pusscat Posted June 6, 2019 Share Posted June 6, 2019 A little advice called for…please don’t laugh! Swift Rio 320 2016, factory fitted 100w solar, have accidentally left lights on once (flat van and leisure battery, van bat replacement, was told leisure bat should be ok…) then over winter, left EC400 on to smart charge batteries via solar, both flat, again new van battery and again told leisure should be OK. Both instances, leisure went below 9 volts, van to about 2… Bar my stupidity in the two instances above, I’ve never been confidant the solar has been charging the batteries correctly. The Solar amps on the EC400 display reads say 2 amps for a second or so then goes to 0 for say about 20 seconds and so on, even when the leisure battery was 11.6 volts and in full sun. When I switched from Smart solar to ‘to leisure’. Then a high steady bat amp but all a bit random. Maybe a result of the leisure batter not functioning fully? I have emailed Sargent re my concerns, had one response with a diagram on how to test the solar is working OK, but I don’t have a volt meter and the test point junction boxes are hidden. Did contact them again but no response back so far… So, after reading an article on Alpha Batteries about motorhome AGM batteries, non- optimised EC400 charge rates and also on aandncaravanservices site re the not so efficient ‘smart solar’ charging and the more efficient votronic regulator direct to the two batteries, suffice to say I’m not confidant and so I’m wanting a change! Decided the old AGM leisure battery was pooped so splashed out on Yuasa L36 efb from Alpha B. I’ve had to move the battery as in the Rio it’s under the driver’s seat with only enough space to be laid on it’s side…so space made in cupboard to side of driver seat so the new one can be upright….can also vent battery to outside here. So now I’m wanting to install a Votronic MMPT 250 Duo. I’ve had a look at the installation diagram but had a few question folks maybe able to help me with. The cable that goes into the Sargent reg from solar , a same sized cable comes out, disappears then a similar looking black cable appears on the other side of the van going into the EC400. Wiring diagram tells me the P14 input is the solar…but I can’t find any markings on the back of the EC400 to confirm which input / lead this is… Can anyone confirm if it’s the one on the file attachment please? As I was going to remove the Sargent reg, I was going to replace it with a terminal block to effectively join the ‘solar input’ to ‘battery output’ (obviously covering up solar panel and disconnecting solar input to EC400 first..). Then was going to connect the end that originally inputted to the EC400 via a block and extension to the Votronic that would be placed near the Leisure battery. A few questions…anyone know if the cable that’s already installed from the Sargent reg to EC400 would be OK to connect to the cable coming from the solar? Would I be able to use the same spec cable from the EC400 to the new Votronic reg? Also Aandcaravans makes the point a solar panel is like a big power source and should effectively have an inline fuse…I was going to place one at the old point of the Sargent reg, one with 2.5mm2 cable (12awg) but wasn’t too sure on the fuse to use. If I needed to isolate the solar panels at all say to stop over trickle charging, could I do this by just removing this fuse? I’ve also added a photo of the planned connections and size of wires that I hope to use. Anyone have any advice or comments? Much appreciated, Pusscat. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pusscat Posted June 6, 2019 Author Share Posted June 6, 2019 Here's the back of the EC400... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aandncaravan Posted June 6, 2019 Share Posted June 6, 2019 Natalie writes for Allan - You have grasped the concept perfectly. 1. The old EC400 solar input cable will have only very minor voltage drop so ok to re-use. 2. Because the Votronic output to the Starter battery will only be low current and designed to primarily 'top up' the Starter battery it doesn't need to be 'fat' cable 2.5mm will be ok. 3, Because the Votronic to Habitation area battery is short distance and only passing about 10amps, 6mm cable will be perfect. 4.Yes 10a fusing at the old Sargent junction is the perfect place for the Solar Panel 'isolation' fuse The standard Sargent Solar regulator is very inefficient, low technology, poor quality, unreliable and has very poor voltage regulation. Not unknown for the voltage regulation to fail totally and put out 17v+. It also has poor voltage control in that when the Solar Panel goes from shade to full sun suddenly, the regulator is slow in responding and spikes higher than 15v would get through for a fraction of a second before the Solar regulator brought the voltage back under control. This sometimes caused an error or 'freezes' the display, which a 're-boot' sometimes cures. Sargent are aware of this. You should notice a huge difference in charging with the Votronic wired as you describe. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pusscat Posted June 6, 2019 Author Share Posted June 6, 2019 Thanks Allan / Natalie, wow! I think I can start buying things! Anyone any guidance on which is the p14 connector on the back of the ce400 unit at all? Ta muchly! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pusscat Posted June 6, 2019 Author Share Posted June 6, 2019 Right...had a good look at the back of the EC400 and found where p14 the solar input actually is...I was way off in the above photo, if anyone wants to know, it’s top right of the pcb but directly below another plug, easy to miss. Ive also taken the microwave out, never used it and wanted the extra space for tea and coffee stuff ...behind that was the cable from the sargent solar reg unit, the battery side. This was then connected to a couple of cables, one brown with a orange stripe, other white with an orange stripe. The plug into the p14 socket of the EC400 has one cable in it, the brown with organic stripe. I think i’ve found the white with orange strip, that goes into the Sargent charger...makes sense. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pusscat Posted June 7, 2019 Author Share Posted June 7, 2019 Slight correction, after speaking to Sargent, looks like the police the white and orange from the reg into the earth for the motorhome...the white and orange going into the charger is just the normal earth... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pusscat Posted June 16, 2019 Author Share Posted June 16, 2019 Fitted and working! I was able to fit the new yuasa L36 efb upright and by creating a platform with straps to hold the battery in place was actually able to increase the space in the cupboard! The solar reg is in place and has been charging the battery nicely without the need for the ec400 to be on. It’s also about 75cm cable length from the leisure battery. The old one was probably around the 6 m mark now I’ve had a look at the cabling so hopefully, that alone will make a huge difference. I’ve had the satisfaction of the battery voltage going up via solar witch I can’t remember seeing with the old set up... The hardest part was threading a while re behind the shower cubicle. A piece of long downing and lots of trial and error poking helped! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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