spannerman Posted July 20, 2007 Share Posted July 20, 2007 please can you help is it a requirment that a new van should have a fire extinguisher and smoke detector fitted by the dealer :-o Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
michele Posted July 20, 2007 Share Posted July 20, 2007 How new is new? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
davenewellhome Posted July 20, 2007 Share Posted July 20, 2007 Not a legal requirement as far as I know but definitely a good idea, well the extinguisher is, not too sure about the benefits of a smoke alarm unless it can be disabled while cooking. Personally I prefer to have two extinguishers, one 2KG dry powder behind the drivers seat and a 2KG AFFF by the habitation door. We also have a fire blanket by the cooker. D. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
madmick Posted July 20, 2007 Share Posted July 20, 2007 There is no legal requirement spannerman. A smoke detector is considered esential, followed by a fire extinguisher, then a fire blanket and/or carbon monoxide detector, then, if you think the devil is out to get you, a narcotic gas alarm. Buy what you can afford, but remember you can't fight the fire if you are already under the influence. And I'm talking about smoke, not whisky. madmick (hic!) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest peter Posted July 20, 2007 Share Posted July 20, 2007 Dave, just take the smoke alarm off it's mounting when cooking. That's what we do. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spannerman Posted July 20, 2007 Author Share Posted July 20, 2007 new new Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clive Posted July 20, 2007 Share Posted July 20, 2007 I thought it was a legal requirement for the manufacturer to provide an extinguisher and a fire blanket together with the label on the inside of the wardrobe door that tells you what not to lock and how to escape in the event of a fire. Something to do with SMMT Habitation requirements?? But I aint sure. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ralph Posted July 21, 2007 Share Posted July 21, 2007 Clive - 2007-07-20 11:04 PM Something to do with SMMT Habitation requirements?? But I aint sure. If so that wouldn't make it legal Clive. Just compulsory for SMMT members. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derek Uzzell Posted July 21, 2007 Share Posted July 21, 2007 I believe the legal requirements for safety-related 'accessories' (fire extinguisher, fire blanket, smoke alarm, first-aid kit, etc) to be provided with a new motorhome marketed in the UK are the same as for a new UK-marketed car - you don't have to be given any of them. When I bought my Hobby from Germany it came with a first-aid kit and warning triangle. According to the Caravan Club's "Caravan Europe 1" touring handbook there's a legal requirement for motorists to carry these two items in their vehicles in that country, so I guess that's why I got them rather than the dealer feeling generous. I've added a smoke-alarm (with a mute facility) close to the kitchen area, together with a fire blanket (not sure how practical this would be in the close confines of a motorhome, and I think "Which?" said a wet cloth worked more effectively, but I bought it very cheaply from a local pharmacists). I've got 2 fire extinguishers - a 1kg Kidde dry-powder (bought from Argos) by the caravan entrance door and a (nowadays illegal) halon extinguisher mounted behind the driver's seat. Also a couple of reflectorised waistcoats. Studying the CC's handbook suggests that, if you've a warning triangle, first-aid kit, fire extinguisher, spare bulb-set and reflectorised waistcoats you should satisfy the motoring 'accessory' legal requirements of pretty much all EC countries. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave Newell Posted July 21, 2007 Share Posted July 21, 2007 Going off topic slightly, but I'm intrigued as to why you carry an old (and almost certainly out of date) extinguisher of a type that you openly admit is illegal Derek. A dry powder or AFFF type is not terribly expensive nowadays, my two 2KG ones (dry powder and AFFF) cost me less than £40 which is a small price to pay to give some protection to a vehicle with a value of many thousands of pounds. How confident are you that it would still work if required? Not a criticism just an enquiry. Its also worth learning how to use a fire extinguisher correctly and which type to use on the various types of fire, I did a fire training course a few years ago and it was very illuminating. One of the tasks they gave us in the practical section was to put out a tray of burning petrol with a water extinguisher, gosh that's exciting 8-). You then get to repeat it with dry powder and finally AFFF which is by far the most effective. D. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian Kirby Posted July 21, 2007 Share Posted July 21, 2007 Derek Uzzell - 2007-07-21 10:05 AM I believe the legal requirements for safety-related 'accessories' (fire extinguisher, fire blanket, smoke alarm, first-aid kit, etc) to be provided with a new motorhome marketed in the UK are the same as for a new UK-marketed car - you don't have to be given any of them. When I bought my Hobby from Germany it came with a first-aid kit and warning triangle. According to the Caravan Club's "Caravan Europe 1" touring handbook there's a legal requirement for motorists to carry these two items in their vehicles in that country, so I guess that's why I got them rather than the dealer feeling generous. I've added a smoke-alarm (with a mute facility) close to the kitchen area, together with a fire blanket (not sure how practical this would be in the close confines of a motorhome, and I think "Which?" said a wet cloth worked more effectively, but I bought it very cheaply from a local pharmacists). I've got 2 fire extinguishers - a 1kg Kidde dry-powder (bought from Argos) by the caravan entrance door and a (nowadays illegal) halon extinguisher mounted behind the driver's seat. Also a couple of reflectorised waistcoats. Studying the CC's handbook suggests that, if you've a warning triangle, first-aid kit, fire extinguisher, spare bulb-set and reflectorised waistcoats you should satisfy the motoring 'accessory' legal requirements of pretty much all EC countries. Except Spain, where you need two warning triangles. Don't ask! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fred grant Posted July 21, 2007 Share Posted July 21, 2007 and a spare pare of specs for the driver me andsums finicky fred Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Don Madge Posted July 21, 2007 Share Posted July 21, 2007 fred grant - 2007-07-21 4:46 PM and a spare pare of specs for the driver me andsums finicky fred We could go on for months at this rate :-D :-D :-D If you want to check what you should have on board see http://www.theaa.com/motoring_advice/overseas/atoz.html Don Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clive Posted July 21, 2007 Share Posted July 21, 2007 Ive been on a firemans course - oh yes! Main lesson learnt is never trust a dry power extinguisher. During our demo (where the fire officer let them off) 3 instantly blocked up. It seems that there is an open to atmosphere path through the nozzle into the tank that holds the powder, when the presurizing medium is released (small CO2 cartridge) this powder is forced out through the nozzle. But with changes in atmospheric pressure the extinguishers breath and the power is slightly hydroscopic so gets damp and becomes easy to clump at the point where it enters the exit tube to the nozzle. Hence dry power extinguishers MUST be re-charged (or replaced) very regularly. Its easy to be sure that the pressure is still there but not so easy to check the dryness of the powder. CO2 extinguishers on the other hand don,t suffer this problem. And there is no extinguisher generated mess to clear up afterwards - providing you still have a motorhome that is. So I guess the bottom line is if you cannot put the fire out in the first few seconds then get the hell out of the van and stand a long way back as gas bottles and tyres go with a big bang. Grab a couple of potatoes and a burger to cook in the embers on the way out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thai Bry Posted July 21, 2007 Share Posted July 21, 2007 Clive - 2007-07-21 10:46 PM So I guess the bottom line is if you cannot put the fire out in the first few seconds then get the hell out of the van and stand a long way back as gas bottles and tyres go with a big bang. Grab a couple of potatoes and a burger to cook in the embers on the way out. CliveGood advice, it's about all you can do really. No point putting yourselves at risk, just get out when you can, leave the firefighting to the experts.All I can say is that we all try to limit the dangers, and I'm sure that's what we all do as a matter of course.Thai Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
michele Posted July 21, 2007 Share Posted July 21, 2007 Whats the most likely thing to start a fire in a van ? In the home it is said to be the washing Machine Anyone know Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flicka Posted July 21, 2007 Share Posted July 21, 2007 davenewell@home - 2007-07-20 6:55 PM Not a legal requirement as far as I know but definitely a good idea, well the extinguisher is, not too sure about the benefits of a smoke alarm unless it can be disabled while cooking. Personally I prefer to have two extinguishers, one 2KG dry powder behind the drivers seat and a 2KG AFFF by the habitation door. We also have a fire blanket by the cooker. D. Our Bessacarr new last October only came fitted with a Fire Extinguisher in the habitation area close to the Cooker, I would hope that Bessacarr had met the legal requirement. Have fitted Smoke Alarm & Carbon Monoxide Detector plus an additional Extinguisher in the Cab but had not thought of a Fire Blanket also. Which now seems the most practical first option. I found this one on a quick web search, http://www.towsure.com/product/405 does anyone have any knowledge of this or any others, please. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
davenewellhome Posted July 22, 2007 Share Posted July 22, 2007 No personal knowledge of that particular one Flicka but a fire blanket is a fire blanket is a fire blanket to all intents and purposes. I got ours from Aldi for about £7 I think it was. In the event of a fire its obviously up to the occupants to decide whether to fight it or just bugger off fast but do make sure you know and understand how to use your extinguishers. AFFF does make a mess at the time of discharge but it dries out, as long as you extinguished the fire succesfully, and doesn't leave any marks, not even on upholstery I'm told. Still not sure but I don't think there is a legal requirement for any of this kit to be carried or supplied though. D. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GJH Posted July 22, 2007 Share Posted July 22, 2007 The owners manual for our 2003/4 Elddis Autoquest 100 says "The National Caravan Council (NCC) requires that all new or used touring motorhomes sold by its members be fitted with a smoke alarm featuring an alarm silence facility." The manual says nothing about fire extinguishers or blankets. We bought both but, having read Dave's posts, I think we may need to invest in a different extinguisher. Graham Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
W3526602 Posted July 22, 2007 Share Posted July 22, 2007 Hi, Just out of interest, would a professional fire fighter be expected to approach a fire armed only with the sort of extiguisher that is being discussed here? While wearing a pair of shorts and a T-shirt? OK, I probably would, but I would resent anybody telling me I MUST. I once dashed into a burning building....never again. I had a very sore throat, etc, afterwards. Forcing me to carry an extinguisher implies that I am expected to use it. 602 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Don Madge Posted July 22, 2007 Share Posted July 22, 2007 Many years ago I was told by a senior fire officer that a fire extinguisher in a Motorhome/Caravan should be used to get your self out of the vehicle at the double. With the enclosed area it could be suicide to to fight a fire inside. Having seen how fast a motorhome/caravan can be reduced to a smouldering wreck I thought it was very good advice. Don Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
michele Posted July 22, 2007 Share Posted July 22, 2007 if people are to carry them can you guys please advise which is the BEST ? I do carry two but if totally honest I have not a clue which type (alot of good that would do us). To be honest I would have the kids out the door in a flash or a window I would not take chances. What would we all do without the Fireman who everyday lay their lifes on the line for us.. Any advice WILL be taken on board. Thank you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derek Uzzell Posted July 22, 2007 Share Posted July 22, 2007 There is an ancient anecdote about someone being interviewed for a job as a petrol-tanker driver. When asked what steps he would take if a fire occurred in his vehicle he replied "Long and often ones". Brian: On warning triangles the Caravan Club's 2007 "Caravan Europe 1" handbook indicates that for visitors to the countries covered by the book carrying 2 triangles is RECOMMENDED for France and Spain, and obligatory in Croatia and Slovenia for vehicles with trailers. My belief was that the '2 triangles rule' for Spain strictly applied only to Spanish nationals (or perhaps only to Spanish-registered vehicles) and visiting motorists legally only needed to carry one triangle. Dunno if that's right, but it squares with the CC's advice. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest caraprof Posted July 22, 2007 Share Posted July 22, 2007 I always carry two warning triangles. If you break down on a winding country road your obstruction may not be spotted until the last few seconds by motorists storming round blind bends both behind and in front of you.In such circumstances I will put a triangle behind and in front of me in such a place as to give ample warning in both directions.For what these things cost nowadays, and the fact they slip away in many of the nooks and crannies that we have I wouldn't really bother about legislation. Use two regardless. It may save someone from ploughing into the front or rear of your expensive motorhome, or even worse, some other innocent driver who's waiting behind your broken-down vehicle or trying to overtake it, being run into. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian Kirby Posted July 22, 2007 Share Posted July 22, 2007 Derek Uzzell - 2007-07-22 11:57 AM There is an ancient anecdote about someone being interviewed for a job as a petrol-tanker driver. When asked what steps he would take if a fire occurred in his vehicle he replied "Long and often ones". Brian: On warning triangles the Caravan Club's 2007 "Caravan Europe 1" handbook indicates that for visitors to the countries covered by the book carrying 2 triangles is RECOMMENDED for France and Spain, and obligatory in Croatia and Slovenia for vehicles with trailers. My belief was that the '2 triangles rule' for Spain strictly applied only to Spanish nationals (or perhaps only to Spanish-registered vehicles) and visiting motorists legally only needed to carry one triangle. Dunno if that's right, but it squares with the CC's advice. I'm sure that is correct, Derek, but I tend to work on the basis that not all policemen are versed in the exceptions to their home laws that may be applicable to foreigners. If the locals have to have two, I think, on the whole, it is preferable to carry two - even when the law says you needn't because you are a visitor! Anyhow, my Spanish wouldn't begin to equip me to agrue the point with a Spanish policeman and I've harboured a hearty mistrust of the Spanish police ever since a Guardia Civil stick a sub-machine gun in my face! Re triangles in France, I have a feeling in the back of my mind that the CC's repeated recommendation from the French Government Tourist Office actually relates primarily to caravans. If I remember it is, or was, the case that if a trailer had to be abandoned at the roadside, it must be denoted by warning triangles placed fore and aft: hence, caravanners need two. If so, it would seem equally applicable to motorhomes towing cars.There is another little issue, which is whether you triangle is compliant. We have, and always carry, two; but I'm fairly sure neither is compliant with current regulations. However, they are very nice triangles, they are stable and reflective, and of realistic size, so I'm hanging on to them in the hope I'll get "Brownie" points for having and using them if circumstances demand, rather than a ticket for having the wrong design! Heigh, ho, all this driving around keeps yer brian churning, don't it! :-) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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