Kennyd Posted December 22, 2018 Share Posted December 22, 2018 I have read much about MIRO My question is is there a defined specification for MIRO or do every manufacturer / country have there own Ideas & does the +-5% thing relate to all MIRO’S *-) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derek Uzzell Posted December 23, 2018 Share Posted December 23, 2018 There used to be an EC Directive (EC 92/21 if I remember correctly) that standardised the definition of a motorhome’s Mass In Running Order, but that was surperseded. Nowadays, the formula that produces a MIRO datum for a new motorhome is whatever the motorhome manufacturer specifies in their technical literature, and that specification may or may not include a 5% +/- build-weight ‘fudge factor’. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clive_Adams Posted December 23, 2018 Share Posted December 23, 2018 The only sure way to know what the MIRO is, have it weighed. I had mine weighed as soon as I could after purchase and I know where my plus or minus 5% went, the manufacturer took it lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brock Posted December 23, 2018 Share Posted December 23, 2018 MIRO now has to fall within the EU standard EN 1646-2 [cost you a few hundred quid to get a copy!] The standard specifies requirements intended to ensure the safety and health of people when they use motor caravans for temporary or seasonal habitation. The standard moved us away from a clearly defined MIRO to one that gives manufacturers some freedom of expression. You will have to read the manufacturers definition for each motorhome. EU countries should not vary from the EU standard. The +-5% reflects that there will be some variation in weights during manufacture and, also as a whole, EU weighbridges tend to work within a +-5% tolerance. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Billggski Posted December 23, 2018 Share Posted December 23, 2018 The hard copy is €47, but you can print it yourself for free. https://www.en-standard.eu/csn-en-1646-2-leisure-accommodation-vehicles-motor-caravans-part-2-user-payload/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kennyd Posted December 23, 2018 Author Share Posted December 23, 2018 Thanks for the replies, pretty much as I thought At 5 ton max weight with a MIRO of 3800 kg & 1200 kg payload, it seems 5% plus could loose me 190kg I lost 200 kg when upping the spec ( gearbox/engine/awning etc ) then possibly 190 kg That could be almost one third of my payload gone lol I’ll have to get it on a weight bridge & check Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kennyd Posted December 23, 2018 Author Share Posted December 23, 2018 Derek Uzzell - 2018-12-23 8:23 AM There used to be an EC Directive (EC 92/21 if I remember correctly) that standardised the definition of a motorhome’s Mass In Running Order, but that was surperseded. Nowadays, the formula that produces a MIRO datum for a new motorhome is whatever the motorhome manufacturer specifies in their technical literature, and that specification may or may not include a 5% +/- build-weight ‘fudge factor’. It’s a Dethleffs I have , I have tried looking for their definition of MIRO but have been unsuccessful Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robinhood Posted December 23, 2018 Share Posted December 23, 2018 Clearly defined at the last page here: https://www.dethleffs.co.uk/fileadmin/user_upload/dethleffs/uk/Downloads/Kataloge/2019/PL19_Moca_GB_screen.pdf The “mass in running order” according to VO (EU) 1230/2012 includes the empty vehicle weight, the driver’s weight calculated at 75 kg and 90% fuel capacity as well as the following basic equipment: filled water tank (with reduced water tank capacity), 1 x 11 kg gas bottle (100% filled) and a cable reel. (all subject to +/- 5% variation) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derek Uzzell Posted December 24, 2018 Share Posted December 24, 2018 Brock - 2018-12-23 6:03 PM MIRO now has to fall within the EU standard EN 1646-2.... This standard has been withdrawn and - although it is still referred to in plenty of motorhome manufacturers' brochures/trchnical specifications - it’s EU 1230 / 2012 that now matters. The following quote is from a brochure for the “Etrusco” motorhome marque "In accordance with VO (EU) 1230 / 2012 the “mass in running order” includes 20 litres of fresh water, 1 × Aluminium gas bottle (15 kg) and a cable drum (4 kg).” and it will be seen that no mention is made of weight-allowances for a driver or diesel-fuel, and that the 15kg allowance for an aluminium gas-bottle must either relate to a small-capacity canister or one that is empty. There’s also no mention of a +/- 5% tolerance. And this comes from a Pilote motorhome brochure “...Official seating classification and Mass in Running Order are calculated as accurately as possible in compliance with European legislation. These take into account basic and standard equipment with a tolerance of +/- 5%. Mass In Running Order figures include freshwater tanks with a capacity of 20 litres and diesel tanks 90% full, one gas bottle 90% full, but do not include the weight of the driver or other occupants. Available load capacity figures are the difference between Maximum Technically Permissible Laden Mass and Mass In Running Order. The manufacturer undertakes to provide a motorhome with an actual Mass In Running Order within the 5% tolerance of the indicated Mass In Running Order used for type approval...” This 2015 forum thread discussed the impact on usable-payload of rule-changes https://www.outandaboutlive.co.uk/motorhomes/news/european-rule-changes-means-more-motorhome-payload Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kennyd Posted December 24, 2018 Author Share Posted December 24, 2018 Robinhood - 2018-12-23 9:10 PM Clearly defined at the last page here: The “mass in running order” according to VO (EU) 1230/2012 includes the empty vehicle weight, the driver’s weight calculated at 75 kg and 90% fuel capacity as well as the following basic equipment: filled water tank (with reduced water tank capacity), 1 x 11 kg gas bottle (100% filled) and a cable reel. (all subject to +/- 5% variation) Thanks for that , I have been on that page just never read to page 74 ( general information) I’m guessing they don’t particularly want us to see it Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
monique.hubrechtsgm Posted December 24, 2018 Share Posted December 24, 2018 They are not relevant anymore. You will go back to British Standards (BS). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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