MikenKath Posted October 22, 2016 Share Posted October 22, 2016 Hi all,your advice needed, we have 10 month old autotrail tracker lo line 8,000 miles,washing it to-day have noticed extensive crazing to front of overcab area above and below autotrail logo, one crack seems to be starting to open up, what can be done,on monday do i ring autotrail or dealer,apart from wobly hinge on oven ,we have had no problems and are very happy with this motorhome. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AlanS Posted October 22, 2016 Share Posted October 22, 2016 On Monday phone your dealer and they should deal with it under warranty. The AutoTrail handbook says that you may experience some crazing in the gel coat and that it would be rectified under warranty. So, AutoTrail, via your dealer will get Lamplas Plastics to come out and carry out the remedial works (usually at your address). Lamplas make a lot of the GRP panels for many motorhomes and especially AutoTrail. I know that it is very concerning for you but the repair they carry out should be perfect and you should not notice where it has been carried out. We have had a small 'craze' repair carried out on our previous MH and on our present one and are happy with the outcome. Alan MikenKath - 2016-10-22 7:17 PM Hi all,your advice needed, we have 10 month old autotrail tracker lo line 8,000 miles,washing it to-day have noticed extensive crazing to front of overcab area above and below autotrail logo, one crack seems to be starting to open up, what can be done,on monday do i ring autotrail or dealer,apart from wobly hinge on oven ,we have had no problems and are very happy with this motorhome. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MikenKath Posted October 22, 2016 Author Share Posted October 22, 2016 Alan,thankyou so much we feel much better now knowing that it can be sorted,we were worried they may think we had bashed it on something,thankyou. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
globebuster Posted October 22, 2016 Share Posted October 22, 2016 Alan, Can you just clarify something please - Are you actually saying the Autotrail handbook implies that you may encounter such a problem - or did I misunderstand that? If that's the case, I find it amazing that something has to be rectified after manufacture [i'd still be amazed even if the handbook doesn't state it!] There must be some inherent fault in either the manufacturing process, or the installation - or just poor design. No moulding should require remedial work, and whilst you may have what appears to be a lovely cosmetic finish afterwards, I would still question the structural integrity of what lies beneath. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AlanS Posted October 23, 2016 Share Posted October 23, 2016 Hi This is an extract from my 2015 AT Frontier handbook Motorhome Exterior The exterior of Auto-Trail Motorhomes are finished with a highly polished fibreglass skin. This is a very durable surface and is very easy to clean due to its high gloss finish. To maintain a showroom finish, wash the Motorhome regularly with a mild detergent, rinse off with cold water and leather off. A good quality car wax may be applied which will make washing even easier in the future. Abrasive cleaning agents must never be used to clean the exterior of Auto-Trail Motorhomes. Within the first twelve months cracks and blisters can appear in the surface of moulded GRP components. These are cosmetic only and have no effect on the vehicles structure. These components can be readily repaired using the correct procedure (please refer this to your supplying dealer). So there you are and this was the same for our previous AT in 2013. These cracks are purely in the gel coat and are not structural and is due to the thickness of the gelcoat when the fibre glass is laid up. Often on sharp contours the gel coat is thinner than in other places. I am not making any excuses for AT and only stating what is in their documentation. Alan globebuster - 2016-10-22 10:10 PM Alan, Can you just clarify something please - Are you actually saying the Autotrail handbook implies that you may encounter such a problem - or did I misunderstand that? If that's the case, I find it amazing that something has to be rectified after manufacture [i'd still be amazed even if the handbook doesn't state it!] There must be some inherent fault in either the manufacturing process, or the installation - or just poor design. No moulding should require remedial work, and whilst you may have what appears to be a lovely cosmetic finish afterwards, I would still question the structural integrity of what lies beneath. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
globebuster Posted October 23, 2016 Share Posted October 23, 2016 Thanks Alan, Well, in my 40 years of boat design, development and build I have never heard a bigger admission to poor practice. You just cannot categorically say there are no underlying problems - certainly with crazing. During the GRP laying-up process the odd gelcoat void may occur, and even a variation in gel or substrate thickness 'loading up' - but unlikely on such a light moulding which I would imagine is infused anyway. I'm sure the cosmetic repairs all look great, you just need to ask why they are required in the first place. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AlanS Posted October 23, 2016 Share Posted October 23, 2016 As I said previously AutoTrail use Lamplas as do many other motorhome and caravan manufacturers and this is one of their statements :- Lamplas built up a reputation in the leisure industry and by 1985 was operating from three separate factories producing a wide range of be-spoke mouldings for the majority of UK caravan manufacturers. Components include A frame covers, wheel arches, one piece roofs and full height front and rear panels. Over the years Lamplas have diversified into many other areas notably bus and commercial vehicle. They are the experts in the field so who am I to question their abilities - yes, I was not please when I found crazing around the rear light cluster on the rear panel but as I said they carried out and excellent 'repair'. They appear to be a sizeable company of 40 years standing - have a look at their website:- http://www.lamplas.co.uk/about_us.html Alan globebuster - 2016-10-23 8:55 AM Thanks Alan, Well, in my 40 years of boat design, development and build I have never heard a bigger admission to poor practice. You just cannot categorically say there are no underlying problems - certainly with crazing. During the GRP laying-up process the odd gelcoat void may occur, and even a variation in gel or substrate thickness 'loading up' - but unlikely on such a light moulding which I would imagine is infused anyway. I'm sure the cosmetic repairs all look great, you just need to ask why they are required in the first place. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lennyhb Posted October 23, 2016 Share Posted October 23, 2016 I would say not fit for purpose, poor build quality. Never heard such a lame excuse for poor workmanship. You don't see it on other Motorhomes or boats. Our last Hymer was a low profile with a GRP overcab absolutely no problems with the GRP in 6 years, current Hymer the front end is GRP again no problems at all. I wouldn't accept a repair I would be inclined to insist on a replacement moulding this type of fault just should not happen with modern resins & Gel coats. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rayjsj Posted October 23, 2016 Share Posted October 23, 2016 I had gelcoat problems on my new 2012 Autotrail Savannah, was like a large crack coming up from the joint between metal cab and fibreglass overpod, had me really worried at the time. The dealer re-assured me that the repair would be undetectable, and wouldnt happen again. And it wasnt and didnt. I was told it was repared by a fibreglass specialist, dont know if that was Lamplas or not ? Dealer was Continental leisure vehicles of Crosshands Wales. Having a sympathetic and helpful dealer is worth sticking with. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
globebuster Posted October 23, 2016 Share Posted October 23, 2016 It would appear that Lamplas do have vast experience, judging by there website - and are pretty well up to speed with there processes. So, I can only conclude that these problems are created by poor installation during build. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ROND Posted October 23, 2016 Share Posted October 23, 2016 From my experience I would say it is definitely the way they are moulded, they are far too thin and flexible obviously to keep cost and weight down. I have had my overhead split on the back and also crazing on the front both repaired on guarantee but the crazing on the front is back again. You only have to press with your hand to feel how flexible and thin the mouldings are, if they were moulding for a boat like that then it would sink within a month. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rayjsj Posted October 24, 2016 Share Posted October 24, 2016 I think you are correct about the thickness of the fibreglass, they have obviously thinned it down over the years to get their vans well below the 3500 kg license limit .(an arbitary figure dreamed up by some bod in Brussels.....the British limit was and is in most towns and villages 7.5 tonne) my old license still stated 7.5 tonnes as definining an HGV. I diverse. Whilst we still require gadgets, bikes,scooters etc., etc., then build quility will continue to degrade. They are even talking of making internal furniture out of Balsa wood !! Heaven help us ! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pepe63xnotuse Posted October 24, 2016 Share Posted October 24, 2016 It took a dozen or so posts but in true forum style, we finally got there... ... it's all the fault of "Brussels" (lol) (lol) We had our 2008 7mtr Chausson for 5 years(2 years old when bought) and in that time none of the "fibreglass" crazed or cracked on that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
globebuster Posted October 24, 2016 Share Posted October 24, 2016 The weight of the mouldings will not necessarily have a bearing on strength, but the materials/composites used will - and in fact the ability to flex is an important factor. Resin has no structural/strength benefit, in fact [as a general rule] minimising the resin content will increase strength and flexibility - providing the right core materials are used, bi-axials, PBM and the like. From the various comments thus far, it will be the installation of the panels and mouldings that cause a problem - either by excessive force or compression [hard spots] rather than a poor manufacturing process of the panel or moulding. In modern boat building low resin materials [Kotec for example] are preferred by quality manufacturers because they afford greater strength with lighter weight using RTM and infusion. So, whilst I can't comment on how well these mouldings are made, I still think it's poor installation that's the root cause - but to say there will be no underlying problems with the structure after repair is questionable! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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