SAS Posted November 20, 2006 Share Posted November 20, 2006 Saw these at the Ex-Cell Show at the weekend. Does anyone have one, or know if it`s worth getting one? :-S Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave Newell Posted November 21, 2006 Share Posted November 21, 2006 Stay below the speed limits and you won't need one. (lol) D. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Frank Wilkinson Posted November 21, 2006 Share Posted November 21, 2006 Ignore the comment above. Yes, it is definitely worth getting a speed camera detector. Both I and one of my van drivers were caught by a new camera on a quiet road with no pedestrians and hardly any houses. I was doing 36mph and he was doing 34mph.I got three points and a £60 fine and he was allowed to do a speed awareness course at a cost of £100. He told them to stuff their speed awareness course as he'd been driving for thirty years without a penalty or an accident and he'd cheerfully take the lower price of £60 and the three points.I was driving sensibly and as always, was more concerned with the road conditions and other road users than about watching my speedo every thirty seconds and, as you all know, it is so easy to slip over the prevailing limit.I was so appalled by this that I immediately bought a speed camera detector which warns me in advance of every fixed camera. The best thing about it is that I have the reassurance of knowing that if I happen to inadvertently drive at 34mph I will no longer risk losing my licence.Can anyone tell me the logic of a system where someone doing 4mph over the limit can attend a speed awareness course and avoid penalty points but a young hooligan doing 45mph in a 30mph area has no choice but to have the penalty points?It's obvious to me that it's the second one who needs a speed awareness course and not the first. Regrettably however, the jobsworths and bureaucrats who run our local councils aren't as clever as they like to think that they are.Finally, I don't condone speeding, especially in built-up areas, but because of the viscious and rigid system of speed cameras, which can penalise a driver for doing a few miles an hour over the limit at three o'clock in the morning, we now have a generation of drivers who are not monitoring the road conditions properly because their number one priority is watching their speedometer in case they accidently slip over the limit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
enodreven Posted November 21, 2006 Share Posted November 21, 2006 I agree Frank, But please don't take it to France with you as I beleive its an on the spot fine for just having one ? Brian Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Frank Wilkinson Posted November 21, 2006 Share Posted November 21, 2006 That is not the case. GPS speed-camera detectors, which inform of fixed-camera sites are legal in France because such cameras are in the public domain. What is illegal in France and other European countries are cameras that user radar or laser technology as they may be able to detect moveable speed cameras which use similar technology.In this country, radar and laser speed camera detectors are currently legal but there is a bill due to go through the Commons shortly, which may outlaw them.I for instance have a detector that uses both. It informs me of fixed sites using GPS satellites but it also picks up the beams from both fixed and portable speed cameras.If this bill goes through I shall simply remove the laser sensor from my unit and I'll be completely legal. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
enodreven Posted November 21, 2006 Share Posted November 21, 2006 Hi, Frank while I accept your statement. As I don't speak another language I really wouldn't want to take one with me ? just in case I can't explain the difference clearly enough ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Frank Wilkinson Posted November 21, 2006 Share Posted November 21, 2006 I promise you, you've no problems here. French police know the difference. Any radar or laser model has a clearly defined sensor for picking up the signals. They're usually fixed to a windscreen or are forward-facing on the unit itself. GPS speed-camera detectors are similar to sat-nav systems so you may as well warn people not to have a sat-nav unit on their dashboard in case the police can't tell the difference.I've just ordered a Tom Tom 910 unit for my new motorhome and as well as being a sat-nav system it also has speed-camera detection but as is only based on GPS it is legal all over Europe.People with GPS-only speed-camera detectors should have no fear of using them in Europe. The law is on your side! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
enodreven Posted November 21, 2006 Share Posted November 21, 2006 Hi, I still wouldn't take one for the reasons I said above, also, I find it a lot easier staying within the speed limit ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mike Chapman Posted November 21, 2006 Share Posted November 21, 2006 If you have a GPS navigation system with a Speed Camera location fair enough except the camera POI's require regular updates which may need an annual update contract at additional cost and require regular updating (weekly?). The good safety point about these is that most give you warnings of accident blackspot and hazard warnings including the location of schools and colleges. Personally I think these are worthwhile and I use a Road Angel Navigator in the UK. If you are using a radar beam detector the problem is, that in most cases, the warning comes at the point where you have already been targetted and the speed registered. These devices are also illegal to use in most European countries and their legality in the UK is questionable. My personal thoughts are that these are a waste of money, so does my son who has just collected 3 points and a £60 fixed penalty after being caught by a camera van. He has a radar detector which just confirmed that he had been targetted in a 50 mph zone and gave him no time to reduce the speed by the 6 mph required to go legal. The only way to ensure avoiding a speeding fine is, as Dave Newell says, simply not to exceeed speed limits. The devices above do nothing to detect such systems as VASCAR, Hand Held or temporary camera systems and especially unmarked Police vehicles with speed measuring camera systems. I would prefer to see more marked Police vehicles out catching the ever increasing numbers of bad drivers and acting as a deterrant but that does not raise revenue for the authorities at the rate of speed cameras does it? Just as an aside has anyone had their speedometer calibration checked or carried out a test against the speed registered by their GPS system and what was the percentage error? I have just had mine checked on the car and found that it is actually UNDER-reading by 6%. In other words at an indicated 70 mph the vehicle is actually doing approx 75 mph. The cause was the fitting of factory option larger wheels without recalibrating the speedometer. Food for thought eh!! Regards, Mike. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave Newell Posted November 21, 2006 Share Posted November 21, 2006 Frank said "Ignore the comment above. Yes, it is definitely worth getting a speed camera detector. Both I and one of my van drivers were caught by a new camera on a quiet road with no pedestrians and hardly any houses. I was doing 36mph and he was doing 34mph. I got three points and a £60 fine and he was allowed to do a speed awareness course at a cost of £100. He told them to stuff their speed awareness course as he'd been driving for thirty years without a penalty or an accident and he'd cheerfully take the lower price of £60 and the three points." Don't ignore the comment above, its perfectly valid. One simple fact about speed cameras and fines/points, you can only get caught if you're breaking the law. The amount over the limit is immaterial, if you're over the limit then you're breaking the law. As for Frank's second paragraph, well hard luck but you broke the law and got caught, nuff said! I wouldn't tell people to not get a camera detector, if it makes you feel safer then fine but I've never used one and never had a speeding fine in 27 years of driving. The problem I find with detectors when I have seen them used is that they suddenly make a noise to alert you of the camera whether or not you are over the limit and this leads to people braking suddenly when they were perfectly safe and under the limit anyway. Personally I prefer to use cruise control to stay under the limit. A camera warning device that works from GPS locations is not illegal in France but a device that actively detects speed cameras is and you could well get fined for using one. Make your own mind up. D. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Frank Wilkinson Posted November 21, 2006 Share Posted November 21, 2006 I'm sorry Mike Chapman, but there is nothing 'questionable' about the use of radar/laser detectors in this country at present. It is also true that if you are the first to go through a mobile speed trap that you will not be able to react quickly enough, as your son discovered. What is questionable, is the use of devices which actively jam mobile speed cameras. These are normally wired into the radiator grill and the driver can be charged with interfering with the police in the discharge of their duty.However, if for instance, you were driving along a motorway and had strayed over 70mph, or if your speedo was out as mentioned above, it is likely that the mobile camera will first be triggered at a vehicle in front of you. That is when your detector will pick it up, giving you ample time to react.As I've said earlier, I do not condone speeding but how many of us can honestly say that we have never broken the speed limit, even by accident and it is wrong in my opinion that a perfectly safe driver may, as happened to my friend, trigger a camera at two o'clock in the morning on a dual carriageway, and receive three points. A police officer seeing such an incident would have done nothing or at worst, pulled him up and cautioned him. He was doing 46mph by the way. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bazza454 Posted November 21, 2006 Share Posted November 21, 2006 I've had a Talex (not the Talex Lite) for over a year and it's a fabulous piece of kit. When starting it generally tracks satellites in a matter of seconds, is very accurate and is easy to update via the USB supplied. Prior to purchasing the Talex I had a RoadMate which was hopeless, sometimes taking 30 minutes to track the satellites. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
euroanchor Posted November 21, 2006 Share Posted November 21, 2006 [QUOTE]Dave Newell - 2006-11-21 7:28 AM Stay below the speed limits and you won't need one. (lol) D.[/QUOTE] Sounds like the best bit of advice to me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
euroanchor Posted November 21, 2006 Share Posted November 21, 2006 [QUOTE]Frank Wilkinson - 2006-11-21 10:03 AM he was allowed to do a speed awareness course at a cost of £100. He told them to stuff their speed awareness course as he'd been driving for thirty years without a penalty or an accident and he'd cheerfully take the lower price of £60 and the three points./[QUOTE] Gosh he sounds like a sensible guy, I think most people would realise the points on your licence would cost you more than £40 over 4 years in insurance rises. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Frank Wilkinson Posted November 21, 2006 Share Posted November 21, 2006 I'm sorry, but you are wrong to infer this and to imply some kind of stupidity on my employee. He drives on my company's fleet policy and this kind of conviction makes no difference whatsoever to our costs. Some insurers make no extra charge for an SP30 conviction, even on a private policy. I have to say as well, that when someone asks a perfectly sensible question about the efficacy of a particular speed camera detector, nothing is more irritating than 'holier than thou' people who bang on about how they have never broken the speed limit. We all know that speeding is wrong, please don't keep reminding us. Unfortunately, some of us aren't as perfect as certain contributors to this forums and we occasionally slip up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mike Chapman Posted November 21, 2006 Share Posted November 21, 2006 Hello Frank, You are correct about Radar/Laser detector law not being questionable in UK read England but under Scottish Law there has not been legal precedent on this matter and the position does remain questionable. In England precedent was set by a case where the Wireless Telegraphy Act was used to bring a prosecution and the case was thrown out. Details of this can be found on several websites relating to speed cameras etc. Not sure of the position in Wales and Northern Ireland. My understanding is that the act that would have made the use of Radar/Laser detectors illegal (NOT including GPS systems) has been dropped for the time being. One warning about driving around in a clean vehicle but with filthy supposedly unreadable number plates to attempt to make vehicle recognition impossible. I remember reading somewhere that there has been precedent for this and the person was charged and found guilty of Perverting the Course of Justice which carries a far higher penalty than a speeding offence. Some Radar/Laser detectors do have the ability to recognise the transmission even when partly shielded but others need a clear and strong signal for recognition (ie., not shielded by the vehicle in front). This was the cause of complaint about many of the early models that not only failed to pick up the transmission but also picked up stray signals from other sources. The camera vans target a flat surface such as the front number plate and it is one of the myths that setting ones number plate at an angle will divert the signal and therefore escape detection. Regarding "Holier than thou people who bang on about how they have never broken the speed limit". Who on this thread actually made that comment? I read it as "One can only get caught by breaking a speed limit". We have probably all broken speed limits at some time, I know that I have, but that is different to continuously driving above the legal speed limit as a matter of course. This is an interesting topic please ALL lets not let it degenerate into the area of personal insults. Regards, Mike. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Frank Wilkinson Posted November 21, 2006 Share Posted November 21, 2006 Point taken, but the very first response to this post told the poster that if he didn't break the speed limit he wouldn't need a detector. That is frankly an insult to anyone's intelligence. What he wanted to know was if anyone has any experience of this device, not a lecture from someone who then goes on to tell us of his 27 years of clean driving.This is something that happens a lot on this forum. I asked a question about a particular levelling device and if anyone had any experience of it. Most of the responses were from people who told me that they didn't use one and preferred driving up sloping ramps! Well thank you! I know all about using ramps but I really wanted to know about the product that my post mentioned.In this case, the poster wished to know about the Talex device. He didn't ask for a lecture on his driving habits.Finally, on thje subject of wrongly calibrated speedos I suspect that reading under is the exception. Most manufacturers err on the side of caution as this makes their mpg better and their cars seem a little faster. I believe that they are allowed up to 15% error so there are occasions when the person if front who thinks that he's being good by driving at 29mph is actually doing about 25mph. I promise you, this can be very irritating for those such as me who have a GPS based and very accurate readout!My own car, which is supposedly a very good model and has no larger wheels etc. is about 8% out. When I'm doing 30 mph on the speedo it's really only doing about 28mph. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
euroanchor Posted November 21, 2006 Share Posted November 21, 2006 [QUOTE]Frank Wilkinson - 2006-11-21 2:40 PM I'm sorry, but you are wrong to infer this and to imply some kind of stupidity on my employee. He drives on my company's fleet policy and this kind of conviction makes no difference whatsoever to our costs. Some insurers make no extra charge for an SP30 conviction, even on a private policy. I have to say as well, that when someone asks a perfectly sensible question about the efficacy of a particular speed camera detector, nothing is more irritating than 'holier than thou' people who bang on about how they have never broken the speed limit. We all know that speeding is wrong, please don't keep reminding us. Unfortunately, some of us aren't as perfect as certain contributors to this forums and we occasionally slip up.[/QUOTE] Far be it for me to infer stupidity on anybody, But i'm afraid I would have paid the extra £40. I take it your employee has his own policy and drives his own car or whatever, some insurers may ignore one speeding conviction (I wouldn't know I've never had one B-) ) but not all, and if it wasn't his first conviction it would most certainly make a difference. It could also prove to be the straw that breaks his back. By the way you openly dismiss the convictions as being at most an inconvienience, imagine what would happen if he drove at 34mph through 4 cameras in a day..............that £40 would have been worth it then eh ? It would also appear you have shot yourself in the foot over the "going off topic" statement , as it was indeed your good self who started the speeding conviction topic. Anyway Frank, keep up the good work my friend, because whilst you are making statements like those in this thread, people on here are leaving me alone :D . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mike Chapman Posted November 21, 2006 Share Posted November 21, 2006 Hello Frank, Thanks for the information re speedo calibration. Somewhere in the dark dismal depths of my grey matter I seem to remember someone posting that a manufacturer providing a speedo calibrated as under reading is breaking some law. (Can anyone confirm this?). I have always found on previous vehicles that speedos have been calibrated as over reading that is why I was so surprised to find that mine is under reading. I wonder who would be liable if I had been prosecuted for exceeding the speed limit only to find the speedo was under reading? I suppose there is also here a note of caution about changing wheel sizes and upsetting speedo calibration. Regards, Mike. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Frank Wilkinson Posted November 21, 2006 Share Posted November 21, 2006 Euroanchor, I really do despair! How can discussing how a speed camera can save you from convictions, and give an example of such a conviction, be going off topic!And once again you are wrong and have completely jumped to the wrong conclusion. This member of my staff drives a smallish van which is also his personal transport. He is unmarried and has no need of another car and the expense it will incur. The four points has done nothing to his insurance and he's worked for me for 15 years and has no intention of leaving. You must give people credit for having some sense. We discussed the merits of him taking the speeding course or the three points. He is an excellent driver with an accident-free record and he decided, and I agreed, that a full day spent on such a course is unnecessary. If these courses are so brilliant, why aren't they offered to the real speeders, those doing ten or 15 miles over the limit? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bazza454 Posted November 21, 2006 Share Posted November 21, 2006 Back to the original question and my earlier response, coincidentally I have just received an e-mail from Talex advising that they have just launched 3 sat nav units and each includes the Talex Speed Camara data. Full specs available at WWW.Talex.Co.Uk. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave Newell Posted November 21, 2006 Share Posted November 21, 2006 Chill out guys, my first posting on this was made with tongue a little way into the cheek which was what I hoped to show with the smily I placed along side it. However the fact still remains that you only get a ticket by breaking the law, the amount over the speed limit is pretty much irrelevant as over the limit is just that, over the limit! "Holier than thou", Moi? :-D I don't think so. "Never broken the speed limit" Definitely does not apply to me and I would never make that claim. I have in the past exceeded speed limits on a routine basis and sometimes to ridiculously high margins but then I grew up, calmed down and got myself a motorhome. I've been lucky enough in the past to not get caught (well I did get stopped twice by one bobby but argued my way out of it) and now I've grown up into a wise and mature adult I try very hard not to break the speed limit. I find cruise control is an excellent aid to this. Mike, your vehicle speedo is allowed to read up to 10% over the true speed but not under and the typical error is 6% over. I personally prefer to use the speedo rather than GPS for speed monitoring as it gives you a couple of miles per hour safety margin. SAS, I'm truly sorry that your question has gone un-answered and apologise for the way the thread has gone off topic. Bye Bye, D. :-D Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Frank Wilkinson Posted November 21, 2006 Share Posted November 21, 2006 With respect how can you say this thread has gone unanswered? I took it as a question not just on a particular brand of detector but on whether or not he should buy one in the first place.He has had some very good answers about the use and efficacy of detectors and one poster answered his question specifically about the Talex unit. I think his question has been answered superbly and besides, we've all learned something and had a bit of fun. (If you enjoy a good debate that is.)I'm going out for the night now and promise not to break the speed limit! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Philman Posted November 21, 2006 Share Posted November 21, 2006 I appreciate that this is a little off topic, but I can not see the need for speed camera detectors or warners. Any decent satnav will warn you at any time you exceed the prevailing speed limit. This way you can be sure, if you wish, that you do not break the law whether or not there are cameras around. Phil. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
michele Posted November 21, 2006 Share Posted November 21, 2006 Philman , prey, please tell what sat nav is that then? we have the Tom Tom Go 510 & the Avic Pioneer any good ? *-) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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