had to use the jacks twice and they have worked to provide better levelling and also a steadier van in the wind. i was thinking of doing the same....our fiamma ramps are ok but they arent as high as some and i dont want a buklier hier set really.... disadvantage with the fiammas is that the wheels are still on a slope even when raised, ie not 'parked' in a shaped recess like the milenco ones.... so, to add a little extra height, imwas thinking of a pair of bottle jacks or the fiamma 'jacks' as mentioned by Ray. each will take a tonne in weight (plenty) although they would never be used except to raise the van a tad hegher than when on the ramps..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Billggski Posted February 18, 2016 Share Posted February 18, 2016 I've had a scissor jack collapse in the past, they don't like sideways movement and if changing a tyre I always put the tyre under the body before undoing or tightening the bolts. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian Kirby Posted February 18, 2016 Share Posted February 18, 2016 The further you raise the vehicle, the less friction there will be between the tyres and the ground, as more of its weight is transferred to the jack. If the ground is to any extent soft, the jack bases will be liable to sink, and may not do so evenly, leading to the vehicle beginning to tilt, possibly to the point at which the tyres can no longer hold it in place. Wind may also play a part in this, as may the shifting internal load. Should this happen, it is possible the van could twist sideways off the jacks, possibly damaging both jacking points and jacks. This is not a use either jacks, or jacking points, have been designed for. Not, I think, a good idea. Besides which, I doubt levelling ramps weigh any more than the extra jack, although they are admittedly bulky. They are also easy to position and use. If unavoidably on sloping ground, park across the slope wherever possible, as it is far easier to level a van across its width, than along its length. But best of all, as suggested above, is to find somewhere flatter. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tasman Posted February 18, 2016 Author Share Posted February 18, 2016 Thanks to all who have responded. Your various comments have been carefully noted. So, it looks like the levelling blocks will have to stay. I can't help thinking though that there must be an easier and more efficient way without resorting to the exhorbitant cost of an hydraulic jacking system or all this mucking about shoving lumps of plastic or wood under ones wheels !!! Please consider the subject closed - for the time being. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
colin Posted February 18, 2016 Share Posted February 18, 2016 tasman - 2016-02-18 7:51 PM or all this mucking about shoving lumps of plastic or wood under ones wheels !!! I can understand that if you have limited storage space only having to carry one extra jack has an appeal, but using these would IMO be much more mucking about. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nowtelse2do Posted February 18, 2016 Share Posted February 18, 2016 Air Bags. Push a button ;-) Dave Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Colin Leake Posted February 22, 2016 Share Posted February 22, 2016 Your problem like many others is in leveling terms you only think up. A bit of lateral thinking is what you need. It's simple dig a couple of holes and drive the end that is too high into them! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tracker Posted February 22, 2016 Share Posted February 22, 2016 Colin Leake - 2016-02-22 4:06 PM Your problem like many others is in leveling terms you only think up. A bit of lateral thinking is what you need. It's simple dig a couple of holes and drive the end that is too high into them! Brilliant - so all you need now is to tow a generator or compressor and carry a Kango! Why didn't anyone else think of that! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Allen Posted February 22, 2016 Share Posted February 22, 2016 And a winch to pull yourself out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Colin Leake Posted February 22, 2016 Share Posted February 22, 2016 Tracker - 2016-02-22 4:26 PM Colin Leake - 2016-02-22 4:06 PM Your problem like many others is in leveling terms you only think up. A bit of lateral thinking is what you need. It's simple dig a couple of holes and drive the end that is too high into them! Brilliant - so all you need now is to tow a generator or compressor and carry a Kango! Why didn't anyone else think of that! Na select a grass pitch and all you need is a folding shovel and an early morning departure before the warden starts. You could even empty your waste water into the holes killing two birds with one stone as it were. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tracker Posted February 23, 2016 Share Posted February 23, 2016 Colin Leake - 2016-02-22 10:55 PM You could even empty your waste water into the holes killing two birds with one stone as it were. How dare you sir - doncha know that it is the Club's policy that ALL motorhomes must leave the site with their waste tank taps open to more fairly distribute the soapy water over the road and not concentrate it in one spot! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Colin Leake Posted February 23, 2016 Share Posted February 23, 2016 Just a thought the next motorhomes to use the pitch would love me. No need to faff about with leveling blocks, just drive into my leveling holes! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tracker Posted February 23, 2016 Share Posted February 23, 2016 Colin Leake - 2016-02-23 5:19 PM Just a thought the next motorhomes to use the pitch would love me. No need to faff about with leveling blocks, just drive into my leveling holes! Come on Colin - lateral thinking - why not just dig up your holes and take them with you to use again - how's that for green thinking recycling? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Colin Leake Posted February 23, 2016 Share Posted February 23, 2016 And another thing. Leveling holes self evidently do what they say but Pot Holes. Where did that come from? Road holes, highway holes, or simply holes would,be fine but who on earth thought calling them Pot Holes? What on earth has a hole in the road to do with pots? Makes about as much sense as calling the downs that are always on high ground the downs when they should obviously be called the ups or the highs. Must have many a forign tourist wondering what the Devils going on when told one is going up on the downs! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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