Don Madge Posted December 30, 2006 Share Posted December 30, 2006 This article http://tinyurl.com/yzvgq8 in yesterdays www.telegraph.co.uk makes very interesting reading if you plan to travel abroad in 2007. Happy New Year. Don Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian Kirby Posted December 30, 2006 Share Posted December 30, 2006 The lesson being to make sure you understand and respect the laws for each country you visit, and don't whinge if you get caught notwithstanding.One thing the "Gruff" article didn't mention, is that roadside speed traps in Europe are frequently concealed. They are out to book the speeders, not to stop them speeding. If oncoming traffic flashes you, check your speed. Remember there are often no speed limit signs on entry to towns/villages, because there is a blanket limit in force once you pass the town name sign, even if it has been flattened so you can no longer see it! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest JudgeMental Posted December 30, 2006 Share Posted December 30, 2006 Years ago, approx 1989 we were accused of speeding in Portugal and marched of to a cash machine in nearest town as we did not have enough cash. can't remember how much it was but felt it was a scam at the time... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Basil Posted December 30, 2006 Share Posted December 30, 2006 Was anyone on here aware that it is illegal to use cruise control in Belgium, I certainly wasn't and have done many times, I don't recall reading that anywhere? Bas Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keith T Posted December 30, 2006 Share Posted December 30, 2006 this must be potentially an abolute can of worms where almost evry country will have it's own favourite regulations - what is the situation now with Sat Nav systems which include speed camera locations for example. WSe've heard tales of such items being conficated in France and a heavy fine imposed on the spot. Is this trus and is it still the case? Half the problem is trying to argue the case in a foreign language, unless you are fluent of course in it? if its speeding and they send you a 'ticket', then perhaps they should also incorproate a translation into the 'international language'.....!! Or will the AA/RAC /Caravan Club or Insurance COmpanies provide that Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clive Posted December 30, 2006 Share Posted December 30, 2006 Basil, I challenge you to support the comment about Cruise control being illegal in Belgium with referance to the particular legislation. I think someone is winding you up ???? Prove me wrong! Good luck C. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian Kirby Posted December 30, 2006 Share Posted December 30, 2006 Clive - 2006-12-30 4:44 PM Basil, I challenge you to support the comment about Cruise control being illegal in Belgium with referance to the particular legislation. I think someone is winding you up ???? Prove me wrong! Good luck C. CliveIt ain't Basil. Follow Don's link to the "Gruff" article. Its them wot said it, so it must be true :-) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian Kirby Posted December 30, 2006 Share Posted December 30, 2006 Keith T - 2006-12-30 4:36 PM this must be potentially an abolute can of worms where almost evry country will have it's own favourite regulations - what is the situation now with Sat Nav systems which include speed camera locations for example. WSe've heard tales of such items being conficated in France and a heavy fine imposed on the spot. Is this trus and is it still the case? Half the problem is trying to argue the case in a foreign language, unless you are fluent of course in it? if its speeding and they send you a 'ticket', then perhaps they should also incorproate a translation into the 'international language'.....!! Or will the AA/RAC /Caravan Club or Insurance COmpanies provide that KeithAll the countries always have had their own traffic regulations. There is very little actual European harmonisation on speed limits, vehicle lighting laws, signalling requirements (and practice), procedure after accidents, procedures at road junctions, etc. etc. There is great harmonisation in vehicle construction standards, but not in how they are/can be used. There is quite good harmonisation over road signs, although all states have their "specials" here as well.Re sat nav and speed camera locations, what is illegal in France is radar detectors. Systems that show fixed cameras are not illegal, but as you say, it is a matter of convincing the police what you have on board. The best advice is stick to the limits, keep your eyes skinned, and your wits about you. The biggest risk is not a Gatso, it is the hidden cop with the radar gun. After years of blasting through everywhere at whatever speed seemed inappropriate, the French have suddenly become very punctilious observers of speed limits, starting from about 3 or so years ago. There is only one reason for that! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
soarer Posted December 30, 2006 Share Posted December 30, 2006 when on my travels in europe especially france you get plenty of warning from other road users,anyhoo whats the hurry your on holiday for gawds sake (lol) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Frank Wilkinson Posted December 30, 2006 Share Posted December 30, 2006 Keith T - 2006-12-30 4:36 PM this must be potentially an abolute can of worms where almost evry country will have it's own favourite regulations - what is the situation now with Sat Nav systems which include speed camera locations for example. WSe've heard tales of such items being conficated in France and a heavy fine imposed on the spot. Is this trus and is it still the case? Half the problem is trying to argue the case in a foreign language, unless you are fluent of course in it? if its speeding and they send you a 'ticket', then perhaps they should also incorproate a translation into the 'international language'.....!! Or will the AA/RAC /Caravan Club or Insurance COmpanies provide that This has been aired previously but I'll repeat it before it becomes another urban myth. Speed camera detectors that work on GPS (this includes satnav systems) are not illegal in France and will not be confiscated.What is illegal in France is the kind of radar-detector models which measure the beam from fixed and mobile speed cameras. Fixed speed-cameras are in the public domain and it isn't illegal to have a device that simply tells you where they are. In fact I've just bought a new atlas and it lists all fixed speed-camera locations and the popular sites used by mobile ones simply because such sites are, as I said, in the public domain.My speed camera detector in my car is a mixture of both. It has a GPS database, which knows where all fixed cameras are and it also has a sensor fixed on the windscreen, which picks up radar emissions for fixed and mobile units. I would never even take this one to France as the police would confiscate it immediately, even if it wasn't in its cradle and in my glove box for instance.However, when I take my motorhome to France in a few months I shall be using my TomTom satnav with its speed camera database, safe in the knowledge that it's perfectly legal.What is scary however, is the plethora of different minor rules, such as no cruise-control in Belgium and having to drive with permanently-lit dipped beam headlamps in some countries but not others. We'll all have much more research to do before embarking on our European trips in 2007!Edited to say: This was posted whilst Brian Kirby was saying more or less the same thing and of course I only realised that I was duplicating much of what he said when I pressed the 'Submit' button! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Don Madge Posted December 30, 2006 Author Share Posted December 30, 2006 Clive - 2006-12-30 4:44 PM Basil, I challenge you to support the comment about Cruise control being illegal in Belgium with referance to the particular legislation. I think someone is winding you up ???? Prove me wrong! Good luck C. Clive, No Wind up Cruise Controls are banned on certain roads in Belgium. Basil found the info and you can read the full story on MHT at http://www.motorhometoday.co.uk/index.php?showtopic=572 Don Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Basil Posted December 30, 2006 Share Posted December 30, 2006 Hi Clive, It's no wind up, but not quite as bad as suggested in the origional article followed from Don's post. Clive I like a challenge, please follow the link Don has given you in his posting just prior to this one and see what I have picked up so far. This is what concerns me about overseas regulations, who informs us of changes this has only come to light to me from Don's post! Happy New Year All Bas Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Don Madge Posted December 30, 2006 Author Share Posted December 30, 2006 Bas, What bothers me is the customs and practice they have in some countries. Take for example Greece which has the highest fatal accident rate per head of population in Europe. You will find the Greeks driving on the hard shoulder of a multi lane motorway. This dates back to the time when most main roads in Greece were a single strip of tarmac. Either side of the road was a a donkey track, if somebody was approaching or overtaking you just moved onto the donkey track. It's bred into them I've even seen the police do it. I've been driving in Greece since 1969 and many a time I've been on a two lane dual carriage way and had a blast from the vehicle behind because I was not using the hard shoulder. The Greeks invented road rage with their chariots. Don Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bill Posted December 31, 2006 Share Posted December 31, 2006 Don Madge - 2006-12-30 10:10 PM Take for example Greece A few years ago I was working in Athens, doing a weekly commute. One Monday morning there was a wildcat strike on the busses, so of course the chaos on the road from the airport to the office was even worse than usual. Nothing deterred, my taxi driver was determined to get me to work on time, and took all sorts of back streets. As we sped up one of these all the cars coming the other way hooted, waved and flashed their lights. My driver turned right round in his seat, and with a big smile informed me: “Is a one-way: taxi doesn’t mind”! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian Kirby Posted December 31, 2006 Share Posted December 31, 2006 Don Madge - 2006-12-30 10:10 PM Bas, What bothers me is the customs and practice they have in some countries. Take for example Greece which has the highest fatal accident rate per head of population in Europe. You will find the Greeks driving on the hard shoulder of a multi lane motorway. This dates back to the time when most main roads in Greece were a single strip of tarmac. Either side of the road was a a donkey track, if somebody was approaching or overtaking you just moved onto the donkey track. It's bred into them I've even seen the police do it. I've been driving in Greece since 1969 and many a time I've been on a two lane dual carriage way and had a blast from the vehicle behind because I was not using the hard shoulder. The Greeks invented road rage with their chariots. Don A few years back we were stuck in a jam on the Northbound A9 just outside Perpignan, when we were passed at some speed by a car driving down the hard shoulder. No, not the police; just an Italian presumed in in a hurry to get home. Perhaps he had previously been in Greece? However, unless all Italians have visited Greece, I am a bit inclined to the opinion that the practice of using the hard shoulder to overtake when the rest of the road is full is not entirely limited to the Greeks. It's these little differences between us that makes travel so much fun, don't you think? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bill Posted December 31, 2006 Share Posted December 31, 2006 Brian Kirby - 2006-12-30 4:59 PM All the countries always have had their own traffic regulations. There is very little actual European harmonisation Isn’t it amazing how the EU is punctilious about harmonizing things that don’t matter a damn – like the shape of tomatoes and cucumbers – but when it comes to areas where harmonization might actually be useful, like traffic laws, they are utterly clueless. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Don Madge Posted December 31, 2006 Author Share Posted December 31, 2006 Brian Kirby - 2006-12-31 12:23 PMDon Madge - 2006-12-30 10:10 PM Bas, What bothers me is the customs and practice they have in some countries. Take for example Greece which has the highest fatal accident rate per head of population in Europe. You will find the Greeks driving on the hard shoulder of a multi lane motorway. This dates back to the time when most main roads in Greece were a single strip of tarmac. Either side of the road was a a donkey track, if somebody was approaching or overtaking you just moved onto the donkey track. It's bred into them I've even seen the police do it. I've been driving in Greece since 1969 and many a time I've been on a two lane dual carriage way and had a blast from the vehicle behind because I was not using the hard shoulder. The Greeks invented road rage with their chariots. Don A few years back we were stuck in a jam on the Northbound A9 just outside Perpignan, when we were passed at some speed by a car driving down the hard shoulder. No, not the police; just an Italian presumed in in a hurry to get home. Perhaps he had previously been in Greece? However, unless all Italians have visited Greece, I am a bit inclined to the opinion that the practice of using the hard shoulder to overtake when the rest of the road is full is not entirely limited to the Greeks. It's these little differences between us that makes travel so much fun, don't you think?Brian,The Greeks treat the hard shoulder as a third lane on a two lane highway, they use it all the time not just when there's congestion. I've often seen a lone car driving along the hard shoulder.The Greeks share another strange habit with the Spanish. On some cars the drivers hold the roof on with their right hand. I use to do this in Cyprus until a wasp went up my shirt sleeve 8-) I now let the roof take care of itself. (lol) (lol) Don Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Basil Posted December 31, 2006 Share Posted December 31, 2006 Don Madge - 2006-12-31 12:39 PM The Greeks share another strange habit with the Spanish. On some cars the drivers hold the roof on with their right hand. I use to do this in Cyprus until a wasp went up my shirt sleeve 8-) I now let the roof take care of itself. (lol) (lol) Don Hi Don, The other thing is until I went to Italy I didn't realise that Italian drivers, certainly the males anyway, had three arms one steering one on the horn and the other waving out the window!!! :-D :-D :-D Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tonyishuk Posted December 31, 2006 Share Posted December 31, 2006 Time for a sticky " Do not get caught doing this " ( I suppose I had better add "whist driving" ) Second thoughts 'nuff said ! :$ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rayjsj Posted December 31, 2006 Share Posted December 31, 2006 *-) The thing that concerns me with this 'small world' for chasing up fines is that any 'tin pot hitler' council official who dislikes motorhomes parking in his town/village/city can impose obscure 'small print' parking conditions ie no height over 2.85 metres, ehh !( by the time my imperial brain has worked it out, i'm IN ) No individual axles over 1500 kilos EHH ! no overhanging bays (even if you pay for 1/2 dozen !) how do they get away with that one ! anyway you get the picture... the fines usually now £60 no mean sum, I paid less than that for REALLY breaking the law (in my younger days....) anyway ignorethem at your peril... they can and DO resort to bailiffs if you choose to ignore them (my usual treatment of unfair vindictive discriminatory bullies). Rayjsj Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bill Posted January 2, 2007 Share Posted January 2, 2007 Rayjsj - 2006-12-31 5:53 PM unfair vindictive discriminatory bullies. Taxis in the New (i.e. post-apartheid) South Africa have a unique way of dealing with same. I should explain that a taxi there is not like an English taxi, but more like a Turkish dolmus: they are actually mini-buses and will stop and pick up others headed in the same direction. Each one carries a Tokarev [Russian machine pistol]. If a 'tin pot Hitler' stops them - they kill him. We have much to learn from these "primitives". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chas Posted January 2, 2007 Share Posted January 2, 2007 From my experience of driving in France and Spain I find their driving to be of a much higher standard than this country. I have found they will give way , and show much more consideration, now this may well be down to seeing that I am a foriegn driver, or that my motorhome is larger than their vehicle, but I know one thing, as soon as I return to the U.K I am having to look out for idiot driving and road rage. This of course could also be because of our congested badly designed roads and a far higher traffic flows, but for me, it is a pleasure to drive abroad. chas Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Usinmyknaus Posted January 2, 2007 Share Posted January 2, 2007 Struggling to hold on to my two toddlers who desperately wanted to run to the bright lights of the seafront at Bognor some years ago, I was caught out by a grossly unfair parking sign in a side road. In large print at the top it said I could park there, but hidden away in a lot of small print there was a caveat that I could not park there on a handful of dates, including that day! Within a few minutes my vehicle received a £12 parking ticket which Arun District Council refused to cancel and I told them I would boycott their district's retail businesses. I immediately switched all my retail shopping from Midhurst and Chichester to Farnham, Guildford and Woking. I have kept a tally since and it is just over £92,000. When it hits the £100K milestone next year I will write to the Chief Executives of Arun District Council, West Sussex County Council, the political Leaders of both Councils, the relevant Chambers of Trade and their MPs and point out the negative impact on local businesses. If I make a genuine mistake and it's a fair cop, I put my hands up and acknowledge it but I detest the sort of tactics which some councils seem to think they can get away with. Every month I read the letters in MMM and any council reported as anti-motorhome is crossed of my visits list. Those recommended by readers move up the list of destinations to receive my tourist pounds. Bob Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rayjsj Posted January 2, 2007 Share Posted January 2, 2007 Bill - 2007-01-02 10:31 AM Rayjsj - 2006-12-31 5:53 PM unfair vindictive discriminatory bullies. Taxis in the New (i.e. post-apartheid) South Africa have a unique way of dealing with same. I should explain that a taxi there is not like an English taxi, but more like a Turkish dolmus: they are actually mini-buses and will stop and pick up others headed in the same direction. Each one carries a Tokarev [Russian machine pistol]. If a 'tin pot Hitler' stops them - they kill him. We have much to learn from these "primitives". Great Idea ! Do Riversway leisure sell Tokarev's ?? I might need one for my Tour of British Historical Cities in my Motorhome. So that I can park,you understand. (You can't park THAT anywhere in THIS city Chum !!! BANG ! ) rayjsj :D Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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