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Water pressure, 2005 Bürstner


Tony Jones

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Any thoughts on how to improve our water pressure, especially for the shower? Taps have microswitches, and take a few moments for the water to come through, so it's not a pressurised system like Roxie's was. Pump appears to be INSIDE the tank, so I've not yet identified its make and model.

Any ideas - especially from any other Bürstner owners with a similar system?

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Just change the pump, last year in France our pump failed, went into a camping-car dealership and there was plenty to choose from.

 

As long as it's simular to the spec in the manual it will be fine, ours is the same as yours and water is instant and good pressure.

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Your system has a non-return valve close to the outlet from the fresh water tank.

 

Suggest you check this valve is operating correctly, otherwise water will seep back into the tank and thereby delay the repressurisation of the system.

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There could be a bit of grit in your non return valve as they are usually instantaneous. Alternatively, your pump may be on the way out. You better hope it is not. :'(

 

I had problems with my water pump on my 2006 Burstner and found that the identical pump is no longer available. In the end I fitted the Reich double pump which has a faster flow rate and slightly higher pressure. It was a bit of a faff to fit it as my tank is quite low and it was a tight fit. Since then I have come across Comet submersible pumps. They are cheaper than Reich and seem a good bit of kit. Whatever you fit, make sure it has a non return valve built in if possible.

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Tony

 

This “Practical Caravan” article may be of interest

 

https://www.practicalcaravan.com/advice/32060-guide-to-caravan-water-pipes-and-pumps

 

If water-flow from water outlets (taps/shower) is considerd inadequate, things to check with a submersible pump (where the pump is immersed in the motorhome’s fresh-water tank) are whether there is any ‘crud’ around the pump’s impeller and in any filter fitted to the pump’s water-inlet.

 

To prevent water siphoning back into the water tank through a submersible pump a non-return valve (NRV) will be needed. To minimise delay before water reaches the water outlets, the NRV is normally (though not always) attached directly to the pump’s outlet. As there’s a noticeable delay before water is delivered to your Burstner’s water outlets, you should follow 747’s advice to check that the NRV is opening and closing properly.

 

This section of a 2015 “Destinea” accessories catalogue

 

https://issuu.com/destinea-accessoires/docs/3.eau

 

suggests (Page 93) that both Reich and COMET submersible pumps should be readily available in France. The COMET range is described here

 

https://www.comet-pumpen.de/en/products-rv/pumps/submersible-pumps/submersible-pumps-12-v.html

 

and COMET NRVs here

 

https://www.comet-pumpen.de/en/products-rv/pumps/submersible-pumps/accessories/non-return-valves.html

 

I have an elderly COMET product leaflet-indicating that their submersible pumps were marketed ‘bare, with an attached air-lock release valve, or with an attached NRV/air-lock release valve and a filter in the pump’s base.

 

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  • 2 years later...

Hey guys,

Great thread and very useful, accurate info. Had the same issue in my 04 Burstner 747-2, and so I followed your steer and picked up the one way valve and fitted it today. Sure enough, the old one was buggered.

However, since fitting, my pressure has gotten worse instead of better.

There's two issues: 1) the delay between opening the tap and getting water to pour, and 2) the actual pressure.

 

The are micro switch taps, and the pump is an 'Easy - 14' submersible, and is working when tested in the tank.

I added the one-way valve by just the John Guest connection, and it worked for a while. But returning later, the pressure has dropped right off...

All help and diagnosis appreciated!

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Welcome to the Out&AboutLive forums, Bob.

 

Replacing the non-return valve should have addressed the delay in water coming from the taps after they have been turned on, provided that there is no water leakage in the water system anywhere between the water-pump and the taps.

 

If the water-pump is 2004-vintage, I suggest you replace it. A like-for-like replacement won’t be expensive

 

https://www.leisureoutlet.com/caravans-and-motorhomes/water-and-waste/pumps-drainage-and-filters/9037-reich-easy-pump

 

and replacement can’t do any harm.

 

If that doesn’t cure the problem, check VERY carefully for a water leak.

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Right then Bob. First of all you would be better off buying a new pump with an integral non-return valve. There are not many about but the Reich double pump is a very good one, although not cheap.

 

I have googled for Comet pumps (which are good quality and cheap) but none state that they have a built in non-return valve. Avoid Whale pumps, they are highly priced but cheap quality and don't have a NRV. In fact, avoid anything made by Whale. *-)

 

I had the 747-2 Active which has a different layout to the 747-2 Argos but a new pump should be a very easy fit.

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Comet submersible water-pumps are generally marketed with or without a non-return valve (NRV).This was mentioned here last month

 

https://forums.outandaboutlive.co.uk/forums/Motorhomes/Motorhome-Matters/Water-system-saga-another-lesson-learnt-/52798/

 

and the Comet website makes it plain.

 

As Bob has already replaced the NRV in his motorhome’s water system, it would be asking for trouble to choose an alternative pump with an integrated NRV unless the present NRV were first removed.

,

I don’t disagree with the idea of fitting a ‘better’ pump, but if the Easy 14 pump worked adequately in the past, a new Easy 14 should work adequately in the future.

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The following link is to the section of the Comet website that covers 12V ‘immersion’ (ie. ‘submersible’) water-pumps

 

https://www.comet-pumpen.de/en/products-rv/pumps/submersible-pumps/submersible-pumps-12-v.html

 

Ignoring the specialised “AQUATRI” pump, the pumps in the seven other ranges are all offered in three formats - a ‘bare’ pump, a pump with an air-lock release add-on, or a pump with a vented non-return-valve and filter.

 

For instance, pumps in the ECO/ECO-PLUS ranges showing the three formats can be viewed here

 

https://www.comet-pumpen.de/en/products-rv/pumps/submersible-pumps/submersible-pumps-12-v/eco-eco-plus.html

 

When Comet submersible pumps were discussed here in August it became evident that, when a Comet pump was marketed with a “vented non-return valve and filter”, that the NRV+filter was non-removable. However, it is possible to obtain NRV adapters (with or without the air release feature) that can be attached to the outlet of a ‘bare’ Comet pump (example of adapter here)

 

http://www.watertankswarehouse.co.uk/ourshop/prod_3776445-CP30045300-Comet-NonReturn-Valve-With-Air-Release.html

 

I’m not sure what the position is with other makes of submersible pump, but installing a submersible pump with its own NRV, and having another separate NRV downstream of the pump, would a) be unnecessary and b) probably restrict the water flow-rate.

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Hey lads

Sorry for delay in response, only get to check this once a day or so.

So, the issue seems to be that the new NRV is letting water back, and so is faulty (it wasn't when I fitted it) so my pressure is crap.. also, I'm assuming the 'vent' you ref here is to stop/prevent/solve air locks? Maybe that's an issue for me here, not sure the pump I have is vented, can't see one obvious if it is....any tips on how to solve the airlock before that?

So, I might try a new pump with integrated valve today using 'Norbonne accessories' here in France while on the road...

Cheers

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Earlier submersible pumps could need ‘waggling’ to get rid of air before they were prepared to suck water.

 

This advert

 

https://www.leisureshopdirect.com/water/caravan-water-pump/reich-pumps/reich-easy-pump-14l

 

suggests that a Reich Easy 14 pump might be vented (I would have thought this would be the norm) but I doubt you’d be able to tell if that’s so just by looking at it.

 

Although an ineffective NRV will delay water delivery initially, unless the NRV were restricting the flow, the lack of pressure is much more likely to be due to the pump itself. Presumably you’ve checked that there is no muck where the pump’s impeller is?

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From memory (therefore potentially unreliable at my age), the original water pump in a 747 was around 19-20 litres/min. A 14 l/min one might look weak compared to an original. I also think the pressure was around 1 Bar, not the 0.6 Bar of the Easy model.
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On-line comments suggest that older Burstner 747 models had as standard a Reich submersible pump with an around 15 litres-per-minute water flow-rate and a sub-1.0bar pressure. Evidently this did not always meet owners’ expectations and there have been enquiries about fitting a more powerful replacement. Fitting a pump with an 18 or 19 lpm flow-rate and a pressure not exceeding 1.0bar does not seem to have caused problems.

 

Interestingly, there’s a throw-away mention that, if a Reich pump’s wires are connected wrongly (ie. with their polarity reversed) the pump will still function but its performance will be much reduced.

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So, a bit of column A, bit of B.

Went back to Sorbonne camping supplies (great chain of stores, great stock) and had them look at the NRV I had just fitted. Turns out it was faulty, allowing return. The technician reckons it's down to me inserting the male JG connection on the pump too far into the female on the valve, and thereby interfering with the valve operation. They still replaced for free, and system is working good now. But, I suspect the 14l/min pump I have is under rated for this MH and it should be 19/20 and 1 bar.. that'll be a winter project to find and replace..there's enough here to get me home and hosed hopefully... thanks again lads!

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