All weather tyres

[Charresdeverill]

Camping on fields is always a problem,particularly getting off if wet. Can anyone suggest an all weather Tyre to fit my IH tio Fiat Ducato motorhome.

[euroserv]

Hello,

 

I have very limited experience of all weather or winter tyres but have recently driven two small vans in back to back testing. Both were Fiat Doblo's and were identical except that one had regular Pirelli tyres and the other had Goodyear all weather tyres. I drove the all weather version first and thought that it was a fairly nervous drive in the wet and the dry. While it might have resisted aquaplaning and it may well have had superior grip on wet grass; it just did not feel very secure even at modest speeds. The regular tyre version was completely different with vastly better steering feel and felt as though grip was massively improved in the dry and while it may slip a bit if you drive to hard in the wet; if driven sensibly as per the conditions it was very secure and had better steering feel.

 

You might think that this bears little relevance to heavily laden motor-homes but how often do we get to try different tyres, back to back on the same vehicle?

 

My impression of all weather tyres is that while they might be a jack of all trades they are clearly a master of none! I would be more inclined to choose a chunky M&S (Mud and Snow) regular commercial tyre instead of a compromised all weather version if i regularly had to cope with Peterborough showground!

 

Most of the all weather patterns that i have seen are designed to disperse water efficiently and to resist aquaplaning. They are not over-endowed with lateral tread blocks to aid traction and the compound is going to be designed to be softer in colder conditions to help with ice. I would not expect such a tread construction to yield as high a mileage as a standard tyre.

 

I would be very happy to be proven wrong; but i don't think they are the solution to any problem faced by motor-homers.

[StuartO]

There might be some benefit from M&S (or proper winter) tyres on wet/soft grass but I doubt that it would be a big difference, certainly not the difference necessary to get off a wet Peterborough Showground when others are failing to do so.

 

There is advantage from installing M&S tyres if you want to drive on the Continent in winter because they do qualify as suitable tyres for general use in those countries which require winter tyres to be used in winter, and unlike proper winter tyres M&S are suitable for use on your MH all year round.

 

The best standby I have come across for getting off soggy grass (or mud) is to drive on to a pair of "rope ladder" type gripping aids as you park up, then you really should be able to get moving as you drive away.  Then of course you need to keep going gently as you cross the soggy grass until you get to a roadway, to avoid losing grip and digging in.

 

The "rope ladder" gripping aids are light and take up relatively little space - and they are far, far better than the yellow ridged plastic sheets, which I found pretty useless, except for prepositioning under non-driving wheels.  By prepositioning the "rope ladder" devices under each of the driving wheels I've managed to get off really soggy grass even when towing a car on a trailer.  I got off without wrecking the turf either, even though the "rungs" of the gripping device had gone well into the ground.

 

[Tracker]

Being a simple guy I have for the last 40 plus years employed a far more simple approach.

 

When parking on grass I place each wheel if it's soggy, or just fronts even if it is dry, on a 12" (30 cms for the converted) square of 3/4" WBP (plywood). This very effectively prevents the rounded wheel sinking into the mire and has enabled me to get off the likes of a water logged Peterborough field on more occasion than one.

 

I now do have a Mark 2 version which are hinged double squares for the driven wheels and this either gives me a bit more height if I need it or a better take off grip - especially for soggy showground use!

 

Start the engine and warm it for a few secoonds, engage first gear and move smarlty off without causing wheel spin and drive to a hard surface. Then walk back and retrieve the squares which are varnished and have a carrying rope loop ready to be washed off and reused.

 

When you see how much 4x4s and even tractors sometimes I'm not sure that changing tyres will make a lot of difference anyway?

 

Plywood squares are considerably cheaper than new tyres and they work well for me.

[Derek Uzzell]

Charresdeverill - 2016-05-04 9:22 AM

 

Camping on fields is always a problem,particularly getting off if wet. Can anyone suggest an all weather Tyre to fit my IH tio Fiat Ducato motorhome.

 

You could try Continental’s Vanco FourSeason tyres (assuming there’s a suitable size)

 

http://www.continental-tires.com/car/tires/van/four-season-tires-van/vanco-fourseason

 

These have a pretty chunky tread pattern and are offered as an option on some Ducato vans. They OUGHT to be better for grip on grassed fields than common-or-garden road tyres, but one should not expect miracles.

 

[Airstream]

Hi,

We have Vredestein Comtrac All Season - 225/70 R15 C 112R TL on our Ducato SWB based M/H they are great in normal ie road use with very positive steering and breaking

We were the only van in our area that did drive off the Peterborough Showground this year !!!!

Overall in my opinion a great tyre

Ray

[pepe63xnotuse]

Airstream - 2016-05-06 9:39 AM

 

Hi,

We have Vredestein Comtrac All Season - 225/70 R15 C 112R TL on our Ducato SWB based M/H they are great in normal ie road use with very positive steering and breaking

We were the only van in our area that did drive off the Peterborough Showground this year !!!!

Overall in my opinion a great tyre

Ray

 

Not sure if they would've been the exact / same "model" but we had "chunkier" Vredestein (M+S?)tyres fitted to a previous swb Boxer coachbuilt we had..

Prior to fitting them, in the wet, the existing *tyres could/would struggle for grip just making it up our steepish driveway!

(*can't recall what the originals were but they were in good nick and with the van at only 2-3 years old at the time, they would've probably been OE).

 

On our van the Vredesteins were a major improvement ( and we pitch up on loads of, usually muddy, music festivals, where stopping and blocking the gateway, whilst you "walk the route", isn't usually an option!(lol) ).

They also showed no signs of any obvious short comings eg no additional road noise, wear or reduction in road grip etc.

 

Obviously, no tyre is going to turn a front wheel drive (sometimes over-bodied?) MH into a Unimog. (lol)

[Will86]

Euroserve must be one of the best judges of vehicles as its his full time occupation.

 

Otherwise there are so many variants I see it almost impossible to find a proven answer as to which is the better on wet or muddy surfaces.

 

Vehicle are designed to be road users so I would assume whatever is offered regarding off road use its 'on the road' where safety matters and for what tires are in the main, designed for.

[Archiesgrandad]

I'm with you on this Will, and whenever I have to drive off the hard stuff I recall the Sergeant Driving Instructor for our MT pool advising us that fourwheel drive simply meant that we would be much deeper in the mire before we realised that we had a problem. I imagine that fitting chunky tyres to motorhomes comes in the same category. Our motorhomes are converted road vehicles, and not always the most able of those. I too am an advocate of squares of plywood and carry them as an alternative to levelling ramps, I also competed in production car trials as a young man, and with practice, and a bit of thought it is surprising what you can achieve, but don't expect miracles. One bit of advice, if you can't get any traction with low revs and a gentle release of the clutch pedal, don't bother putting your foot down hard, the only place that will take you is Australia.

AGD

[Derek Uzzell]

This 2014 discussion may be worth rereading:

 

http://forums.outandaboutlive.co.uk/forums/Motorhomes/Motorhome-Matters/M-S-MOTORHOME-TYRES/34065/

 

I notice that (at least with new Ducato-based coachbuilt motorhomes) the move from Continental “VancoCamper” tyres to Michelin “Agilis Camping” tyres as original equipment (OE) that took place a while back now seems to have reversed.

 

All the brand-new 2016-model Ducatos with 15”-diameter wheels I saw in France had 215/70 R15CP VancoCamper tyres. (I was told that 225/75 R16CP Agilis Camping tyres are still fitted as OE if the motorhome has 16”-diameter wheels, but I’m not certain that’s true.)

[pepe63xnotuse]

Nick(euroserve) actually said ..

 

Quote:

"....My impression of all weather tyres is that while they might be a jack of all trades they are clearly a master of none! I would be more inclined to choose a chunky M&S (Mud and Snow) regular commercial tyre instead of a compromised all weather version if i regularly had to cope with Peterborough showground!.... "

 

..you will see that he would also opt for chunky M&S type tyres, where regular grass ("showground ) usage is involved.

 

It's just about avoiding or coping with, full on mud...the OE tyres on the swb Boxer we had would balk at a bit of damp grass... :-S

[pepe63xnotuse]

Nick(euroserve) actually said ..

 

Quote:

"....My impression of all weather tyres is that while they might be a jack of all trades they are clearly a master of none! I would be more inclined to choose a chunky M&S (Mud and Snow) regular commercial tyre instead of a compromised all weather version if i regularly had to cope with Peterborough showground!.... "

 

..you will see that he would also opt for chunky M&S type tyres, where regular grass ("showground ) usage is involved.

 

It isn't just about avoiding or coping with, full on mud...the OE tyres on the swb Boxer we had would balk at a bit of damp grass... :-S

[Tracker]

I note the OP has not yet responded?

 

If my van was not very old with good tyres well in date there is no way I would be spending hundreds of quids on new tyres on the off chance that they might or might not make any difference.

 

On the other hand if I were to habitually use the van in winter or travel in the Euroland mountain ranges I would absolutely opt for the M&S tyres as a simple alternative to faffing about with snow chains etc.

 

We did have a Autotrail Cheyenne with the Michelin Camper M&S tyres and it did grip surprisingly well when coming back up through the Pyrenees in a raging blizzard several years ago, but I don't recall it making much difference on a muddy showground whereas my cheap and simple trusty plywood squares did!

[747]

Derek Uzzell - 2016-05-06 11:34 AM

 

This 2014 discussion may be worth rereading:

 

http://forums.outandaboutlive.co.uk/forums/Motorhomes/Motorhome-Matters/M-S-MOTORHOME-TYRES/34065/

 

I notice that (at least with new Ducato-based coachbuilt motorhomes) the move from Continental “VancoCamper” tyres to Michelin “Agilis Camping” tyres as original equipment (OE) that took place a while back now seems to have reversed.

 

All the brand-new 2016-model Ducatos with 15”-diameter wheels I saw in France had 215/70 R15CP VancoCamper tyres. (I was told that 225/75 R16CP Agilis Camping tyres are still fitted as OE if the motorhome has 16”-diameter wheels, but I’m not certain that’s true.)

 

That might simply be down to the fact that Michelin are unable to guarantee supplies of those tyres. I know of a number of people who have had to either wait for Agilis tyres or choose something else.

 

A lot of Tyre Companies have shut down European Plants which at times, has resulted in a shortfall of supply. I believe one has just shut down (or is in the process) in N. Ireland and from memory, it may even be a Michelin one.

[pepe63xnotuse]

Oops! sorry about my duplicate posts earlier chaps :$

 

(..I'll ask if I can get it tidied up).

[Derek Uzzell]

747

 

Whatever, but I think anyone awaiting delivery of a new 2016-model Ducato/Boxer-based coachbuilt motorhome (with 15” wheels) should expect it to arrive fitted with Continental CP-marked tyres rather than the Michelins that were previously original equipment.

 

(If the vehicle does have Michelins, it might be worth checking the tyres’ date of manufacture.)

[dicksob]

Hi, we also have an Ih, Rl 4000kg max, we ordered it from new with Continenal Vanco four season tyres, 2.5 years ago. Wearing well and happy with choice.

 

Bill

[747]

Derek Uzzell - 2016-05-06 2:19 PM

 

747

 

Whatever, but I think anyone awaiting delivery of a new 2016-model Ducato/Boxer-based coachbuilt motorhome (with 15” wheels) should expect it to arrive fitted with Continental CP-marked tyres rather than the Michelins that were previously original equipment.

 

(If the vehicle does have Michelins, it might be worth checking the tyres’ date of manufacture.)

 

The people I know who have ordered Michelin Camping tyres online have all found the date stamp to be very recent, 2 to 3 months max. This would suggest that that the shelf is fairly bare, as in no old stock.

 

 

[kevina]

Good to hear Airstream highly rating his Vredstein Comtrac All Season tyres as they are the ones I have decided will replace the front pair of my Continental Vanco Winter2s before the next ski season. Although Vredstein also make a winter version with softer compound the All-Season tyres actually have the "mountain snowflake" rating as well.

 

I have been running standard and winter tyres but now the original Michelins are 8 years old I will run winters all year which is why these look particularly suitable.

 

Kev

[Derek Uzzell]

747 - 2016-05-06 4:46 PM

 

Derek Uzzell - 2016-05-06 2:19 PM

 

747

 

Whatever, but I think anyone awaiting delivery of a new 2016-model Ducato/Boxer-based coachbuilt motorhome (with 15” wheels) should expect it to arrive fitted with Continental CP-marked tyres rather than the Michelins that were previously original equipment.

 

(If the vehicle does have Michelins, it might be worth checking the tyres’ date of manufacture.)

 

The people I know who have ordered Michelin Camping tyres online have all found the date stamp to be very recent, 2 to 3 months max. This would suggest that that the shelf is fairly bare, as in no old stock.

 

 

Historically Michelin ‘camping-car’ tyres were always fitted as OE to Ducato chassis built in the Italian SEVEL factory and destined to become coachbuilt motorcaravans. When Continental then ‘won’ the contract to supply such tyres this was widely reported in (Continental European) motorhome magazines. Similarly, when the contract went back to MIchelin this was well advertised in the motorhome press.

 

I’ve not read anything about the contract for Ducato OE CP-marked tyres recently switching from Michelin to Continental, but my observations in France suggest that this has probably happened. If that’s correct, the question arises as to when the change took place. It wasn’t just the new 2016-model Ducatos on dealership forecourts that wore Continental VancoCamper tyres, as a newish Pilote X290-based motorhome parked at Ouistreham campsite also had them.

 

The point of my last sentence was that - assuming ‘camping-car’ Ducato chassis (and presumably ‘camping-car’ Boxer/Relay chassis) are now leaving the Italian factory with VancoCamper tyres - if a buyer of a new 2016-model Boxer/Ducato/Relay coachbuilt motorhome finds that the vehicle has Michelin Agilis Camping tyres, it would be worth checking the tyres’ date of manufacture.

 

This would not primarily be to establish how old the tyres were, but to get a quick idea how old the chassis might be. It should be a simple enough matter to identify the date of manufacture of the chassis from its VIN or the accompanying paperwork, but motorhome buyers often don’t seem to bother and then get peeved when it transpires that the base-vehicle of their brand-new motorhome is a lot older than they thought it was.

 

So the present rule of thumb seems to be that the chassis of a 2016-model Ducato-based coachbuilt motorhome wearing VancoCamper tyres was manufactured pretty recently, but if the motorhome has Agilis Camping tyres the chassis will be somewhat older.

 

Returning to the inquiry in the original posting, this link may be of interest

 

http://motorhometrips.blogspot.co.uk/2013/01/winter-tyres-part-2-tyre-choices.html

 

It’s worth highlighting (again!) that there’s nothing magic about the M+S marking. It relates to an ancient USA standard defining a tyre’s tread pattern design and an M+S-marked tyre does not need to meet any defined technical test/performance criteria. Although an M+S-marked tyre might reasonably be expected to provide some improvement in mud/snow conditions over a tyre not M+S-marked, there’s no guarantee how much (if any) better it will be in that respect than a non-M+S-marked tyre.

 

(The “CP” marking is somewhat similar. A CP-marked tyre does not need to meet defined technical test/performance criteria – the marking merely indicates that a tyre manufacturer is marketing the tyre as being particularly suitable for motorcaravan usage.)

 

It should be noted from the link above that Vredestein’s “Comtrac All Season” has a directional tread pattern. In principle this might give better grip off road, but there are availability/fitting/usage implications worth bearing in mind.

 

If potential off-road grip is the priority the Vredestein product ‘looks’ the best bet as its tread pattern is clearly the chunkiest. Then comes Continental’s Vanco FourSeason pattern (still fairly chunky) with Michelin’s M+S-marked Agilis Camping pattern lagging well behind in the ‘chunkiness’ stakes.

 

Nick Fisher (euroserv) has lots of experince of Fiat/Iveco vehicles, but he is not a motorcaravanner and I’m pretty sure he does not anticipate that the people who hire his Ducatos will regularly wish to drive/park them in wet fields.

 

I’m not aware of any independent reviews of motorhome-suiitable tyres that have tested off-road grip. It’s likely that all ‘all weather’ tyres will be (at least) M+S-marked and that they will all have a chunkier tread pattern than M+S-marked ’summer’ tyres (eg. Agilis Camping) that are not advertised as ‘all weather’ type.

 

What this really boils down to is that - for maximum traction on a wet soft grassed surface - it would be logical to opt for a tyre with a really chunky open tread pattern, which (for motorhomes) is likely to mean an ‘all weather’ tyre. But if it’s just the starting off that’s considered to be the main challenge, then common sense is to take the type of precautionary measures mentioned by StuartO and Tracker above and in this earlier forum thread

 

http://forums.outandaboutlive.co.uk/forums/Motorhomes/Motorhome-Matters/ever-been-stuck-in-the-mud-/37002/

 

We recently overnighted at the small French campsite at Céaucé

 

http://www.campingfrance.com/uk/find-your-campsite/normandy/orne/ceauce/camp-municipal

 

This had only just opened and it was evident that a motorhome had parked on one of the grassed pitches and then had trouble getting off as there was a pair of deep muddy depressions where the driving wheels had spun and gouges across the turf as the vehicle eventually extracted itself.

 

I have four Milenco grip mats and if there is any doubt whatsoever about the stability of the surface I’ll be parking on I position the motorhome on the mats. Obviously these won’t assist with traction when the motorhome is being driven off road, but they do help when starting off which is when grip problems generally occur. I used the mats at Céaucé and just drove straight off the pitch.

[747]

Derek Uzzell - 2016-05-07 9:06 AM

 

747 - 2016-05-06 4:46 PM

 

Derek Uzzell - 2016-05-06 2:19 PM

 

747

 

Whatever, but I think anyone awaiting delivery of a new 2016-model Ducato/Boxer-based coachbuilt motorhome (with 15” wheels) should expect it to arrive fitted with Continental CP-marked tyres rather than the Michelins that were previously original equipment.

 

(If the vehicle does have Michelins, it might be worth checking the tyres’ date of manufacture.)

 

The people I know who have ordered Michelin Camping tyres online have all found the date stamp to be very recent, 2 to 3 months max. This would suggest that that the shelf is fairly bare, as in no old stock.

 

 

Historically Michelin ‘camping-car’ tyres were always fitted as OE to Ducato chassis built in the Italian SEVEL factory and destined to become coachbuilt motorcaravans. When Continental then ‘won’ the contract to supply such tyres this was widely reported in (Continental European) motorhome magazines. Similarly, when the contract went back to MIchelin this was well advertised in the motorhome press.

 

I’ve not read anything about the contract for Ducato OE CP-marked tyres recently switching from Michelin to Continental, but my observations in France suggest that this has probably happened. If that’s correct, the question arises as to when the change took place. It wasn’t just the new 2016-model Ducatos on dealership forecourts that wore Continental VancoCamper tyres, as a newish Pilote X290-based motorhome parked at Ouistreham campsite also had them.

 

The point of my last sentence was that - assuming ‘camping-car’ Ducato chassis (and presumably ‘camping-car’ Boxer/Relay chassis) are now leaving the Italian factory with VancoCamper tyres - if a buyer of a new 2016-model Boxer/Ducato/Relay coachbuilt motorhome finds that the vehicle has Michelin Agilis Camping tyres, it would be worth checking the tyres’ date of manufacture.

 

This would not primarily be to establish how old the tyres were, but to get a quick idea how old the chassis might be. It should be a simple enough matter to identify the date of manufacture of the chassis from its VIN or the accompanying paperwork, but motorhome buyers often don’t seem to bother and then get peeved when it transpires that the base-vehicle of their brand-new motorhome is a lot older than they thought it was.

 

So the present rule of thumb seems to be that the chassis of a 2016-model Ducato-based coachbuilt motorhome wearing VancoCamper tyres was manufactured pretty recently, but if the motorhome has Agilis Camping tyres the chassis will be somewhat older.

 

Returning to the inquiry in the original posting, this link may be of interest

 

http://motorhometrips.blogspot.co.uk/2013/01/winter-tyres-part-2-tyre-choices.html

 

It’s worth highlighting (again!) that there’s nothing magic about the M+S marking. It relates to an ancient USA standard defining a tyre’s tread pattern design and an M+S-marked tyre does not need to meet any defined technical test/performance criteria. Although an M+S-marked tyre might reasonably be expected to provide some improvement in mud/snow conditions over a tyre not M+S-marked, there’s no guarantee how much (if any) better it will be in that respect than a non-M+S-marked tyre.

 

(The “CP” marking is somewhat similar. A CP-marked tyre does not need to meet defined technical test/performance criteria – the marking merely indicates that a tyre manufacturer is marketing the tyre as being particularly suitable for motorcaravan usage.)

 

It should be noted from the link above that Vredestein’s “Comtrac All Season” has a directional tread pattern. In principle this might give better grip off road, but there are availability/fitting/usage implications worth bearing in mind.

 

If potential off-road grip is the priority the Vredestein product ‘looks’ the best bet as its tread pattern is clearly the chunkiest. Then comes Continental’s Vanco FourSeason pattern (still fairly chunky) with Michelin’s M+S-marked Agilis Camping pattern lagging well behind in the ‘chunkiness’ stakes.

 

Nick Fisher (euroserv) has lots of experince of Fiat/Iveco vehicles, but he is not a motorcaravanner and I’m pretty sure he does not anticipate that the people who hire his Ducatos will regularly wish to drive/park them in wet fields.

 

I’m not aware of any independent reviews of motorhome-suiitable tyres that have tested off-road grip. It’s likely that all ‘all weather’ tyres will be (at least) M+S-marked and that they will all have a chunkier tread pattern than M+S-marked ’summer’ tyres (eg. Agilis Camping) that are not advertised as ‘all weather’ type.

 

What this really boils down to is that - for maximum traction on a wet soft grassed surface - it would be logical to opt for a tyre with a really chunky open tread pattern, which (for motorhomes) is likely to mean an ‘all weather’ tyre. But if it’s just the starting off that’s considered to be the main challenge, then common sense is to take the type of precautionary measures mentioned by StuartO and Tracker above and in this earlier forum thread

 

http://forums.outandaboutlive.co.uk/forums/Motorhomes/Motorhome-Matters/ever-been-stuck-in-the-mud-/37002/

 

We recently overnighted at the small French campsite at Céaucé

 

http://www.campingfrance.com/uk/find-your-campsite/normandy/orne/ceauce/camp-municipal

 

This had only just opened and it was evident that a motorhome had parked on one of the grassed pitches and then had trouble getting off as there was a pair of deep muddy depressions where the driving wheels had spun and gouges across the turf as the vehicle eventually extracted itself.

 

I have four Milenco grip mats and if there is any doubt whatsoever about the stability of the surface I’ll be parking on I position the motorhome on the mats. Obviously these won’t assist with traction when the motorhome is being driven off road, but they do help when starting off which is when grip problems generally occur. I used the mats at Céaucé and just drove straight off the pitch.

 

I note your comment about the history of the M + S designation counting for nothing. However, as anyone who had the older Michelin XC Camper tyre fitted (not designated M + S) will tell you that they were absolutely atrocious on damp grass (never mind Mud). I asked for 6 new tyres to be fitted to the 2003 Tag Axle van I bought in 2009 and the Michelin Agilis were fitted. At first I was not happy at having anything from Michelin after my previous experience. I was proven wrong and found them to be far, far better tyres off Tarmac. They are now fitted to my latest van.

[Derek Uzzell]

747 - 2016-05-07 1:02 PM

 

I note your comment about the history of the M + S designation counting for nothing. However, as anyone who had the older Michelin XC Camper tyre fitted (not designated M + S) will tell you that they were absolutely atrocious on damp grass (never mind Mud). I asked for 6 new tyres to be fitted to the 2003 Tag Axle van I bought in 2009 and the Michelin Agilis were fitted. At first I was not happy at having anything from Michelin after my previous experience. I was proven wrong and found them to be far, far better tyres off Tarmac. They are now fitted to my latest van.

 

 

It was well recognised that the only (potential) advantage Michelin’s "XC Camping” pattern had over an ordinary ‘white van’ tyre was that it could be obtained in 15”-diameter size with a high load-carrying safety margin. As Michelin was fond of saying XC Camping was an 8PR-marked tyre offering 10PR load-carrying performance. However, it was also well recognised (and confirmed by a 2002 Pro-Mobil test) that XC Camping’s on-road performance was nothing special and motorhome owners regularly complained that its off-road capability was poor. XC Camping was not M+S-marked because its tread pattern (photo attached) did not conform to the M+S definition.

 

Agilis Camping’s tread pattern does meet the M+S definition, but it’s still nowhere near as ‘blocky’ as Continental’s “VancoFourSeason” tyre (that was also Pro-Mobil tested in 2002 and rated highly) or Vredestein’s Comtrac All Season. Hankook’s RA 18 pattern was rated best in a more recent Pro-Mobil test and is also M+S-marked, but this is still not as ‘blocky’ as VancoFourSeason or Comtrac All Season.

 

The only thing that currently sets Agilis Camping apart from other tyres is that it is both M+S-marked and CP-marked, but if the priority is optimum off-road grip then any ‘all season’ tyre (VancoFourSeason, Comtrac All Season, etc.) designed for use on light trucks should provide better traction on wet grass than Agilis Camping simply because an all-season tyre’s tread pattern’s chunkiness is more likely to gain grip off road and self-clean when the tread-voids fill with mud than the tread pattern of an ordinary ’summer’ tyre whether the latter is M+S-marked or not.

 

The original posting asked "Can anyone suggest an all weather tyre to fit my IH Tio Fiat Ducato motorhome?” The motorhome’s current tyre size was not given, but a GOOGLE-search indicates that there are alternatives to the Continental and Vredestein 'al-weather’ products. However, as Airstream has practical experience of using Comtrac All Season tyres on fields and has advised positively that should be the logical choice.

 

[pepe63xnotuse]

Derek Uzzell - 2016-05-08 8:05 AM

The original posting asked "Can anyone suggest an all weather tyre to fit my IH Tio Fiat Ducato motorhome?” The motorhome’s current tyre size was not given, but a GOOGLE-search indicates that there are alternatives to the Continental and Vredestein 'al-weather’ products. However, as Airstream has practical experience of using Comtrac All Season tyres on fields and has advised positively that should be the logical choice.

 

 

Hi Derek, having since dug out the receipt from when we had our Vredesteins fitted, I see now that ours were also "Comtrac"..

(although the receipt is only handwritten, and doesn't state sizes/details, they were only 15" on our swb X250 Boxer))

 

And prior to ordering them, I do recall being present when our independent tyre fitting depot/supplier was ringing 'round searching for "chunky" options, that met the size/weight criteria...and the "Comtracs" did.

 

I would certainly not hesitate in having them fitted again.

[Derek Uzzell]

For new ‘commercial’ Ducatos there are several tyre-related options that include specifying “winter” or “M+S” tyres.

 

Based on an earlier forum discussion I’m guessing that, if the M+S option were specified, it’s likely that Continental VancoFourSeason tyres would be fitted as original equipment (OE). I don’t think any tyre with a directional tread (eg. Vredestein Comtrac All Season) would be chosen as OE as there would be obvious spare-wheel implications.

 

It’s worth highlighting that there are significant differences between Vredestein’s Comtrac All Season tyre (as fitted to Airstream’s Ducato) and Vredestein’s “Comtrac" tyre. The former has a directional tread-pattern and carries M+S and 'Three Peak Snowflake’ markings, while “Comtrac” is a straightforward ‘summer’ tyre with a non-directional tread-pattern and (as far as I can make out) no M+S marking. The visual difference in the tread-pattern will be plain from the following adverts:

 

https://www.tyreleader.co.uk/car-tyres/vredestein/comtrac-all-season/215-70-r15c-109-107r-50927

 

https://www.tyreleader.co.uk/car-tyres/vredestein/comtrac/215-70-r15c-109-107r-12178

 

As a tyre’s ability to provide off-road grip depends primarily on its tread-pattern, there’s no reason to think that Vredestein’s ordinary “Comtrac” tyre would be any better on a wet soft grassed surface than, say, Michelin’s Agilis Camping, whereas Vredestein’s Comtrac All Season SHOULD be better than any pure ‘summer’ tyre.

 

 

 

 

[pepe63xnotuse]

Mornin' Derek

Looking at your links, ours were definitely the Comtrac "All Season".

 

..when I first saw them fitted, I was expecting them to be markedly noisier but they weren't (well not from sitting in the cab anyway).