Barryd999 Posted January 24, 2017 Share Posted January 24, 2017 Well done Gina! Lets just give it up as a bad idea. :D Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StuartO Posted January 24, 2017 Share Posted January 24, 2017 Inevitably those who feel strongly that they are right and the Referendum was wrong will now continue arguing their cause - and they have the right to do so. But our politicians have already said they will not block the notification of Article 50, so aren't they waisting their time and everyone else's? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John52 Posted January 24, 2017 Share Posted January 24, 2017 I don't think its wasting time because it would have set a dangerous precedent if Theresa May could do this without a Parliamentary Vote. She already has enourmous powers gifted to her by Her Unelected Majesty the Queen under the Royal Prerogative. But it does highlight yet another difficulty of negotiating a decent Brexit deal for Britain. Something which was just ignored or glossed over in the Referendum. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Barryd999 Posted January 24, 2017 Author Share Posted January 24, 2017 Exactly. The demands are already coming in thick and fast from Labour, SNP and the Lib Dems. The SNP have 50!! :D Lib Dems to demand a second referendum on any deal before its put forward to the EU. I doubt Article 50 being invoked will not happen but the government are not going to get away with a hard brexit now if the terms are crap. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Violet1956 Posted January 24, 2017 Share Posted January 24, 2017 They were split 8:3 so I guess it's not appropriate to criticise the government for appealing the decision of the court below. A definitive judgement from the Supreme Court on such an important constitutional matter was perhaps the way to go anyway so there could be no doubt about the authority of the ultimate decision when it comes to providing a definitive legal authority on the use of the prerogative powers. Any government will now benefit from being cognisant of the possible consequences of failing to draft legislation carefully enough to bind parliament to take a specific course if that was that was their intention from the outset. Veronica Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
antony1969 Posted January 24, 2017 Share Posted January 24, 2017 You want to get excited by a delay Barry try using public transport ... A delay of the inevitable is all it is ... I welcome it , we might get to lose even more Labour MPs if they vote against those who they serve Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest pelmetman Posted January 24, 2017 Share Posted January 24, 2017 Barryd999 - 2017-01-24 10:33 AM Exactly. The demands are already coming in thick and fast from Labour, SNP and the Lib Dems. The SNP have 50!! :D Lib Dems to demand a second referendum on any deal before its put forward to the EU. I doubt Article 50 being invoked will not happen but the government are not going to get away with a hard brexit now if the terms are crap. I guess a election will come before any referendum >:-) .........I also suspect the supreme court will also be neutered at a later date, as it appears to think its views are superior to the people *-) ........ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest pelmetman Posted January 24, 2017 Share Posted January 24, 2017 Violet1956 - 2017-01-24 10:39 AM They were split 8:3 so I guess it's not appropriate to criticise the government for appealing the decision of the court below. Veronica Given the gene pool from which they're selected, I'm surprised even 3 voted against it *-) ........ Unless it was just for appearances ;-) ....... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Barryd999 Posted January 24, 2017 Author Share Posted January 24, 2017 pelmetman - 2017-01-24 11:27 AM Barryd999 - 2017-01-24 10:33 AM Exactly. The demands are already coming in thick and fast from Labour, SNP and the Lib Dems. The SNP have 50!! :D Lib Dems to demand a second referendum on any deal before its put forward to the EU. I doubt Article 50 being invoked will not happen but the government are not going to get away with a hard brexit now if the terms are crap. I guess a election will come before any referendum >:-) .........I also suspect the supreme court will also be neutered at a later date, as it appears to think its view are superior to the people *-) ........ OMG! Did you really just say that? Ive imagined that surely. 8-) Thats the new way then? If someone or some organisation gets in the way of the "New Order" they will be "neutered". Thank god then for people like Gina Miller who are prepared to stand up and put themselves and their families at risk to defend democracy. The result may not overturn Brexit (or perhaps it ultimately will I dont know) but it will almost certainly ensure we dont give the government an open ticket to take us down a hard brexit route and lose the single market access. 90% of the public who voted leave have already said they are not prepared to accept a brexit that is going to cost them and that is exactly what a hard brexit will do. £100-200bn pounds is the latest prediction since TM's announcement so I doubt there will be much fuss made when it becomes clear that is the likely outcome and we opt for a soft brexit or maybe no brexit at all!! :D Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Barryd999 Posted January 24, 2017 Author Share Posted January 24, 2017 antony1969 - 2017-01-24 11:01 AM You want to get excited by a delay Barry try using public transport ... A delay of the inevitable is all it is ... I welcome it , we might get to lose even more Labour MPs if they vote against those who they serve Will they be voting against those they serve though? The referendum was a long time ago. Reality is starting to kick in. Another year or two down the road those very people who they serve may well be demanding MP's vote against Brexit. Yes they want rid of the nasty foreigners and daft bendy banana laws but not if its going to cost them anything. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Violet1956 Posted January 24, 2017 Share Posted January 24, 2017 pelmetman - 2017-01-24 11:33 AM Violet1956 - 2017-01-24 10:39 AM They were split 8:3 so I guess it's not appropriate to criticise the government for appealing the decision of the court below. Veronica Given the gene pool from which they're selected, I'm surprised even 3 voted against it *-) ........ Unless it was just for appearances ;-) ....... Mmm "the gene pool" Dave now that's an interesting observation regarding their inherited characteristics. Tell us what makes you a better judge in relation to the issues before them which is down to the gene pool from which you inherited yours. I know mine doesn't compare favourably on the intellectual front, though I consider myself a bit better looking than Lady Hale. ;-) Veronica Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Violet1956 Posted January 24, 2017 Share Posted January 24, 2017 Barryd999 - 2017-01-24 10:33 AM Exactly. The demands are already coming in thick and fast from Labour, SNP and the Lib Dems. The SNP have 50!! :D Lib Dems to demand a second referendum on any deal before its put forward to the EU. I doubt Article 50 being invoked will not happen but the government are not going to get away with a hard brexit now if the terms are crap. I don't get why some people are in favour of a second referendum once the terms of the deal have been finalised. Once we've invoked Article 50 we will have a deal or no deal on the table at the time any referendum takes place won't we? How will we decide by referendum what is best. It didn't work terribly well before did it? We can't rely on the possibility that other members of the EU will allow us to rescind the Article 50 notice that's way too risky IMO. Also if we trigger article 50 on the basis that there will be a referendum on it what hope is there of getting the best deal we can? It's not a great bargaining position to have is it? You may have the answers Barry but I'm struggling to understand Fallon's position. Veronica Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest pelmetman Posted January 24, 2017 Share Posted January 24, 2017 Barryd999 - 2017-01-24 11:40 AM pelmetman - 2017-01-24 11:27 AM Barryd999 - 2017-01-24 10:33 AM Exactly. The demands are already coming in thick and fast from Labour, SNP and the Lib Dems. The SNP have 50!! :D Lib Dems to demand a second referendum on any deal before its put forward to the EU. I doubt Article 50 being invoked will not happen but the government are not going to get away with a hard brexit now if the terms are crap. I guess a election will come before any referendum >:-) .........I also suspect the supreme court will also be neutered at a later date, as it appears to think its view are superior to the people *-) ........ OMG! Did you really just say that? Ive imagined that surely. 8-) Thats the new way then? If someone or some organisation gets in the way of the "New Order" they will be "neutered". Thank god then for people like Gina Miller who are prepared to stand up and put themselves and their families at risk to defend democracy. Supreme court = Democracy?.......You're aving a Giraffe Barry (lol) ......... We can get rid of the Government......we cant get rid of the supreme court judges *-) .......... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest pelmetman Posted January 24, 2017 Share Posted January 24, 2017 Violet1956 - 2017-01-24 11:50 AM pelmetman - 2017-01-24 11:33 AM Violet1956 - 2017-01-24 10:39 AM They were split 8:3 so I guess it's not appropriate to criticise the government for appealing the decision of the court below. Veronica Given the gene pool from which they're selected, I'm surprised even 3 voted against it *-) ........ Unless it was just for appearances ;-) ....... Mmm "the gene pool" Dave now that's an interesting observation regarding their inherited characteristics. Tell us what makes you a better judge in relation to the issues before them which is down to the gene pool from which you inherited yours. I know mine doesn't compare favourably on the intellectual front, though I consider myself a bit better looking than Lady Hale. ;-) Veronica Intellect as perceived by like minded folk eh? ;-) ......... I've always thought the word intellect is interchangeable with snobbishism :-| ........ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
antony1969 Posted January 24, 2017 Share Posted January 24, 2017 Barryd999 - 2017-01-24 11:45 AM antony1969 - 2017-01-24 11:01 AM You want to get excited by a delay Barry try using public transport ... A delay of the inevitable is all it is ... I welcome it , we might get to lose even more Labour MPs if they vote against those who they serve Will they be voting against those they serve though? The referendum was a long time ago. Reality is starting to kick in. Another year or two down the road those very people who they serve may well be demanding MP's vote against Brexit. Yes they want rid of the nasty foreigners and daft bendy banana laws but not if its going to cost them anything. The Supreme Court decision was regarding triggering Article 50 , that you can't deny will happen ... It may well be we have an election before the two year deadline is up ... I would imagine those Labour MPs who may go against Corbyn and against the people they serve may well lose out and open the door to more Tories and quite possibly UKIP ... I think your mad in thinking folks view will change in two years time ... What this will do with each delay will only make stronger leave voters thoughts regarding leaving Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Archiesgrandad Posted January 24, 2017 Share Posted January 24, 2017 Just a small point really, but we do not have to negotiate our leaving the EU. We trigger article 50, wait 2 years, cancel the standing orders relating to it, and then wave them goodbye. The only things we need to negotiate are the things we want for the future, and there will be things that the EU might want to negotiate for the future as well. AGD Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Barryd999 Posted January 24, 2017 Author Share Posted January 24, 2017 Archiesgrandad - 2017-01-24 12:44 PM Just a small point really, but we do not have to negotiate our leaving the EU. We trigger article 50, wait 2 years, cancel the standing orders relating to it, and then wave them goodbye. The only things we need to negotiate are the things we want for the future, and there will be things that the EU might want to negotiate for the future as well. AGD Yes but leaving with no deal or any deal that doesnt include single market access will cost us dearly. £100-200bn. It would be a bit like spending ages managing all your utility bills and insurances getting the best tariffs then just not bothering to check them all when renewal is due and just accepting whatever is offered. With so many bills to consider the difference would be massive. Brexiteers have already said they are not prepared to pay for Brexit so just cancelling the standing order and walking away as you put it is not an option. I doubt that will be allowed to happen now the government no longer have a free pass on Brexit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Barryd999 Posted January 24, 2017 Author Share Posted January 24, 2017 antony1969 - 2017-01-24 12:24 PM Barryd999 - 2017-01-24 11:45 AM antony1969 - 2017-01-24 11:01 AM You want to get excited by a delay Barry try using public transport ... A delay of the inevitable is all it is ... I welcome it , we might get to lose even more Labour MPs if they vote against those who they serve Will they be voting against those they serve though? The referendum was a long time ago. Reality is starting to kick in. Another year or two down the road those very people who they serve may well be demanding MP's vote against Brexit. Yes they want rid of the nasty foreigners and daft bendy banana laws but not if its going to cost them anything. The Supreme Court decision was regarding triggering Article 50 , that you can't deny will happen ... It may well be we have an election before the two year deadline is up ... I would imagine those Labour MPs who may go against Corbyn and against the people they serve may well lose out and open the door to more Tories and quite possibly UKIP ... I think your mad in thinking folks view will change in two years time ... What this will do with each delay will only make stronger leave voters thoughts regarding leaving Peoples views will change Antony. Its alright for wealthy right wing retired motorhomers who can just shout and stomp their feet in support of Brexit at any cost but the massive majority of leave voters are poor. It wont take much for them to give it up. A week is a long time in politics as well never mind two years. I already linked a while back a couple of times to a north east Tyne Tees survey which showed a dramatic swing to remain. Its only a matter of time and maybe a bit of political manipulation. :D Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest pelmetman Posted January 24, 2017 Share Posted January 24, 2017 Barryd999 - 2017-01-24 2:02 PM Archiesgrandad - 2017-01-24 12:44 PM Just a small point really, but we do not have to negotiate our leaving the EU. We trigger article 50, wait 2 years, cancel the standing orders relating to it, and then wave them goodbye. The only things we need to negotiate are the things we want for the future, and there will be things that the EU might want to negotiate for the future as well. AGD Yes but leaving with no deal or any deal that doesnt include single market access will cost us dearly. £100-200bn. Another scaremonger figure plucked straight out of Remoaner Central *-) ..........How will it cost £100-£200bn eh Barry?..........Coz of tariffs? ;-) ........... Well if so we should be about a 100 billion better off >:-)...... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest pelmetman Posted January 24, 2017 Share Posted January 24, 2017 Barryd999 - 2017-01-24 2:07 PM antony1969 - 2017-01-24 12:24 PM Barryd999 - 2017-01-24 11:45 AM antony1969 - 2017-01-24 11:01 AM You want to get excited by a delay Barry try using public transport ... A delay of the inevitable is all it is ... I welcome it , we might get to lose even more Labour MPs if they vote against those who they serve Will they be voting against those they serve though? The referendum was a long time ago. Reality is starting to kick in. Another year or two down the road those very people who they serve may well be demanding MP's vote against Brexit. Yes they want rid of the nasty foreigners and daft bendy banana laws but not if its going to cost them anything. The Supreme Court decision was regarding triggering Article 50 , that you can't deny will happen ... It may well be we have an election before the two year deadline is up ... I would imagine those Labour MPs who may go against Corbyn and against the people they serve may well lose out and open the door to more Tories and quite possibly UKIP ... I think your mad in thinking folks view will change in two years time ... What this will do with each delay will only make stronger leave voters thoughts regarding leaving Peoples views will change Antony. Its alright for wealthy right wing retired motorhomers who can just shout and stomp their feet in support of Brexit at any cost but the massive majority of leave voters are poor. It wont take much for them to give it up. A week is a long time in politics as well never mind two years. I already linked a while back a couple of times to a north east Tyne Tees survey which showed a dramatic swing to remain. Its only a matter of time and maybe a bit of political manipulation. :D You really are in a "Barry Bubble" (lol) .........When was that survey?........how much has the sky fallen in since?.......Has the motor industry not been given a reassurances re tariffs?........Have you really met anyone who has voted leave and changed their mind? ;-) ..........and where you p*ssed at the time? :D ..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
antony1969 Posted January 24, 2017 Share Posted January 24, 2017 Barryd999 - 2017-01-24 2:07 PM antony1969 - 2017-01-24 12:24 PM Barryd999 - 2017-01-24 11:45 AM antony1969 - 2017-01-24 11:01 AM You want to get excited by a delay Barry try using public transport ... A delay of the inevitable is all it is ... I welcome it , we might get to lose even more Labour MPs if they vote against those who they serve Will they be voting against those they serve though? The referendum was a long time ago. Reality is starting to kick in. Another year or two down the road those very people who they serve may well be demanding MP's vote against Brexit. Yes they want rid of the nasty foreigners and daft bendy banana laws but not if its going to cost them anything. The Supreme Court decision was regarding triggering Article 50 , that you can't deny will happen ... It may well be we have an election before the two year deadline is up ... I would imagine those Labour MPs who may go against Corbyn and against the people they serve may well lose out and open the door to more Tories and quite possibly UKIP ... I think your mad in thinking folks view will change in two years time ... What this will do with each delay will only make stronger leave voters thoughts regarding leaving Peoples views will change Antony. Its alright for wealthy right wing retired motorhomers who can just shout and stomp their feet in support of Brexit at any cost but the massive majority of leave voters are poor. It wont take much for them to give it up. A week is a long time in politics as well never mind two years. I already linked a while back a couple of times to a north east Tyne Tees survey which showed a dramatic swing to remain. Its only a matter of time and maybe a bit of political manipulation. :D For every survey you show I suppose I could show one that differs ... For every radio phone in that callers support Brexit another won't and so on and so on ... The one thing I always put faith in is what folk say to your face and to me whenever the discussion gets onto Brexit I'm hearing the same thing all the time ... Let's crack on and no regrets ... I'm going to come up to your house and sample the beer , the cheese and the guitar and hopefully your going to point me in the direction of some of these disgruntled leave voters because in all honesty they aren't around here Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Violet1956 Posted January 24, 2017 Share Posted January 24, 2017 "I've always thought the word intellect is interchangeable with snobbishism :-| ........" I've not found a thesaurus that agrees with you on that one Dave even - the godawful one in Word doesn't come up with it. There are intellectual snobs I grant you but that doesn't mean that all people possessed of a great intellect fall into such a category. Veronica Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bulletguy Posted January 24, 2017 Share Posted January 24, 2017 Excellent news to see common sense prevail from the Supreme Court. This was exactly what Brexiters wanted....British justice enforcing British laws for Britain. After all, the referendum was advisory and not legally binding. I'd like to believe all Brexit voters knew that but somehow i'm not sure they did. They certainly wanted British courts overseeing our own laws......well they got that today. I think any UK government would do well to bring Gina Miller on board as legal adviser. Since the referendum there have been 13 public polls. The results are astonishing, though hardly surprising, showing a huge increase of Bregretters. http://www.theneweuropean.co.uk/top-stories/we_want_to_remain_say_11_out_of_13_polls_since_the_brexit_vote_1_4768596 the percentages here; http://no2brexit.com/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bulletguy Posted January 24, 2017 Share Posted January 24, 2017 Violet1956 - 2017-01-24 2:48 PM "I've always thought the word intellect is interchangeable with snobbishism :-| ........" I've not found a thesaurus that agrees with you on that one Dave even - the godawful one in Word doesn't come up with it. There are intellectual snobs I grant you but that doesn't mean that all people possessed of a great intellect fall into such a category. Veronica I've no idea how/where Pelmet arrives at that conclusion at all. Oxford English dictionary definition; "The faculty of reasoning and understanding objectively, especially with regard to abstract matters." https://en.oxforddictionaries.com/definition/intellect Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest pelmetman Posted January 24, 2017 Share Posted January 24, 2017 Bulletguy - 2017-01-24 3:22 PM Excellent news to see common sense prevail from the Supreme Court. This was exactly what Brexiters wanted....British justice enforcing British laws for Britain. After all, the referendum was advisory and not legally binding. I'd like to believe all Brexit voters knew that but somehow i'm not sure they did. They certainly wanted British courts overseeing our own laws......well they got that today. I think any UK government would do well to bring Gina Miller on board as legal adviser. Since the referendum there have been 13 public polls. The results are astonishing, though hardly surprising, showing a huge increase of Bregretters. http://www.theneweuropean.co.uk/top-stories/we_want_to_remain_say_11_out_of_13_polls_since_the_brexit_vote_1_4768596 the percentages here; http://no2brexit.com/ BREAKING NEWS 8-) ........... A poll carried out by the "NEW EUROPEAN" show people regret voting for BREXIT (lol) (lol) (lol) ....... Did they ask my mate Barry Bubble? :D .......... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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