Caravan Club Website Change

[Guest Frank Wilkinson]

I don't think that I'm being harsh. Time after time this site is littered with snide and critical comments about the CC. The post that provoked mine is typical of the kind of thing that I refer to, in which someone says that the guy who shut Barclays' branches on a Saturday and claimed it was to improve customer service, must now be working for the CC.

I'm convinced that we have many members on this forum who don't know that the CC is a non-profit-making organisation whose sole existence is to improve the service to its members. No, it's not always perfect and maybe they don't always get it right first time but I'm convinced from my experience over many years that they do their best.

The paradox is of course, that if they weren't business-like and weren't profitable then site fees and other service charges would have to rise, and guess who'd be the first people whinging and moaning about that!

It's not just this site either but the whole of society today. We in the western democracies have never had it so good. We enjoy an unparallelled standard of living that our fathers and grandfathers could only have dreamed of but all we seem to hear is a stream of complaints from a the kind of of people who need counselling when their budgerigar dies!

[Mike Chapman]

Hello Frank,

 

I do not think you are being harsh either although I will say that the contributors to this forum seem to be far less critical than on some of the other Motor Caravan and Caravan forums.

 

As a long term member and regular user of CC sites (Excellent for those in need of disabled facilities) there have been times when I hardly recognised the site from others descriptions.

 

We have probably all met the occasional "bad" warden(s) but the vast majority we have found to be helpful and friendly. The reaction from the wardens can be a direct result of ones attitiude to them from the beginning. I have seen, on several occasions, people arriving on site and starting out with an immediate aggressive attitude to the wardens. In the very few cases where a site warden has been difficult we have tried to resolve the issues face to face and on the one occasion where this turned out to be impossible we wrote to the CC and received an apology and a promise to "re-train" the warden involved.

 

My only disagreement with you on this subject is the seeming reluctance of the CC to answer letters and E-mails on some subjects that they probably consider controversial or critical of their stance (eg. Wild Camping).

 

As far as the new website is concerned I must admit that I personally preferred the previous version but do not find the new version particularly difficult to use.

 

With reference to the budgerigar we did not need counselling when ours died but did need advice on how we could get 1lb of sausage meat up its chuff before cooking. (lol)

 

Regards,

 

Mike.

[Brian Kirby]

Frank

I think you may not be giving motorhomers credit for much sense.  We don't moan about the CC just because we feel like it, we moan because they irritate us.  You may not like, or agree with, the reasons for the moans, but they are genuine customer complaints. 

Why do you suppose are they on MMM forum?  Mainly, this is because you can't get a hearing from the CC.  You have switched from caravanning and, as a member of the CC, you defend its stance on many issues.  This is admirable loyalty (no condescension intended, I am also a member and find them admirable for most things, but infuriating beyond belief over others.  French bureaucracy comes to mind.)

They are not a club in the true sense, they are a business.  However, a large, and growing, part of their membership are now motorhomers - you've just added another.  A good business listens to its customers.  Motorhomers don't use sites like caravanners: they tend to be much more mobile.  They don't like booking, they do things more spontaneously.  Both the UK clubs are locked into a two weeks static use, with tent or caravan, plus weekends, mentality.  Both need to become far more flexible in their attitudes.  If you search back, I think you'll find it is motorhomer's reactions to this inflexibility, or perception of inflexibility, that causes most of the gripes.

Try taking the complaints for what they are, not just as an excuse to knock this or that club, but as an expression of a dissatisfaction that the clubs themselves won't openly discuss. 

That, fundamentally, is why the gripes are here and not on the clubs own forums - they just don't have any, and give every impression of not wanting any.  Mores the pity say I!

And no, I don't know why the last para taxt has grown a point size!!

[Mike Chapman]

Brian Kirby - 2007-01-07 1:42 PM

 

Why do you suppose are they on MMM forum?  Mainly, this is because you can't get a hearing from the CC.  You have switched from caravanning and, as a member of the CC, you defend its stance on many issues.  This is admirable loyalty (no condescension intended, I am also a member and find them admirable for most things, but infuriating beyond belief over others.  French bureaucracy comes to mind

 

Both need to become far more flexible in their attitudes.  If you search back, I think you'll find it is motorhomer's reactions to this inflexibility, or perception of inflexibility, that causes most of the gripes

 

Hello Brian,

 

Sorry but I am going to disagree with you on this one. Most of the moans I have seen on the forums are about the club rules and the seeming inability of some members to read and understand them. Arriving on site expecting to do as they please to the detriment of others, moaning about charges that are clearly and specifically given in the handbook and booking details, moaning about wardens being "Little Hitlers" and "Jobsworths", disagreement with the rules on pitch allocation, etc., etc.

 

I do agree that the postings on this forum do tend to be more targetted at the inflexibility issue and the reluctance of the CC to answer some communications but there have over the years been quite a few of the whinge and moan postings as well.

 

It is probably a good thing that the CC have not issued writs for liable against some of those making the more extreme accusations or taken the action of membership cancellation for those who continually flout the rules.

 

It is quite simple really, if you join a club you should obey the clearly stated rules of that club and if you find them unacceptable don't join. If you do not like the rules as a member you have the option to communicate with the club officials and/or attend meetings, raise petitions etc., in an attempt to get the rules changed BUT for the benefit of the other members NOT just to meet a personal requirement that others may dislike.

 

On the issue of the CC Website Change the club have responded and explained their position quite clearly and personally I do not find that response arrogant or misleading.

 

Regards,

 

Mike.

[Brian Kirby]

Mike Chapman - 2007-01-07 2:33 PM  Hello Brian, Sorry but I am going to disagree with you on this one. Most of the moans I have seen on the forums are about the club rules and the seeming inability of some members to read and understand them. Arriving on site expecting to do as they please to the detriment of others, moaning about charges that are clearly and specifically given in the handbook and booking details, moaning about wardens being "Little Hitlers" and "Jobsworths", disagreement with the rules on pitch allocation, etc., etc.

Mike, in general, agreed, although I have been met by a far from smiling welcome when arriving, mid week, without having booked.  However, I didn't complain at the time, or later, or on here.  I'm afraid I just formed the view that the warden was cross-grained, and left it at that!

I do agree that the postings on this forum do tend to be more targetted at the inflexibility issue and the reluctance of the CC to answer some communications but there have over the years been quite a few of the whinge and moan postings as well.

True, and I've just blanked those.  However, there is an underlying thread of frustration at the way those rules are interpreted.  It comes out as a whinge, or an outburst about a petty fogging insistence on compliance that appears not to be applied to all comers.  However, reading between the lines, there seems to me to be a common thread.  The customers aren't getting a fair hearing, or feel they aren't which, in reality, is as bad.

It is probably a good thing that the CC have not issued writs for liable against some of those making the more extreme accusations or taken the action of membership cancellation for those who continually flout the rules. It is quite simple really, if you join a club you should obey the clearly stated rules of that club and if you find them unacceptable don't join. If you do not like the rules as a member you have the option to communicate with the club officials and/or attend meetings, raise petitions etc., in an attempt to get the rules changed BUT for the benefit of the other members NOT just to meet a personal requirement that others may dislike. On the issue of the CC Website Change the club have responded and explained their position quite clearly and personally I do not find that response arrogant or misleading. Regards, Mike.

Mike please see also above.  However, all organisations, as they say, must change or die.  I think we motorhomers have a different approach to use of sites than caravanners or tenters, and also to this concept of always booking - which I find incomprehensible.  Why book?  Why get locked into one area if the weather is lousy, when another area has better?  Why should you pay for a pitch for a week, if you want to go after three days? Why if you've booked for three days, can't you move pitch and stay a bit longer.  You can at some sites?  Why not at others?  We're freebooters, not freeloaders, and we need the clubs to take this on board and make provision.  But, above all, we want to be able to engage with the clubs in a more transparent way.  The CC response to my complaint about the "wild camping" issue, was an e-mail to me, saying the club wasn't anti-motorhome.  I asked that they make this sentiment public, in the interest of undoing some of the harm unguarded comments had caused.  They refused.  I can't understand why, but it seemed to me more to do with not admitting to the unguarded comment, than with undoing the harm done.  That seems to me profoundly stupid, and that attitude (not the first time I've encountered it with the CC), is what frustrates and irritates me. 

One feels one's attempts to alert them to an issue where they could usefully repair damage, are about as much use as the proverbial wee wee down a well.

[Mike Chapman]

Hello Brian,

 

We are probably getting a bit off subject on this thread but I do enjoy our exchanges especially as I hold your opinions in the highest regard (almost all of the time) and really do appreciate the work you do in investigating and reporting motor home matters such as Gas Attacks and Payloads on this forum.

 

I do not think we are poles apart on the subject of the CC especially on the attitiude of the CC to Wild Camping where I consider that they did themselves great harm by their attitude to mainly the Motor Home community but also to some Caravanners as well.

 

The issue of booking in advance is a dificult one to resolve considering the balance of the needs of Motor Homers v Caravanners. In my case we rely very much on the CC sites being available because of the need for Disabled facilities for Kay. We therefore do usually book in advance especially at the most popular sites, mainly because taking a chance on pitch availability is not an option that we can easlily consider. My understanding is that if one has booked and paid for a pitch for several days and then wish to leave before the booking is complete a refund should be given. This has been so on some sites but we have run into difficulties on some of the Affiliated sites who generally seem to operate their own rules between a refund, a credit or no refund. Coincidentally many of the Affiliated sites ask for booking deposits.

 

I totally agree with you that organisations must change or die. The problem I see with the CC is that they often give the impression intentional or otherwise that the Motor Home community amongst their membership is very much second class to the Caravanning members. As the Motor Home membership increases they will have to make the changes and perhaps that could take the form of a change of title to "The Caravan and Motor Caravan Club".

 

Regards,

 

Mike.

[Guest Frank Wilkinson]

Regrettably, Brian's response just confirms what I'm beginning to learn about some of the motorhoming fraternity which is, that they think because they are 'free spirits' they should be treated differently from everyone else. Take this comment from Brian:

Why book?  Why get locked into one area if the weather is lousy, when another area has better?  Why should you pay for a pitch for a week, if you want to go after three days? 

He doesn't don't have to book. He can phone on the day that he wants to arrive and take his chance. If the site has vacancies he will never be turned away. But what he also seems to be saying is that he'd like to book for a week, to make sure that he gets a pitch, but if he then changes his mind he'd like to cancel the booking and zoom off somewhere else.

But isn't this the same chap who was moaning about the CC a few days ago when he complained that he couldn't get on at weekends because sites were booked? So he is now saying that he ought to be able to book a site for a week but maybe go after three days. But of course because his pitch is booked for a week some other person who wants a pitch for the last four days of Brian's booking period will be turned away. But lo and behold, if Brian had his way that pitch would suddenly become available after three days, but by then it's too late for the poor chap who wanted it, who will have made other arrangements, if he's lucky enough to do so.

This however, is the bit that I find absolutely staggering!

Brians says:

I think we motorhomers have a different approach to use of sites than caravanners or tenters, and also to this concept of always booking - which I find incomprehensible. 

Once again, he wants to be treated in a different way from the rest of the population. Why? How is he so special? I really must try this approach the next time that I try to book into my favourite hotel in Bloomsbury. "Listen, Miss receptionist, I know that you're busy but I'm a bit of a free spirit. I'd like to reserve my room for a week but if I get bored with London I'll probably go home after 3 days. I'm sure that you don't mind turning away a few American tourists for the last few days of my booking, do you?"

What is special about camp sites? Why are they different from hotels? In France, which Brian seems to think is motorhoming Nirvana, the situation is no different. I roll up to sites in June without booking and I get on. I don't get on because they're much nicer people than all those terrible 'Little Hitlers' on CC sites. I get on because they have space available! Try rolling up to French campsites in August and tell them that you'd like to reserve a pitch for  a week, but you might go in three days! You'll be surprised how many 'Little Napoleons' will suddenly come out of the woodwork.

Perhaps what Brian and others who feel as he does should do, is ask the CC to reserve a third of its pitches for those motorhoming 'free spirits' who just want to come and go as they please. If some family with young children and a caravan, who can only get away at weekends or in school holidays, is then turned away while there are empty pitches on the site, that may or may not be taken eventually, well that's jolly hard luck on them. What's much more important is that us motorhomers, who are different from those 'campers and tuggers', are catered for.

[Keith T]

Frank

I don't think there is any fundamental difference of attitude between caravanners and motor-caravanners....there may be differences according to how we are able to use our respective 'homes' more by age or occupation, though, and what 'free' time we can arrange.

However, I have been to sites where cancellations at the last minute due the weather not being good have been mostly by caravanners booked over the weekend., and often due to this, we as motrcaravanners have been able to take up the then empty places.I doubt thta we are the only ones to have found this.

Of course France is different - we have never in 12 years booked a site there, even over the July -August period. That is just a case of knowing where to go (or not to...!) In the Uk however, we have to book ahead quite often - more 'ahead' for some places and dates than othere, of course. But surely theree is a totally different outlook on the continent, not only France, and maybe as visitors, we also are more relaxed, but it has to be said that they are more 'geared up' to our needs over there in lots of ways.

However, I do not think the majority of us on this forum have 'knocked' the CC - just putting alternative views and suiggestions is, to my mind, constructive criticism, and perfectly acceptable.

[Mel B]

We stayed at the CC sites at Southport and Blackpool over the Christmas break, we were due to stay at Blackpool for 3 nights, leaving on New Year's Day, however, due to the weather turning and the fact that we would be at work on 2nd Jan, we decided to come home on 31 December so we could get the van cleaned out and Christmas trimmings etc down rather than rush on 1st Jan. We had 'paid' on arrival for 3 nights using site night vouchers which were due to expire on 31st December. As far as I was concerned, I had paid for 3 nights, whether or not I used them was up to me and I certainly didn't expect a refund.

 

I'm sure though from the lovely lady warden's attitude that if I had wanted the voucher for the 3rd night back she would have given me it, however, as it wouldn't be any use to us I suggested to her that if it was permitted, that they allow someone else to use the voucher for the night and ask them to put some money in the charity box. This she agreed to do. So someone will have got a 'cheap' night and the charity would've benefitted as well. Whether this is the norm I don't know as we don't usually leave early.

[Brian Kirby]

Frank Wilkinson - 2007-01-07 5:46 PM

Regrettably, Brian's response just confirms what I'm beginning to learn about some of the motorhoming fraternity which is, that they think because they are 'free spirits' they should be treated differently from everyone else. Take this comment from Brian:

Why book?  Why get locked into one area if the weather is lousy, when another area has better?  Why should you pay for a pitch for a week, if you want to go after three days? 

He doesn't don't have to book. He can phone on the day that he wants to arrive and take his chance. If the site has vacancies he will never be turned away. But what he also seems to be saying is that he'd like to book for a week, to make sure that he gets a pitch, but if he then changes his mind he'd like to cancel the booking and zoom off somewhere else.

But isn't this the same chap who was moaning about the CC a few days ago when he complained that he couldn't get on at weekends because sites were booked? So he is now saying that he ought to be able to book a site for a week but maybe go after three days. But of course because his pitch is booked for a week some other person who wants a pitch for the last four days of Brian's booking period will be turned away. But lo and behold, if Brian had his way that pitch would suddenly become available after three days, but by then it's too late for the poor chap who wanted it, who will have made other arrangements, if he's lucky enough to do so.

This however, is the bit that I find absolutely staggering!

Brians says:

I think we motorhomers have a different approach to use of sites than caravanners or tenters, and also to this concept of always booking - which I find incomprehensible. 

Once again, he wants to be treated in a different way from the rest of the population. Why? How is he so special? I really must try this approach the next time that I try to book into my favourite hotel in Bloomsbury. "Listen, Miss receptionist, I know that you're busy but I'm a bit of a free spirit. I'd like to reserve my room for a week but if I get bored with London I'll probably go home after 3 days. I'm sure that you don't mind turning away a few American tourists for the last few days of my booking, do you?"

What is special about camp sites? Why are they different from hotels? In France, which Brian seems to think is motorhoming Nirvana, the situation is no different. I roll up to sites in June without booking and I get on. I don't get on because they're much nicer people than all those terrible 'Little Hitlers' on CC sites. I get on because they have space available! Try rolling up to French campsites in August and tell them that you'd like to reserve a pitch for  a week, but you might go in three days! You'll be surprised how many 'Little Napoleons' will suddenly come out of the woodwork.

Perhaps what Brian and others who feel as he does should do, is ask the CC to reserve a third of its pitches for those motorhoming 'free spirits' who just want to come and go as they please. If some family with young children and a caravan, who can only get away at weekends or in school holidays, is then turned away while there are empty pitches on the site, that may or may not be taken eventually, well that's jolly hard luck on them. What's much more important is that us motorhomers, who are different from those 'campers and tuggers', are catered for.

I'm sorry Frank, but now you're just "having a - non selective - go".  Conflating separate points, and taking those I actually did make to extremes, is unhelpful.  The point about booking is really quite simple, if only you would look for the straightforward instead of the devious!

To get a pitch for a week, on a lot of club sites, you have to book.  If you don't do so, in my experience, even "off season", but just arrive, the pitch will only be available Mon - Thurs.  So, you find what looks a promising area, and you book to be on the safe side.  You then have to pay.  You pay for the week booked.  If the weather is lousy and you decide to decamp to another area, even with the same club, you can't get a refund or transfer the booking, you have to pay again at the next site.  Of course the vacated pitch then becomes available for others.  This is not a "no show", this is a "show up, but the decide to leave" and, having already paid the club, you might hope to transfer the booking elsewhere with the same club.  Why ever not?  However, that has been my experience.  I really don't see the relevance of hotels to this point, except that with the hotel chains I have used you can transfer a booking to another of the same chain if it becomes necessary.

Re club wardens, I challenge you to find a reference of mine to these being "Little Hitlers".  I think that was someone else's description, to which, for the record, I do not subscribe.  Facts is facts.

Re French sites, I did not make reference to France in my original post above.  This is your introduction to the debate, not mine.  Notwithstanding, arrive at almost any site, anywhere, in August, and you'll be likely to find no vacancies.  However, it may surprise you to learn that it is possible to do this, even in France, if you go to inland sites and arrive after Bastille weekend. 

What I want the clubs to do is to encourage you, and all your fellow inveterate bookers, to move away from this "book everything" mentality.  Yes I do indeed appreciate the fact that in the other European sites I have used, I have just turned up, got a smile, and been admitted on an open duration basis.  Stay one night?  OK.  Might stay two or three.  OK.  Heavily booked over the next weekend?  If you decide to stay over, let us know in good time, otherwise you may find we've re-booked your pitch!  Still OK, because that is easy to understand, and it's my own fault if I loose out.  These are commercial operations, not even trying to be clubs.  The owners depend upon them for their livelihoods.  Can they be so wrong, and the UK clubs so right?  The Europeans are frequently far worse at customer relations that are the Brits, but not in this respect.  In this respect (and perhaps one or two others!), could we not for once learn from them, and relax about booking.

Final point.  I do, fundamentally, object to paying for a pitch before I have seen it, which is what the UK clubs ask.  Even when I have booked in France, in July, I have only be asked for a reservation fee, and not the full whack (except, on the odd occasion, when I have sought one night bookings, which I consided eminently fair).  If you want to know about hotels in this respect, most accept a booking without any fee.  They trust you to turn up as you say you will, but if you haven't turned up by 19:00, and you haven't let them know you will be arriving late, they just re-sell the room.  I have never yet lost a room on this basis.

We've lost so much industry because we stubbornly keep insisting the rest of the world has it wrong and only we are right.  If only we'd looked and learned in the past at how others organised things, and then adopted best practice.  Go, wander around Europe, Frank, and then try the same thing in UK, on the same basis.  Then come back and tell me which you prefer: the binding tedium of booking, or the freedom of coming and going pretty much as you please.

As to "Once again, he wants to be treated in a different way from the rest of the population" no, I dont.  I want to be treated in exactly the same way as the other 200 odd million Europeans are treated.  I just want that treatment within the UK as well!

I hope I've not been tempted to reciprocate in kind with the personalised rudeness that characterised so much of your attached response, but if I do seem to have slipped, I apologise.

[empress]

Gentlemen, gentlemen aren't we all getting a little hot under the collar here? This started with a simple question about the change in the CC's pitch booking website. This has been addressed by the CC in, what I feel is quite a reasonable manner. Can we all stay friends!?

 

Empress

[Guest Frank Wilkinson]

As the post above is getting long I'll start a new one.

Let's start with this written by Brian:

To get a pitch for a week, on a lot of club sites, you have to book.  If you don't do so, in my experience, even "off season", but just arrive, the pitch will only be available Mon - Thurs.  So, you find what looks a promising area, and you book to be on the safe side.  You then have to pay.  You pay for the week booked.  If the weather is lousy and you decide to decamp to another area, even with the same club, you can't get a refund or transfer the booking, you have to pay again at the next site.  Of course the vacated pitch then becomes available for others

This is the nub of my entire argument with you and those who feel like you. Of course the pitch isn't 'available for others'. That family with a caravan and three kids, who can only get away at weekends haven't booked, because they can't take the chance that they'll turn up at a site and be turned away. Can't you see that? Can't you see how unbelievably selfish it is to expect a site in Britain, where land is short, where sites are few (relative to other parts of Europe) to operate on a system like this?

Re club wardens, I challenge you to find a reference of mine to these being "Little Hitlers".  I think that was someone else's description, to which, for the record, I do not subscribe. 

I never actually suggested that you said these words. My argument is not just with you but with all those people who are forever banging on about what a terrible organisation the CC is and this phrase is one that I've learned from this site and has been used many times by others to describe CC wardens.

We've lost so much industry because we stubbornly keep insisting the rest of the world has it wrong and only we are right.  If only we'd looked and learned in the past at how others organised things, and then adopted best practice.  Go, wander around Europe, Frank, and then try the same thing in UK, on the same basis.  Then come back and tell me which you prefer: the binding tedium of booking, or the freedom of coming and going pretty much as you please.

Why are you so self-loathing about your own country? Can't you see the reasons why tiny little Britain may have to be different as far as booking goes? For God's sake man, we all would like nothing more than to be able to simply wander along to a site, stay one night or seven as the fancy takes us and then wander off to somewhere else. Wouldn't that be wonderful and why don't we all just do it then? The reason that we can't do it is because of all those selfish buggers who work during the week and have those horrible children and tow those terrible caravans. They can't take the chance that the site may be full, they have to book or their family holiday is up the Swanee! Can't you see that?

I'm pretty appalled to be honest by the attitude of retired motorhomers who think that they have a God-given right to something that isn't and probably can never be available in the U.K., except perhaps to the detriment of hard-working familes who cannot themselves experience the kind of freedom that you expect, for the reasons that I've outlined on more than one occasion.

[Guest Frank Wilkinson]

I'm just going to add a little something to this debate. We were supposed to be going to York for three or four days last week but an old friend died so we put it off until next week.

I've just tried to book the CC's site at York (Rowntree Park?) and in early January I find that I can only get on during the week as the weekend is booked up.

There is only one person at fault for this and it's me! It's not the Caravan Club, or its booking system or this terrible country that we live in - it's me for being stupid and leaving it too late. This is obviously an incredibly popular site and unlike most other sites here and on the Continent it is at least open. So will someone please tell me, how can we make it possible for the likes of me to be able to just roll up to a site and get a pitch?

Instead of people banging on about how dreadful it is, will they please give me a solution. But please, a solution that won't disadvantage working families who can only go away at weekends and in school holidays.

I really would like to know how they'd run things differently.

[maggyd]

Re; booking on CC sites, to be on the safe side is is best to book if you can but if you carn,t at least ring up before you set off. What I would like to see is deposits taken for bookings as Ive said before selfish people book willy nilly as many sites as they have the time to sit and pick out ! it is no skin off their nose (just ring up and cancell last min; ) Ive been told many a time by sitemanagers ring about 11.ooa.m Thurs morning and see if there has been any cancellations THEY KNOW WHATS GOING ON!

As to not getting refunds your wrong about that, If you decide for any reason to cut short your stay you will get a refund, We have had money put back on our cards twice , with no questions asked .TRY THAT IN A HOTEL ! :-S

[Ralph]

Err... as the originator of this thread I was actually complaining not about having to book in advance, which I recognise is a necessity in cases like York, but at the CC making it more difficult to do so by changing their website.

 

 

[empress]

Exactly, Ralph!

 

Empress

[Basil]

Hi All,

 

Having just used the new website I agree with Ralph that it is not as good or useful as before and will e-mail the CC to this effect.

 

A lot of the problem stems from the fact that there are far too many members for the limited number of pitches available, and most of those members all want to use the same facilities at the same times.

 

Ourselves we usually do not bother to book but just move from site to site in different areas as we feel, but we always phone ahead for availability this is surely just common sense and politeness, also the reason for having the site handbook and just what mobile phones were made for isn't it? We usually find if the particular site phoned has no space they will advise you whether or not the next nearest has space and we have even had a warden book through for us to the other site, hows that for unhelpful 'little Hitler' wardens.

 

Last year using the website we did book for a couple of nights on each of half a dozen sites from mid week across the weekend and the following week and weekend, on a circular trip around the Cotswolds, this was only a couple of weeks prior to going. However we found that we did not like one site so only stayed for one of the nights of the three booked, for which we got a full refund for the two and an apology if it was something they had done to upset us (which it wasn't just couldn't stand the all night clock bells of the Abbey next to the site). Prior to telling the wardens we were leaving early we phoned (ain't mobiles wonderful things) another site to check availability and book for two nights.

 

Now I find that totally flexible, we were able to do what we wanted it cost us no more money (in fact it cost less as the new site had already just switched from high to mid season charges that day and was a cheaper site anyway) we did not pay for the cancelled nights (so we were unintentional site blockers!), we had no problems booking anywhere and every warden was more than polite and helpful.

 

It is also our feeling, like Frank has said, that motorhomers seem to be the biggest whingers going and, in our experience, amongst the most unfriendly of campers (perhaps herein lies the problem some seem to experience!), never found this with either tenters or caravaners, but then that is only our experience.

 

Thing is there is no compulsion to join any club, if you don't like the rules and regulation then don't belong, with 900000 members and in excess of 370000 units 70000 of which are motorhomers, they must be doing something right!

 

Bas

[Brian Kirby]

Ralph - 2007-01-08 8:21 AM Err... as the originator of this thread I was actually complaining not about having to book in advance, which I recognise is a necessity in cases like York, but at the CC making it more difficult to do so by changing their website.

For Ralph

My apologies for straying so far off topic at such great length, and hi-jacking your thread.

For Frank

I'm tired of the personal attacks and misrepresentations.  Enough!

[Lunarsandy]

Getting back to the original point, I have just received an e-mail from CC which reads that they are to bring the calenders back again.

 

Quote:

" appreciate that this may not be ideal for everyone but would ask you to bear with us. We have had feedback since the launch of the new website which suggests that many members did in fact like the calendars so we now have to look into returning them to the website in a way that suits all members – most likely both options will be available. This is not an overnight job by any means though and so will take some time to implement."

 

Perhaps some of the energy expended in the earlier "discussions" would be better directed at local authorities, central government and also our clubs to try to get more pitches; whether they are sites, aires or a general relaxation of bylaws. Surely there are enough of us to bring a bit of pressure to bear on the people who make these planning decisions.

Write to your MP: write to your local councillors: write to your club: write to the press but at least write to someone rather than let off steam on these forums.

[Guest Frank Wilkinson]

Brian Kirkby wrote:

I'm tired of the personal attacks and misrepresentations.  Enough!

Where have I misrepresented you! Have I once said anything that is untrue? Have I once claimed that you said something that you didn't? My attacks aren't personal, they're against what I and others see as your entire 'special treatment and freedoms for motorhomers' ethos. Having said that I'm sorry if what I consider a reasonable argument upsets you somehow.

I happen to think that you're a huge asset to this site, much more than I am I'm sure. I also happen to think that you've become incredibly blinkered about the 'freedoms' that you seem to think are the right of motorhomers.

Please don't instruct me when I've said enough and if you want to accuse me of misreprentation, as you have previously in this thread, start another one and show me where I have once misrepresented your views on the subject of the CC and bookings etc.

[Guest TC01]

Look into my eyes, the eyes, the eyes

 

Leave the bone, let the relaxation spread through your body.

 

321 you’re back in the room.

 

[Ralph]

Brian Kirby - 2007-01-08 3:00 PMFor Ralph

My apologies for straying so far off topic at such great length, and hi-jacking your thread.

Hijack away, I don't mind. I just didn't want to take the blame :-D

[John H]

Hi All,

 

I'm not sure if anyone has already posted this but I have just noticed that availability calendars are back on the Caravan Club website.

 

John.

[Wilson]

I noticed this too. It seems that some time the Club listens to its membership! :-D