Violet1956 Posted February 26, 2016 Share Posted February 26, 2016 The Caravan Club issued a notice in the March 2016 magazine saying that they cannot accomodate deliveries from supermarkets to sites adding... "In the interests of health and safety, we aim to keep vehicles on site to a minimum, and the unloading of supermarket lorries can obstruct others. In addition, delivery times do not necessariy coincide with reception opening times and drivers often require assistance from site staff to find pitches. There have also been instances of deliveries turning up before members have arrived on site. Details on nearby shops are available on site." In my view the health and safety issue is but one other example of an organisation providing what is a convenient excuse but which is in reality no major health and safety problem at all. Aren't visitors in cars allowed access at pretty random times. A delivery should take little more than 5 mins so I can't see how that is going to cause major inconvenience to other campers. The real issue I suspect is timing and increasing the burdens on site staff. The site could make clear in their website what opening times are available for delivery vehicles to enter. Once a local supplier's drivers have been to the site a few times I don't doubt that they will become sufficiently knowledgeable about the site layout not to bother the hard pushed staff. I would not use such a service with only two of us but I could see how it would be invaluable to larger families and groups who wish to take the drudge out of shopping in order to maximise their enjoyment of their holiday. My experience of the CC goes back a long way and it seems they always have to be dragged screaming into meeting the needs of their customers/members as their default position is always to minimise inconvenience to the site staff. Does anyone else agree/disagree? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tracker Posted February 26, 2016 Share Posted February 26, 2016 Sorry Violet but I have to disagree. What is so hard about arriving with enough food to at least see you overnight if not for a day or three, after all we all manage it perfectly well at home? For us one of the joys of being away is to sample different foods and for that one needs different shops in local towns an villages and whilst the staples I guess will always be bought from a supermarket, I for one (although I never use club sites!) would expect them to be a nicer place without various supermarket vans buzzing in and out so for once in my life I find myself agreeing with the Club. Who'd have ever thought it!! You'll be telling me next that a chauffeur to drive you to the site would be handy! (only joking!!) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
malc d Posted February 26, 2016 Share Posted February 26, 2016 Violet1956 - 2016-02-26 3:07 PM Does anyone else agree/disagree? Totally disagree with you and support the Caravan Clubs reasons 150%. :-| p.s. What would be next - window cleaners ? ;-) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StuartO Posted February 26, 2016 Share Posted February 26, 2016 The Caravan Club promotes its Club Sites as holiday venues and caravanners often book stays of a week or more on the same site. Delivery of shopping is a new service but it's becoming more and more popular, so on the face of it why not facilitate supermarket deliveries to a Site as an additional customer service? The "health & safety" argument against doing so strikes me as a pretty weak one, although I suppose if there ended up being multiple deliveries per day it could become a nuisance to the majority if the vans were allowed to drive around the Site to find the pitch. Do they allow taxis on site to pick people up or make them wait at the entrance, I can't remember? On French sites of course it's quite common to have bread deliveries, often the van tours the site honking his horn loudly too. I'm pretty sure I have seen fish & chip vans on CC Sites - are those assessed for health and safety? I suspect the staff moaning about the extra work it brings for them is more credible as the real reason for CC banning them. Either way CC is unlikely to feel any urgent pressure to meet its members' wishes, should there be any objections. Anyone who thinks CC is remotely like a club run for the benefit of its members has another think coming. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Violet1956 Posted February 26, 2016 Author Share Posted February 26, 2016 Tracker - 2016-02-26 4:28 PM Sorry Violet but I have to disagree. What is so hard about arriving with enough food to at least see you overnight if not for a day or three, after all we all manage it perfectly well at home? For us one of the joys of being away is to sample different foods and for that one needs different shops in local towns an villages and whilst the staples I guess will always be bought from a supermarket, I for one (although I never use club sites!) would expect them to be a nicer place without various supermarket vans buzzing in and out so for once in my life I find myself agreeing with the Club. Who'd have ever thought it!! You'll be telling me next that a chauffeur to drive you to the site would be handy! (only joking!!) I have one already Tracker. He's the one with the cold bottom remember! (lol) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tracker Posted February 26, 2016 Share Posted February 26, 2016 Violet1956 - 2016-02-26 5:02 PM I have one already Tracker. He's the one with the cold bottom remember! (lol) Handy tip - let cold bottomed chauffeur have a nice warm cup of coffee and a bacon sarnie in the cafe whilst he waits for you to do the supermarket shopping - go on it's be kind to hubby year this year - I hope! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Violet1956 Posted February 26, 2016 Author Share Posted February 26, 2016 malc d - 2016-02-26 4:38 PM Violet1956 - 2016-02-26 3:07 PM Does anyone else agree/disagree? Totally disagree with you and support the Caravan Clubs reasons 150%. p.s. What would be next - window cleaners ? ;-) What a good idea. I could also do with a daily maid service, cook and bottlewasher and someone to mix my cocktails. Seriously though I accept that a free for all is not advisable and likely to be unpleasant and grossly inconvenient for staff and campers alike. I think there is a get round though e.g. they could inform people when booking that there are strict time slots when deliveries are allowed. Its all very well for couples like me and the OH who are semi-retired and don't have lots to shop for. Years ago when we went caravaning in groups of families with our young children it would have been a godsend to have a joint kitty for all the necessaries for the week or two we were staying and the facility to order supplies on line. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Violet1956 Posted February 26, 2016 Author Share Posted February 26, 2016 StuartO - 2016-02-26 4:53 PMThe Caravan Club promotes its Club Sites as holiday venues and caravanners often book stays of a week or more on the same site. Delivery of shopping is a new service but it's becoming more and more popular, so on the face of it why not facilitate supermarket deliveries to a Site as an additional customer service? The "health & safety" argument against doing so strikes me as a pretty weak one, although I suppose if there ended up being multiple deliveries per day it could become a nuisance to the majority if the vans were allowed to drive around the Site to find the pitch. Do they allow taxis on site to pick people up or make them wait at the entrance, I can't remember? On French sites of course it's quite common to have bread deliveries, often the van tours the site honking his horn loudly too. I'm pretty sure I have seen fish & chip vans on CC Sites - are those assessed for health and safety? I suspect the staff moaning about the extra work it brings for them is more credible as the real reason for CC banning them. Either way CC is unlikely to feel any urgent pressure to meet its members' wishes, should there be any objections. Anyone who thinks CC is remotely like a club run for the benefit of its members has another think coming. The CC has improved a lot since we used them in the 80s particularly in relation to provision for families with small children, Washing a baby or a toddler in a small vanity sink was not easy. Would be happy if it was a policy brought about by a democratic process. I suppose it is an issue I could raise at the AGM. Would be happy if they at least reconsidered and it was put to a vote. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PJay Posted February 26, 2016 Share Posted February 26, 2016 I have always maintained that the CC is for caravans , so not a problem for them, as they have a car!, Too bad if shops are miles away for motorhomers, who do not have bikes. We are no longer members as we don't use van in UK now PJay Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Colin Leake Posted February 26, 2016 Share Posted February 26, 2016 We were on a site in Scotland some years ago that was some 26 miles away from the nearest supermarket and bank for that matter. One user we were talking to had done his shopping on line with Tesco which they duly delivered. When he checked he found he had part of someone else's order. She rang them up tell them and was told to keep the goods. Apparently they did not fancy a trip of 26 miles each way to collect the goods. I gather that whilst the club used to permit this some members used to order then be out when the goods delivered leaving the wardens to,take delivery of multiple orders with all the ensuing complications. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Violet1956 Posted February 26, 2016 Author Share Posted February 26, 2016 PJay - 2016-02-26 6:50 PM I have always maintained that the CC is for caravans , so not a problem for them, as they have a car!, Too bad if shops are miles away for motorhomers, who do not have bikes. We are no longer members as we don't use van in UK now PJay I can see your point and I believe the CC club are way behind the trend. We have been out just two times since we bought our van and stayed both times on CC sites so that we could get used to the practicalities of motorhoming. I would say that at least 70% if not more of the CC site users we encountered were in motorhomes. The CC will hopefully have their own stats on this and will need to assess the needs of the majority of their users/members. We are wildcampers at heart but the UK is so motorhome unfriendly that we plan to spend most of our time outside the UK eventually. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Violet1956 Posted February 26, 2016 Author Share Posted February 26, 2016 What you describe Colin in terms of the imposition on wardens is totally unacceptable. If the people who ordered aren't on site for a scheduled delivery then then they need to understand that the delivery will be rejected and they will have to bear the costs. I believe that most people would understand this and the minority who don't would soon amend their behaviour when it hits their pocket. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
malc d Posted February 26, 2016 Share Posted February 26, 2016 Violet1956 - 2016-02-26 5:13 PM malc d - 2016-02-26 4:38 PM Violet1956 - 2016-02-26 3:07 PM Does anyone else agree/disagree? Totally disagree with you and support the Caravan Clubs reasons 150%. p.s. What would be next - window cleaners ? ;-) What a good idea. I could also do with a daily maid service, cook and bottlewasher and someone to mix my cocktails. Seriously though I accept that a free for all is not advisable and likely to be unpleasant and grossly inconvenient for staff and campers alike. One of the most important things for me on a campsite is a bit of peace and quiet, so any unnecessary traffic is the last thing I want to see on site. Lawn mowers are bad enough. It's true that on some sites ( certainly in France ) it is quite common for the local baker to drive his van around the site each morning for those who require bread. As bread doesn't stay fresh much more than 24 hours ( if you are lucky ) I can accept this as a useful arrangement to make a daily visit to the shops unnecessary. On most sites in this country I have been required to walk all the way to the office (!) each morning to collect bread - but I don't feel I am being persecuted by the site owners.. I wouldn't object to groceries being delivered to a SITE - I just wouldn't like to see vans roaming round sites looking for individual pitches. Why not just go to the gate to collect your groceries. ? It's true that fish and chip vans often visit sites - but I've never seen one where the van visits each pitch. Again, customers are usually prepared to walk all the way to the fryers van. If you do win with your proposal to further interrupt my peace and quiet I will come and park next to you and keep ordering pizzas - - and hopefully they will be delivered on really noisy motorbikes. ;-) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Violet1956 Posted February 26, 2016 Author Share Posted February 26, 2016 Malc you seem to have overlooked the part where I said that I accept that a free-for-all would not be acceptable and that there could be limits placed on the times and duration of any access to the sites by delivery vans. You may have a point about people being able to collect their stuff from a central point if that were practical. It is also the case that when pitching on campsites we have to be careful to cause minimun annoyance to our neighbours. Some of the CC sites are large enough to have strictly quiet areas to accommodate people who would not wish to be disturbed by deliveries. All I am proposing is that more thought could be given to the needs of certain people who use the campsites and that enabling supermarket deliveries would enhance some people's holiday experience. That may not be practical throughout the CC estate. The last site we visited in Brighton however was huge with many distinct areas in which in my judgement could separately accommodate those who would wish to have a delivery service and those who don't wish to have them or to be disturbed by them. It's a service that I see would most benefit families or groups of friends with several units camping together. Even without a delivery service they are not going to be the quietest of people to pitch next to. Those of us who are retired, semi-retired or childless generally have much greater freedom about where and when we go away. Shouldn't we be a little more generous in spirit and pay attention to the needs of those who don't enjoy such freedoms? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keithl Posted February 27, 2016 Share Posted February 27, 2016 Violet, But what about those campsites who run small on-site shops which help supplement the upkeep of the site? I admit they may only stock the 'essentials' but surely this is direct competition and a loss of potential income to the site. Keith. PS And I don't agree with supermarket deliveries to sites in the first place. Just my opinion! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Violet1956 Posted February 27, 2016 Author Share Posted February 27, 2016 Keithl - 2016-02-27 9:22 AM Violet, But what about those campsites who run small on-site shops which help supplement the upkeep of the site? I admit they may only stock the 'essentials' but surely this is direct competition and a loss of potential income to the site. Keith. PS And I don't agree with supermarket deliveries to sites in the first place. Just my opinion! Thanks for your input Keith. I did acknowledge in a previous post that it would not be a practical option on all sites within the CC estate. If I substitute the word advisable for practical I think it covers the very valid point you make. I am glad I started the thread which was to test out the water. I believe that the demographic on this forum means that there is likely to be more against than in favour. I fear that it is a proposal that would be rejected out of hand by the people in power in the CC for the same reason. The points some have made, including yours, have given me much food for thought (pun not intended). Whilst my emphasis has been on catering for families and groups I wonder if there are others who might benefit e.g. people with disabilities. In addition with payload being an ever present concern for motorhomers not having to take on board heavy items needed for a long stay en route e.g. cases of champagne (in my dreams) bottled water (in reality) would be a bonus. Have a good weekend. It would be nice to be out and about in the van but the dreaded weekly shop beckons ;-) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
malc d Posted February 27, 2016 Share Posted February 27, 2016 Violet1956 - 2016-02-26 11:44 PM Shouldn't we be a little more generous in spirit and pay attention to the needs of those who don't enjoy such freedoms? Good morning Violet I really don't understand how the fact that people can't have groceries delivered to their PITCH is in any way restricting anyones freedom. As for proposing separate areas for those who do / do not wish to have groceries delivered - !!! I hope you are not serious. As a tourer myself ( never booking any sites ) I can just imagine turning up at a site where there are clearly spaces empty - and being told the site is full - as those spaces are reserved for people who don't want groceries delivered to their pitch. ( That's restricting a tourers freedom ). I can go along with deliveries to SITES if that is what a lot of people need /want - --- but - - white van man delivering to PITCHES ! ---- I sincerely hope not. Have a good weekend - even if you have no Champagne ;-) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brock Posted February 27, 2016 Share Posted February 27, 2016 Whilst agreeing with the CC, there is a sense of double standards when it comes to the health & safety issue because in my experience, numerous sites allow tradesmen such as newspaper vendors, a fish-man, grocery van, fish & chip van [usually by reception] to drive into the site and honk. Admittedly there is a difference between one van at a regular time than one van from each supermarket chain delivering - possibly several times a day. I think it comes down to wardens being seen as concierges by too many people and that is worth stamping out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
malc d Posted February 27, 2016 Share Posted February 27, 2016 Brock - 2016-02-27 12:43 PM I think it comes down to wardens being seen as concierges by too many people and that is worth stamping out. Yep. I think what some peoples' long term aim is " room service " ;-) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Violet1956 Posted February 27, 2016 Author Share Posted February 27, 2016 malc d - 2016-02-27 11:15 AM Violet1956 - 2016-02-26 11:44 PM Shouldn't we be a little more generous in spirit and pay attention to the needs of those who don't enjoy such freedoms? Good morning Violet I really don't understand how the fact that people can't have groceries delivered to their PITCH is in any way restricting anyones freedom. As for proposing separate areas for those who do / do not wish to have groceries delivered - !!! I hope you are not serious. As a tourer myself ( never booking any sites ) I can just imagine turning up at a site where there are clearly spaces empty - and being told the site is full - as those spaces are reserved for people who don't want groceries delivered to their pitch. ( That's restricting a tourers freedom ). I can go along with deliveries to SITES if that is what a lot of people need /want - --- but - - white van man delivering to PITCHES ! ---- I sincerely hope not. Have a good weekend - even if you have no Champagne ;-) Malc I think I didn't explain the freedoms bit very well so I understand where you are coming from. The following scenario perhaps is the best way of illuminating what I am getting at- Lily a nurse who works shifts and Alan a “white van driver” who works 60 hours a week for the minimum wage (and a boss who shouts at him if he doesn’t manage to complete all his drops in the allotted time) have three children under 10. They managed to buy a motorhome/caravan with a bank loan. They like to holiday near the seaside and have to take their holidays in the UK when work/school allows. They are more likely to have to sit in horrendous traffic tailbacks driving to the coast than the likes of me (and you?). Lily and Alan are pretty exhausted at the end of their hard working week. A quick 15 minutes in a shop will buy them all they need for the first night and morning of their holiday. On the day or arrival one or both of them will have to get in the shopping covering the needs of a family of 5 for the first few days at least. Either they both go to the nearest supermarket where they have the cheapest deals or one of them goes. If both of them share this burden (like many modern parents) it will be a task completed with three whiney children who would rather be on the beach. Not much joy for any of them then at the start of their much needed holiday. And you may be pleased to hear that when doing my weekend shop this morning at a great discount supermarket I was able to pick up a bottle of champagne for £10. Yey one happy bunny :-) Forgive me (I promise this will be my last post on this subject as I think I may be becoming a bit of a bore)..how about this one- Derek has a bad back and his severely disabled wife Norma uses a wheelchair. Norma cannot be left alone at any time because she also been recently diagnosed with Altzheimer’s disease. Derek is struggling to retain a sense of normality in their lives. As keen motorhomers getting out and about is essential for their sanity and well-being. They often stay for extended periods on their favourite sites. If they could have their groceries and other necessaries delivered to their van this would reduce the toll on Derek of carrying heavy items of shopping and/or taking his wife to local shops some of which have very poor access for the disabled. Derek is thinking about giving up taking the trips in his beloved motorhome because it is all becoming too much. If he doesn’t have to worry about the logisitics of getting food and other necessaries whilst away then that may change his mind. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
George Collings Posted February 27, 2016 Share Posted February 27, 2016 I only use club sites a few days a year but seeing how some members speed around sites I don't much fancy the aforementioned hard presses delivery driver trying to keep to schedule as well. What if we run out of what ifs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tracker Posted February 27, 2016 Share Posted February 27, 2016 The peace and quiet of a pleasant site seems like an ideal place to write a great work of literary genius Violet - maybe you have found your new vocation! Just as long as there are no delivery vans, mobile chippys, bakers, butchers or candle stick makers to disturb you! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Violet1956 Posted February 27, 2016 Author Share Posted February 27, 2016 Tracker - 2016-02-27 4:09 PM The peace and quiet of a pleasant site seems like an ideal place to write a great work of literary genius Violet - maybe you have found your new vocation! Just as long as there are no delivery vans, mobile chippys, bakers, butchers or candle stick makers to disturb you! Flattered - one of my favourite tactics in debates as you have no doubt noted. The subtle/not so subtle subtext is another. What fun. :-) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest pelmetman Posted February 27, 2016 Share Posted February 27, 2016 The reason the CC won't allow deliveries, is because they cant make any money on it >:-) ........... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Colin Leake Posted February 27, 2016 Share Posted February 27, 2016 Now here you are a busy Warden cleaning the toilets when Mr Tesco arrives needing you to raise the site barrier and let him in and by the way could you tell him what pitch Mrs Smith is on. Back to the toilets and a few minutes later he's back Mrs Smith is no where to be found. Can he leave the delivery in the office for them. Naturaly they wont be bothered to check and see if its there when they come back. No need you'll have plenty of time to go and find them! Repeat this s few times and one can see how it could all get out of hand. You'll need to be careful not to get the deliveries mixed up. It will get worse. Some members are so lazy they order before they are due to arrive. I can't realy see the need. We spend around 120 days a year on club sites in a van conversion with limited storage space but even so we simply pop into a supermarket on the way between sites and manage just fine. Things we may run out of like milk are normally available on site or from a local shop. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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