Suggy Posted July 14 Share Posted July 14 I just read a thread about pulling the 20amp fuse to stop the leisure batteries getting charged by the EBL My question is which fuse is ? there are 2 20amp. I assume 1 is for leisure charging and the other starter charging. Asking as I'm planning a new matched pair off batteries and total amps will be more then the 180amp capacity of the EBL 99 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robinhood Posted July 14 Share Posted July 14 The appropriate fuse is the LH one of two in the left part of EBL Fascia, probably marked "Internes Lademodul". Whilst it isn't recommended to go above 10x the charger's rated capacity, I've certainly run slightly above for years without any issue. The Schaudt solution for larger battery banks is to attach an additional charger into block 7 (a LAS1218) though it is probably more cost-effective simply to apply a separate charger directly to the battery(ies), say a Victron IP22, especially if you want to add lithium or AGM profile. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Suggy Posted July 14 Author Share Posted July 14 Google translate as internal charger as well but over on the right there's another 20amp fuse that translates to additional charging is this for the starter battery? I'm putting solar in the MH which should take care off the leisure batteries and mat if an additional charger for when on ECU Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robinhood Posted July 14 Share Posted July 14 The one on the right ("Zusatz Ladegerät") is to protect the optional additional leisure battery charger I mentioned above, which can be connected to block 7 of the EBL. Unless someone has modified your EBL in the past, it is unlikely that this is in use (i.e. block 7 will be unpopulated and the fuse will be 'redundant'). The Starter battery only ever receives a trickle charge (on the EBL99 that maxes out at 2A, and isn't conventionally fused in the EBL (AFAIR, it uses an internal self-resetting polyswitch)). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alanb Posted July 14 Share Posted July 14 30 minutes ago, Suggy said: Google translate as internal charger aswell but over on the right there's is another 20amp fuse that translates to additional changing is this for the starter battery? I'm putting solar in the MH which should take care off the leisure batteries and mat if an additional charger for when on ECU This is what @Robinhood was referring to as "additional" charger. Alan Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alanb Posted July 14 Share Posted July 14 2 minutes ago, Robinhood said: The one on the right ("Zusatz Ladegerät") is to protect the optional additional leisure battery charger I mentioned above, which can be connected to block 7 of the EBL. Unless someone has modified your EBL in the past, it is unlikely that this is in use (i.e. block 7 will be unpopulated and the fuse will be 'redundant'). The Starter battery only ever receives a trickle charge (on the EBL99 that maxes out at 2A, and isn't conventionally fused in the EBL (AFAIR, it uses an internal self-resetting polyswitch)). The starter battery charging battery output is routed via the charger 20A output fuse. Hence the EHU charging of the starter battery will be lost if the 20A fuse is pulled. I do not see polyswitch/fuse used the EBL 99G diagram. There is however a positive temperature coefficient thermistor (PTC), which limits the starer battery charge current to about 2A. Alan Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robinhood Posted July 14 Share Posted July 14 (edited) 18 minutes ago, Alanb said: The starter battery charging battery output is routed via the charger 20A output fuse. Hence the EHU charging of the starter battery will be lost if the 20A fuse is pulled. I'm not convinced of that. The relay which enables charging of the starter battery is energised separately from the 20A fuse (on the line which powers the mains indicator). AFAICS, if there is charging in place via the block 7 connection, or indeed via a separate charger to the battery, if the EBL is powered (as it will be on EHU, regardless of pulling the 20A fuse), then the starter battery will get a trickle charge from the separate/additional charger regardless of the lack of charge from the original internal charger. You're right about the polyswitch, though 😉 it's aPTC (probably functioning as a polyswitch as well) Edited July 14 by Robinhood Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alanb Posted July 14 Share Posted July 14 Robin., Yes the relay coil is separately supplied via a single diode. This supply is also used for the "Mains On" indication, as in my own CBE system. However the charging current to the relay contact is routed via the 20A charger output fuse. From Schaudt EBL 99 diagram immediately to hand, starter battery charging will require the internal charger on, to operate the relay coil, and the charger 20A output fuse installed, to allow current to flow through the relay contacts, blocking diode, and thermistor. Alan Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robinhood Posted July 14 Share Posted July 14 Alan, the charging current from the internal charger is routed via that 20A fuse, but with the relay operated with the EBL on hook-up, even with that fuse removed, the starter battery will be charged by any auxiliary battery charger connected via block 7 on the EBL, or indeed via "back-current" from any charger connected directly to the battery(ies). (They're all on the same circuit). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alanb Posted July 14 Share Posted July 14 17 minutes ago, Robinhood said: Alan, the charging current from the internal charger is routed via that 20A fuse, but with the relay operated with the EBL on hook-up, even with that fuse removed, the starter battery will be charged by any auxiliary battery charger connected via block 7 on the EBL, or indeed via "back-current" from any charger connected directly to the battery(ies). (They're all on the same circuit). Yes I accept that Robin. Alan Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robinhood Posted July 14 Share Posted July 14 I admit to a slight advantage, Alan. whilst mine is an EBL30, not an EBL99, it's the way I operate mine. 🙂 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Suggy Posted July 15 Author Share Posted July 15 13 hours ago, Robinhood said: Alan, the charging current from the internal charger is routed via that 20A fuse, but with the relay operated with the EBL on hook-up, even with that fuse removed, the starter battery will be charged by any auxiliary battery charger connected via block 7 on the EBL, or indeed via "back-current" from any charger connected directly to the battery(ies). (They're all on the same circuit). If the starter battery gets a back charge from ant battery connected to the leisure battery why are people (not from this forum) suggest using a split charge relay? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robinhood Posted July 15 Share Posted July 15 Don't know, but possibly because it won't get any back charge unless you're on EHU (energising the relay)? (A split-charge relay is normally associated with 12V charging via the alternator, when there is no EHU). Frankly, with the nature of the questions you're asking, I think it would be a good idea to get someone competent to check your final proposals before implementation. (That really isn't meant to sound rude). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Suggy Posted July 15 Author Share Posted July 15 (edited) Tonight I pulled the 20amp fuse and the leisure battery aint getting any charge. Starter shows the same voltage with or without the fuse plugged in, same when pulling the mains plug from the MH. Will see over the next few days if it still receiving a charge. @RobinhoodI take no affence by your comment, you dont know what im capable any more then i do yours. Last 38yrs have been with caravans so only hade 1 battey to worry about. I have more than average knollage on electrical stuff as i designe circuit boards and build them for a hobby. Just trying to get my head around the charging system im my MH. If you don't know ask, it's all about learning, it's how we ALL learn Edited July 15 by Suggy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robinhood Posted July 16 Share Posted July 16 The questions you've asked make me wonder whether you have access to the EBL manual, which contains details of the fusing, and a circuit diagram. Whilst there are several versions of the EBL99, they are, AFAIK, functionally very similar. A sample manual can be downloaded from Lippert/Schaudt here: https://res.cloudinary.com/lci-cloudinary/image/upload/v1694803226/lippert-eu/support/power-on-board/pdf/anleitungen/911/9110417/911417_20080821_EBL99G_BA_EN.pdf Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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