Hella Main Beam Headlight Corrosion

[BruceM]

When I bought this van about six years ago I noted that the main beam 90mm Hella headlights showed rust corrosion at the bottom of the reflector silvering so replaced them.

It’s worth noting that I have four Hella headlights, two for main beam and two for dipped. The side lights are separate.

 

About three years ago I noted some minor rust corrosion returning.

 

Recently I’ve noticed condensation on the inside of the main beam lenses and also increased corrosion.

 

And then today I wandered out to the van and discovered one of the main beam headlights a quarter full of water! – see photo (bulb removed).

 

The rear rubber boots are fully fitted so anyone have an idea how water is getting in?

 

Might it just be condensation – in which case why, given the dipped beam lights show no problems?

Is this a known issue with this brand of headlights?

Is there a workaround or possibly an installation tip that will avoid a reoccurrence of the problem after I replace them?

[peterjl]

Hi. I know nothing about your light but years ago I had a light on a VW that collected water when it rained. Tried everthing to seal with no success sooooo I drilled a drain hole in the bottom and a small air hole higher up. Never filled with water again.

 

peter

[Derek Uzzell]

Bruce

This Hella webpage relates

https://www.hella.com/techworld/uk/Technical/Automotive-lighting/Condensation-in-headlight-836/ 

With this type of glass-fronted light, although some internal rusting/corrosion might be expected from condensation after 3 years (and have worsened significantly by 6 years) the cause of the major water ingress into this particular headlamp will almost certainly be due to failure of the joint where the glass front is bonded to the rear reflector.The headlamp has died of old age and (realistically) there's nothing you can do to protect against this issue when you fit a brand new unit.

[onecal]

You may find that when you replace them with updated new ones you may have no more issues

Of course you must use the correct bulbs recommended  and fitted correctly  

Regards 

[Derek Uzzell]

At least a replacement unit will not be outrageously expensive

https://www.ebay.co.uk/p/653124621

I have a Hyundai i20 car with halogen-bulb headlamps. A replacement headlamp unit isn't cheap, but swankier i20 models have all-LED headlamp units and I'm given to understand that a replacement for these costs £1400 (that's one thousand 400 pounds) per headlamp.

[simians]

Had helluva lot of Hellas over the years but know nowt about these particular lamps. Do they have a rim drain hole intended to be at base or possibly blocked.? With the new ones as soon as any water ingress is noticed, nothing would be lost if you run a self seeking sealer around the join line between clear lens and reflector body.

Capn Tolleys Creeping Crack Cure! comes to mind or a similar self seeking crack filler, even Superglue might be worth a try.

With only one headlamp affected..... suggests a manufacturing fault. 

[BruceM]

1 hour ago, simians said:

 . . .Do they have a rim drain hole intended to be at base or possibly blocked.? 

 . . . With only one headlamp affected..... suggests a manufacturing fault. 

Interesting point about a drain hole. The lights are definitely the correct way up so when I order the replacements I'll investigate closely.
Incidentally both of the main beam headlights show corrosion at the base of the reflector as did their predecessors which is one reason I'm  wonder if this is a feature of this particular make of main beam headlight.

[BruceM]

3 hours ago, Derek Uzzell said:

At least a replacement unit will not be outrageously expensive

https://www.ebay.co.uk/p/653124621

My main beam headlight does not have the parking (side) light incorporated within it so comes out a little more expensive Hella 90mm Main Beam - however it has got me thinking that I could just fit one of the main beam headlights that incorporates the parking light and either 

1/ not wire in the parking light or even use it to replace the existing parking lights which I could just blank off on the bodywork or

2/  extract the parking light fitment in the Hella light to provide a drain hole in case it too suffers from the corrosion issue.

Anyone any thoughts on either approach - especially with approach 1 at MOT time.

[simians]

I'd go for option 1. Leaving set up as original. If leaking is due to poor design/QC  this might have been resolved on the new lamps. Leaving the parking light as drain hole as in 2 seems dodgy to me, is it even at the lamp base in any case to let H2O out. It might allow a bit of drying ventilation I suppose.

That the main and dip beam are separate lamps and this may be the reason for the condensation, perhaps you drive more on dip than full and the warmth in the dip beam lamp tends to drive off the condensation.....well you never know  🤔. Then again the lamps at 90mm dia. are small and it might be that heat build up produces thermal stress in the lamp, enough to crack a bonding line between the 'glass' lens (I reckon acrylic?) and the reflector body.

[onecal]

Hi,

Again,

You may find that when you replace them with updated new ones you may have no more issues

Of course you must use the correct bulbs recommended  and fitted correctly  

Regards 

[Derek Uzzell]

BruceM's motorhome is a 2003-vintage LHD Dethleffs A-class motorhome bought from a private owner (via ebay) in early-2017.

I don't know the Dethleffs model number, but its frontal appearance will be similar to the following image and (has Bruce has said) the headlamp units are Hella 90mm type.

The Hella catalogue has several pages dedicated to 90mm units, but Bruce's motorhome's headlamps will be the 'traditional' halogen-bulb products that were widely fitted to A-class motorhomes from the late-1990s.

Bruce has said that his main-beam lamps have no position-lights (side-lights) and I THINK the Hella part code will be 1K0 008 191-011 and as advertised heavily discounted here

https://www.opieoils.co.uk/p-92548-spotlight-insert-headlamp-ff-h7-without-side-light-hella-1k0-008-191-011.aspx 

(As Bruce replaced the headlamps when he bought the motorhome, he quite likely knows the correct Hella part number.)

As I said above, the front 'lens' of these light units is made of glass and the lights' design and construction makes adding any sort of 'drain hole' a non-starter. Putting sealant over (or in) the joint where the glass lens meets the light's body should be unnecessary: I wouldn't bother, but If it would make Bruce happier, so be it.

If replacement main-beam units can be obtained that exactly match the present ones (ie. units without position-lights) at a competitive price, that's the logical way to go. Choosing main-beam headlamps that include position-lights just to save a few quid and then not wire in those bulbs, (or alter the motorhome's wiring) verges on the daft in my view - just get exactly matching light units at the best price and replace the current units on a like-for-like basis.

The main-beam unit lasted 5 years before filling with water (otherwise the vehicle would have failed its last MOT test) which isn't bad considering how exposed the headlamps are. Realistically, condensation causing corrosion at the base of the reflector is bound to occur as the headlamp ages.

[simians]

Old replaced with new and after 3 years corrosion noticed, 5 years on and half full of water is noted, I wonder when it was when they were 1/4 water filled, or being used with unnoticed condensation, and possibly a resulting lack of road visibility put down to failing eyesight! 

Corrosion at base of reflector probably taking place on the first rainy day or one of high humidity. No MoT for the first 3 years, hopefully the lamps are fit for purpose, after then? 

My headlamps are 28 years old, no corrosion, no condensation and equally exposed, as determined by the very nature of their function. So I would say that there's not necessarily an inevitability regarding (at least what I would regard) as premature degradation of a safety related component such as headlights. Certainly not occurring at just 3 years if not before, that is.

[onecal]

Hi 

Again from experience on replacing same 

when you replace them with updated new ones you may have no more issues

Of course you must use the correct bulbs recommended  and be fitted correctly  

Regards

[Derek Uzzell]

11 hours ago, onecal said:

...when you replace them with updated new ones you may have no more issues...

Assuming that the Hella headlamp unit appropriate for Bruce's Dethleffs motorhome is the one shown in this advert

https://trucks.autodoc.co.uk/hella/931352

could you say, please, what 'updates' there will have been to the design/construction over the replacement main-beam units Bruce fitted 6 years ago?

[simians]

Perhaps 'upgrade' in this instance signifies a reduced service life, time will tell. If so, then certainly could be considered an 'upgrade' from the manufacturers point of view !

[Derek Uzzell]

It's well known that these Hella 90mm units are corrosion-prone (just one example)

https://www.motorhomefun.co.uk/forum/threads/headlight-main-beam-and-side-light-for-arto-69g-2003.241472/

Being familiar with the unit, my view is that the design (and usage) makes this highly likely to occur and that a 6-years maximum lifespan is about what one might expect.

[onecal]

Hi

Maybe contact Hella as to improvements/update to lights 

Regards 

[onecal]

Hi Bruce ,

As you only have one light affected , replace it . Check  the wiring going to the lamp for maybe extra connections that may have been made poorly  or in fact any break in any of the wiring insulation on the loom to the headlamp

Replace wiring if necessary and make sure the loom to the light is correctly placed down under the connection on the rear rubber boots 

Damaged wiring insulation on the loom tends to wick water down the wiring and connectors into the light 

Regards 

[BruceM]

Both lights are effected by corrosion but just one filled up with water.

 

I suspect condensation is the cause of the generic reflector corrosion and that wicking of water is the reason one of the lights filled with water as the one that filled with water is in a more exposed position – something I intend to have a closer look at and seek a way of rectifying.

[onecal]

Hi Bruce

You need to check the loom run to the lights for insulation damage and positioning to prevent it happening again .

Regards

[Derek Uzzell]

I'm very doubtful that the filling up with water was due to 'wicking'. The simplest (and most logical) explanation is that the bond at the joint  between the light's glass front and its reflector failed, quite likely as a result of the corrosion.

If the light-unit is removed and filled with water,  it may well be possible to spot any leakage through the joint.

[Brian Kirby]

As it seems clear these units are prone to failure in the manner illustrated, and in view of the number of options/variants (I've looked! 🙂) for these 90mm units, and the number of years they have been in production, I wonder if it might be easier for Bruce to initially contact Hella direct to verify a) the product code for the failed unit/s, and b) whether there is an updated, like for like, unit that could be installed to replace the failed unit/s.

At least Bruce could then have confidence that what he buys will fit and function as intended - and possibly better.

Contact details for Hella customer services in UK:

HELLA Ltd
Unit 6 Appletree Industrial Estate
Chipping Warden, Banbury, Oxfordshire
OX17 1LL

Tel: 01295 662400
Fax: 0800 783 2571
Email: hella.sales@hella.com

 

[Derek Uzzell]

Hella's catalogue relating to 90mm modules can be viewed here

https://www.hella.com/truck/assets/media_global/977_90mm_Gesamtbroschuere_HELLA_EN.pdf

The units fitted to Bruce's motorhome are shown on Page 13 ("Classic low beam and high beam") and the high-beam 12V halogen H7-bulb units (without position light) will be Part Number 1K0 008 191-011

Page 12 of the catalogue shows "Performance" units that are stated as having an aluminium reflector (rather than a magnesium one) and using a H1 bulb. I think these may have been fitted to some motorhomes, but it appears (from the catalogue) that 12V variants are for a Performance" or "Premium" fixing, not a "Classic" fixing.

[Brian Kirby]

Looking at those units, which are stated as having a hardened glass cover lens, unless moisture is entering via the lamp holder, the joint between that glass lens and the body of the light seems one potential route for ingress.  I wonder if Bruce might find it worthwhile to obtain some self amalgamating tape (Screwfix, but doubtless others) and carefully wrap a length around the joint?  I'm assuming the headlamp is sufficiently recessed for the tape not to show.  If not familiar with the tape, it needs to be stretched while applying, in which state it can usually be persuaded to stick to the substrate as well as to itself when, over a short time, it fuses together to form a very effective seal.  Brilliant stuff!  🙂  Also very useful to keep the wet out of electrical wiring connections in damp locations.  Once fused, the only way to get it off is to cut it.

[BruceM]

As a postscript . .

 

The new Hella headlights are now installed.

 

They were manufactured in Romania in Feb 2023.

The defunct headlights were likewise manufactured in Romania but in May 2016 .

 

There ‘s no discernable difference between the old and new lights. It’s interesting to note how recently the new pair were made. I’d assumed that they are an old design that’s being phased out. So with them still being made, I suspect that either they’re going in to new vehicles or there’s a healthy replacement market for failed lights. We’ll see how long they last.