Speed of DVLA turnaround time for return of Ci category over 70 licence

[chris]

This is not a question of the process but a rough idea of the speed dvla take to renew licence . Husband has established, settled medical conditions. The envelope and and medical are done and ready to post but the licence expires may 5th. Almost 9 weeks away. As they date it from when they return it then I don't want to post too early or too late. We leave the country may 30th. . This is the 3rd time we have applied (79 this year for hubby). But I would like to know recent experience. Thanks Chris

[Derek Uzzell]

This link provides advice about driving while a driving-licence application is being processed by the DVLA.

 

https://tinyurl.com/y3x7fvts

 

While your husband should still be legally able to drive in the UK a vehicle requiring a C1 driving-licence entitlement, (as is warned on the link) this may not be the case while driving outside the UK.

 

Your husband’s present C1 licence expires on 5 May 2019 and you’ll be going abroad on 30 May 2019.

 

Although there are 2 months before your husband’s licence expires, you’d be wise to apply for its renewal now. (In fact, I’d go further and say you’d be very unwise not to apply now unless you are keen to play russian roulette with the DVLA’s turn-around times.) After all, if you apply now and receive the new licence back within a week, all that will have been lost will have been about 7-weeks ‘worth’ of a licence that has a 3-years duration.

 

As your husband’s medical conditions are unchanged, and his C1 licence has been renewed twice before, there’s no real reason to think the DVLA might deliberately delay renewal. But your husband is now 3 years older than he was at the last licence renewal and there’s no certainty what the DVLA will do.

 

(A cousin of mine was banned for a year for drink-driving. As the end of the 12-months ban approached she became obsessed over having her driving-licence reinstated on time (primarily so she could ‘stalk’ her estranged husband) and started to telephone the DVLA regularly (like daily!) to encourage them to process the reinstatement promptly. I warned her “Don’t **** with the DVLA” but she took no notice and, shortly before the 12-months was up, the DVLA extended the ban to 18 months because they (correctly) believed her behaviour suggested she was still drinking. Didn’t stop my cousin driving unlicenced during the next 6 months though...)

[747]

The new licence can be back to you in a week or so ....... or it could be a long process if additional medical tests deem to be needed.

 

My advice is to wait until nearer the deadline. You can still legally drive while it is being processed.

[ron.]

The DVLA advises that, so long as you meet certain conditions, you are able to drive in the Uk whilst your licence is being pressed and also abroad if the countries travelling in allow it. Has anyone any idea which countries these are please? Is there a list or is it a case of contacting five or more foreign organisations, whoever they are to find out?

[daviddwight]

I renewed mine on Feb 12th, it expires on the 11th Fed 2022 this seems to be a new thing in the past they have always expired on my birthday 8th April. My first application to renew my C1 6 years ago took 8 months I was told by DVLA that I could still drive whilst it was being processed. The last two times the licence has been back within 4 days.

[Derek Uzzell]

ron. - 2019-03-03 12:13 PM

 

The DVLA advises that, so long as you meet certain conditions, you are able to drive in the Uk whilst your licence is being pressed and also abroad if the countries travelling in allow it. Has anyone any idea which countries these are please? Is there a list or is it a case of contacting five or more foreign organisations, whoever they are to find out?

 

If the authorities in (say) France demanded to see a UK motorist’s driving-licence and the expiry-date on the licence that is presented has passed (as would be the case with Chris’s husband’s licence unless he gets a replacement by 30 May 2019 when they plan to go abroad) the motorist might decide to explain to the ‘foreign’ authorities that this is perfectly OK because the UK’s DVLA is still in the process of renewing the licence. And the best of luck...

 

(I hesitate to say this, but I’ve read plenty of peculiar questions on this forum and plenty of peculiar answers - but I don’t recall any question where the sensible way forward was so clear and the potential penalty for choosing otherwise so obvious.)

[Brian Kirby]

chris - 2019-03-03 10:25 AM

 

This is not a question of the process but a rough idea of the speed dvla take to renew licence . Husband has established, settled medical conditions. The envelope and and medical are done and ready to post but the licence expires may 5th. Almost 9 weeks away. As they date it from when they return it then I don't want to post too early or too late. We leave the country may 30th. . This is the 3rd time we have applied (79 this year for hubby). But I would like to know recent experience. Thanks Chris

Although not directly relevant to renewing your licence, the following are potentially relevant. Have you picked up on these four issues?

 

1 You may need one (or possibly two, depending on countries visited), International Driving Permits per insured driver post-Brexit.

 

2 Your existing driving licences may not be recognised as valid by the relevant authorities in EU/EEA states post-Brexit.

 

3 You will probably need an actual Insurance Green Card post-Brexit, to prove that you have valid legal minimum insurance to drive.

 

4 If your vehicle registration plates are "Europlates" (those on which the GB is enclosed within the European flag) you will probably need a separate "Vienna convention compliant" GB sticker on the (continental) o/s rear of your van. You may also need to change the plates, either to plates with no national recognition indication (in which case the GB sticker as above will be essential), or to plates that have the letters GB included within them (front and rear, with no European flag), in which case you should not need the GB sticker.

 

In view of the dates of your proposed trip, this should have become clear before you depart, but as there is now increasing mention of a delay to the Brexit date, this may not be the case.

 

1 above arises because when the UK leaves, it will become a "third country", and whether or not UK issued licences will continue to be recognised will depend on the form of Brexit. Were we to leave with no deal, it seems probable that our licences would need to be backed by IDPs. If there is a deal, your licences may, or may not, be recognised - depending on what is in the deal. If visiting Spain, a different IDP is required. If driving across France to Spain, then two IDPs will be required. More info here: http://tinyurl.com/y2madfg3

 

2 above may arise because our existing photocard licences contain an image of the European flag, which declares us to be EU citizens. When we leave, we will of course cease to be EU citizens, so our licences will be of questionable legality outside in the EU/EEA. I have been unable to find guidance specifically on this point.

 

3 arises because the EU's mutual recognition of vehicle insurances will die with our departure, so the translations on the back of your existing certificate of insurance will no longer provide the required legal declaration.

 

4 arises for the same reason as 2 above: i.e. the inclusion of "GB" within the European flag is a declaration that the vehicle is registered in an EU state which, post-Brexit, it will no longer be.

 

All the above are subject to the caveat expressed in 1 above: if leave with no deal, it seems probable all these issues will arise. If there is a deal, they may, or may not, arise - depending on what is in the deal.

 

If all/any do arise, they may eventually be resolved during negotiation of our future relationship with the EU.

[ron.]

Derek Uzzell - 2019-03-03 2:19 PM

 

ron. - 2019-03-03 12:13 PM

 

The DVLA advises that, so long as you meet certain conditions, you are able to drive in the Uk whilst your licence is being pressed and also abroad if the countries travelling in allow it. Has anyone any idea which countries these are please? Is there a list or is it a case of contacting five or more foreign organisations, whoever they are to find out?

 

If the authorities in (say) France demanded to see a UK motorist’s driving-licence and the expiry-date on the licence that is presented has passed (as would be the case with Chris’s husband’s licence unless he gets a replacement by 30 May 2019 when they plan to go abroad) the motorist might decide to explain to the ‘foreign’ authorities that this is perfectly OK because the UK’s DVLA is still in the process of renewing the licence. And the best of luck...

 

(I hesitate to say this, but I’ve read plenty of peculiar questions on this forum and plenty of peculiar answers - but I don’t recall any question where the sensible way forward was so clear and the potential penalty for choosing otherwise so obvious.)

 

Derek - I'm not sure whether your insult was aimed at me or the original poster but in case it was me I will try to enlighten you further as to my question.

 

Again, under certain conditions the DVLA allow you to drive beyond your licence expiry date - but that this 'may not' be accepted in other countries. You could also take the term as meaning that it 'might be' accepted under reciprocal agreements with some other countries, much the same as the reciprocal agreements that allow other countries to access DVLA information on us regarding other driving related offences abroad. So if we do have reciprocal agreements on the subject I would like to hear about them, if not fine. This doesn't seem a particularly daft question to me - but if you think different thats fair enough.

[chris]

Thanks for replies. Only one person seems to have had recent experience. The first time we applied we were told it would takes ages but it came back within 10 days and we ended up loosing 3 months on the licence.. Last time we applied mid march and it came back 5th may so that time took around 7 weeks due to errors from doctor re eye test. In 3 years time , if all well, I would love to be wintering in sunny Spain until at least the end of march so that is why I do not want to lose weeks off the new licence. I can drive anyway if it doesn't come back in time. Can't see why it is not dated from expiry date of last licence.

[Derek Uzzell]

ron. - 2019-03-03 9:13 PM

 

Derek - I'm not sure whether your insult was aimed at me or the original poster but in case it was me I will try to enlighten you further as to my question.

 

Again, under certain conditions the DVLA allow you to drive beyond your licence expiry date - but that this 'may not' be accepted in other countries. You could also take the term as meaning that it 'might be' accepted under reciprocal agreements with some other countries, much the same as the reciprocal agreements that allow other countries to access DVLA information on us regarding other driving related offences abroad. So if we do have reciprocal agreements on the subject I would like to hear about them, if not fine. This doesn't seem a particularly daft question to me - but if you think different thats fair enough.

 

My critical comment (not an “insult”) was aimed at Chris not you.

 

She has now said that she is licensed to drive the motorhome, which removes some of the potentail risk involved in her husband delaying his application for renewal of his C1 licence as, if the application were made (say) at the beginning of April and the new licence did not arrive at their home by end-May, Chris could still drive the motorhome while abroad and, if a check were made abroad, could present a valid C1 driving-licence for inspection.

 

The common sense objective should be for Chris’s husband (who I’m guessing normally drives the motorhome) to leave the UK on 30 May 2019 with a valid C1 photo-card licence in his possession and the ’safest’ way to achieve that objective is to send the application for the new licence to the DVLA sooner not later.

 

I admire Chris’s optimism in looking ahead 3 years (when her husband will have reached age-82) and wanting his renewed C1 licence to endure as long as possible, but the critical target-date is 30 May 2019 and if that date is ‘missed’ by delaying the application being sent to the DVLA, the consequences are potentially greater than losing a few weeks of the licence’s validity in 2022.

 

The risk of failing to receive the renewed licence by 30 May 2019 will increase the longer the application is delayed and not just because the DVLA’s processing might be slow. For instance the application could be lost on its journey to the DVLA or the new licence could be lost on its way back to Chris’s address. (My wife’s replacement driving-licence licence never made it home and, a couple of weeks ago, some financial documentation of mine disappeared somewhere in the postal system.)

 

Chris’s husband’s present licence expires on 5 May 2019. If the renewal application were submitted now and his new licence were received next week, the new licence’s duration would reduce by about 7 weeks from its potential 3-years lifespan. And if the application were submitted in (say) mid-April and the new licence was received within a week, the licence’s maximum duration would still reduce. Although Chris’s husband could still legally drive in the UK if the DVLA had received his renewal application prior to 5 May 2019, it would (and obviously this is just my view!) be preferable if he actually had the new licence in his hand before his current licence expired. Forget Brexit, forget arguments about the legality (or not) of driving abroad with an ‘expired’ photocard licence while the DVLA is processing the licence’s renewal, forget about a few weeks loss of 'licence-life’ in 2022 - just get the renewal application in now.

 

As it will have no impact on me (nor on other forum members) what Chris and her husband decide regarding when to send in the licence renewal application, this really comes down to “Please yourselves”. I’m not particularly risk-averse, but there’s absolutely no chance that (if I were in Chris’s husband’s shoes) once the medical had been carried out and the licence application documents prepared, I’d delay sending in the application merely to gain a short increase in the new licence’s duration 3 years in the future.

 

 

[StuartO]

I remember reading somewhere that the medical form remains valid for four months (for purposes of a licence application) from the date on which the doctor signs it, so you don’t have to submit it straight way. However medical issues are the most likely of any to be problematic when renewing a driving licence over the age of 70 so it makes no sense to delay applying for renewal when one of DVLA’s options (if they see medical reason to do so) is to decide not to allow driving while the application is being considered. There is no absolute right to drive while an application is being considered and it’s as well to remember that.

 

The process of enquiring into the nature and driving implications of medical problems can involve requirements for special medical investigations and assessments by specialists and can take many months. The costs can be considerable and they will almost always fall upon the applicant. For example suspected heart conditions will often require an echocardiogram (£300-400) and an angiogram (£500-800) and these will not be done by the NHS unless the individual needs them for purposes of clinical care - and even then there may be quite a waiting list.

 

Brinkmanship with the submission of the application for purposes of maximising the period of validity of a driving licence will only pay off if you are sure that you have no reason at all for DVLA to want to pursue further medical enquiry before issuing the licence. If you are a motorhomer who tours abroad, it will often pay to get your ducks in a row in plenty of time.

[chris]

Thanks again. My enquiry related to anyone having recent experience. I realise that there are lots of issues involved with all this and probably it will be the last time he will apply for C1. I am 62 so can keep driving and we can even down plate the van easily anyway. Will update you all when the licence is issued hopefully.

[old grey mare]

*-) Not exactly a reply. I am having to pick up the reins as hubby as had a stroke and will never drive again. I will be 70 in 3 years and believe I must down plate my Hymer 634 from 3900 kgs to whatever I can drive at 70.

 

Am I correct that if I down plate my road tax will soar.

 

I will not find another motorhome as wonderful as this one is for both my dogs and hubby. That is not an option.

 

(?) Will I be informed by DVLA on what is required of me.

 

I did look at the DVLA website, I failed to understand a word! (lol) *-)

 

A down loadable page would be excellent. My garage thinks that as a 'girlie' I am talking rubbish.

[747]

old grey mare - 2019-03-04 3:51 PM

 

*-) Not exactly a reply. I am having to pick up the reins as hubby as had a stroke and will never drive again. I will be 70 in 3 years and believe I must down plate my Hymer 634 from 3900 kgs to whatever I can drive at 70.

 

Am I correct that if I down plate my road tax will soar.

 

I will not find another motorhome as wonderful as this one is for both my dogs and hubby. That is not an option.

 

(?) Will I be informed by DVLA on what is required of me.

 

I did look at the DVLA website, I failed to understand a word! (lol) *-)

 

A down loadable page would be excellent. My garage thinks that as a 'girlie' I am talking rubbish.

 

If you have the C1 on your licence (given as standard up to 1997 I believe) , you can take the medical at 70 and continue driving without downplating.

[chris]

Approximately 56 days before your license runs out you will get an automatic renewal letter. Easy to fill in and send back but dont do this if you wsnt to kerp C1. If you want to keep your c1 category go online to gov. UK and search for D2 /D4 pack. https://www.gov.uk/dvlaforms select the D2/D4 pack and it will be posted out. You then need a medical where the doctor fills in D4 for you and you complete D2. I used our gp twice and made copies of the forms and it cost approx £120 and they still made mistakes . This time I asked a lorry driver friend where they all went to get a medical and I booked this for £50. They knew what to do and I am very happy with their service. Blood pressure and eyes are tested. If you have any medical issues they wI'll be discussed. Dvla will send to your own doctor if they need more information. Only you know if you have established controlled medical issues. Diabetes and heart problems usually are the main concerns. If you do not want to go for this then check that your van can be downplated. Svtech do this as a paper exercise. Contact them soon to check this out first. Yes your road tax will go up...not sure how much but others will tell you. Personally I would aim to keep C1 and you can keep your lovely van for longer. Copy all the documents so you have copies for 3 years time too.. All the best. Christine

[Brian Kirby]

old grey mare - 2019-03-04 3:51 PM

 

*-) Not exactly a reply. I am having to pick up the reins as hubby as had a stroke and will never drive again. I will be 70 in 3 years and believe I must down plate my Hymer 634 from 3900 kgs to whatever I can drive at 70.

 

Am I correct that if I down plate my road tax will soar.

 

I will not find another motorhome as wonderful as this one is for both my dogs and hubby. That is not an option.

 

(?) Will I be informed by DVLA on what is required of me.

 

I did look at the DVLA website, I failed to understand a word! (lol) *-)

 

A down loadable page would be excellent. My garage thinks that as a 'girlie' I am talking rubbish.

Assuming you presently have a C1 licence, I think you have two questions to answer before you do anything.

 

First, could you satisfactorily use your van if its payload were reduced by 400kg (that is the reduction you would have to make to reduce its maximum permissible mass (MAM) to 3,500kg, which is the maximum weight you can drive without the C1 licence)?

 

Two, is there any medical reason at present why you might not pass the medical examination required to retain your C1 licence beyond age 70?

 

If the van is inoperable at 3,500kg MAM, two does not arise, but you will then need to decide whether to change it for a 3,500kg van, or find a different way to travel.

 

If you suspect you may not pass the vital medical (which will be at your expense - it is not provided by the NHS) in three years time, you will be obliged to down plate your Hymer (but see "one" above), or change it for a van already plated at 3,500kg MAM.

 

If you have taken the van to a weighbridge and weighed it fully laden, you will know how close to its plated MAM of 3,900kg it runs. However, I would suspect that a van originally plated at 3,900kg MAM would become actually, or very close to, inoperable if reduced to 3,500kg MAM.

 

The easiest (though not the most agreeable or cheapest) remedy might be to begin planning now to change the van to one that will work satisfactorily at 3,500kg MAM, so that you have ample time to research what is available before you are confronted with a "shotgun" decision. Then, you can move when suits you, rather than being driven by circumstances to Hobson's choice at the 11th hour.

 

And yes, perversely, your VED will rise with a lighter van; currently to £255 p/a.

[Derek Uzzell]

I’ve looked though OGM’s earlier postings, but I don’t think the age of her Hymer 634 motorhome has ever been stated.

 

Although it seems commonplace for UK-specification right-hand-drive early/mid-2000s B-634 models to have a MAM of 3900kg, it’s certain that left-hand-drive equivalents marketed outside the UK will have been offered with a 3500kg MAM.

 

As Chris has advised above, SVTech

 

http://www.svtech.co.uk/

 

can advise on the viability of ‘downplating’ OGM’s motorhome and - assuming that the exercise proves to be practicable - the downplating could be delayed until nearer to OGM’s 70th birthday, thus saving on Vehicle Excise Duty.

[Brian Kirby]

Derek Uzzell - 2019-03-04 6:15 PM............….Although it seems commonplace for UK-specification right-hand-drive early/mid-2000s B-634 models to have a MAM of 3900kg, it’s certain that left-hand-drive equivalents marketed outside the UK will have been offered with a 3500kg MAM...……………...

Just had a quick look on Mobile-de and found three, all registered between 2003 - 7, and all are listed @ 3,500kg with none above. So, clearly possible to operate at that weight. It will then be for OGM, husband, and dogs, to decide whether they can comfortably trim their load to fit within their newly reduced payload if they down plate to 3,500kg MAM.

[Derek Uzzell]

A 2003 “Camping-Car“ magazine quoted a payload of 480kg for a 2004 model-year Hymer B634 on a Ducato Maxi AL-KO chassis with 2.8JTD motor. (I’ve no idea what ‘formula’ was used to produce the payload datum, but the weight seems a mite optimistic to me.)

 

If OGM has her motorhome weighed, the truth will out...

[old grey mare]

:-D Thank you all so much. The water has become less muddy and I now understand most of it. I presently have no medical problems and hope to keep it that way........1!

 

We will keep Skylark for a few more years! (lol)

 

[jak]

chris - 2019-03-03 11:31 PM

 

Thanks for replies. Only one person seems to have had recent experience. The first time we applied we were told it would takes ages but it came back within 10 days and we ended up loosing 3 months on the licence.. Last time we applied mid march and it came back 5th may so that time took around 7 weeks due to errors from doctor re eye test. In 3 years time , if all well, I would love to be wintering in sunny Spain until at least the end of march so that is why I do not want to lose weeks off the new licence. I can drive anyway if it doesn't come back in time. Can't see why it is not dated from expiry date of last licence.

 

I having just turned 70 submitted an application on 8th December and unfortunately I am still waiting. I do have pre-existing medical problems which are strictly monitored and reviewed. The condition is accepted and my specialist filled in all the appropriate forms and submitted them as requested. The DVLA after 3 months have just sent me a letter telling me to stop driving immediately claiming I have refused to be monitored or reviewed and stated I must re-submit ie start the whole process over again once I agree to my condition being monitored and reviewed!

 

Their statement is grossly incorrect - if I did what they claim I would be dead! In a subsequent telephone conversation with the Medical Group they conceded that the statement was incorrect but went on to claim the Specialist had incorrectly ticked a box on the form and they were using this as validation for refusal. I and the specialist are currently demanding evidence from the DVLA to substantiate these claims as the specialist is admant he filled the forms in correctly and advised me has had many problems with this section of the DVLA.

 

I had presumed I would have recieved a replacement licence by this time and made arrrangements to travel to France shortly but this is now all up in the air. In an attempt to speedily rectify the matter the specialist has submitted a written statement confirming my medical status by email as suggested by the DVLA. However when I subsequently contacted the Medical Group the representative said the they had n't recieved any email and did not anticipate getting it from their central communications section for between 3 and 5 days! Which begs the question why bother with emails. I am advised that all correspondence is hand scanned into their system.

 

In some respects I find dealing with the DVLA is very much a 'good cop bad cop' scenario. Many of the representatives one speaks to are very helpful but unfortunately others seem intent on creating a wall of indifference with a standardised response of 'its been elevated to the supervisor' or 'we get thousands of letters a day sir'. I appreciate the Medical Group have a very serious and demanding task to undertake but one gets the impression they are an under resourced, overworked, section which works to strict time targets and this unfortunately adversely affects their decision making.

 

It really seems that one takes pot luck with them and if you are planning anything I would err on the side of caution whatever that maybe. My horror is they ignore my consultants statement and push me back on another 3 month submission cycle on the basis of an alledgely incorrectly ticked box.

[chris]

Thanks for your example. Posted ours but I have made a copy of everything sent. I hope yours gets sorted soon. Thanks . Chris

[jak]

I am sure my experience is not typical but it serves as a warning of the potential pitfalls of presuming the processing will be straightforward if you have a medical problem. Unfortunately there appears to be a significant group of people whose applications for one reason or another appear to take unreasonably long periods to process - 12 months or more. I am endeavouring to avoid getting drawn in to a cycle of re-submissions which judging by the documents they have just issued to me seems to be a potential scenario. The statements they have made in their correspondence are factually incorrect and of a nature that could, in the wrong hands, be potentially very damaging.

 

The DVLA undoubtedly have the upper hand and realistically there is little one can do to speed things up. If they start to demand additional medical data to support an application the costs start to spiral. Legally any challenge is via the magistrates court which is both very slow and potentially expensive.

 

I am afraid if the matter is n't resolved soon I will have to consider selling the Dethleffs which will be soul destroying as I really enjoy touring especially in Europe.

 

PS I trust that was n't you that I unintentionally ignored in the Auxerre aire last Sept/Oct.

 

 

[longtemps]

Received mine in two and a half weeks. Used D4Drivers for the medical which cost £50, saving £70 if I had had my med at the local GP.

[Chudders]

Just got mine back icluding C1/D1 entitlement (70 years old I'm afraid)

It took 3 weeks but the GP did everything inc. eyesight test but got the figures wrong . Had a form sent back telling me that I did not meet the eyesight criteria for the C1/D1 renewal but that if I wanted to accept just the C1 then eyesight did meet the criteria (which is apparently the same as a standard car licence) I had to tick a box, sign and send it back which I was happy with. They also enclosed another form I could get completed regarding proper eyesight test if I wanted to. As a coincidence I had an optician appointment a few days later and she filled in the form with correct eysight figures and I returned that to DVLA. They then reissued the licence

with all categories. About 3 weeks in total but for the above would have been much quicker.

However I did renew it a little early (month before 70th) and the licence runs from the date they renew it not the date of your 70th birthday. The 90 days mentioned prior to birthday is apparentely for ordinary car licence renewal not one involving D4 GP forms etc. (I did ring and query that)

I also found the DVLA,' view your driving licence' , website very useful. That is updated several days before you physically get your licence back in the post so you can check the renewal progress

My GP charged me £50. I am type 2 diabetic but DVLA not bothered about that.

Dave