Guest pelmetman Posted April 6, 2018 Posted April 6, 2018 http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-5581061/Lammy-blames-prolific-cocaine-market-makes-buying-drugs-easy-ordering-Deliveroo.html He's behind you! (lol) (lol) (lol) .........
Brian Kirby Posted April 6, 2018 Posted April 6, 2018 That's great Dave. It's so reassuring to know there is an abundance of police on the streets, and all these reports of stabbings and shootings must therefore be fake news.
antony1969 Posted April 7, 2018 Posted April 7, 2018 Brian Kirby - 2018-04-06 6:26 PM That's great Dave. It's so reassuring to know there is an abundance of police on the streets, and all these reports of stabbings and shootings must therefore be fake news. It would be more reassuring Brian if we didn't have so many criminals ... Many shipped in from from countries far and wide
Guest pelmetman Posted April 7, 2018 Posted April 7, 2018 Our so called British justice system loves foreign criminals, it especially likes to allow them to escape justice *-) ........ http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-5587395/Romanian-gangster-jailed-attempted-murder-homeland-fled-UK-walks-free.html
Brian Kirby Posted April 7, 2018 Posted April 7, 2018 antony1969 - 2018-04-07 7:35 AM Brian Kirby - 2018-04-06 6:26 PM That's great Dave. It's so reassuring to know there is an abundance of police on the streets, and all these reports of stabbings and shootings must therefore be fake news. It would be more reassuring Brian if we didn't have so many criminals ... Many shipped in from from countries far and wide To the first part, obviously. To the second part, it seems these are mainly kids, so hardly likely to have been "shipped in from countries far and wide". We've been here before, when government reduced police numbers to save money, over did it, and we had a crime wave as a result. It was then necessary to radically increase police numbers, at considerable cost, until the police gained dominance - by which time we had more police than before the reductions. In both cases it is/was the consequence of false economics, driven by a preoccupation with lowering taxes over maintaining essential services. If the police become over-stretched, it takes days for the scallywags to notice and respond. It then takes years, and a lot more money, to put the police back in control where, irrespective of the origins of the scallywags, we need them to be.
Guest pelmetman Posted April 7, 2018 Posted April 7, 2018 Brian Kirby - 2018-04-07 3:04 PM antony1969 - 2018-04-07 7:35 AM Brian Kirby - 2018-04-06 6:26 PM That's great Dave. It's so reassuring to know there is an abundance of police on the streets, and all these reports of stabbings and shootings must therefore be fake news. It would be more reassuring Brian if we didn't have so many criminals ... Many shipped in from from countries far and wide To the first part, obviously. To the second part, it seems these are mainly kids, so hardly likely to have been "shipped in from countries far and wide". We've been here before, when government reduced police numbers to save money, over did it, and we had a crime wave as a result. It was then necessary to radically increase police numbers, at considerable cost, until the police gained dominance - by which time we had more police than before the reductions. In both cases it is/was the consequence of false economics, driven by a preoccupation with lowering taxes over maintaining essential services. If the police become over-stretched, it takes days for the scallywags to notice and respond. It then takes years, and a lot more money, to put the police back in control where, irrespective of the origins of the scallywags, we need them to be. You conveniently ignore how the loony liberals have for years been trying to curb the polices stop & search powers *-) ............ I think if your looking for someone to blame, then I reckon they should be your first port of call ;-) ........
John52 Posted April 7, 2018 Posted April 7, 2018 You wouldn't believe there was a shortage of police when you look at the Royal Palaces, or Downing Street, or Houses of Parliament. But the police shortage becomes apparent when you ring up to report crime in a deprived area.
John52 Posted April 7, 2018 Posted April 7, 2018 pelmetman - 2018-04-07 3:16 PM for years been trying to curb the polices stop & search powers *-) ............ Nope Just saying stop and search should apply to everyone equally
Tracker Posted April 7, 2018 Posted April 7, 2018 Stop and search relies on 'reasonable suspicion' and guess which people, based on experience, give rise to more reasonable suspicion than others?
Brian Kirby Posted April 7, 2018 Posted April 7, 2018 pelmetman - 2018-04-07 3:16 PM....................You conveniently ignore how the loony liberals have for years been trying to curb the polices stop & search powers *-) ............ I think if your looking for someone to blame, then I reckon they should be your first port of call ;-) ........ Oh dear, party politics trumps logic again! :-D And, in the absence of sufficient numbers of police, who is going to do all this stopping and searching? Just, as you so like saying, askin! :-D
malc d Posted April 7, 2018 Posted April 7, 2018 John52 - 2018-04-07 3:42 PM pelmetman - 2018-04-07 3:16 PM for years been trying to curb the polices stop & search powers *-) ............ Nope Just saying stop and search should apply to everyone equally Yeah. We should start with old peoples homes - no-one ever checks them for weapons. ;-)
Guest pelmetman Posted April 7, 2018 Posted April 7, 2018 John52 - 2018-04-07 3:42 PM pelmetman - 2018-04-07 3:16 PM for years been trying to curb the polices stop & search powers *-) ............ Nope Just saying stop and search should apply to everyone equally Yeah maybe they should bring a few white Brits into Hackney so that they can search them (lol) (lol) (lol) ..........
Guest pelmetman Posted April 7, 2018 Posted April 7, 2018 Brian Kirby - 2018-04-07 4:11 PM pelmetman - 2018-04-07 3:16 PM....................You conveniently ignore how the loony liberals have for years been trying to curb the polices stop & search powers *-) ............ I think if your looking for someone to blame, then I reckon they should be your first port of call ;-) ........ Oh dear, party politics trumps logic again! :-D And, in the absence of sufficient numbers of police, who is going to do all this stopping and searching? Just, as you so like saying, askin! :-D The one's that are currently sat in the Plod shop doing unnecessary box ticking paperwork to appease the loony liberal brigade ;-) .......
antony1969 Posted April 7, 2018 Posted April 7, 2018 Brian Kirby - 2018-04-07 3:04 PM antony1969 - 2018-04-07 7:35 AM Brian Kirby - 2018-04-06 6:26 PM That's great Dave. It's so reassuring to know there is an abundance of police on the streets, and all these reports of stabbings and shootings must therefore be fake news. It would be more reassuring Brian if we didn't have so many criminals ... Many shipped in from from countries far and wide To the first part, obviously. To the second part, it seems these are mainly kids, so hardly likely to have been "shipped in from countries far and wide". We've been here before, when government reduced police numbers to save money, over did it, and we had a crime wave as a result. It was then necessary to radically increase police numbers, at considerable cost, until the police gained dominance - by which time we had more police than before the reductions. In both cases it is/was the consequence of false economics, driven by a preoccupation with lowering taxes over maintaining essential services. If the police become over-stretched, it takes days for the scallywags to notice and respond. It then takes years, and a lot more money, to put the police back in control where, irrespective of the origins of the scallywags, we need them to be. If your theory is correct regarding reduced police numbers being to blame for higher criminality why have Muslim prison numbers being going up year on year long before police cuts ??? Hey sorry Brian do I need to put "some" with that ???
Brian Kirby Posted April 8, 2018 Posted April 8, 2018 antony1969 - 2018-04-07 8:37 PM Brian Kirby - 2018-04-07 3:04 PM antony1969 - 2018-04-07 7:35 AM Brian Kirby - 2018-04-06 6:26 PM That's great Dave. It's so reassuring to know there is an abundance of police on the streets, and all these reports of stabbings and shootings must therefore be fake news. It would be more reassuring Brian if we didn't have so many criminals ... Many shipped in from from countries far and wide To the first part, obviously. To the second part, it seems these are mainly kids, so hardly likely to have been "shipped in from countries far and wide". We've been here before, when government reduced police numbers to save money, over did it, and we had a crime wave as a result. It was then necessary to radically increase police numbers, at considerable cost, until the police gained dominance - by which time we had more police than before the reductions. In both cases it is/was the consequence of false economics, driven by a preoccupation with lowering taxes over maintaining essential services. If the police become over-stretched, it takes days for the scallywags to notice and respond. It then takes years, and a lot more money, to put the police back in control where, irrespective of the origins of the scallywags, we need them to be. If your theory is correct regarding reduced police numbers being to blame for higher criminality why have Muslim prison numbers being going up year on year long before police cuts ??? Hey sorry Brian do I need to put "some" with that ??? But Antony, again you miss my point. I have not said that reduced police numbers are "to blame" for "higher criminality". That would be a stupid claim. The criminals are to blame, and I have not suggested otherwise. Please read again.
W3526602 Posted April 11, 2018 Posted April 11, 2018 Hi, What I want is enough police for there not to be any crime. But if the police are not arresting anybody, because nobody is breaking the law, they will be given the choice of being made redundant, or being told to go out and find some criminals. But there aren't any crimials, so they will have to dig deeper into the private lives of those that are generally law abiding "Just a routine check, Sir," There is no need for "stop and search" ... just have road-side body scanners like they do at airports. And perhaps a couple of sniffer dogs sitting beside the "doorman". I read somewhere, that 1% of the population of USA are in jail. Hmmm! 602
W3526602 Posted April 11, 2018 Posted April 11, 2018 Hi, What I want is enough police for there not to be any crime. But if the police are not arresting anybody, because nobody is breaking the law, they will be given the choice of being made redundant, or being told to go out and find some criminals. But there aren't any crimials, so they will have to dig deeper into the private lives of those that are generally law abiding "Just a routine check, Sir," There is no need for "stop and search" ... just have road-side body scanners like they do at airports. And perhaps a couple of sniffer dogs sitting beside the "doorman". I read somewhere, that 1% of the population of USA are in jail. Hmmm! 602
Tracker Posted April 11, 2018 Posted April 11, 2018 Brian Kirby - 2018-04-08 1:06 PM I have not said that reduced police numbers are "to blame" for "higher criminality". That would be a stupid claim. The criminals are to blame, and I have not suggested otherwise. The real problem is with the lack of deterrent and the perceived lower risk of being caught which makes crime more attractive to those so inclined so in addition to more police maybe we need more prisons and much better security at all prisons to stop the use of illicit mobile phones, drugs and other contraband. Sure it will cost, but what is the alternative if successive governments do nothing and allow criminal activity to increase?
Brian Kirby Posted April 11, 2018 Posted April 11, 2018 Tracker - 2018-04-11 12:55 PM Brian Kirby - 2018-04-08 1:06 PM I have not said that reduced police numbers are "to blame" for "higher criminality". That would be a stupid claim. The criminals are to blame, and I have not suggested otherwise. The real problem is with the lack of deterrent and the perceived lower risk of being caught which makes crime more attractive to those so inclined so in addition to more police maybe we need more prisons and much better security at all prisons to stop the use of illicit mobile phones, drugs and other contraband. Sure it will cost, but what is the alternative if successive governments do nothing and allow criminal activity to increase? Yes, because once the police become over-stretched, that quickly becomes obvious to the scallys. Word travels quickly, and the scallys become more casual and brazen, and we get an outbreak of criminality - though not always across all areas of criminality. Once the genie is out of the bottle, it costs more, and takes greater resource, to put it back in. Add to that increased cost, the actual cost of crime, which we all (or nearly all) pay: through increased insurance premiums as well as increasing taxation, loss and injury, etc. and the bill tends to exceed the savings achieved by overdoing the assumptions about savings from "increased efficiency" and reduced numbers. It is the almost inevitable consequence of an over preoccupation with cost saving without proper regard to the consequences of overdoing it. As I said above, we have been here before.
Guest pelmetman Posted April 11, 2018 Posted April 11, 2018 Brian Kirby - 2018-04-11 1:15 PM As I said above, we have been here before. and......As I said before we need to build more prisons ;-) ....... Which means we can jail more scally's B-) ....... Which in the end will save us law abiders more dosh B-) ......... Just being sensible ;-) .........
Brian Kirby Posted April 11, 2018 Posted April 11, 2018 pelmetman - 2018-04-11 5:01 PM Brian Kirby - 2018-04-11 1:15 PM As I said above, we have been here before. and......As I said before we need to build more prisons ;-) ....... Which means we can jail more scally's B-) ....... Which in the end will save us law abiders more dosh B-) ......... Just being sensible ;-) ......... Don't know, Dave. Leaving the police short handed reduces the probability of detection, arrest, and prosecution, in creasing the probability that your nice, expensive, shiny, new, prisons would be likely to end up with numerous scally vacancies. There's no magic bullet: it is a balance in which the scallys have to come to believe that if they commit crimes, they are likely to be found out and punished. It won't deter all, but it will deter some. Whichever route is taken, the balance between individual freedom and living in a police state has to be made, or we'll all find we are living in a country we don't much like.
Guest pelmetman Posted April 11, 2018 Posted April 11, 2018 Brian Kirby - 2018-04-11 6:16 PM pelmetman - 2018-04-11 5:01 PM Brian Kirby - 2018-04-11 1:15 PM As I said above, we have been here before. and......As I said before we need to build more prisons ;-) ....... Which means we can jail more scally's B-) ....... Which in the end will save us law abiders more dosh B-) ......... Just being sensible ;-) ......... Don't know, Dave. Leaving the police short handed reduces the probability of detection, arrest, and prosecution, in creasing the probability that your nice, expensive, shiny, new, prisons would be likely to end up with numerous scally vacancies. There's no magic bullet: it is a balance in which the scallys have to come to believe that if they commit crimes, they are likely to be found out and punished. It won't deter all, but it will deter some. Whichever route is taken, the balance between individual freedom and living in a police state has to be made, or we'll all find we are living in a country we don't much like. Well if we did away with the human rights act for those that don't deserve access to it :-| ........ Then the country would save billions and quite a lot in insurance premiums and LIVES ;-) ....... But hey that would be against your liberal agenda would it not Brian? *-) ..........
Brian Kirby Posted April 11, 2018 Posted April 11, 2018 Then why not do away with the whole legal paraphernalia as well, and just revert to mediaeval accusation followed by prison with a trial as an optional bolt-on. Even that didn't prevent crime, so whatever you add or omit, you have to face up to the fact that people commit crime. I guess one might eventually eliminate criminal tendencies from the gene pool, or the social environment, by adopting euthanasia for all transgressors, but I doubt people generally would support that, and even if the did there'd be huge arguments over which crimes would qualify. I mean, being euthanased for 35MPH in a 30MPH zone might strike some as a bit OTT, don't you think? There are no simple, black and white, answers, of the kind you seem to crave if you want to live in a reasonably civilised country. That is why we have all that legal paraphernalia: it has been developing and evolving for over 1,000 years, and will go on doing so. No-one has the "perfect" answer, because we all have to believe the system is fair and reasonable, and that means your favoured solutions won't succeed unless they instil confidence in a majority of people.
Bulletguy Posted April 11, 2018 Posted April 11, 2018 Brian Kirby - 2018-04-11 6:44 PM Then why not do away with the whole legal paraphernalia as well, and just revert to mediaeval accusation followed by prison with a trial as an optional bolt-on. Even that didn't prevent crime, so whatever you add or omit, you have to face up to the fact that people commit crime. I guess one might eventually eliminate criminal tendencies from the gene pool, or the social environment, by adopting euthanasia for all transgressors, but I doubt people generally would support that, and even if the did there'd be huge arguments over which crimes would qualify. I mean, being euthanased for 35MPH in a 30MPH zone might strike some as a bit OTT, don't you think? There are no simple, black and white, answers, of the kind you seem to crave if you want to live in a reasonably civilised country. That is why we have all that legal paraphernalia: it has been developing and evolving for over 1,000 years, and will go on doing so. No-one has the "perfect" answer, because we all have to believe the system is fair and reasonable, and that means your favoured solutions won't succeed unless they instil confidence in a majority of people. That seems right up the street of the Mad Hatter. We can outlaw hypocrisy too and do away with those ne'er do well hypocrites who want to drag the country out of EU......only to then flee off to spend 6 months of the year in Spain because they won't support their own countries economy. Send 'em into permanent exile.
Tracker Posted April 11, 2018 Posted April 11, 2018 I think there is a strong case for those who are proven in a court of law to have infringed the human rights of another in any way to forfeit their own entitlement to any human rights of their own.
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