which engine??

[royston]

Hi all,i want to get into motor caravaning and am just looking around for my first motorhome.I was looking for something with a 2.5 or 2.8 turbo diesel. But some people are telling me to go for a 2.0 or 2.2hdi.I have tried a 2.0hdi which seemed fine around town and not loaded.I have also tried a non turbo 2.5 which also seemed fine around town so i am a bit confused at the moment.Bear in mind that i will want to take this van over to europe and probably up into the french alpes.I would be grateful of any feedback.Seems like Im being told all different things as people want me to buy their vans. Also the size of van i am looking for will be on the lines of a Swift Royale 590 5 berth.Cheers

[Guest starspirit]

It depends on what you are used to and what you expect.

My peugeot Autocruise Starspirit is a 20' medium sized coachbuilt van and has a 2.0 ltr hdi motor. We find it quite adequate although it can get a bit breathless on long inclines when a bit of gear stirring is often called for.

It is a fairly quiet and refined unit and returns about 26 to 32 mpg depending on driving conditions and weight of right foot.

The 2.2 and 2.3 hdi's are much better with, so I understand, very little extra fuel costs. The 2.8 hdi is very much quicker but is a bit noisier and harsher as well as thirstier.

The old 2.5 is a very strong and reliable unit but also very agricultural by todays standards. The non turbo is slow and noisy and the turbo is acceptable and noisy.

The 1.9 falls somewhere between the 2.0 hdi and 2.5.

It's as important to get the right van for your needs and any of the modern hdi engines should not and I personally would much prefer the modern PSA engines to the older 1.9 and 2.5.

Then there are Renault, VW, Merc and Ford about which I know very little save that older Ford engines tend to be noisy and harsh.

Many others on here know much more than me and no doubt more infor woll follow.

[Basil]

Hello royston,

 

Just my opinion others may well feel different!

Depends on the size of van you are looking at. In our case a just sub 7metre six berth I would not have one of the smaller engines whether HDI or not, I would have an older 2.5TD or a newer 2.8 either JTD or HDI and would also consider a non turbo 2.5 at the right money but be prepared to have a Turbo charger fitted (e.g. TB Turbo).

We actually did buy a non turbo 2.5 at the right money and with the turbo conversion done it is fine, economical and has sufficient power to cruise all day at 70 if you want. It's a good reliable and solid engine we have done 69000 miles now and only had normal servicing (including cam belt) an exhaust and a split drive shaft boot.

 

Bas

[Guest Frank Wilkinson]

The bigger the better in my opinion. I don't think that you can have too much power. One of the contributory factors in choosing my 'van (a Lunar Telstar 2 berth) was its engine, a Renault 2.5 ltr with a six-speed 'box.

It cruises comfortably at 70mph but even with 2.5 ltrs you need to change down on inclines if you wish to maintain speed.

If you consider that many ordinary family saloons have 2 ltr engines, and then look at the size and weight of a motorhome I couldn't contemplate one with a smallish engine.

I also think that we get a bit hung up on mpg. If you do 10,000 miles per annum at 20mph as against 25mph, you spend an extra £450. OK, £450 sounds a lot, but consider it against depreciation, loss of interest on capital and all the other costs and it's relatively costing peanuts for the pleasure of driving something that's not under-powered.

Finally, Royston, if you're looking at five berth 'vans this implies up to three more bodies than I carry, with all of the weight that entails. You'll certainly struggle in the French Alps and anywhere with a few hills I would imagine.

[royston]

Hi everyone,thanks for all your thoughts on this.Seems as tho the more power you can muster the better even tho it might cost a bit more fuel wise.I know that anything of that size and weight is going to flag a bit going up hills but looks like Im in the market for either a 2.5 or 2,8 tdi.All i got to do now is find the right van at the right price.I live right down south and theres not a lot of choice at the moment without going to a dealer.Seems plenty up north.But its a long way to go just to have a look.Covered a lot of miles so far to look at "this is definateley the one for you,once you see this youll be amazed, its imaculate" only to come home empty handed.Anyway back to Ebay,Autotrader etc.Cheers all. Roy

[Guest starspirit]

Keep an open mind Royston and drive a few different vans bearing in mind that a full load probably won't affect cruising ability but it will affect hill climbing.

I agree fuel 'economy' is not much of an issue but it does help to have a rough idea of the cost of using the darned thing.

You may experience 'peugeot throttle ankle' due to the acute angle twixt leg and pedal and even if not, a cruise control is, in my view, money very well spent.

Many many owners are very happy with a 2.0 hdi and are quite happy to trundle along without undue haste (my other cars are both high powered and I welcome the change) so don't pay too much attention to what others say about how much power you 'need'.

Judge for yourself always remembering that the van conversion itself is more important than the power output and even the lowest powered van is designed to pull a full load up a mountain pass without danger or obstructing others.

[mark lambert]

I have a mclouis 690 6 berth with a 2.8jtd, travelled around the alps last year, stunning! a smaller engine would have struggled although the newer engines have more power i still wouldn't buy anything under a 2.5. when you consider a peugeot 206 can have a 2.0hdi i think size matters here. ps my vans for sale.

mark.lambert907@ntlworld.com

[royston]

Cheers guys,Ill take all this advice on board.I really only wanted to go up to about 20ft. One small thing ,do you think it would be just as easy to sell on a smaller engined motorhome as it would be one with a larger engine.Thing is i have the opertunity to buy a Compass Avantgarde 300 with 2.0hdi year 2003 19000on clock for 18,500 so Im umming and arring a bit.Cheers

[Keith T]

royston - 2007-01-09 3:18 PM

 

looks like Im in the market for either a 2.5 or 2,8 tdi.......All i got to do now is find the right van at the right price.I live right down south and theres not a lot of choice at the moment without going to a dealer.

 

Hi Royston - firstly, I'd definately say go for the larger engine, which in most cases for the last few years would be 2.8JTD Fiat, or the previous 2.5TD. Have had both, also a couple of 2l petrol, on van conversions, and there's just no comparison. It's not so m uch hills, but head winds, especially if you're looking overcab bed models.

Not sure quite where you live, but why not take a look at Shepton Mallet Show this weekend - whilst perhaps not as big as some of the other outdoor shows, there will be a number of dealers there looking to sell second hand (sorry - what's it icalled now 'previously loved'....?) stock.

[Brian Kirby]

Royston

What engine you can get will, to a large extent, be dictated by the age of the 'van you buy.  Not all the engine variants are/have been available on all 'vans.

However, it is frequently true that, on a like for like basis, a more powerful engine uses less fuel than a lower powered one.  The main reason is that the lower powered engine is often lower geared and runs out of puff sooner.  You therefore have to "row" it along on the gear lever, and that increases fuel consumption.  What you will definately find, is that as you push up your cruising speed, the fuel consumption for the smaller engines will rise faster than it does for the more powerful variants.

That freedom from frequent downshifts can be quite beneficial on long trips.

However, whatever engine you decide upon, do check the available payload on the van if considering long trips.  The number of berths you are looking for probably means that you should be looking for something on an AlKo 3,500Kg chassis.  These do cost more but seem generally lighter than the chassis manufacturer's originals, and so give a bit more payload.  Failing that, go for at least a 3,850Kg chassis.  Do, however, also check your driving license above 3,500Kg.

[Guest starspirit]

Royston,

 

If the layout is right and you feel the price is right at least give it a test drive.

If you then find it a bit underpowered there are after market chips to help. Look at Van Aaken's website and there are many others.

However do go for a removable or 'no trace' software only upgrade as these can detract from resale values and check with warranty and insurance suppliers. Would you knowingly buy a 'tuned up motor'?

A bigger engined van seems to command a higher price on the dealers forecourts but whether that translates into better p/x is open to conjecture.

[Clive]

I,m with Frank on this one. The bigger and more powerfull the engine the more relaxed the driving, and definately a turbo.

 

Good luck with the quest

 

C.

 

[royston]

Wow Im amazed at the responce on this,youve all been a great help.Thanks again for all your input.We are out and about this weekend searching so hopefully we will find what we are looking for.Cheers all. Roy

[breakaleg]

hi royston, we have just gone from a vw 2.4 5 cylinder to a peugot 2.2hdi turbo 4 cylinder.

and boy is there a difference, the vw was a pleasent van to drive, but a bit breathless, the pegot flies already, not many miles on the clock yet, but even within 2 months its made a big difference.

both vans were less than 20 foot long, and both coachbuilt.

pete

[Mel E]

One point that nobody has mentioned. All van engines are set up by the manufacturers to quite tight limits: low emissions, reasonable consumption, but therefore lower power. With new engines, this is defined in the EMU (Engine Management Unit) CHIP.

 

Thus, for example, the Renault Master is offered with three different engines that are all 2.5 litre, virtually identical, but with different engine mapping.

 

With older engines, it is still possible to retune them.

 

So, whatever you buy, if you need more power an outfit like TB Turbo can provide it. Retuning an older engine (the Talbot 2.5D or TD, older Fiat 2.8s, etc) typically costs around £150 and will add about 25% to both max horse power and also, most importantly for ease of driving, to engine torque. I had it done on a 2.8 Iveco TD (basically the same engine as the Fiat 2.8 TD) and the result was like magic - and at no extra cost to fuel consumption. Emissions did go up but were still well within MoT test limits.

 

More recent engines are either re-chipped, or you can buy a unit to plug between the Engine Control Unit and the fuel injection control that does the same thing for around £400 - 25% more HP and torque without extra fuel consumption.

 

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[royston]

Cheers Mel E.You seem to know your stuff.Ive never had a deisel before so didnt really know you could chip them up and tuning parts for them.Thanks for the info.