Aires are Safe.

[robertandjean]

Hi, Felt we must respond to the letter in this months issue of "Out and About" which states that the Aires de Services in France are unsafe and people should not stay on them. This is just not true. We spend six months a year in France staying on aires all the time with no problems. Speaking with many French vanners they also report no problems, nor do the French web forums, like camping car infos, or the French motorhome magazines. France is the best country in the world for the motorvanner, the excellent aires network allowing complete freedom when touring and at little or no cost. We would hate people to be put off by such scare stories. (Maybe the letter writer was confused and was thinking of autoroute service areas, where we would not stay overnight; they can not mean the small rural villages where we stay. If people are really being attacked there then the Western world is finished). Don't believe it and head for France! Robert and Jean

[peejay]

Hello Robert & Jean; Although I haven't seen the letter I would hope you're correct in assuming they are not referring to all aires in general but only to the autoroute aires where there have been many opportunist robberies, especially in the southern regions of France, i'd never stay overnight on these. No aire can be 100% safe but the 'proper' ones away from the autoroutes are no more unsafe than a campsite and as long as sensible precautions are taken there shouldn't be any problems, we've certainly used and loved them for many years and will continue to do so. On a slightly different tack, its the Caravan Club that specifically advise against staying in ANY aire abroad, but the cynic in me feels this is more to do with club profits than sensible advice for their members *-) pete

[Keith T]

Like Pete, haven't seen the letter to which this item refers. However, we make it a practice not to stay on Aires by and large, and have heard first hand of a number of unfortuate expererences on some of these - whether Autoroute or others I'm not sure. We do stay on a couple either Roscoff or St Pol de Leon, both of which are well patronised, and feel safe, but elsewhere we prefer to donate a small fee (usally around €10 per nite to the local economy and stay on the municipal sites. We've also explored some lovely little villages and towns whcih otherwise we would have missed.

[Roy]

I must say that we have used French Aires (and similar in other countries) for many, many years now without the slightest problem. They are indeed a great boon for touring and suit our purposes. Roy.

[mom]

In my ignorance, I always thought Aires meant Motorway Aires.  How do I find out about these small village aires?

[John H]

Hi mom, You need the "Le Guide Officiel Etapes touristiques Camping Car". It's available from french supermarkets, early season. I think they tend to sell out quite quickly. I've heard that it's also available from Amazon. The guide lists thousands of aires and municipal sites. Regards, John.

[Don Madge]

[QUOTE]peejay - 2006-11-23 2:10 PM Hello Robert & Jean; Although I haven't seen the letter I would hope you're correct in assuming they are not referring to all aires in general but only to the autoroute aires where there have been many opportunist robberies, especially in the southern regions of France, i'd never stay overnight on these. No aire can be 100% safe but the 'proper' ones away from the autoroutes are no more unsafe than a campsite and as long as sensible precautions are taken there shouldn't be any problems, we've certainly used and loved them for many years and will continue to do so. On a slightly different tack, its the Caravan Club that specifically advise against staying in ANY aire abroad, but the cynic in me feels this is more to do with club profits than sensible advice for their members *-) pete [/QUOTE] I'm with Pete on this one. We have used aires all over Europe for many years, after a while you get a "Sixth Sense" you can look at a place and you get a "Feeling" about the place, whether it's OK for you or not. You might think I'm going Ga Ga but any experienced motorhomer who uses village/town aires will say the same. Motorway aires are another matter, we have spent many nights on motorway aires in France, Italy, Germany & Luxembourg in the winter months. In Spain in the winter we often stay at restaurants/service stations after using their services while en route to Portugal/Morocco. Don

[Brian Kirby]

[QUOTE]mom - 2006-11-23 2:58 PM

In my ignorance, I always thought Aires meant Motorway Aires.  How do I find out about these small village aires?

[/QUOTE]

Mom

It's a common confusion arising from multiple uses and meanings of the French word "aire".  Aire d'etape, aire de service, aire picnique etc.  The ones on autoroutes (and a few busy main roads), whether service areas, picnic areas, or rest areas, are all best avoided for overnight stops, especially those on the main holiday routes.  They are the "aires" where the great majority of robberies take place.  They attract thieves during the holiday season precisely because a lot of tired slightly disoriented strangers, who don't generally speak much French, will stop.  The added attraction is the ease of escape at speed.

The aires d'etape, on the other hand are rest areas, service areas and overnight stopping points provided by municipalities, campsites and some other businesses all across France (also widely in Italy (aree di sosta) and Germany (stellplatz)).  They are aimed specifically at motorhomes and offer parking, often - but not always - overnight parking, very frequently drinking water, waste dump, and sometimes electricity hook ups as well.  On some, you can stay several days; on others, it is limited to a day, more often a night.  Some are free, most make a smallish charge, few are more that 10 Euros/night.  Some have toilets and even showers, thought this is rare.  Many are on the edges of small towns and villages, designed to net the local shops a bit of extra trade.

In essence, they are glorified car parks, though some are much more attractive than this makes them sound.  Generally, they are not supervised and the charge is frequently levied by a visiting official or a pay and display machine.  Charges for water and electricity are often from a "borne" which will take coins or, more often, tokens from the local tabac, Marie, or tourist office etc.

If you like campsites, with their (relatively) spacious pitches on which you can extend your awning, put out your table and chairs and live outside the van, you may find aires a bit limited.  If you are happy with other 'vans in relatively close proximity and some exposure to passers by, by and large, you'll be happy.  You may have the place to yourself or you may find all places gone.  Late arrival is a bit of a high-risk strategy, since many accommodate only around 6 'vans (although some will take 50 or more).  How crowded do they get?  Just like the campsites, it depends on the popularity of the area and the time of year.

[olley]

Hi Mom try this site http://campingcar.enliberte.free.fr/03_franc/03c_fr-d.htm scroll down and they list links to others. Olley

[Roy]

Mom, Do have a look at : campingcar-infos.com. Roy

[zulurita]

Hello robertandjean, I haven't seen the letter you refer to as we have just returned from France. However we find like you the Aires in the villages of France are safe and have never had any problems. We love the French way of life and especially their passion for camping cars and they are very active in getting "Aires" for camping cars (motorhomes). I only wish our country/councils would do the same. Staying at an Aire usually means it is close to a village/small town etc and so easy for us to walk/cycle to the shops for food or a restaurant for a meal. At least the French recognise that camping car owners spend money in their villages. We have just come back from 2 months in France and found some lovely places to stay. It is rare for us to feel that an Aire is unsafe but have moved on if we have felt the need to do so. We also like the Germany "Stellplatze" run on similar lines but perhaps a little more expensive but still better than campsites that charge high prices and little or no facilities for a motorhome and the added difficulty of getting onto pitches because of trees etc. Rita

[Peter B]

Hi, Another publication (or series of publications) worth looking at is "Guide des aires de service, which I recently purchased at a Le Clerc Supermarket. There are three in the series ( each costing 14 - 15 Euros), one covering the Channel and Atlantic coasts, another Brittanny and Normandy and the third Eastern France. Although written in French (suprise, suprise) each aire has its own locality map, with details of any charge, whether a jeton (token) is required and where any jeton can be purchased. Also indicated is how many spaces there are within the Aire and even how many motorhomes can be accomodated at the service point at any one time! I feel that this is by far the best publication of its type around. After purchasing them, we decided to camp overnight at the Aire at St. Valery -en- Caux. after all, the book indicated that there was rom for 15 units and it was mid October ( hardly high season). We were somewhat suprised to find 40 units there. However, we squeezed in ( no 20ft. rule) and had one of the quietest nights in weeks! Not a sound! Regards Peter B

[Mel B]

So how do we get to see the letter so we can comment on it properly? Is anyone able to post it on here for us all to see? Mr Moderator - would you allow this especially since it is a topic which is very important to us motorhome owners??? *-)

[smokingdragon]

Hi We've overnighted on French Motorway Aires for the last 6 years and never had a problem. We always stay in the All night fuel station ones. Cheers Simon

[mom]

Thanks everyone!

[A W]

I have not had the benefit of reading the article but if as reported it is total nonsense. The problem is that visitors from the UK bring their fear of crime with them as part of their holiday baggage.That is natural but not necessary.Once away from major cities the crime rate is virtually zero. People in our area don't lock their homes and leave keys in cars. Motorway aires in any country and wild camping in Spain are best avoided.The problem is not the French/Spanish but gangs of East Europeans. 99.99% of aires in France are completely safe.The exception is the Narbonne area in summer because of the easy access for gangs coming up from Spain. If you use aires you will have a great time in some wonderful locations. Leave your fear of crime at home!!

[Guest Frank Wilkinson]

I'm new to motorhomes but have towed a caravan on the Continent for years. As with my caravan, when I take my new MH I shall always try to find a proper camp site as I value the space, security and facilities. I've usually managed to locate a municipal site and find these reasonably priced and clean.

However, there have been occasions when, trying to get from A to B as quickly as possible, I have parked up on motorway aires for the night. These are the times when we've driven until late in the evening, pulled into an aire, dropped the steadies and lived from our separate water container that we carry, as caravans don't usually have the luxury of built-in tanks.

We always stay on aires (often part of service areas) that have lots of other vehicles, mainly lorries and have never had any problems. I always think that the presence of a number of heavily built lorry drivers may be enough to put off the thieves that everyone worries about.

I would however, think twice about staying on the simple rest areas, which have no facilites and may be almost empty.

The downside of course is that you can have the noise of lorries coming and going but one of us, the driver, uses ear plugs to help get a good night's sleep.

As has been said, there will always be a risk staying on unsupervised aires, but if you apply common sense you may find that, like me, you'll have an uneventful, if slightly noisy night and of course I wouldn't recommend this policy for your entire touring holiday, but just for an occasional overnight when travelling from one place to another within a reasonable time.

[Basil]

Hi All, We have certainly never had problems using Aires of all types, including motorways. We have been to some where we have moved on due to a dislike of some issue, e.g. we don't use the one at Calais due to too many boy/ girl racers hanging about in the carpark outside and causing a disturbance throughout the night, you may as well stay on the Calais dockside as the security is better. I have said this before, we have never met or personally had any problems on Aires, Services or otherwiswe however friends had their caravan stolen whilst they stopped for a comfort break on a UK motorway (M40 if I recall corectly) and my brother came home from a late night out to find himself confronted by his own caravan being wheeled down the road towards him by three theives, it was fitted with an alarm a wheel clamp and a hitch lock. Does that mean we should not park up on Uk motorway services even for a comfort break?? Should we be concerned about keeping our own vehicles on our own property???? Keep everthing in perspective I say. Bas

[Brian Kirby]

Perspective in all things Basil, totally agreed.  However, there is a clear indication that autoroute aires, along holiday routes, at holiday times, are a haunt of highly mobile blaggers.

The problem with the "we've never had any problem with that" line, is that it's a bit like the man who fell from the top of the Empire State building.  You know, he who was heard saying "so far, so good" as he plummeted down!

I think that the experiences of others should be allowed to feed into our own individual perspectives.  After all, they say experience is the best teacher, but has the highest fees.  Other people's experience, on the other hand, is free!

[Basil]

I agree in principle Brian, but my point is that things can happen on your own premises or on a UK motorway, so why only be worried about Aires?? I can only speak as I find and personally we have never had a problem at home or away and have never met anyone who has, maybe it is because we are careful and try to observe where we are parking up I don't know. I am talking about over a period of time, every year most times more than once, since the 70's and in the earlier days with car caravan combinations that are inherantly more vulnerable as you are sleeping away from the car it is more open to being broken into. So I still feel it should be kept in perspective after all if the man had never jumped off of the high building there would be no problem so it was self inflicted. Had he just stood on the top and admired the view he would have no problems would he, and certainly should he not go to the top of the building in case he felt like jumping off?? We would do nothing if we felt like that! :-S :-S Bas

[Mel B]

[QUOTE]Frank Wilkinson - 2006-11-24 10:23 AM I always think that the presence of a number of heavily built lorry drivers may be enough to put off the thieves that everyone worries about.[/QUOTE] Unfortunately I don't think this would make much difference, the fact that they also get robbed etc, for various reasons, wouldn't mean that you would be any safer staying near them. Also, staying in an area with lots of vehicles coming and going in my mind would not make me feel safe, just the opposite, as people wouldn't bat an eye at a car drawing alongside and then speeding off as it would be accepted as just another driver rushing to get home. I'll stick to the nice little village aires, well way from the motorway and major road networks. Maybe I'm over cautious, maybe not, but I'd rather have a good nights kip than worry and feel crappy the next day because I'm tired. Each to their own. ;-) Sleep well!

[coach2000]

I have been using the French aire's and service stations to rest for the last 8 years now without incident. I do not use any near city's, but wait till I am at least about 30 km in the countryside. Common sense is used, if I feel doubtful forever reason I move on. Parking where it is quiet has never deterred me. During the night you are lucky to find a space on any of the aires because of all the lorries, I tend not to spend more than 4 hours max. on them, preffering to stop at regular intervals for toilets and a brew. If you time it right, stopping to sleep you will find all the lorries have departed when it is daylight and you can get the bacon on. On my last trip I tried a couple of camper stops in quiet villages and found them to be excellent, no lorries and only 1 or 2 other motor homes. No noise except the birds when you wake up. p.s. Try to avoid the refrigerated lorries, the sound echoes at night. Clive.

[Brian Kirby]

Well, Basil, I think part of the answer to your question lies in the fact that the man fell, rather than jumping (suicide) or being pushed (murder).  Thus, he was optimistic as he fell.  Maybe a bit like you? :-)

The other part of the answer lies in the probabilities.  Robbery can happen wherever you may be.  This is true.  Robbery is more likely in certain places and at certain times, than in other places or at other times.  This is also true.  Therefore, if one wishes to minimise the risk of being robbed, it is wise to avoid the locations/times where the risk is greatest.  False?

Answers on a postcard please.

What we are talking about, in reality, is risk management.  To reduce the risk of robbery, not to eliminate it altogether.  We know from any number of reports where/when the risks are greatest.  Surely the lowest risk strategy is to avoid those places/times?

[Basil]

Ok Brian, fair comment!! I'll have to keep up the 100% satisfactory 'Risk Management'. I knew that course would come in handy one day!! :-) :-) Bas

[robertandjean]

Hi, Thanks for all the responses, glad to see how many others also see the camping car aires as great, safe places to stay in France. Not sure how the guy jumping off the Empire State Building managed to get in on the act. Could have understood it if it had been a French vanner about to jump off the Efile Tower on hearing about the high cost of sites, need to advance book and general anti-motorhome feeling when contemplating a trip to Great Britain!!!! On a more serious note regarding finding aires in France then we find "Le Guide National des AIRES de SRVICES" user friendly and comprehensive. Get it in France from larger supermakets or Newsagents from Easter onwards.To research a few aires before you go then visit www.campingcar-infos.com This site has details of over 1000 aires, many with photos (so you can try before you buy!). If you have not visited this site before on entering main site click on "rechercher une aire" and a map of France then comes up. Select the region you are interested in and away you go.