Terrytraveller Posted January 30, 2007 Share Posted January 30, 2007 Had a MH'er ask how the alarm was working after three years of constant use on standby but mostly activated - its fine and has saved our bacon on at least one known occaision. Below is a post from last June, as there are alot of new motorhomers coming into the forum, I thought it would be useful reposting and updating. The installation and operating instructions are on the link below in pdf format. I fitted the Micromark house alarm from Focus DIY (also sold by Argos) £39.99. The kit has two PIR's and two magnetic switches, you can buy additional magnetic switches from Maplin for £2/pair. The alarm is supplied with a 9v/12v mains adapter with a 3.5mm plug, I discarded the adapter, and the unit is wired directly into the leisure battery on a two amp fuse. The alarm is set by using a key pad on exiting the van. Download PDF The system is hard wired just like the van blitz system, sensors on all windows, locker doors, cab doors and windows, I used one of the PIR's with a by pass switch, it detects movement inside the saloon, not necessary really, as any access would trigger the other door or window sensors, but activate it anyway when we are not in the van. I also fitted an addtional alarm under the bonnet, two screws and one wire and its fixed, about 10 mins work from Argos (was £20 when I bought it), it has remote controls, voltage/current and shock sensing, siren will activate when cab doors open, providing cab lights are in working order Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mel E Posted January 31, 2007 Share Posted January 31, 2007 Terry, Looks like a bargain - but 10 minutes to invisibly wire up all those sensors? Now come on! That's just blatant oversell!!! 10 HOURS, maybe! Have fun, Mel E ==== Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave Newell Posted January 31, 2007 Share Posted January 31, 2007 Hi Terry, I have no doubt that your alarm system is effective but to compare it with a Van Bitz (no "L" in Bitz by the way) strikeback is a bit over the top I think. The Strikeback will include a tilt sensor which wil trigger the alarm should the vehicle be lifted for towing. The Strikeback also includes an engine immobilizer which yours patently does not. The Strikeback is also Thatcham approved which means the insurance industry recognize it, I doubt the same can be said for yours. The Strikeback can, and usually does, include a security loop for bikes etc on a bike rack. Most alarm installers do not fit window sensors for the simple reason that most people do not want plastic trunking running up/down walls to the windows, I know of no other way to fit window switches/sensors unless you have wireless ones which are expensive. As a large proportion of the cost of professional alarm installation is the labour to fit them it is unfair to compare a diy fit alarm sytem to a commercially installed one on price. D. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Terrytraveller Posted January 31, 2007 Author Share Posted January 31, 2007 Hi Mel and Dave, Thanks for your comments, I knew I was going to get my bottom smacked over my suggestion of a cheaper alarm, and perhaps I did mean 'Blitz' !! throw back to the 40's at this end - don't you know! Para 4 refers to an additional alarm, which really can be fitted in 10 mins, has remote controls and provides adjustable shock sensing, cab door opening and voltage sensing, see Argos new catalog number 740/9439 now costs £34.99. Dave most vehicles now have their own immobiliser fitted as standard so another one is nice to have I know, but do you really want to pay a couple of hundred pounds more. Point taken - the Micromark is not thatchem approved - so what! fully comp insurance plus breakdown for UK and europe (90 day multitrip) is still only £310 for a 2004 Stargazer. To hardwire neatly, sensors to window is an absolute must in my opinion and can be done by hiding the low profile trunking, in my case under pelmets and curtains, you don't see it even when looking for the wiring. Fully wiring the alarm took two weeks, 4 hours on and one week off - so yes it does take time, but most MH can be wired from the inside - so whats the rush? Fitting a loop for bikes on a bike rack by using a series wired switched socket should not be difficult, I can think of a a few ways to do it. Next project is fitting Heosafe lockable type cab door locks for a cost of £13.38 not £135.00 the pair - only two screws per side and no dismantling ! - Watch this space. If I can't do it I will eat my motorhome - promise... Regards Terry Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave Newell Posted January 31, 2007 Share Posted January 31, 2007 Hi Terry, My reason for picking up on the Van B(l)itz point is that many people say blitz when the company name is Van Bitz with no L and this can be confusing for others trying to find them, especially via a "google" search. Many insurance companies are now insisting on Thatcham approved alarms for motorhomes over £30,000 value which is why I mentioned it. The low profile trunking might be well hidden in your motorhome Terry but as I do fit alarms, among other things, I can tell you that many motorhomes don't have pelmets etc which would allow you to hide the low profile trunking. As I said before, to compare a diy, non approved alarm, however effective and reliable it has been, with a professionally installed, Thatcham approved, sophisticated alarm system is not very fair. Igf yours took you four hours to fit then a full Thatcham system with immobilizer, tilt switch etc might well take longer and at £50 per hour (rough guess, I don't know what Van Bitz hourly rate is) the labour alone is going to be £250 plus. D. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fred grant Posted January 31, 2007 Share Posted January 31, 2007 agree with dave - makes a change!! If i took 5 hours off from me farm to wire a alarm it would cost me more than 300 pounds in subsidees, never mind me hourly wages thats why i goes to van bits or similar and lets them do a proper job fred and hello from alice Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brambles Posted January 31, 2007 Share Posted January 31, 2007 Well what can I say Terry. Marvelous information and suggestions. Not everyone who reads these forums can afford an expensive alarm and locks so ideas for cheaper varients are welcome by many I am sure. On an off topic if I may, met a chap this afternoon doing up a 1974 VW campervan , a complete renovation job and looked marvelous inside and goes to get resprayed next week. Looking forward to seeing the completed job. J. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
icelander Posted January 31, 2007 Share Posted January 31, 2007 Thanks Terry for the advice. The Micromark 6 zones with 4 pirs and 2 magnetic switches with bell box purchased a few days ago for £31.99 from Homebase seems to worth it. Certainly not everyone with a motorhome can afford paying for the most expensive systems. So I reckon these low cost mods will help out some - perhaps not all - but I for one am grateful. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest peter Posted January 31, 2007 Share Posted January 31, 2007 Well done Terry for this info' why pay £50 an hour when you are capable of doing it yourself. Keep it up we all need to save cash where we can, plus it's quite satisfying to do it yourself. At least if it plays up, you know how it's wired. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Terrytraveller Posted January 31, 2007 Author Share Posted January 31, 2007 Thanks Rob, Peter and Jon for the kind words and encouragement. I went to Screwfix and purchased the Deadlocks this afternoon for £6.69 each and have fitted them - looks like they will do the job, so won't have to eat the motorhome after all, pity really because my daughter makes a very nice cake in any sort of shape!! If you missed the posting its on http://forums.outandaboutlive.co.uk/forums/forums/thread-view.asp?tid=6324&posts=4 Regards Terry Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mel E Posted February 1, 2007 Share Posted February 1, 2007 The problem with most cheapy alarms is that, even if they do work, the siren is just too weak to raise anyone's interest. Van Bitz will fit the 'siren from hell' which really is a lot louder (tho' within the legal decibel limit). This saved us from a big loss 'cos it really scared the would-be thieves away before they did anything more than wreck the garage compartment locks. You also get options like a unit to call your mobile phone when you're in the supermarket and the 'van is being broken into outside. I take Brian's point that most modern vans are much better protected, and I consulted Van Bitz on fitting a system to my Renault Master conversion - they said that they would have to disable the existing system and couldn't really add to it. It already has an internal motion sensor, sensors on all doors, an engine immobilser and one or two special tweeks - the whole system is an optional extra except in the UK, so it may not be fitted to foreign sourced Masters (or Movanos or Interstars). But if you have a coach built motorhome, you really do, in my view, need a proper system to cover the conversion doors and external compatment doors as well as all the clever stuff. ESPECIALLY if your m'home is LHD, because the whole of Europe is now a market for it, including certain eastern parts of Europe that gobble up such things and render them instantly invisible. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest starspirit Posted February 1, 2007 Share Posted February 1, 2007 I too think that Terry has the right idea. Why spend hundreds if you don't need to and have the ability not to? Do we really need sirens that wake the dead? And what happens if they go off accidentally - in the middle of the night - something for which car and van alarms are notoriuous? I for one feel that I only need a system that will alert me to the fact that an intruder is having a go and that any alarm system is really only a back. I much prefer to have so many visible extra locks etc that a thief just looks at them and goes next door to a softer target - well that's the theory anyway. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave Newell Posted February 1, 2007 Share Posted February 1, 2007 I fear I may have been misunderstood here. I was never saying that the cheaper diy installed alarms weren't any good or that you should pay hundreds if the £50 job does what you want. My only point was that it is unfair to compare a cheap diy installed alarm with an expensive professionally installed system towhit I refer you to the title of this thread "Van B(L)itz type alarm for £39-never". My point is quite simple and is this; Terry's alarm is fine, it does what he wants it to and he is happy and capable to do the installation himself but it is most definitely NOT a Van B(L)itz type alarm. The only similarity is it should wake you up if somebody tries to enter your 'van while you are inside it. D. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Basil Posted February 1, 2007 Share Posted February 1, 2007 I am with Terrytraveller on this one. The Van Blitz IMO is overpriced and no better than many others that can be bought, including TOAD Thatcham approved models with fitting certificate that work out less than half the cost. See how much notice is taken of any alarm that goes off by the way, thats how good and useful any alarm is cheap or expensive. I know of the theft of two and attempted theft of three other caravans from a secure (??) storage compound under CCTV, three of which were alarmed including the two that were removed, all Thatcham approved and all were defeated, one was wrenched of its fixings with some implement and dropped into a bucket of water, only know that one because it was one of the three that were left, don't know how they defeated the other two!! I am embaressed to say I recommended a freind to have a VanBlitz one fitted as at the time they seemed to be the 'market leader' according to the magazines and I have never seen such shoddy workmanship. Bas Edit spelling mistake Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest starspirit Posted February 1, 2007 Share Posted February 1, 2007 At £250 for a basic alarm system Dave seems to offer a fair compromise between the very expensive and the DIY, although looking at the activity on his webcam I can see why he is sitting in a nice warm office right now playing with the computer! Does the £250 include any locker doors Dave please? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave Newell Posted February 1, 2007 Share Posted February 1, 2007 Hi richard, no the £250 isa basic installation for, say, a panel van with interior light switching on all doors that could then be used to trigger the alarm. That one would also only have the standard alarm systems ultrasonic motion sensors in the cab. Can we please stop calling them "Van B(L)itz? The company name is Van Bitz, there is no L in it at all. I find this every bit as annoying as perople who spell my surname "Newall" instead of Newell. Does it matter? Well yes it does if a newcomer were to read the name as Van Blitz and then do a google search (other search engines are available) they would not find the company. As I said before my only point of contention with Terry's thread is the title, it is unfair to compare a diy fitted cheap alarm with a professionally installed and far more comprehensive system. D. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest JudgeMental Posted February 1, 2007 Share Posted February 1, 2007 Agree with Basil here... Van B…… playing on the fears of the 50 + motorhome demographic charge a hefty price for average equipment ( the name of equipment they use escapes me for now, but this has been discussed in other threads) Neither do they have a monopoly on “hell sirens" these are readily available elsewhere, albeit different names. They just give this equipment a provocative title and sit back, again simply playing on peoples fears. A top quality alarm from the likes of Cobra etc can be had for a fraction of these prices. A goggle search of accredited commercial vehicle alarm companies should be able to identify local fitters. By the way the same applys for locks as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Basil Posted February 1, 2007 Share Posted February 1, 2007 I will always know and call them Van Blitz because tha's how our freinds motorhome looked after their work! It took a couple of weekends care by us to make it look reasonable after the total lack of helpfulness when complained about. Yet another grab your money and stuff off outfit IMO!! It's people like this that spoil it for people like you Dave. Bas Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave Newell Posted February 1, 2007 Share Posted February 1, 2007 Judge Mental wrote: "A top quality alarm from the likes of Cobra etc can be had for a fraction of these prices. " not with all the extras you get with a Strikeback. The basic Cobra, Scorpion, Laserline or any other vehicle alarm system will not include extra door switches, PIR motion detection etc for "half the price". I have no comment regarding Van Bitz standard of work as I've never personally had anything done by them but I've seen plenty of their work and found no real reason for complaint. Its still completely unfair to compare a diy fit £40 domestic alarm with a sophisticated insurance approved professionally installed system. D. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mel E Posted February 1, 2007 Share Posted February 1, 2007 As I indicated above, I had a Van Bitz system fitted to our last motorhome. The workmanship was excellent with proximity sensors fitted to all doors, an internal motion sensor, a glass breakage sensor, a trailer attachment and the additional 'siren from hell'. It also has a built-in voltage sensor that detects any attempt to interfere with the system and sets it off. And, of course, it has a good engine immobiliser. Yes it was not cheap, costing, from memory, around £500. But it was Thatcham approved for commercial vehicle bases (Cobra and the like are mostly Thatcham approved only for cars.). The insurance saving plus the deterred theft made it more than worthwhile. And frankly, an alarm system without self protection and a decent immobiliser is little more than use than a goldfish out of water. If you think this is a rip-off, then by all means do something cheap! It never ceases to amaze me that people will spend upwards of £40,000 on a motorhome and then skimp like mad. You've seen them - wild camping next to a perfectly good camp site to save a night's camping fees. And so on. Mel E ==== (I feel a lot better having got that off my chest!) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest JudgeMental Posted February 1, 2007 Share Posted February 1, 2007 I am sorry but the above is simply nonsense. its not buying something cheap! its the same or better equipment for Gods sake! Specification mentioned above all readily available elsewhere at fraction of Van B... prices. It is not rocket science. It is all standard alarm equipment. I stand by what I say regards playing on the particular fears of motorhomers. I don’t mind spending money - but dislike being played for a mug Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Terrytraveller Posted February 1, 2007 Author Share Posted February 1, 2007 Just because I can't spell Blitz correctly and other “perople” can, no need to take the Mickey! Regarding protection given by the so called cheap alarm, as it happens my alarm has more protection than some professionally fitted alarms by Bitz, the Bitz fitted to my sisters MH at Taunton was really badly installed in some areas, un-sleeved wires hanging out of the reed switches which were flimsily mounted and falling to Bitz after a few months. My installation protects with magnetic switches and a PIR in 6 areas – 1. Habitation door, 2. Both Cab doors, 3. All opening windows, 4. Gas Locker, 5. External Locker Door. 6. PIR to cover movement if entry is via the skylight. 7. Interference protection for control box and wiring. 8. Ability to protect external property, Bike Racks, trailers etc… The above is an absolute minimum cover in my view. About the remarks of cheap alarm systems, this is the second Micromark I have installed, the first in a MH kept for 18 months, the present MH in which the system has been in constant operation for over three years now, no faults and no maintenance apart from changing the pp9 internal back up battery. The external 120 Db siren is mounted behind an outside vent, the internal sounder in the control box is around 80 dB, a further siren under the bonnet will also activate adding another 120 db to the din! As a useful spin off the under bonnet siren, will activate if the toilet seat is dropped down, indicating that the bathroom will soon become vacant. The alarm has to be at its maximum sensitivity setting for this facility, and may not be needed by some people! I agree with Dave, it is the labour charges which inflate the overall costs, and not the material cost so much, so price need not be an indicator of quality in this case. To make a good job of fitting your own alarm, you only need to be handy with a screwdriver and have a modicum of electrical sense, the instructions are well laid out and clear, most of us old codgers can replace a light switch and change a bulb, it takes a bit longer to install an alarm system, but its no more difficult than that, and its easier than your old Mechano set. Regards Terry Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Basil Posted February 1, 2007 Share Posted February 1, 2007 I accept that a one off is not neccessarily a definate indication of a pattern of poor quality, however it is the after service when someone feels they have a problem that counts to me, that is where the prablems lay. No matter how good back up service is it can never replace the lost hours doing a near 200 miles round trip to have something corrected, even if there was an indication of paying out of pocket expenses, which there wasn't. But to find a completely dismissive attitude and no real sympathy or support for a problem is poor after sales at best and at worst... well we are all customers somtime, place yourself in that position. Just my point of view. Bas Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave Newell Posted February 1, 2007 Share Posted February 1, 2007 Basil - 2007-02-01 3:37 PM I accept that a one off is not neccessarily a definate indication of a pattern of poor quality, however it is the after service when someone feels they have a problem that counts to me, that is where the prablems lay. No matter how good back up service is it can never replace the lost hours doing a near 200 miles round trip to have something corrected, even if there was an indication of paying out of pocket expenses, which there wasn't. But to find a completely dismissive attitude and no real sympathy or support for a problem is poor after sales at best and at worst... well we are all customers somtime, place yourself in that position. Just my point of view. Bas As I said earlier I have no personal experience of Van Bitz but I do know Eddie Jones and I find your friends experience quite surprising. I'm a little surprised that they chose to go all the way to Taunton as Van Bitz has agents dotted all over the country, was there not an agent closer who could have installed the system? Terry said; "Just because I can't spell Blitz correctly and other “perople” can, no need to take the Mickey!" Sorry about that Terry, no mickey taking intended, just a slip of the finger. The one difference is though that, by your own admission, yours is a deliberate mistake while mine was just a mistake. ;-) D. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
twooks Posted February 1, 2007 Share Posted February 1, 2007 wow, another heated debate, p'raps there's something being added to the water.We have to have a 'Thatcham alarm' in order to get the van insured, and I would think that this would be a requirement by most companies for anything over £25k-£30k. I find the main problem is that the battery in the remote doesn't seem to last very long, or perhaps it's a problem with the connections. Personally I much prefer Dave Newell's immobiliser - free to a good home! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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