New digital radio woes

[mikebeaches]

We picked up our new van ten days ago (Rapido V68 pvc), and very nice it is too!

 

Came with a digital radio fitted (Pioneer DEH-4800DAB), but I'm having difficulty getting it to hold the memorised stations.

 

Either Fiat or Rapido (?) have fitted a clever and very neat switch on the dash to power the radio, so it can be used when the ignition is turned off. I can set up the various stations on digital and FM that I want programmed in and all is well, with the pre-set buttons working fine... until the power is turned off. Next time it is turned on, all settings lost!! Grr.

 

Have read the manual - which is a challenge in itself - for me anyway - but can't identify what the problem is? Wonder if the radio does not like the 'hard' power on and off through the dash switch, although surely only the same as the ignition turning off?

 

Any help or suggestions where I might be going wrong - thanks.

 

Mike

[RogerThat]

Sounds like that switch is cutting the permanent live.

 

Ideal for preventing a flat battery, terrible for remembering stations!

 

Got any mobile auto electricians in your area (or car stereo shops) that could wire it to the leisure battery instead?

 

[aandncaravan]

Motorhome specific radios are very low current draw when in use and standby mode, so their load on the battery is almost zero in storage.

Most CAR stereos assume the car will be used every day, so there isn't the same attention to low power use.

Most Car Stereos require two power sources (in simple terms) one to power the radio which is usually via the ignition switch and a second permanent, on all the time, feed to power the remote control listening feature (if fitted) and keep the Station memory presets 'saved'.

The minute the memory loses power it 'loses' the Station that was saved.

 

If you install a CAR radio in a Motorhome that might only be used infrequently, the continuous drain of the Station memory and the Remote 'listening' hardware can drain down a Starter battery in 4 weeks. Therefore it is not unusual to wire the power feeds from a separate switch. Ideally there should be two switches, with the station memory power only being cut when the vehicle goes into longer term storage?

 

 

I would guess that in your case the Dealer has used a switch to take power from the Starter battery direct to the Stereo for both the Radio Main power and the Standby memory saver power?

If it is wired from the Starter battery you might want to monitor your usage as having a Car style stereo on for a while can flatten the Starter battery fairly quickly. Better to wire both power feeds from the Habitation battery, with a second switch for the memory 'power'?

 

 

The other way around it is install a Stereo that uses non-volatile station memory, so doesn't need 12v power to save them.

We have been struggling to find a good stereo that has this feature but recently found the Kenwood KDC 100UR which lists amongst it's features :

Non-volatile preset memory for 24 stations (18 FM x / 3 x MW / LW 3 x)

 

No good for you as you require Digital.

 

 

Sorry Roger, posted the same time?

 

 

 

[Billggski]

So it remembers the stations if you just switch it off at the radio?

If so the dashboard switch is just an extra battery saver, only needed when you aren't using your Moho.

[mikebeaches]

Thanks aandncaravan and Roger!

 

I don't think the radio is 'motorhome-specific' because I see it can be purchased from Halfords.

 

My suspicion is that the one fitted in our new van was installed by the converter ie Rapido, but I can't be absolutely certain of that.

 

But whoever put it in, I'm sure you're right that the 'standby' power has been wired through the dash switch - which is causing me to lose the settings when the power is cut.

 

As an aside, I didn't in fact specify a digital radio - it was simply what was fitted. At the time I thought it would be a bonus, but now I'm not so sure.

 

Oh and I appreciate the tip about the Kenwood radio - it could be one to consider if the Pioneer digital doesn't work out. In the first instance I'll ask the supplying dealer to investigate.

[Brian Kirby]

RogerThat - 2016-07-10 4:50 PM

 

Sounds like that switch is cutting the permanent live.

 

Ideal for preventing a flat battery, terrible for remembering stations!

 

Got any mobile auto electricians in your area (or car stereo shops) that could wire it to the leisure battery instead?

Sounds familiar :-), and my guess is that Roger is right. Who installed the radio? It needs a permanent live to keep the memory alive, and it seems this is being cut by that switch.

 

It is quite normal to wire the live feeds to the radio from the habitation battery. It is possible this has been done, and that the switch is only intended to be used at times when the van is out of use long term.

 

It is also possible that the wrong adapter cable has been connected between the vehicle wiring and the radio connections, so that the switch isolates the wrong circuit.

 

It may be a defective radio, but the way it has been wired is a more likely cause until it can be eliminated.

 

I'd be inclined to ask the dealer for further details, either from Rapido if they fitted it, or from his supplier if fitted in UK. Whatever the cause, its is really his job to get it fixed.

[mikebeaches]

Right, I think - with everybody's help - I have PERHAPS solved the problem.

 

The clever dashboard switch appears to perform 2 functions:

 

1. When switched on it enables the radio to be played for any length of time, even with the ignition switched off.

 

and

 

2. It acts as an isolation switch that can be used if the van were to be put into extended storage ie it disables all supplies to the radio including the 'standby/memory' power, which could eventually deplete the cab battery if not being charged by using the vehicle. However, it's use does require the programme memories to be re-installed when the radio is required again.

 

From what I can tell, the radio is currently wired to the cab battery. I will think on and decide whether it should be changed and wired to the habitation battery. So for the time being I will leave the dashboard switch in the 'on' position and use the on/off control on the radio to turn it on and off.

 

We don't normally leave the van unused for long periods of time; and it is kept at home where we have a hook-up (which charges both batteries if required). I also have a separate stand-alone automatic trickle charger I periodically use on the cab battery during winter.

 

Thank you for all of the advice - very much appreciated!!

[Derek Uzzell]

Current-model Rapido motorhomes generally do not have a radio unit as standard. The radio will be part of an optional Rapido factory-fitted ‘pack’ that comprises things like a radio, cruise-control, passenger air-bag, etc.

 

Unless a buyer deliberately opts not to have the basic ‘pack’ that includes a radio, Rapido will install a Pioneer unit and (apparently) the basic single-DIN radio fitted at the moment (at least for UK-marketed Rapidos) is a Pioneer DEH-4800DAB.

 

Pioneer radios may present problems when installed in a motorhome as they are often intended for vehicles that have an ‘auxiliary’ position on their ignition-switch (which current Ducatos do not have). If the radio does not have its own ON/OFF switch (as is the case with certain Pioneer units) some means needs to be provided to switch the unit on and off. This was discussed here

 

http://forums.outandaboutlive.co.uk/forums/Motorhomes/Motorhome-Matters/Pioneer-AVH-2700BT/41394/

 

regarding the double-DIN Pioneer unit that Rapido offers as part of its 'camera pack’. However Mike says that his DEH-4800DAB unit has its own ON/OFF switch.

 

My Rapido’s Pioneer unit does not have its own ON/OFF switch and, consequently, needs to be turned on and off by the small circular dashboard-mounted switch that Rapido installs. I THINK my radio’s main power-source is the motorhome’s habitation battery, but there’s clearly also a link to the vehicle’s ignition circuit as, if I turn the radio on with the ignition off and then start the motorhome’s motor, this switches off the radio temporarily. This is irritating, but I’m reluctant to extract the radio-unit (again) to modify its wiring (again) to prevent this.

 

I’m tempted to think that Rapido installs the dashboard-mounted ON/OFF switch as standard, irrespective of which Pioneer unit is eventually installed. In my motorhome’s case switching the ON/OFF switch off has no effect on any of the radio’s settings, though I fully accept this may not be so with Mike’s radio.

 

There is guidance in my Rapido’s User Manual about using the radio. My Manual does not apply to Rapido panel-van conversions, though I can’t see why their radio installation/usage should be any different from coachbuilt models. I could have chosen to have the basic single-DIN Pioneer unit, but there’s nothing in my Manual to suggest using this would be significantly different. All my Manual says is “The radio can only be switched on withe the knob (1), whatever the ignition-key’s position”.

 

I note that this has also been explored on MHFun

 

http://www.motorhomefun.co.uk/forum/threads/dab-digital-radio-woes.134166/

 

It may be that, when Rapido fits the DEH-4800DAB unit, the dashboard-mounted switch is there to completely isolate the radio (losing all its settings) when the motorhome is long-term stored. If that’s so it would be nice if Rapido’s Manual mentioned it!

[mikebeaches]

Thanks Derek!

 

I agree, it would be helpful if the Rapido manual gave more information. It simply states "Turn the car radio on and off by pressing the the radio's ON/OFF button". The description is illustated with an image of a standard single slot radio, one of the dash-mounted switch and one of a large screen (double slot) radio. And that's it. It is unclear precisely which radio switch is being referred to.

 

As an aside, it took me ages fiddling with the settings on the Pioneer radio to get the 'SRC (source)/OFF' control button on the set to actually switch the radio off! At which point I was reliant on the Rapido dash-mounted switch to do the job, but as previously mentioned - that cuts ALL power, so station settings are lost!

 

However, I can now switch the radio on and off using the 'SRC (source)/OFF' control on the set to do the job. It's slightly more fiddly than the dash-mounted Rapido switch - which would have been ideal, but I can live with that.

 

And I've just been to check again, and all is fine. Oh, and the main motorhome electrical panel is switched off - but the radio still works.

[Derek Uzzell]

The Connections/Installation section of the DEH-4800DAB’s Pioneer manual advises that turning the radio off via its SRC/OFF switch involves pressing and holding down that switch. However I also note that the unit has a PW SAVE menu item that reduces battery power consumption and that there are warnings on how the unit should be wired up if a vehicle’s ignition-switch has no Accessory position.

 

My Rapido User Manual’s “Car radio, audio pack” section begins by saying that “The control panel must be switched on to commision the radio” for 7, 9, 10 and Distinction Series or the motorhome’s ignition switched on, but the radio of S6 and S8 Series models (eg. my Rapido 640) is switched on via the little round dashboard-mounted switch.

 

My Pioneer unit - wherever it is obtaining 12V power from - maintains its settings when switched off via the little round dashboard-mounted switch (which figures as that’s the only way to switch the unit on and off) and thus has the potential to drain a battery. On the other hand, if a radio’s settings are to be maintained, power must be provided to it from somewhere.

 

You might try e-mailing the Rapido factory about this (info@rapido.fr) There’s a (French language) anti-spam feature that you’d have to negotiate, but you should be able to get ‘horse’s mouth’ information on what the dashboard-mounted switch is intended for when a Rapido ‘Van’ motorhome is fitted with this model of Pioneer unit. You might also point out that the radio-related guidance in the Rapido User Manual is a bit minimalist!