Red Robbo Posted March 6, 2016 Share Posted March 6, 2016 Hi there this is only my second post! I read the forums the forums regularly and find the information very helpful, useful and so informative so I wonder whether you can help me with a couple of problems. We are currently part exchanging our van and the dealer has advised us that we need work doing as follows:- 1. The Thule step is shuddering at the end of its retraction. It comes in and out OK it just shudders. We have looked underneath and have sprayed WD40 and the micro-switch appears to be working freely but it still shudders. They are stating we need a whole new step which we have to pay for! Do we really need a new step or is there something we can do to rectify the problem? 2. At our last habitation check in mid January (done by another dealer) there was no problem with damp issues, all readings were 10 or below. Our current dealer is now stating we have two problem areas which need major replacement work on the floor and wall panel. Their check was done on a very wet and snowy day. We immediately took it to the first dealer (who did our habitation check and they did another damp check the same day and whilst their levels were higher than in January they were still well below the current dealers ratings and advised this could be due to the atmospheric conditions. Whilst this work would be covered by our warranty does it really need to be done. How do we resolve this dispute? Any suggestions and help on the way forward would be gratefully appreciated. Thanks Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tracker Posted March 6, 2016 Share Posted March 6, 2016 As far as damp goes it is a well known dealer ploy to frighten you into taking less money in p/x, especially if in hind sight they now feel they were perhaps overly generous at a show. A major motorhome sales group tried it on me once and failed and they will never get the chance to do it again, so don't let them bully you. We had our van checked by two other dealers prior to getting a firm p/x price and both declared it damp free but when I told the offending dealer they were not interested in re-checking so we went elsewhere - and got a better deal too! Open up and empty all the lockers inside especially the areas that are under suspicion and run a dehumidifier in the van for a few days, that will seriously reduce any condensation or damp and you will be amazed at the volume of water it collects! If you don't have a dehumidifier a combination of warm and cold fans to circulate the air, preferably with a window open should do the trick and even directing a hair drier into suspect areas for a few minutes can help. Rudimentary damp meters are inexpensively available on Amazon and whilst they may not be as sensitive as some the kit the dealers use they are more than good enough for you to get a before and after reading for damp. Lots of steps judder as they retract, especially on the older vans, and even newer ones are sometimes not entirely smooth and I suspect that it comes down to either lubrication or wear in the mechanism and again my thoughts are not to let them bully you. Run the step out and back in several times and if it works it works and politely tell them that they can take it or leave it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
snowie Posted March 6, 2016 Share Posted March 6, 2016 Hi Robbo; I would check that the tracks are clear of stones/grit; seem to recall reading of this, regards alan b Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Red Robbo Posted March 6, 2016 Author Share Posted March 6, 2016 Many thanks Tracker for your response. We thought it might be their tactics to get more money out of us. We don't think there is a major problem with damp as they have quoted and we have the proof from the other dealer. It's just now who do we believe and who do we trust! Surely the dealers know that steps can shudder - is this just another ploy? My other half is under the van as we speak looking again at the step. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RogerThat Posted March 6, 2016 Share Posted March 6, 2016 Tracker - 2016-03-06 4:05 PM Run the step out and back in several times and if it works it works and politely tell them that they can take it or leave it. I'd have to agree! The dealer might need reminding of just how many other dealers there are in the UK! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robbo Posted March 6, 2016 Share Posted March 6, 2016 Hello Red Robbo from Robbo I would suggest you use silicone spray on the step and not WD40. There are normally plastic parts in the step mechanism and WD40 has a tendency to make the plastic swell (so I've heard). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StuartO Posted March 6, 2016 Share Posted March 6, 2016 This does seem like an attempt to extract some more money from you, doesn't it? It would be a pity if you have to lose the MH you were planning to buy but there are lots of other dealers and there will also be lots of other suitable motorhomes. If this dealer behaves in this way at this stage in the deal do you trust them to deal with you fairly later on, if you have a problem with your new MH? Did you place a written order and pay a deposit? And did you read what you were signing? If not, now would be a good time to read it, in case there was a condition favouring what they are now trying to do to you. I have little doubt that you could get around that if necessary, but you might as well known what you are up against. Tread carefully. Explain that the other dealer has found lower dampness readings and you don't think the step is a problem. Tell them politely that you therefore disagree about the need for any repair to your part-exchange MH and do not intend to pay for such. If they are unhappy with that do they now wish to abandon the deal and repay your deposit? If they try to tell you that you have an obligation to pay, tell them that you have posted on this Forum (without naming them) and there is a lot of interest. Ask if would object to being named on the Forum - you don't need their permission to do so of course and as long as you are telling the truth in what you post you should come to no harm by doing so. What you are trying to get across, without having to have a row about it, is that if they try to bully you they will be named and shamed. They probably won't want that to happen. And anyway consumer law is almost certainly on your side. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Red Robbo Posted March 6, 2016 Author Share Posted March 6, 2016 Many thanks for all your replies. I knew I could depend on this forum. Thanks StuartO for giving us some advice re the money side of things - very useful. We are now in deep discussions regarding our next move. Thanks again. :-) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tracker Posted March 6, 2016 Share Posted March 6, 2016 Unless there is a clause in your contract allowing the dealer to alter the terms without your agreement should they find a defect I doubt they can penalise you. And even if such a clause existed I doubt any court would uphold it as fair trading. It could then be argued that if your van needs so much money spent on it it would be uneconomic for them to continue on the agreed basis and in their best interests to void the deal and return any deposit. We now NEVER agree a deal before the dealer has checked our trade in van to their entire satisfaction and a guaranteed definitive price has been mutually agreed. It works for us, surprises the dealers and also lets them know that you are not only straight in not trying to hide any defects but also not to be messed with! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derek Uzzell Posted March 7, 2016 Share Posted March 7, 2016 Robbo - 2016-03-06 4:44 PM Hello Red Robbo from Robbo I would suggest you use silicone spray on the step and not WD40. There are normally plastic parts in the step mechanism and WD40 has a tendency to make the plastic swell (so I've heard). I agree - though if ‘ordinary’ WD-40 has already been used there will be little advantage in trying silicone instead. I tend to use this stuff nowadays http://wd40specialist.com/products/dry-lube/ It’s possible that the outer end of the step has been caught on something in the past (eg. a high kerb) and slightly bent. This happened with my Hobby motorhome’s sliding step causing it to judder on retraction. A judicious whack with a hammer cured the problem. I’d try spraying plenty of lubrication inside the step’s cassette first. If that’s ineffective, then (perhaps) a careful application of brute force might help. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian Kirby Posted March 7, 2016 Share Posted March 7, 2016 Red Robbo - 2016-03-06 3:05 PM..........................Whilst this work would be covered by our warranty does it really need to be done. How do we resolve this dispute? Thanks Have you checked that this is the case? Motorhome water ingress warranties are full of conditions, and they all have to have been met before the manufacturer will honour the warranty. This almost invariably involves having at minimum annual damp checks carried out, and those checks must be done by a franchised dealer. Are you changing the make of van you now want, and that is the reason for dealing with two dealers? If the make of van is the same, I don't understand why the second dealer isn't simply rectifying the damp under the warranty himself. I assume he must have seen your van before he quoted you the p/x allowance? However, it seems there is damp in some areas, and the only debate is around whether the recorded levels actually indicate trouble or just atmospheric factors, or whether one or other dealer has a defective damp meter, or isn't using it properly. I'm inclined to agree that your best course for now would be to withdraw from the present deal, and seek better elsewhere, taking your van with you, and asking the new dealer to confirm that he is completely satisfied with it before agreeing terms. Steps should not shudder when operated. My reaction would be to remove the step and strip it for examination and then see what that reveals. Look at the maintenance instructions before lubricating anything, as a number of the pivots etc are nylon (or similar) bushed and lubrication is not recommended. Then, having cleaned, lubricated as instructed, and reassembled the step, re-connect it and try it before fully bolting it back in place. But, whatever you do, don't get your fingers anywhere near the mechanism while doing this as the force with which they operate is ferocious, and amputation of stray fingers is a real risk! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derek Uzzell Posted March 7, 2016 Share Posted March 7, 2016 Brian Kirby - 2016-03-07 1:05 PM ...Steps should not shudder when operated. My reaction would be to remove the step and strip it for examination and then see what that reveals... Good advice in principle, but stripping an electric Thule slide-out step may be a challenge - in fact, just removing the step from the motorhome to allow it to be stripped down may prove a real pain. I fitted an electric Omnistep to my Hobby motorhome and this later developed an irritating tendency to continue to ‘alarm’ when the step had retracted. It was plain that the switch inside the step’s cassette needed attention and equally plain that accessing the switch would have meant major dismantling. Because I could work around the problem, I chose to leave things alone. My current Rapido’s Thule slide-out used to squeak loudly when retracting, but copious spraying the internals with dry PTFE lubricant stopped it. Once again I would not have wanted to pull the step apart if I could possibly avoid it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Red Robbo Posted March 7, 2016 Author Share Posted March 7, 2016 Thanks everyone for subsequent replies. The first dealer we had used for our annual habitation check and the second dealer was where we saw another van of the same make but shorter model. The step problem has now been identified (by a kind friend who is an engineer) as the rocker switch beside the door not switching off when the step is retracted, so it does not need a new step. A strip down of the step would have been a step too far for us! The damp problem would be covered by warranty but the whole thing has left a nasty taste in my mouth and we will be taking it further following legal advice. Unfortunately the second dealer had not seen our van before offering the part ex deal but we have learned a valuable lesson i.e. to let the dealer see the van before signing any deal. Another lesson is not to spray WD40 onto everything! Thanks again everyone for taking the time to reply and for the sound advice and guidance. :-D :-D Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Geeco Posted March 7, 2016 Share Posted March 7, 2016 Hi Robbo and welcome to this cave of knowledge. I am not able to offer any advice on the damp issue however I might be able to shed some light on the step issue. My Thule step was juddering badly as you described. The technician reset the step via the Sargent controller, it took about 2 minutes. Apparently this is a common issue. In my case there were two functions to reset, one is when you close with the remote key and two is when you start the vehicle and the step is automatically retracted. I am sure if you google the Thule website there will be info available.Cheers, Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Len Salisbury Posted March 7, 2016 Share Posted March 7, 2016 I stripped my Thule step down last year no problem. Auto electrician informed dealer that motor was knackered. It worked for me but a new step was delivered by dealer and auto electrician fitted it to my satisfaction . Long story but it is not a big job and I'm 82. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Basil Posted March 10, 2016 Share Posted March 10, 2016 Thule cassette step is actually very easy to strip down. First remove the step part, following the instructions for what to do if there is a failure with the step in the open position. Then the whole motor and mechanism come out as a unit after removing the four self tapping screws that attach the rear panel, then pull the complete unit from the cassette you will then be able to see all the moving parts and lubricate where necessary. Whole job start to finish about one hour. Bas Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alanb Posted March 12, 2016 Share Posted March 12, 2016 My experience is with an Omnistep, but I believe that the Thule step is similar. A relay which is energised when the engine is started, and the step is out provides a circuit to retract the step. In order to ensure that the step fully retracts, the release of the relay is slightly delayed after the step limit switch is operated, by a capacitor connected across the relay coil. From what has been said it seems that in the later Thule control system, the time delay is generated electronically. I had a problem with the step warning light that is also operated by the limit switch, illuminating en-route. On investigating I eventually found that operating arm which operates the limit switch was loose where it was fixed to the motor splines. Access was not simple as I had to remove the motor from the mounting plate in order to access the offending screw. The cure was to reassemble using locking compound, on the thread of the offending screw. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Basil Posted March 20, 2016 Share Posted March 20, 2016 Alanb - 2016-03-12 9:56 PM ..... A relay which is energised when the engine is started, and the step is out provides a circuit to retract the step. In order to ensure that the step fully retracts, the release of the relay is slightly delayed after the step limit switch is operated, by a capacitor connected across the relay coil. ........... This is quite correct and from what I found out this capacitor, a 2200 microFarad 16vDC electrolitic Maplin code VH54 at a cost of 58p, is usually omitted buy the installers as they don't consider it necessary, or so I was informed! This was the cause of my step failure and my reason for taking appart, for the same reason as Alanb, the close light staying illuminated and the motor trying to keep closing the step, this could ultimately result in a burnt out motor. The cure is simplicity in itself. Basil Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Len Salisbury Posted March 20, 2016 Share Posted March 20, 2016 When my new Thule step arrived the auto electrician came and installed it but there was a problem that although he wired in to the same points as the old loom the step still malfunctioned, it was cutting off the current before it had completed the task either in or out. He spent hours on it. He wired it in so that if the step is out a buzzer goes off and someone has operate the main switch by the sliding door as opposed to doing it manually. The step has not failed to operate since installation Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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