Jump to content

It's a sad day for some on ere


antony1969

Recommended Posts

The interesting question for me is whether you have to have totalitarian rule to get a leader who creates really good things in a society?

 

In Cuba's case they had excellent educational and medical services and Hitler was pretty good at creating effective industry and armed forces but in both cases these potentially good things came with terrible accompaniments, bad enough to compromise the value of the positives.

 

Democracy protects us from things like mass bumpings-off of opponents and a hollocaust but it also seems to preclude real productiveness.

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

When we went to Cuba in 2001 , the people seemed happy enough. transport for the masses was a bit of a problem, and shortage of items we take for granted . IE toiletries,. But plenty of cigars 1$, (not all genuine )also plenty of Chairman Mao's REd Book, not sure what language it was in! Loads of OLD American cars as well.

I imagine it is a better place now, and certainly worth a visit IMO. Hopefully with more USA goods getting through, probably MUCH better now for the local people.

PJay

Link to comment
Share on other sites

starvin marvin - 2016-11-27 4:22 PM

 

antony1969 - 2016-11-27 7:09 AM

 

starvin marvin - 2016-11-27 3:55 AM

 

Your point is?? No let me guess.

 

Guess away Tony ... You don't need to stay up half the night though trying

 

It's not half the night where I am!

 

Cloud Cuckoo Land ??

Link to comment
Share on other sites

antony1969 - 2016-11-27 6:15 PM

 

starvin marvin - 2016-11-27 4:22 PM

 

antony1969 - 2016-11-27 7:09 AM

 

starvin marvin - 2016-11-27 3:55 AM

 

Your point is?? No let me guess.

 

Guess away Tony ... You don't need to stay up half the night though trying

 

It's not half the night where I am!

 

Cloud Cuckoo Land ??

 

Yes and today it's in the high 70's, jealous?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

StuartO - 2016-11-27 10:04 AMThe interesting question for me is whether you have to have totalitarian rule to get a leader who creates really good things in a society?

 

In Cuba's case they had excellent educational and medical services and Hitler was pretty good at creating effective industry and armed forces but in both cases these potentially good things came with terrible accompaniments, bad enough to compromise the value of the positives.

 

Democracy protects us from things like mass bumpings-off of opponents and a hollocaust but it also seems to preclude real productiveness.

The answer, is the difference between the lowest common denominator (the form of democracy we presently have) and the highest common factor (the form of democracy we should probably adopt for success)! :-D
Link to comment
Share on other sites

starvin marvin - 2016-11-27 6:39 PM

 

antony1969 - 2016-11-27 6:15 PM

 

starvin marvin - 2016-11-27 4:22 PM

 

antony1969 - 2016-11-27 7:09 AM

 

starvin marvin - 2016-11-27 3:55 AM

 

Your point is?? No let me guess.

 

Guess away Tony ... You don't need to stay up half the night though trying

 

It's not half the night where I am!

 

Cloud Cuckoo Land ??

 

Yes and today it's in the high 70's, jealous?

More appealing than a roof in Uddersfield, I'd have thought! :-D

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Brian Kirby - 2016-11-27 7:06 PM

 

starvin marvin - 2016-11-27 6:39 PM

 

antony1969 - 2016-11-27 6:15 PM

 

starvin marvin - 2016-11-27 4:22 PM

 

antony1969 - 2016-11-27 7:09 AM

 

starvin marvin - 2016-11-27 3:55 AM

 

Your point is?? No let me guess.

 

Guess away Tony ... You don't need to stay up half the night though trying

 

It's not half the night where I am!

 

Cloud Cuckoo Land ??

 

Yes and today it's in the high 70's, jealous?

More appealing than a roof in Uddersfield, I'd have thought! :-D

 

Staying in the EU is more appealing than roofing in Huddersfield Brian ... Regarding Tonys jealous question ... No not at all , jealousy is something Ive never suffered from thankfully ... Enjoy your holiday Tony and please don't reply just have a nice cool beer on me

Link to comment
Share on other sites

antony1969 - 2016-11-27 7:27 PM

 

Brian Kirby - 2016-11-27 7:06 PM

 

starvin marvin - 2016-11-27 6:39 PM

 

antony1969 - 2016-11-27 6:15 PM

 

starvin marvin - 2016-11-27 4:22 PM

 

antony1969 - 2016-11-27 7:09 AM

 

starvin marvin - 2016-11-27 3:55 AM

 

Your point is?? No let me guess.

 

Guess away Tony ... You don't need to stay up half the night though trying

 

It's not half the night where I am!

 

Cloud Cuckoo Land ??

 

Yes and today it's in the high 70's, jealous?

More appealing than a roof in Uddersfield, I'd have thought! :-D

 

Staying in the EU is more appealing than roofing in Huddersfield Brian ... Regarding Tonys jealous question ... No not at all , jealousy is something Ive never suffered from thankfully ... Enjoy your holiday Tony and please don't reply just have a nice cool beer on me

 

Only if you're paying!

 

Free beer from the right....now that could possibly turn my head. On second thoughts.......nah.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

starvin marvin - 2016-11-27 8:38 PM

 

antony1969 - 2016-11-27 7:27 PM

 

Brian Kirby - 2016-11-27 7:06 PM

 

starvin marvin - 2016-11-27 6:39 PM

 

antony1969 - 2016-11-27 6:15 PM

 

starvin marvin - 2016-11-27 4:22 PM

 

antony1969 - 2016-11-27 7:09 AM

 

starvin marvin - 2016-11-27 3:55 AM

 

Your point is?? No let me guess.

 

Guess away Tony ... You don't need to stay up half the night though trying

 

It's not half the night where I am!

 

Cloud Cuckoo Land ??

 

Yes and today it's in the high 70's, jealous?

More appealing than a roof in Uddersfield, I'd have thought! :-D

 

Staying in the EU is more appealing than roofing in Huddersfield Brian ... Regarding Tonys jealous question ... No not at all , jealousy is something Ive never suffered from thankfully ... Enjoy your holiday Tony and please don't reply just have a nice cool beer on me

 

Only if you're paying!

 

Free beer from the right....now that could possibly turn my head. On second thoughts.......nah.

 

Yes Tony a free beer from the right ... A free beer from the left would of course come with all hidden costs ... Cheers

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Lee Quan Yu in Singapore while not strictly a Dictator, he ruled with a strong hand and achieved a great deal for the good citizens of that small island country. Most families were able to purchase an apartment with money borrowed at low interest from the Govt superannuation fund. Each employer had to pay  from memory 26% of annual salary for each employee into the fund. Censorship is a little on the heavy side and most people will not openly criticise the Government. However in my experience of working and holidaying there the good folk seem happy and there is certainly no shortage of goods to buy.
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Geeco - 2016-11-28 6:58 AMLee Quan Yu in Singapore while not strictly a Dictator, he ruled with a strong hand and achieved a great deal for the good citizens of that small island country. Most families were able to purchase an apartment with money borrowed at low interest from the Govt superannuation fund. Each employer had to pay  from memory 26% of annual salary for each employee into the fund. Censorship is a little on the heavy side and most people will not openly criticise the Government. However in my experience of working and holidaying there the good folk seem happy and there is certainly no shortage of goods to buy.

 

The streets were clean too, thanks to strict policing of the no chewing gum rule!  Perhaps Singapore is an example of the tolerable sort of totalitarian rule.

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Geeco - 2016-11-28 6:58 AM

 

Lee Quan Yu in Singapore while not strictly a Dictator, he ruled with a strong hand and achieved a great deal for the good citizens of that small island country. Most families were able to purchase an apartment with money borrowed at low interest from the Govt superannuation fund. Each employer had to pay  from memory 26% of annual salary for each employee into the fund. Censorship is a little on the heavy side and most people will not openly criticise the Government. However in my experience of working and holidaying there the good folk seem happy and there is certainly no shortage of goods to buy.

 

 

 

My opinion of Singapore, back in the early 90,s was that the people where very wary ! Although i liked the place, I personally did not feel comfortable there, I guess it has changed since then?

PJay

Link to comment
Share on other sites

antony1969 - 2016-11-28 6:25 AM

 

starvin marvin - 2016-11-27 8:38 PM

 

antony1969 - 2016-11-27 7:27 PM

 

Brian Kirby - 2016-11-27 7:06 PM

 

starvin marvin - 2016-11-27 6:39 PM

 

antony1969 - 2016-11-27 6:15 PM

 

starvin marvin - 2016-11-27 4:22 PM

 

antony1969 - 2016-11-27 7:09 AM

 

starvin marvin - 2016-11-27 3:55 AM

 

Your point is?? No let me guess.

 

Guess away Tony ... You don't need to stay up half the night though trying

 

It's not half the night where I am!

 

Cloud Cuckoo Land ??

 

Yes and today it's in the high 70's, jealous?

More appealing than a roof in Uddersfield, I'd have thought! :-D

 

Staying in the EU is more appealing than roofing in Huddersfield Brian ... Regarding Tonys jealous question ... No not at all , jealousy is something Ive never suffered from thankfully ... Enjoy your holiday Tony and please don't reply just have a nice cool beer on me

 

Only if you're paying!

 

Free beer from the right....now that could possibly turn my head. On second thoughts.......nah.

 

Yes Tony a free beer from the right ... A free beer from the left would of course come with all hidden costs ... Cheers

 

Thanks Tone, I'll toast to the continuing fight of the proletariat.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

starvin marvin - 2016-11-28 3:00 PM

 

antony1969 - 2016-11-28 6:25 AM

 

starvin marvin - 2016-11-27 8:38 PM

 

antony1969 - 2016-11-27 7:27 PM

 

Brian Kirby - 2016-11-27 7:06 PM

 

starvin marvin - 2016-11-27 6:39 PM

 

antony1969 - 2016-11-27 6:15 PM

 

starvin marvin - 2016-11-27 4:22 PM

 

antony1969 - 2016-11-27 7:09 AM

 

starvin marvin - 2016-11-27 3:55 AM

 

Your point is?? No let me guess.

 

Guess away Tony ... You don't need to stay up half the night though trying

 

It's not half the night where I am!

 

Cloud Cuckoo Land ??

 

Yes and today it's in the high 70's, jealous?

More appealing than a roof in Uddersfield, I'd have thought! :-D

 

Staying in the EU is more appealing than roofing in Huddersfield Brian ... Regarding Tonys jealous question ... No not at all , jealousy is something Ive never suffered from thankfully ... Enjoy your holiday Tony and please don't reply just have a nice cool beer on me

 

Only if you're paying!

 

Free beer from the right....now that could possibly turn my head. On second thoughts.......nah.

 

Yes Tony a free beer from the right ... A free beer from the left would of course come with all hidden costs ... Cheers

 

Thanks Tone, I'll toast to the continuing fight of the proletariat.

 

The working class ... You see thats your problem and your boyfriend Jeremys problem ... It doesn't really exist anymore ... The working class have now become the middle class really ... But you and him please keep on fighting for it just to remind us what once existed ... UKIP have just voted in a real man of the people and they are according to him targeting those Labour voters ... You soon could end up as the countries 4th party , maybe even the 5th if the rise of the far right BNP is to believed ... Enjoy your holiday Tony , guna be minus something tonight here in the pits

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Guest pelmetman
antony1969 - 2016-11-28 5:19 PM

 

The working class ... You see thats your problem and your boyfriend Jeremys problem ... It doesn't really exist anymore ... The working class have now become the middle class really ... But you and him please keep on fighting for it just to remind us what once existed ... UKIP have just voted in a real man of the people and they are according to him targeting those Labour voters ... You soon could end up as the countries 4th party , maybe even the 5th if the rise of the far right BNP is to believed ... Enjoy your holiday Tony , guna be minus something tonight here in the pits

 

Labour is fast becoming just a protest party, they're rapidly losing their traditional voter base, and there ain't enough champagne socialists and trotskyists to make them relevant anymore ;-) ..........

 

Cant say I'm disappointed :D ........

 

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

pelmetman - 2016-11-28 5:33 PM

 

antony1969 - 2016-11-28 5:19 PM

 

The working class ... You see thats your problem and your boyfriend Jeremys problem ... It doesn't really exist anymore ... The working class have now become the middle class really ... But you and him please keep on fighting for it just to remind us what once existed ... UKIP have just voted in a real man of the people and they are according to him targeting those Labour voters ... You soon could end up as the countries 4th party , maybe even the 5th if the rise of the far right BNP is to believed ... Enjoy your holiday Tony , guna be minus something tonight here in the pits

 

Labour is fast becoming just a protest party, they're rapidly losing their traditional voter base, and there ain't enough champagne socialists and trotskyists to make them relevant anymore ;-) ..........

 

Cant say I'm disappointed :D ........

 

 

North London ... Still be relevant in that ruddy London ... Jeremys given em a bit of bite hasn't he , a bit of a reminder of those good old working class days .... Lets be honest though the only chance a Labour party has of government is if they become Blairites again ... As a Tory I love it

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Guest pelmetman
antony1969 - 2016-11-28 5:48 PM

 

pelmetman - 2016-11-28 5:33 PM

 

antony1969 - 2016-11-28 5:19 PM

 

The working class ... You see thats your problem and your boyfriend Jeremys problem ... It doesn't really exist anymore ... The working class have now become the middle class really ... But you and him please keep on fighting for it just to remind us what once existed ... UKIP have just voted in a real man of the people and they are according to him targeting those Labour voters ... You soon could end up as the countries 4th party , maybe even the 5th if the rise of the far right BNP is to believed ... Enjoy your holiday Tony , guna be minus something tonight here in the pits

 

Labour is fast becoming just a protest party, they're rapidly losing their traditional voter base, and there ain't enough champagne socialists and trotskyists to make them relevant anymore ;-) ..........

 

Cant say I'm disappointed :D ........

 

 

North London ... Still be relevant in that ruddy London ... Jeremys given em a bit of bite hasn't he , a bit of a reminder of those good old working class days .... Lets be honest though the only chance a Labour party has of government is if they become Blairites again ... As a Tory I love it

 

London is no more representative of the UK as Timbuktu *-) ........and I speak as someone who was born and bred in the East End.......anyone who thinks Jeremy can win a election is having a Giraffe :D .......

 

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I do not see it as anything to with class, woprking or therwise. It is an issue that has been created between our so called lead ers and the ordivnary people, who have basicvally had enough of being abused and told what to do.

 

It all started with the creation of the so called political careerist, namely a degree in bulls..t at Oxford followed by a term of bag carrying and then a safe seat somewhere. This gave them the right to be absolutely correct on every matter under the sun, and the rest of the populace was only there to support them. This does notjust apply to Westminster, up her in Holyrood we have a poltical class that missed Oxford but has to just about rate as the thickest, dumbest and totally stupid bunch you could ever assemble. And that includes the others as well as the SNP. Simuilarly Europe has been dominated by a 'after you Claude' scenario where they all took turns at sucking in the gravy pit and where failure was the key to promotion. It appears that in parts of the modern world [people have had enough. This does noit mean to say they know the answer, they just know what they have is not what they want. So, the person who has the answer will be the next hero.

 

Actually what they all want is quite simple. Decency, morality, honesty and reward and protection for hard work by indigenous people., but then again that does not mesh with being PC correct these days.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Power corrupts all but a very few dedicated and worthy individuals though. There is a genuine uprising of "The people" all over the western world at the moment with all sorts of nasties coming out of the woodwork that are selling themselves as "The peoples champions" etc. The only difference is that some of them have some rather scary political views. When they gain power how long before the worm turns and you are left with more of the same? Sadly its human nature. Take trump for example. Sold the "Working man" a whole diatribe of guff about making America Great again and it all being about the little people. With him though its more transparent. Its all about him. Finding a polly that truly puts his country and its people first and is incorruptible by power is like looking for a needle in a haystack.
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Guest pelmetman
Barryd999 - 2016-11-29 9:54 AM

 

Power corrupts all but a very few dedicated and worthy individuals though. There is a genuine uprising of "The people" all over the western world at the moment with all sorts of nasties coming out of the woodwork that are selling themselves as "The peoples champions" etc. The only difference is that some of them have some rather scary political views. When they gain power how long before the worm turns and you are left with more of the same? Sadly its human nature. Take trump for example. Sold the "Working man" a whole diatribe of guff about making America Great again and it all being about the little people. With him though its more transparent. Its all about him. Finding a polly that truly puts his country and its people first and is incorruptible by power is like looking for a needle in a haystack.

 

I agree about the uprising part, and it looks like globalisation has hit the buffers :D ..........

 

Maybe "The People" don't want their towns turned into immigrant mono cultures.......and maybe we don't want to be expected to adopt their foreign culture to make "them" feel at home either *-) .......

 

Call me a fascist but in my view they should be adopting our culture......ie assimilating with us......NOT the other way round :-| ..........

 

 

 

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Barryd999 - 2016-11-29 9:54 AM

 

Power corrupts all but a very few dedicated and worthy individuals though. There is a genuine uprising of "The people" all over the western world at the moment with all sorts of nasties coming out of the woodwork that are selling themselves as "The peoples champions" etc. The only difference is that some of them have some rather scary political views. When they gain power how long before the worm turns and you are left with more of the same? Sadly its human nature. Take trump for example. Sold the "Working man" a whole diatribe of guff about making America Great again and it all being about the little people. With him though its more transparent. Its all about him. Finding a polly that truly puts his country and its people first and is incorruptible by power is like looking for a needle in a haystack.

 

Give him a chance Barry ... He's not even Prez yet ... In a couple of years you might be laughing saying told ya so but then again old Ronnie proved em wrong ... Anyway if the recounts prove successful you may get ya girlfriend Hilary in

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Archived

This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.

×
×
  • Create New...