Bomb shell from Mel E

[Vernon B]

Mel E has flagged up anticipated changes to C1 licence qualifications in next month's MMM (see top of page 226).

 

[is there no area of human endeavour that this bloody government and the EU want to change and make more complicated? if they really want to do something useful why don't they work on standardising gas fittings across the EU?]

 

Anyway, if Mel is around here I wonder if he's in a position to expand on his comments. I, and I guess others would be interested to know more about what is involved in a HGV driver's medical - is it simply a chat with your own quack or does it involve "exposing" yourself to an independent medic and of course paying a fee plus VAT to you know who?

 

Of course you may not know Mel, but this looks as if it might become a hot topic and any additional info would be helpful. Thanks for picking it up.

 

Vernon

[Clive]

HGV MEDICAL

Recently had mine.

you need to be fit, strong heart, good eyes, no fits and have a spare £100.

 

Clive

 

[fred grant]

bit like elvis then clive?

 

f

[Don Madge]

Clive - 2007-07-24 6:58 PM

 

HGV MEDICAL

Recently had mine.

you need to be fit, strong heart, good eyes, no fits and have a spare £100.

 

Clive

 

Clive,

 

I take it you failed then :-D :-D :-D :-D

 

I'm off see you at York.

 

Don

[michele]

I used to work for a Doctor and he used to do them this was over 7 years ago . It was £55 in my day in the medical it did include a full MOT eye's ears BP/cholestrol check ESR full bloods height weight smoking the LOT.

including past history of illness diabetes heart drinking how many units.

 

When they have finished you need a medical to put you right

:D :they then say if you are fit and fill out the form .

 

I do agree what next

[Beefy]

I'd like to know what changes are being proposed as from what I have recently reviewed they don't affect me...and I've been doing quite a bit of research. But if they do please tell!!

I'm one of those few who decided that riding a motorcycle was more fun than driving a car for a few years, well passing my car test anyway, and although I passed my bike test in 1990 I didn't get around doing the car test until 1998. I'm now paying the hefty price for this for deciding that I would like to drive something with a MTPLM of over 3500kg :(

I just had my medical today, £110 lighter now and I didn't even get a grope for the money...ah well :) For anyone who is interested the procedure is that you sit in with the doc and he fills in the form for you by looking at your notes and checking eyes and blood pressure, weight and then he asks how much you drink and you lie...simple really! I now send off my B photocard licence and my D2 and D4 and I get a licence with provisional C1 and C entitlement. I can then drive a vehicle up to 7.5t with L plates on it on a motorway as long as my wife, who passed her test in 1993, sit's next to me! (as she inherited grandparent rights of C1 entitlement prior to the Jan 1997 euro harmonisation of licence catagories).

As I am not using my C1 licence for hire or reward I don't have to do another D4 (medical) at age 45 and then every 5 years until 70. I only have to do it when (if) I get to 70. I also do not need to do a CPC certificate as I'm not a professional driver.

To pass my C1 licence (if I go that way) I now have to do training in a larger vehicle than I would have had to a couple of months back, not sure of the actual details, but as the C1 and C test are almost identical (and as I'm over 21 with a B licence for more than 3 years I can sit the C without going through the stage system), I might just take the C training and test so I can drive a massive rigid LGV...just for the fun of it.

 

The current guidelines/applications are contained in the following DVLA leaflets;

 

INF4D - Information and Notes for the D4 Medical Examination Report D4

 

INF2D - How to fill in your LGV or PCV licence application form

 

INS115 - Driving licence fees

 

D2 - Licence application form

 

D4 - Medical Examination Report

 

 

I am probably barking up the wrong tree as you mention proposed changes, and these are the current circumstances, but as I said at the top, I've done a bit of research and can't see that any proposals apply to me (or anyone else going through the C1 licence qualification) that will make life anymore difficult or expensive than it is already.

 

[Thai Bry]

Clive - 2007-07-24 6:58 PM HGV MEDICAL Recently had mine. you need to be fit, strong heart, good eyes, no fits and have a spare £100. Clive

Likewise Clive

I take mine  - HGV 1 -every 5 years by law, have been doing so for the past umpteen years.

You can use your own doctor (mine £60) or an agency drivers one (£45) - well in my area anyway.

Main tests are, eyesight, hearing, general health, but now also testing for drugs. Alcohol in system - now a major test, don't forget traces of alcohol stay in your system for up 24 hours.!! Also now testing for drugs abuse, so can trace nicotine and any other normal medication as well as main stream drugs. This is now a requirement every year re any major drugs - some drivers using "Pro Plus"- mixed with Red Bull to stay awake or so it seems.

Forwarned is forearmed if you fall into this category for your vehicle licence.Just look at the number of drivers coming off ferries- we use the Hull to Rotterdam route mainly - who have been drinking in moderation, but are technically over the limit.

As our drivers leave the yard, especially in the early hours, we've seen the police parked nearby just to pull up any driver for a spot check.

Just be very aware if you fall into this category of licence.!! My licence and my drivers licences were hard earned & so am very wary of any laws that may be "inflicted" by the EU on lower class licence holders.

Maybe someone in government has seen the growing trend for so called heavier plated m/home vehicles, and thinks that this would be another avenue for a TAX!!!

Hope this info helps.

Thai

[Rodders]

Sorry, folks but why is this such a bad idea ?

 

We all drive large, bulky and powerful vehicles which could do huge damge if the driver was unfit and lost control. Isn't it better to be checked out for your own peace of mind and the safety of everyone else?

 

I don't like getting older any more than anyone else does- tho my 70th birthday is 16 years off yet- but I'd be prepared to have a medical for those reasons.

 

Perhaps like others, I've seen elderly relatives continue driving when they should have decided not to, and being really worried about what would happen to tham and others when they next went on the road. Thankfully, my father in law- who was 80 at the time- eventuially was persuaded to stop driving but for the last five years until then he was a driving liability.

 

Not saying that the elderly shouldn't drive, of course- only those who are fit to do so.

 

Regards

[Don Madge]

Thai Bry - 2007-07-24 9:23 PM

Clive - 2007-07-24 6:58 PM HGV MEDICAL Recently had mine. you need to be fit, strong heart, good eyes, no fits and have a spare £100. Clive

Likewise Clive

I take mine  - HGV 1 -every 5 years by law, have been doing so for the past umpteen years.

You can use your own doctor (mine £60) or an agency drivers one (£45) - well in my area anyway.

Main tests are, eyesight, hearing, general health, but now also testing for drugs. Alcohol in system - now a major test, don't forget traces of alcohol stay in your system for up 24 hours.!! Also now testing for drugs abuse, so can trace nicotine and any other normal medication as well as main stream drugs. This is now a requirement every year re any major drugs - some drivers using "Pro Plus"- mixed with Red Bull to stay awake or so it seems.

Forwarned is forearmed if you fall into this category for your vehicle licence.Just look at the number of drivers coming off ferries- we use the Hull to Rotterdam route mainly - who have been drinking in moderation, but are technically over the limit.

As our drivers leave the yard, especially in the early hours, we've seen the police parked nearby just to pull up any driver for a spot check.

Just be very aware if you fall into this category of licence.!! My licence and my drivers licences were hard earned & so am very wary of any laws that may be "inflicted" by the EU on lower class licence holders.

Maybe someone in government has seen the growing trend for so called heavier plated m/home vehicles, and thinks that this would be another avenue for a TAX!!!

Hope this info helps.

Thai

Hi Brian,I did not know Pro Plus was still around, I used that a few times when I was coaching (part time job whilst in the RAF) in the early seventies.We use North Sea ferries on a irregular basis. On Monday 8th May 2000 all the drivers coming off the ferry at Rotterdam were breathalysed. I don't know how many the caught but I heard many coach companies schedules were disrupted for the next few days. 8-) 8-) At one time I held every driving license it was possible to have including an ADI (Approved Driving Instructor) now in my mid seventies I've just got my basic car license that allows me to drive up to 3500kg.I still average about 12,000 miles a year but my standard of driving has dropped off over the last few years. I recognise this and now practise defensive driving most of the time.I dread having to give up driving for me it would be a "Topping Job" I just can't imagine life without a steering wheel in my hand.Many of my elderly neighbours, some younger than me should never be on the road. They don't park their cars they just abandon them they don't drive them they "Aim" them. On the whole their relatives turn a blind eye because it would mean chauffeuring the old folks about.An annual eye test for aged (over 50?) drivers would not cone a miss either.It ain't fun getting old. 8-) 8-) Don.From a very wet (again) East Yorkshire.

[Mel E]

When I have a mo', I'll respond with more detail.

 

For now, let me say that the new medical requirements are all specified in some detail in the EU Directive.

 

It's no worse than now, just sooner in life and more frequent. In a sense, it makes sense: motorhomes and motorcaravans are getting bigger, and the user population generally older. How many of you are certain there's no-one out there who shouldn't be driving a 7.5 tonne RV 'Beast' but is. I know of at least one case of a driver of a 12.5 tonne RV, who tows a car and has no C Licence!

 

Mel E

====

[passionwagon]

8-) Two points to bear in mind-

1-the medical report (C10) is only valid for the licence renewal if dated upto 4 months before the birthday! So if you fail and decide to sell or downrate you will only have 4 months in which to do it!

2-my main concern is if you do fail are you fit to drive upto 3.500 kgs and what if you then have an accident and the insurers decide the medical should have been declared! Remember at 70 you only have to self certify by ticking boxes not as some newspapers say pass a medical! But you are required to declare all relevant facts to insureres and DVLA.

 

My idea is that once test is passed licences should be renewed every 10 years upto 60 with a certificate of vision, hearing and reaction. Repeated every 5 plus a simple medical until 75 then every 3 . At 90 every year.

pip pip ;-)

[Mel E]

THE FACTS:

 

A new EU Driver Licensing Directive was passed by the EU Parliament in December 2006. It is required to be implemented in each member state's Law by the beginning of 2012 - that's just 4.5 years away.

 

For the item in MMM I just picked out the most important change affecting motorhomers. This requires all holders of C1, C1E, D1, D1E (D is minibuses and does not apply to motorhomes), and above to renew these 'extras' every 5 years with a medical that is defined in the Directive and that is the same as for C, CE HGV drivers. It is only minorly changed from the existing UK HGV medical.

 

Before implementation in the UK there will be a period of consultation - though that cannot affect the law it can affect how it is implemented, for example by establishing when the first such medical takes place. They cannot suddenly demand medicals of everyone on day 1 , so it will be phased in some way yet to be determined. So you may get an extra 5 years or nothing!

 

THE MEDICAL: The medical is normally done by your own Doctor, as he has access to your full medical record which is a key input. You can also use an external agency, however. The cost currently varies between about £40 and £150, though my own Doctor charges me £15 for the same medical which is required to renew a UK Pilot's Licence - though no actual tests are required for that.

 

Of course, at ANY AGE, you MUST, BY LAW, report to the DVLA any medical condition which might make you unfit to drive, and their Driver Licensing Booklet D100 - available from any Post Office - lists these. They are mostly obvious: blood pressure (high or low), epilepsy or fits, diabetes, heart disease, certain types of Cancer, changes to sight or hearing, damage to limbs or any muscular disease, psychaitric illness, alcoholism or drug dependency. Failure to do so will certainly invalidate the comprehensive part of your insurance cover as well as rendering you subject to the law!

 

The check for up to 3500 Kgs at age 70 is little more than a paper check that you haven't developed such a problem and failed to report it.

 

OTHER CHANGES: There are some other changes that are beneficial, though probably only to a few of our fraternity. A key one concerns towing. At present, for C1E, the trailer MAM (that's its maximum allowed weight fully laden) may not exceed the unladen weight (empty weight without driver, fuel, loose tools) of the towing vehicle. This restriction is removed and you are constrained only by the Maximum Train Weight of the towing vehicle - and common sense. This constraint currently also applies to B and D1E but not, curiously to BE licences.

 

There is also a minor relaxation to help the caravan lobby, so that B licence holders will be able to tow up to a combined maximum of car+caravan of 4250Kgs MAM (currently only allowed if the trailer is less than 750Kgs). However, extra learning will be required, though probably not a test - but the learning includes 'on road' so will require an insured instructor, and the amount is around 8 hours in total. The Caravan Club and other bodies are working together as a body (I represent British Gliding on the body) with the DforT to try and get sensible proposals for implementation ahead of the UK statutory consultation period.

 

There are also longer term aims to go to fully plastic driving licences across the EU, but details are yet to be worked out and the final implementation date is something like 2025!

 

Hope that clears it all up!

 

Mel E

====

[dobscott]

I have just returned from visiting the DVLA in Leeds to have my van re-classified from 3.85kg to 3.5kg. Three years ago I took and passed the medical but did not like the hassle and not inconsiderable expense.

We did not need the extra load capacity and so I decided this time to down plate the van.

With help from this forum I was directed to Sv Tech who were 1st. class and very quickly produced a new plate.

The DVLA's first response to my request to reclassify was to offer to inspect the vehicle "sometime in September". The second suggestion was that I produced the vehicle for inspection at their office (In the centre of Leeds) at 8.30 a.m. next Wednesday. When questioned in detail as to why they needed to inspect the van and after explaining very carefully that the vehicle had not changed in any way and that I just did not need the full carrying capacity The only reason that they came up with was that they needed to take photographs of the vehicle. Fortunately I had a photo of the van with me. After another meeting with the Supervisor and armed with my photo. they agreed to go ahead with the proviso that Cardiff might at some future date wish to inspect the vehicle.

Which is less hassle - a medical,form filling and expense or an hour in- depth negotiation with the DVLA.?

After experience of them both I think you pay your money and take your pick.

Geoff

[Vernon B]

Mel - many thanks for the time taken for that (as usual) lucid account. I shall be keeping it to hand for future reference.

 

Two things occur to me. 1) any lay-person reading this thread can't help but think there must be a simplier way of regulating this matter. 2) a lot of it is about regulating for vehicles getting bigger, while global warming suggests we should be thinking smaller.

 

Thanks again

 

Vernon

 

 

 

 

[Mel E]

Vernon,

 

Can't help agreeing with you. We downsized 2 years ago to a Renault Master van conversion that has so far averaged over 31 mpg in 16,000 miles.

 

And it's 3500 Kgs MAM with loads of capacity - 760 Kgs when empty - so no DVLA nonjsense either. And no sped limit problems (below 3050 Kgs unladen weight) or bans from all those minor foreign roads and small towns and villages.

 

Great, isn't it?

 

Mel E

====

[Vernon B]

Mel E - 2007-07-25 5:58 PM

 

Vernon,

 

Can't help agreeing with you. We downsized 2 years ago to a Renault Master van conversion that has so far averaged over 31 mpg in 16,000 miles.

 

And it's 3500 Kgs MAM with loads of capacity - 760 Kgs when empty - so no DVLA nonjsense either. And no sped limit problems (below 3050 Kgs unladen weight) or bans from all those minor foreign roads and small towns and villages.

 

Great, isn't it?

 

Mel E

====

 

 

mmm interesting. may be the way to go for us in the next 5 yrs. guess there's less risk of water ingress as well

 

 

[Don Madge]

Vernon B - 2007-07-26 11:13 AM

 

Mel E - 2007-07-25 5:58 PM

 

Vernon,

 

Can't help agreeing with you. We downsized 2 years ago to a Renault Master van conversion that has so far averaged over 31 mpg in 16,000 miles.

 

And it's 3500 Kgs MAM with loads of capacity - 760 Kgs when empty - so no DVLA nonjsense either. And no sped limit problems (below 3050 Kgs unladen weight) or bans from all those minor foreign roads and small towns and villages.

 

Great, isn't it?

 

Mel E

====

 

mmm interesting. may be the way to go for us in the next 5 yrs. guess there's less risk of water ingress as well

 

 

Vernon,

 

You might find this helpful in making a decision.

 

I think there is a trend these days towards the panel van conversions. Recently I visited the Timberland factory and was amazed to see the the number of late plated A Class and large coachbuilts that had been traded in for the smaller vans. It's not everybobodys cup of tea though, it can be a very expensive mistake if you get it wrong.

 

Four years ago due to ill health we had to downsize from our A class Laika Ecovip 400i (4200 kg M.A.M.).

 

We had had the Laika for two years and had fitted it out for winter touring.

Extras we had fitted were two sixty litre LPG tanks for domestic use, a

sixty watt solar panel and a Sporty Trailers aluminum back box. As standard the Laika had a 135 litre fridge/freezer, 115 litre fresh water tank, 140 litre waste water tank and a marine toilet of 52 litre capacity. We had just got the van sorted to our satisfaction when we had to part with it.

 

We usually wintered away for four or five months (Jan - May) then an Autumn trip (late Aug - mid Nov) usually seven/eight months continental touring in a year. We had spent Jan - April 2002 in Turkey and returned home via Rhodes Patras and Venice. The Laika was easy to drive, very spacious to live in and the only drawbacks we found during this extensive trip were difficulties in parking and the impossibility to take it down extremely narrow difficult roads to visit isolated ancient sites.

 

The search then started for a replacement motorhome, two single beds with a reasonable payload. It was a lot harder than we thought it would be. It could not be above 3500kg M.A.M. and we fancied a low profile coachbuilt but on most the payloads were inadequate for our needs. Some payloads were only 250 - 300 kg and we were still looking at fairly large motorhomes.

 

We then started to look at LWB high top vans and after much thought and

deliberation we settled for the Timberland Freedom 11 on the LWB Fiat Ducato with a payload of approx 500 kg. We were very apprehensive about laying out over £38,000 and having all our plans go pear shaped. We spent a great deal of time and thought before placing an order for the van.

 

Other vans we considered were the Autosleeper Dueto but this dropped out of contention when we discovered that they were now built on the MWB instead of the LWB chassis. We also considered the Murvi but as they are built in Devon and we live in Yorkshire we decided it was too far to travel if any problems arose and it's layout meant we could not have a back box. Another contender was IH Campers at Ferrybridge. They had very good product and offered to build to our specification but Timberland got the nod as they had the two single bed layout we wanted on the production line when we visited the works

 

 

The Timberland has all the same facilities that we had on the Laika. The

toilet/shower area is smaller but still as good as many coachbuilts. The

cooking facilities are actually better with a small full domestic cooker.

The fresh/waste water tanks are smaller but we don't find this a problem. In addition we carry four eight litre water containers for tea/coffee making.

We also prefer to fill the sixty litre fresh water tank with these - no long

hoses which are often inconvenient any way.

 

Our hobby of chasing the winter sun often means travelling through cold

weather before finding the sun. Before the Laika having enough LPG for

cooking, heating and the fridge was always a major problem.

 

We chose to have the optional Eberspacher diesel heater fitted at Timberland and later had a MTH Autogas 13kg refillable gas bottle with an external filler installed. This solved all the heating and LPG problems. Our sixty watt solar panel was fixed on the roof, this keeps the two leisure batteries and the engine battery topped up when not on the move.

 

Storage is down from the Laika but we still found room for all the

essentials. It wasn't easy but we got there in the end. Sporty Trailers

manufactured us a back box which hangs on the rear door which takes care of the loungers and camping equipment.

 

The main thing we had to come to terms with was the downsizing of the

fridge/freezer from 135 litres to 60 litres (I'm allowed one cold beer at a

time now) it just means you have to shop more frequently. This is not a

problem these days even in Turkey/Greece /Morocco. Large supermarkets are fairly frequent and even small village shops are much better stocked than they used to be and local markets are good.

 

General storage had to be juggled until it was right. The main thing being

not to take anything not strictly essential (no ballgown or tuxedo). One of

our main concerns was the fact that we might be falling over one another all the time. With a bit of thought and cooperation it never happened. Seating is comfortable and we can both lounge with feet up. Sleeping is also comfortable with still room to visit the loo and make tea.

 

If you are thinking of downsizing do your homework first. Sort out your

major priorities and look at all the options. If you get It wrong it can be

a very expensive mistake. It was forced upon us but now we feel it's done us a favour. It's almost halved our fuel bill, reduced our ferry crossings and

we have parked and visited places we would not have thought possible in the past. So our freedom has increased.

 

A five month tour of Turkey, Italy, Sardinia, Corsica and Austria went

quickly without a hitch and all we could say about it was - this is even

better than it used to be!!!

 

I hope this in some way helps.

 

Regards

 

Don

[Vernon B]

Thanks Don - very good review - and as we appear to have similiar objectives and life styles (the winter sun but not necessarily single beers) very relevant.

 

After many years of caravaning we came to motorhoming relatively late. We've had just two - a sub 6m coach built (you always get the first "wrong") and now a 6m Pilote A Class which, like your Laika, at present fully meets our needs. I think we've probably got one more purchase in us and you've made some pretty powerful, albeit qualified, arguments.

 

As far as downsizing is concerned I've no doubt that "Parkinson" would have come up with the law "The prepensity to overload a motorhome increases exponentially with it's increase in MAM"

 

Continue to enjoy

 

Vernon

 

 

 

[Bill]

 

Clive - 2007-07-24 6:58 PM

 

HGV MEDICAL

Recently had mine.

you need to be fit, strong heart, good eyes, no fits and have a spare £100.

 

Clive

 

I recently renewed my pilots licence medical in the States. The doctor counts your legs and arms and if he gets up to 3 you have passed.

 

The last time an aeroplane crashed in the USA due to sudden medical incapacity of the pilot was -- in 1924!

 

So I have to agree with a further quote (this one from Vernon)

 

[is there no area of human endeavour that this bloody government and the EU want to change and make more complicated? if they really want to do something useful why don't they work on standardising gas fittings across the EU?]

 

[Mel E]

Bill,

 

Your 1924 date for the last crash by an incapacitated pilot is certainly wrong! It's just that they don't make a big fuss about it in the USA.

 

There have been recent incidents of this happenning in the UK - and one famous one: the BA Trident Crash after take-off from Heathrow, when the Captain had a heart attack after wrongly retracting the forward droop flaps.

Also a case in Germany about 3 or 4 years ago where an airliner Captain died at the controls leaving the co-pilot to get it down.

 

Mel E

====

 

[Bill]

Mel E - 2007-07-28 12:19 PM

 

Bill,

 

Your 1924 date for the last crash by an incapacitated pilot is certainly wrong! It's just that they don't make a big fuss about it in the USA.

 

There have been recent incidents of this happenning in the UK - and one famous one: the BA Trident Crash after take-off from Heathrow, when the Captain had a heart attack after wrongly retracting the forward droop flaps.

Also a case in Germany about 3 or 4 years ago where an airliner Captain died at the controls leaving the co-pilot to get it down.

 

Mel E

====

 

 

If I had just retracted the Krueger flaps by mistake I think I too should have a heart attack!! (I thought they paid these guys £150K+ so they would remember when to retract flaps?)

 

Seriously though, you rather make my point.

 

Given that these two pilots were flying airliners as captain, especially on our side of The Pond, they must have had very recent and very thorough medicals – yet still they died.

 

If anything, this is prima facie evidence that the doctors don’t know what the hell they are talking about, but like to pretend that they do, cos it is a nice little earner: “Right sir, two legs, two arms, that’ll be 75 bucks, ker-ching!!”. (I understand the UK equivalent is somewhere north of £300.)

 

Many years ago one of my flying buddies in South Africa (where flying medicals are MUCH tougher even than in Britain) effortlessly passed his CPL medical. He was 40, and a teetotal, non-smoking, squash-playing physical fitness fanatic, yet three days after his medical he dropped dead of a heart attack – fortunately in the airport building, not in the air.

 

A bit more prima facie evidence?

 

Flying medicals are not worth the paper they are printed on, and the proposed medicals for C1 driving licences won’t be either.

 

Medicals to operate vehicles always remind me of the old joke about the man walking around Trafalgar Square clicking his fingers. A passer-by asked him what he was doing, and he replied that he was keeping the polar bears away. The passer-by protested that there are no polar bears within 3000 miles of Trafalgar Square. “Yes”, said the man, “effective, isn’t it?”.

 

 

 

[Robinhood]

The details of the directive are at http://eur-lex.europa.eu/LexUriServ/site/en/oj/2006/l_403/l_40320061230en00180060.pdf

 

I would need to read through in a little more detail, (EU law is pretty impenetrable) but there is enough here at a quick perusal to make me think that it might not apply change to those who already have the C1 entitlement (at least until their current licence needs renewing).

 

Specifically "(5) This Directive should not prejudice existing entitlements

to drive granted or acquired before its date of application."

 

And also the fact that it states that medical testing should only be carried out when you apply for licence renewal, (which will then be enforced by an associated limiting of the administrative validity of licences), and that administrative limitation of licence term will apply to all licences issued after 2013 (which aligns with Mel's notes).

 

If you already have a licence, however, that is valid until age 70, it is arguable that you will not have to renew it until then (I can't find anything to the contrary, but it is a 43 page directive!)

 

I did get a bit worried that the instruction to introduce a single pattern of new EU licence might effectively force licence renewal, but this is patently not an aligned objective, as the date for fully implementing this is 2033!

[gordonaldson]

 

 

Come on "Boys" there boffins in the goverment paid lottery money; advisors?spin docs? to think of ways to get more money out of us! Give them credit were happy to pay for their big supperanum/pensions that we could only dream off. Are we not ???

 

Gordon(hate the buggers).

[Vixter]

Hi VoH here,

 

As you may have gathered from Vixters post on French cost of living, we are now living in France having bought a house. We are in the process of re- registering our vehicles and Bridget is now Brigitte. Big Brian is next but I am also going to change our driving licenses to French.

 

In France a car license is only valid up to 3.500 tonnes whereas the British pre 199? was up to 7.500 tonnes. From what I understand the French recognise this and when you change your license you can claim the grandfather rights and be granted a mini HGV which goes up to just under 12 tonnes. Im going to take this option as soon as I can, as possesion is 9/10's of the law!!

 

There is a small medical test you have to take but I've no objections to this as it a small price to pay to know you are fit enough to enjoy driving your motor home.

 

I am however intrigued about the extra weight you are entitled to drive and will keep you all posted as to how I get on.

 

On a slightly different topic motorhome and car insurance is certainly a lot cheaper here in France. To register Brigitte (Smart car) for the Cart Gris was 144 Euros for life and the MOT is every two years. Down side is you have to live here for these savings, but living here is what we want

 

Rgds

 

VoH

[Bill]

Vixter - 2007-07-29 10:53 AM

 

Down side is you have to live here for these savings, but living here is what we want

 

 

What do you have to do to prove you live in France?