RHD and moving to France permanently

[Gypsy]

We are seriously considering moving home and motorhome to Brittany. Doubts have been expressed as to if my RHD motorhome with the habitation door on the LEFT (near side in UK) can be registered in France. In order to obtain adequate French insurance it will have to be registered in France and issued with a French plate. Any authoritative advice please?

 

Further, I own a 1991 Japanese RHD Mazda MX5 and some one has said that the French are not keen on registering old RHD cars. Is this correct? Will I be able to get a French registration for my pride and joy?

:-S (?)

[Mel E]

Of course you can register RHD vehicles in France.

 

EU law allows you to import any vehicle into any EU member state that is road legal in its country of registration, for a mximum period of 6 months. After that you must re-register it. To do so requires it to be road legal in the new country of registration, but I have never heard of any French ban on RHD vehciles.

[Brian Kirby]

Gypsy - 2006-12-09 11:16 AM We are seriously considering moving home and motorhome to Brittany. Doubts have been expressed as to if my RHD motorhome with the habitation door on the LEFT (near side in UK) can be registered in France. In order to obtain adequate French insurance it will have to be registered in France and issued with a French plate. Any authoritative advice please? Further, I own a 1991 Japanese RHD Mazda MX5 and some one has said that the French are not keen on registering old RHD cars. Is this correct? Will I be able to get a French registration for my pride and joy? :-S (?)

As Mel say yes.  However, whether it is worth so doing is quite another question.  I assume you will be able to buy a property, even in Brittany, for less then you sell in UK.  If you take RHD vehicles to France, you will find them almost valueless if you later wish to sell/trade them.  You will also find yourself at a disadvantage driving the RHD car solo on the right, although this will probably not be true for the van due to it's higher driving position.  I do not know if French insurers charge an enhanced premium for RHD vehicles in France, but most UK insurers charge extra for LHD in UK, so I would imagine they will.

Sell the vehicles in UK, where you will get the best prices, and then buy afresh in France, where you will pay less like for like.  Allocate some of the house sale proceeds for this, although you may find you are agreeably surprised how little you'll actually need.

For the car, do look at available servicing near where you will live: France is a large country and not all makes are well supplied with agencies in all locations.  The same will be true for the van, but to a lesser extent, since the mileage is generally lower, so an annual service that involves a long journey could be worked into a holiday trip if necessary.

[barrie w]

very negative brian !

 

[Guest Frank Wilkinson]

barrie w - 2006-12-09 3:41 PM very negative brian !

Personally I thought that Brian gave some sound advice. Rather than just post a disparaging comment such as 'very negative' don't you think that it would be nicer to clarify why you think he's being negative and give some advice of your own?

[derek500]

Gypsy - 2006-12-09 12:16 PM

 

Doubts have been expressed as to if my RHD motorhome with the habitation door on the LEFT (near side in UK) can be registered in France.

 

I have heard a similar thing here in Spain with registering UK caravans. Apparently you need to have the habitation door on the nearside.

 

Derek

[Brian Kirby]

barrie w - 2006-12-09 3:41 PM very negative brian !

Barrie

Can you quantify?  How is saving time and money negative?  Or have you done both, then sold your car and motorhome in France, and saved money inot the bargain?  If so, I think Colin would be grateful to hear how!

[A W]

Please don't take my view as definitve but I do have the advantage of living in Brittany.The posts from Brian and Mel are both right in their own way.EU law says you have 6 months to register in your new country.Don't lose any sleep over that,none of us expats do.French insurance companies will insure on UK plates for a max of 12 months by which time the vehicles need to be registered.There is confusion amongst the French authorities about which side the habitation should be on.Personally I would sell it in the Uk as even if it were re registered it would be worth a small fraction of its true value.

The Mazda may be more difficult.If it is a "grey" import don't even bother putting it on a ferry.If it is UK spec and supplied by a Mazda dealer it is vital that you obtain a "certificate of conformity" else it cannot be registered.Consequently you may consider selling in the UK as the best option.For a more definitive view go to www.brittany.angloinfo.com and do a forum search under HYMER.

Apart from that hope your move goes well

[Randonneur]

We moved to South West France 6 years ago and brought with us a 1991 RHD Discovery - UK registered. We were told that some Insurance companies would insure us for 12 months but after the first 6 months you were not certain to be covered at all if in the event of an accident or claim because the official time is 6 months. There are a lot of ex-pats driving English registered vehicles around France with "dodgy" insurance. One I know of has been here for at least 15 years and still has UK plates. We decided to go the legal route and had to obtain a Certificate of Conformity from LandRover France not UK to say it was French spec.

 

If a vehicle was brought into the UK by any other route than Europe you would have a problem registering in France. I know of a RHD Fiesta that came in from Jersey and it was almost impossible to re-register in France.

 

As far as the motorhome side of things, our neighbour brought with him a Laika RHD motorhome but with the habitation door on the european side, he had a problem in obtaining the certificate from Laika but after 4 months it finally arrived after many, many phone calls and emails. He also had to obtain a certificate of conformity from Fiat for the base unit. With the relevant paperwork then there is no problem.

 

I would dispute the fact that secondhand vehicles are cheaper here - they are NOT - because people tend to keep them longer as they are not subject to the winter hazards such as salt on the roads.

[Randonneur]

Sorry, I forgot to say that each Department in France has its own set of rules. So anything can happen and often does. We live in the Charente 2 miles from the border with the Dordogne and the difference in the bureaucracy (don't know if the spelling is correct) is amazing.

[barrie w]

OOPS,sorry brian & others,i didn't mean to sound offensive.my appologies.

the post was made late at night & until now i've not had the time to reply further

 

let me see if i can make some recommpence with a few figures.

you must bear in mind that this is only of my experience & is based on a renault van & not a camping car.that will follow later.

 

in france the control technique(mot)is valid for 2 years with a free interim inspection at 1 year.cost around €50.only required after the vehicle is 4 years old.

you need a certificate of conformity from the manufacturer(mine from renault €105)

there are various forms to fill in & submit to the prefecture in your department before they send you a certificat de immitriculation(log book)

this you have to pay for & varies with the vehicle(mine €235)

 

once you have the log book you can obtain a set of number plates.€30. (which for some reason must be fixed with rivets)

 

insurance cost me €225 for comprehensive cover but remember that there is no road fund here so overall gives an annual saving.

 

you will ultimately need r/h dip head lamps & depending on the configuration of rear lamps you may need to change these.

 

with a uk spec camping car you will probably have to change the gas regulator & a few other habitation bits to comply with french spec but nothing drastic as far as i am aware.

 

depending on your model of camper you must bear in mind depreciation if you sell in uk.i know i would loose in the region of £6000 if i sell.so if an outlay of £1000 makes it legal here thats good economics for the inconvenience.driving r/h/d isn't a problem,you soon adapt.

 

the european camping car is a different kettle of fish to a uk one,they favour front dinette/fixed beds,no cooker,minimal lounge area etc.so you may not find what you want over here.

cost wise second hand,be it car or camper,appear high compared to uk.

new i'm not sure,although as an axample an adria twin on the new ducato chassis is about €42000/£30000.

 

so,don't be put off.france loves campers!!

 

barrie.

 

[A W]

So there you are "Gypsey" you pays your money and takes your choice.

I think the considered opinion from France is to be very careful about bringing a RHD camping car to France.Personally I have never seen one but other contributors have.Even if you re registered it it would have very little value and be unsellable.

If the Mazda is not a grey import there should not be a problem.You seem to have an emotional attachment to it so may be willing to re register it knowing it will be virtually unsellable here.It would probably mean keeping it and running it into the ground.

There is a new thread running on brittany anglo info that in 2007 the French are changing the rules to make the importation and registration simpler.Without being pessimistic I'll believe it when it happens.

As stated earlier in this thread be under no illusions that secondhand cars are cheap here.They most certainly are not.

It would be interesting to know whether the various postings have been any help to you

[Brian Kirby]

barrie w - 2006-12-11 7:12 AM OOPS,sorry brian & others,i didn't mean to sound offensive.my appologies. the post was made late at night & until now i've not had the time to reply further let me see if i can make some recommpence with a few figures. you must bear in mind that this is only of my experience & is based on a renault van & not a camping car.that will follow later. in france the control technique(mot)is valid for 2 years with a free interim inspection at 1 year.cost around €50.only required after the vehicle is 4 years old. you need a certificate of conformity from the manufacturer(mine from renault €105) there are various forms to fill in & submit to the prefecture in your department before they send you a certificat de immitriculation(log book) this you have to pay for & varies with the vehicle(mine €235) once you have the log book you can obtain a set of number plates.€30. (which for some reason must be fixed with rivets) insurance cost me €225 for comprehensive cover but remember that there is no road fund here so overall gives an annual saving. you will ultimately need r/h dip head lamps & depending on the configuration of rear lamps you may need to change these. with a uk spec camping car you will probably have to change the gas regulator & a few other habitation bits to comply with french spec but nothing drastic as far as i am aware. depending on your model of camper you must bear in mind depreciation if you sell in uk.i know i would loose in the region of £6000 if i sell.so if an outlay of £1000 makes it legal here thats good economics for the inconvenience.driving r/h/d isn't a problem,you soon adapt. the european camping car is a different kettle of fish to a uk one,they favour front dinette/fixed beds,no cooker,minimal lounge area etc.so you may not find what you want over here. cost wise second hand,be it car or camper,appear high compared to uk. new i'm not sure,although as an axample an adria twin on the new ducato chassis is about €42000/£30000. so,don't be put off.france loves campers!! barrie.

Don't disagree with any of that.  However, my point was that after you've done all that re-registering of your RHD 'van/car in France, what you finish up with is virtually unsellable in France.  It will therefore be financially beneficial to sell the RHD vehicles in England, and buy anew in France.  The point above that the French hang onto their cars because the secondhand value stinks doesn't disprove that secondhand cars are cheaper in France, all it suggests is that they aren't so readily available. 

However, as new cars are generally cheaper than in UK, ditto motorhomes (despite the Twin price quoted most low profile coachbuilts are in the region of £5,000 cheaper in France), it makes more sense to chop out the old and replace with new/nearly new. 

Re big lounges; when in Rome, do as the Romans.  There is good reason why different motorhome designs are favoured in different countries.  The favoured UK design tends to be influenced by our cooler, damper climate, as a result of which we lounge around inside and hide in safari rooms.  However, that is not so good in much of France where the weather is generally a bit warmer and drier, so one can live outside more.  If you're going to live in France, adopt their habits, it makes life easier and cheaper.  We have a German low profile, made predominantly for the French market and bought in France.  No lounge - we mostly live outside.  Fixed bed, convenient, no bedding to put away and get out, and a nice big boot under.  3 burner hob, backed I'll admit by a Remoska, and no oven.  We can do 10-12 weeks at a stretch without stress, and we "eat in" far more that we eat out.  Seems to suit the French, and we seem to envy them their lifestyle, so go with the flow and enjoy.

[Gypsy]

Thanks everyone for your input into this problem. I thought it would be a little complex and I was right! Should we finally decide to move permanently to Britanny/Brittany, I think - first, learn to spell the name right; second, sell the motorhome in the UK and buy in France; third - aah, this is where I am really upset, sell my beloved MX5 Eunos in the UK and try to console myself with excellent French wine. I don't think it is a grey import but it was originally produced in Japan to the Japanese spec which was, and is, much higher than UK produced MX5s. I doubt very much if I would be able to obtain a certificate of conformity and so would be unable to re-register the vehicle in France. Further I am sure that I would not be able to buy anything remotely similar in France. Mind you I have seen a few Ferrari's and a couple of Lambos in Britanny/Brittany.

Any way, enough of my emotional meanderings, I will print this thread and put in in my French file. Many thanks again - I think.

[terry1956]

Hi there maybe able to help, as we also have a place in france and took our RHD camper over. The reasons are easy to see. No road tax, better insurrance, mot at 2 years. We did think of buying one out there but find them deal with high KM,s. Anyway we took our ford transit based transit out, Here is the story. 1st one needs to send off to ford for a Cert of build, As the transit was not as ford made it, they would only give us a part cover cert, ie it stated what ford made and know more. We had to go to the french dept of transport for normandy in our case, who asked for a cert from the makers of the motorhome part of the van, as we could not get that I stated that it was a self build. I was asked for a plan of the inside in great detail, and this was returned once asking for more detail. The van then had to be teated for both gas and elec, a outside door was needed for the gas, and a vent had to places in the footwell of the motorhome section, The van would not past due to the rear seatbelts and the fact that it had a side door on the wrong side. AFTER a phone call to the French dept of transport, we had to remove the seat belts from the rear seats and have the log book stamped for two people and not four, the door on the wrong side would not stop us then. After this we had to take it for a weight test, and then a final test which it failed to pass, I had to remove the motorhome window handles and rams and have signs made up in french stateing that the windows had to be closed before moving off. Also all EU signs had to be in place, and road wheels all had to be the same make. AFTER this we got the french log book and number plates, We then had to get an MOT, and insurrance. The MOT took 15 mins, and the insurrance by AXA LESS then 10.

Would I do it again, YES with a one make model, we have a HYMER build now, No if it was a DIY job. I have placed the transit on sorn so as not to loss the plates etc.

Taking a car out is easy, we did our BMW N/P

ps THEY also ask to see paperwork from a garage that you have LHD headlights.

Hope this helps, terry. if you need any more help just ask.

terry1956@btinternet.com

[messerschmitt owner]

Gypsy - 2006-12-12 9:53 AM

 

aah, this is where I am really upset, sell my beloved MX5 Eunos in the UK and try to console myself with excellent French wine. I don't think it is a grey import but it was originally produced in Japan to the Japanese spec which was, and is, much higher than UK produced MX5s. I doubt very much if I would be able to obtain a certificate of conformity and so would be unable to re-register the vehicle in France. Further I am sure that I would not be able to buy anything remotely similar in France. .

 

Buy a smart roadster in France (or even a LHD one in the UK - from £4500-5500), after all, they made them there - the Mazda is more reliable but the smart is more fun!

[aion]

you can checkout a leaflet from angloinfo website on imports. re insurance, most companies will give you insurance for 4 months whilst you arrange importation. no problems with rhd or door on wrong side.