Guest peter Posted February 28, 2007 Share Posted February 28, 2007 It's tongue in cheek Frank, and I'm on Vodka and Coke. As an ex caravanner I don't know what this thing is with MHers and tuggers. Perhaps it's snobbery, or a mines bigger than yours sort of thing. Were all campers as far as I'm concerned. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Frank Wilkinson Posted February 28, 2007 Share Posted February 28, 2007 peter - 2007-02-28 11:46 PM It's tongue in cheek Frank, and I'm on Vodka and Coke. As an ex caravanner I don't know what this thing is with MHers and tuggers. Perhaps it's snobbery, or a mines bigger than yours sort of thing. Were all campers as far as I'm concerned. Yes Peter, I had realised that you were tongue in cheek and well said about caravanners. We all share the same hobby but with slightly different equipment. I think that you may be on track with the snobbery angle. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Basil Posted March 1, 2007 Share Posted March 1, 2007 I'm with you two on the caravanners issue, I think that its motorhomers that are the worst nieghbours myself, but I don't keep harping on about it. As to why some continually knock I can only think they are jealous of the caravan outfits better payload and ability to be free from the living quarters when camped, probably also explains why so many tug a car around nowdays!! :-| :-| :-| Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest starspirit Posted March 1, 2007 Share Posted March 1, 2007 [tonight!Anyway, I'm out of this thread now. As soon as someone starts with totally off-topic snide remarks about CC members again, I think that the best thing for me to do is escape.Frank - feeling touchy again are we? That was not a snide remark about CC and CCC - members merely a comment based on letters seen in BOTH CC and CCC magazines. It was not even off topic as it was Top Gear related having been, in my view, one of the most memorable tongue in cheek stunts ever.What is it with you? Are you just a bad tempered old git who can never see anyone else's point of view and therefore feels obliged to take every comment as a personal insult?Or is it just that you love to have a pop at me?If you think that my comment was aimed at you, you are severely deluded sunshine - because you just ain't important enough.There is nothing wrong with most, but not all, caravanners just as there is nothing wrong with most, but not all, motor caravannners. Snobbery exists in both and is best ignored, and on any site or Aire we will chat and share a coffee or tea with anyone friendly enough to chat with us.Sadly however in recent years the chattiness has considerably decreased on all sites - not just CC sites, which I have not used for several years now and don't miss. Some of my best friends are CC members - and some even tow a caravan - but they, fortunately, do not have their heads so far up their own bums that it distorts their thinking.Get a life. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Frank Wilkinson Posted March 1, 2007 Share Posted March 1, 2007 Starspirtit said:The caravan towing stunt last year was hilarious - but with a sensible under current methinks - and had many CC and CCC members up in arms. Funniest of all was that the more they complained the more we all laughed I rest my case! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spartan3956 Posted March 1, 2007 Share Posted March 1, 2007 This is for Dickvc2 1000cc against nearly 4000 cc not much of a contest mind you the 0 to 60 times speak for themselves as the bike wins hands down, Mind you I am Biased. As for for Japanese being boring they might be boring although the new models have a good turn of speed and at least they dont spend most of their time in the dealers garage being repaired nice Flair and style when on the ramps. Speed doesnt kill I agree on its own, its poor driving accompanied with speed in the wrong place that kills Poor observations and re-action to Hazards, i advocate that every driver should have to take an advanced driving and riding course to teach them how to drive properly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dickyc2 Posted March 1, 2007 Share Posted March 1, 2007 colin the reason vauxhall got the vans was because renault needed a factory in europe to build their vans you state vivaro/trafic (i will spell it correctly) movano/master built in luton,otherwise the ambulance service wouldn't use them(something about supporting british industry) sorry to correct you mate, but also nissan vans are built in the same factory now seeing as renault now own nissan :D :D spartan3956 i do like bikes but can't ride one (i fall off my feet) heres hoping for good weather for you mate :D Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mel B Posted March 1, 2007 Share Posted March 1, 2007 For the record, I didn't think much of the caravan stunt, bit too close to home for me. As at the time I was a member of the CC, I could be classed as one of the people who was 'up in arms', so I believe Starspirit's comment was valid and not a 'pop' at them for the sake of it, it was genuine and in relation to the programme Top Gear.:-S Can we please, once and for all, put the ruddy CC issue to bed once and for all! I'm sure I and many others are totally sick to the back teeth of it. Frank and Starspirit - The pair of you just like to jump on each others corns which unfortunately then causes friction and bad feeling - up until now you two were getting on so well and consequently the forum has been a better place ... now here we go again. :-( I'm sure may of us would be really grateful if you could just play nice. :-) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
twooks Posted March 1, 2007 Share Posted March 1, 2007 There's often too much testosterone dripping under the tv for my liking, and an hour is sometimes too much of an overdose, but I loved the one the other week in the states when they bought bangers instead of hiring them. Also enjoyed watching Ellen MacArthur and Jodie thingy beat the wotsits out of that crummy car; and the one with the caravan taking the michael of the clubs. B-) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian Kirby Posted March 1, 2007 Share Posted March 1, 2007 Well, its gone quite a way from Clive's original post, so I guess a bit more won't do any harm!Clarkson has his moments, but the programme overall, although it can be amusing, does seem to me to play to an irresponsible approach to road use. It isn't the stunts, the burning rubber, or the love of speed for it's own sake that bug me, it's that whole undercurrent of self indulgence and nudges and winks about responsible driving that I find unpalatable.He just seems to play to a "boy racer" gellery, who would be far better off not being excited any more than they already are.Speed kills? Of course it doesn't. As has been said, what kills is excessive speed in the wrong hands/place. However, given the numbers of wrong hands/places around, you can see why speed cameras and speed limits grow in number. Spoilsports? Of coures they are. Half my favourite roads now have 40mph limits on them, in the middle of the country, no houses, no drives, good visibility and quite comfortably negotiable at 60 hitherto without a squeal of protest from the tyres. Then, yesterday, leaving a local village, still a good 400 yds inside its 40mph zone, still passing blind drives behind hedges, I was overtaken at about 60 by a VW Passat. Absolutely outrageous, irresponsible and completely reckless. Somehow, Clarkson just came to mind! It just seemed to represent an attitude I think he subliminally fosters, and I think he shouldn't.How fast is yours? Really? On the M6 at rush hour? 0 - 60 in 3.7 secs? Really? Very impressive! Of course, bikes go even faster? Really? All quite safe and legal of course. All in among that inevitable mix of OAPs, inattentive chatterers, LHD trucks, mobile phoners, lane hoggers, drivers who only passed their tests that morning, the sanctimonious 68 mph overtaking lane resident, the impatient "undertaker", the aggressive tailgater. Ooooh yes, 0-60 in 3.7 easily! Boring, I know, but grow and up come to mind.No, of course you can't really, can you? It's all for the open country really. The wind in the hair, the top down, the swoop and the rush, the horse just round the left hander! It is a shame, and maybe it's just the affect on me of the crowded South East, with its narrow two lane roads full of cars, trucks, vans, horses, cyclists, caravans, motorhomes, dust carts, and what have you, all nose to tail and proceeding forever at the pace of the slowest. The fun has gone and the restrictions are, I fear, here to stay. There really is nowhere it is safe to let rip any more in this part of this country, apart from a few hundred yards of road here and there, between the Gatsos and the speed limits, and the thought of having power enough for 150 mph, but never being able to get the thing out of third gear, would drive me more distracted than I already am. Guess that's why my other car is a four year old diesel Renault Scenic. Mind you, downhill and with a following wind it'll top 100 and still pulling, but not around here! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave Newell Posted March 1, 2007 Share Posted March 1, 2007 For anyone who, like me, missed it on Sunday it is repeated tonight on BBC2 at 7.00 pm, thats just 16 minutes away! D. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave Newell Posted March 1, 2007 Share Posted March 1, 2007 Whaaaatttt!!!! The b@$t@rd$ have replaced the advertised programme with "the best of top gear", with no explanation of why!!!!! D. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
colin Posted March 1, 2007 Share Posted March 1, 2007 dickyc2 - 2007-03-01 6:03 PM colin the reason vauxhall got the vans was because renault needed a factory in europe to build their vans you state vivaro/trafic (i will spell it correctly) movano/master built in luton,otherwise the ambulance service wouldn't use them(something about supporting british industry) sorry to correct you mate, but also nissan vans are built in the same factory now seeing as renault now own nissan :D :D spartan3956 i do like bikes but can't ride one (i fall off my feet) heres hoping for good weather for you mate :D You would think with half my friends and family working there I might have some idea, especialy after asking one at chrismas weather they made master/morvano there yet and being told there was no plans to ;-) and I can't even spell it correctly :'( Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest starspirit Posted March 2, 2007 Share Posted March 2, 2007 Mel B - 2007-03-01 6:15 PM For the record, I didn't think much of the caravan stunt, bit too close to home for me. As at the time I was a member of the CC, I could be classed as one of the people who was 'up in arms', so I believe Starspirit's comment was valid and not a 'pop' at them for the sake of it, it was genuine and in relation to the programme Top Gear.:-S Can we please, once and for all, put the ruddy CC issue to bed once and for all! I'm sure I and many others are totally sick to the back teeth of it. Frank and Starspirit - The pair of you just like to jump on each others corns which unfortunately then causes friction and bad feeling - up until now you two were getting on so well and consequently the forum has been a better place ... now here we go again. :-( I'm sure may of us would be really grateful if you could just play nice. The caravan stunt on Top Gear was a very valid caricature of how not to do it and as such, I reckon, is a very good learning tool about how quickly things can go from innocent ignorance to very badly and dangerously wrong. Things were just fine until Frank just had to have another unwarranted go at me. My first thought was to ignore the cantankerous old git but then I thought why should I let him impose his illogical and biased views on me as he has others? I've seen far too much of his attacks against others on here, many of whom do not wish to make a fuss - well I for one will not put up with it. I have no axe to grind with Frank, the CC ,or anyone else - live and let live has always been my philosophy, but I do have the right to put my point of view and not have pompous self righteous over protesting people attack me personally. I enjoy an argument, a rant, and a good stir as much as the next man (or Lady) and I have no problem with anyone taking issue and disagreeing with any of my ideas, comments and thoughts. Some of these are deliberately controversial and designed to get a response, but I will not tolerate personal attacks. There is nobody else on here who takes this unprovoked attitude to attacking others so perhaps one has to ask oneself why? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mike Chapman Posted March 2, 2007 Share Posted March 2, 2007 Hello Colin, Nothing to do with Top Gear but to the best of my knowledge (5 months out of date now) the only Renault based vans built at Luton were Vivaro, Primastar and Trafic. Not sure where the Movano and Master are built but not at Luton or Sunderland. Hope the spelling is correct. ;-) Regards, Mike. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Frank Wilkinson Posted March 2, 2007 Share Posted March 2, 2007 Starspirit previously said:Anything that upsets tuggers is alright with me.Starspirit said in this thread:The caravan towing stunt last year was hilarious - but with a sensible under current methinks - and had many CC and CCC members up in arms. Funniest of all was that the more they complained the more we all laughed I rest my case! Again! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave Newell Posted March 2, 2007 Share Posted March 2, 2007 Is it that time of the month already? Who's turn is it to pick up the teddies this time? D. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Frank Wilkinson Posted March 2, 2007 Share Posted March 2, 2007 Yes well, I'm sorry Dave but I make a huge point nowadays of not engaging with him in any way as I know what is likely to happen. But when he again starts with the snide little digs against CC and now CCC members he just deserves a response I'm afraid.Ask yourself whether this comment is necessary in the debate about whether or not 'Top Gear' is a responsible programme:The caravan towing stunt last year was hilarious - but with a sensible under current methinks - and had many CC and CCC members up in arms. Funniest of all was that the more they complained the more we all laughed This remark isn't, as he tries to tell us, to do with the topic - it's another deliberate dig at caravanners and as he says, the more the caravanners complained about the way that 'Top Gear' portrayed them, the more he laughed. Why does he feel the need to make these snide comments all the time? If he'll keep on topic and stop the insidious and sly little remarks you won't ever hear a word from me on the subject of Starspirit. Believe me, I want nothing to do with him but I will not sit by and let him constantly traduce a whole class of people who are no different from us. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave Newell Posted March 2, 2007 Share Posted March 2, 2007 Frank, I'll say to you and Richard what I said to my children when they had squabbles; I don't care who started it just pack it in , both of you! You picked up on it as if it were aimed at you personally so you're as much to blame as Richard. Now can you two grow up and stop squabbling like kids, please? D. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bazza454 Posted March 2, 2007 Share Posted March 2, 2007 Well said Dave. At least when children squabble, it's all over in five minutes and then they are the best of friends again. With these two, it seems to go on and on until it becomes really boring. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest peter Posted March 2, 2007 Share Posted March 2, 2007 Frank....He only does it to wind you up, as he knows you will be lurking out there waiting to pounce on any adverse comments about Caravanners. Just ignore it and the thread will eventually go down the list and die. I must admit it does seem a bit childish at times. Especially in another thread about technology started by Brian he backs up Brian's view that people should not try and impose their views on others. But never misses a chance to have a pop at Caravanners and the CC & CCC. Either he has a morbid hatred of them or is doing as I said and winding you up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest starspirit Posted March 2, 2007 Share Posted March 2, 2007 The really silly thing is that my original piece about the Top Gear stunt was never designed to have a go at anyone - least of all Frank! Believe me when I say that he really is too insignificant to warrant me waiting for a chance to wind him up and he deludes himself, as megalomaniacs and bullies often do, if he thinks otherwise. I made a valid point on a valid Top Gear thread about a wonderfully politically incorrect feature related to our leisure pastime - but with a serious message. I also think that CC and CCC members (and anyone else) who got uppity enough about it to write to a magazine were silly and narrow minded and are worthy of a chuckle at. I have never been one to hold a grudge although I am becoming prepared to make an exception in Frank's case in the face of his continuing hostility and pompous self righteousness. You might find, if anyone can be bothered to look back through our encounters, that I have never instigated nastiness - it always starts with Frank getting nasty about something silly, often said tongue in cheek, and turning it into a personal attack on him which it never was in the first place. Peter - it was not an adverse comment about caravanners - just a comment on an insignificantly small minority of caravanners with no sense of humour or proportion. I don't have a morbid hatred of anyone - live and let live - which includes everyone's right to free speech - and everyone else's right to reply - but not unwarranted personal attacks. Thank you to those of you who have sent a PM or email in support of my point of view, it is appreciated. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
colin Posted March 2, 2007 Share Posted March 2, 2007 Mike Chapman - 2007-03-02 11:16 AM Hello Colin, Nothing to do with Top Gear but to the best of my knowledge (5 months out of date now) the only Renault based vans built at Luton were Vivaro, Primastar and Trafic. Not sure where the Movano and Master are built but not at Luton or Sunderland. Hope the spelling is correct. Regards, Mike. B-) Movano,Master and Interstar are built at the SOVAB factory in Batilly, France B-) I would just like to say dispite my having friends and relatives working at Luton and myself being a GM Partner my views on how good this van is unbias I hope. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
carioca Posted March 2, 2007 Share Posted March 2, 2007 the trouble with replies that are sometimes said tongue in cheek is that when it is written & not spoken you carn't see the expressions on peoples faces , so the comments often get misinterperated :-S hope this makes sense & dosen't set another round off :$ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave Newell Posted March 2, 2007 Share Posted March 2, 2007 carioca - 2007-03-02 9:21 PM the trouble with replies that are sometimes said tongue in cheek is that when it is written & not spoken you carn't see the expressions on peoples faces , so the comments often get misinterperated :-S hope this makes sense & dosen't set another round off :$ I know what you're saying but this is used all too often as an excuse for grumpy old gits having a pop at each other. Every time Richard mentions the caravan club Frank assumes its some kind of "snide dig" at him. But then Richard does seem to take great delight in baiting Frank. I just think its time they both grew up, apologised to each other for misunderstanding each others comments (and to the rest of us for being @r$£hol£$ so frequently) and let us all get on with our miserable little lives in relative peace. D. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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