RonB Posted October 6, 2007 Share Posted October 6, 2007 When the Adria Vision I707G won the dubious Caravan Club Design & Drive Awards 2006 it had a payload of just 220kg. Adria's current brochure shows virtually the same vehicle as having a payload of 310kg. Still not much but does anyone know how they have managed to improve things by 90kg without cooking the figures? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Globetrotter Posted October 6, 2007 Share Posted October 6, 2007 Might it be due to a change in the chassis used-i.e. the new Ducato as opposed to the old ? This is just a guess BTW, as I'm not sure which chassis the Vision is on ! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest JudgeMental Posted October 6, 2007 Share Posted October 6, 2007 is that on a 3500kg chassis? That is a BIG van and while many manufacturers may find it possible to build lighter with improved technology and materials are Adria one of them? *-) is this excluding driver/fuel/water & gas? IMO 200/300kg is just not enough. I think a camper that size should be on a 4000kg chassis. its a nice van looked at it last year at Dusseldorf. just do some homework and ask around..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest JudgeMental Posted October 6, 2007 Share Posted October 6, 2007 Globetrotter - 2007-10-06 4:53 PM Might it be due to a change in the chassis used-i.e. the new Ducato as opposed to the old ? This is just a guess BTW, as I'm not sure which chassis the Vision is on ! I believe the Vision in on a Renault chassis? which I don't think, have as many weight choices as the Fiat...... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RonB Posted October 6, 2007 Author Share Posted October 6, 2007 It's the same 3500kg Master chassis. Personally I wouldn't consider a vehicle with this payload but I am intrigued on how they have managed it? Ninety kilogrammes is a lot to lose on like for like chassis. It has crossed my mind that they could be using the 5% GVW tolerance to their advantage - but they wouldn't do that would they? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest JudgeMental Posted October 6, 2007 Share Posted October 6, 2007 not really, as John suggested it could be a better designed chassis or indeed a move from aluminum skin/wood frame to GRP skin/aluminum frame. better lightweight furniture etc.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
davenewellhome Posted October 6, 2007 Share Posted October 6, 2007 Aluminium over wood frame is probalby lighter than GRP over wood frame. very few manufacturers use an alloy frame Eddie. D. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roamer Posted October 6, 2007 Share Posted October 6, 2007 Could they be using two water figures - Niesmann & Bischoff Arto spec. state water figures as travelling/ camping at 20/120 litres. I dont know which they use for the payload figure but why have the travelling value!! This allows an immediate 90 kg improvement. [90% of 120 = 108 : 90% of 20 =18 hence 90 less) Helps a great deal with a 3500 Kg chassis but with 4000kg it is less important. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roamer Posted October 6, 2007 Share Posted October 6, 2007 Could they be using two water figures - Niesmann & Bischoff Arto spec. state water figures as travelling/ camping at 20/120 litres. I dont know which they use for the payload figure but why have the travelling value!! This allows an immediate 90 kg improvement. [90% of 120 = 108 : 90% of 20 =18 hence 90 less) Helps a great deal with a 3500 Kg chassis but with 4000kg it is less important. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
colin Posted October 6, 2007 Share Posted October 6, 2007 Adria have a figure for 'essential hab equip' which I think covers water, they don't include this when coming up with user payload, but they hadn't in old 2005 cat I have, so no change there Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
clubadria Posted October 8, 2007 Share Posted October 8, 2007 Hi Ron My name is David and my wife and I try and run the Adria owners club,you have a good point, but there is a answer. The 2006 Vision has a 115 bhp engine and this was replaced due to euro emissions with a updated engine. Vision 115 bhp Vision 136 bhp Unladen Weight 3280 kg Unladen Weight 3320kg user payload 220kg user payload 180kg Total 3500kg Total 3850kg 2007 Vision 120 bhp 2007 Vision 150 bhp Mass in running order 3175kg 3190 kg User payload 325kg 310 kg Total 3500kg 3500kg Also the payload can be uprated to(3850kg) if you have no restrictions also this model is on a al-ko chassis i hope this helps you. Regards David Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RonB Posted October 8, 2007 Author Share Posted October 8, 2007 Thanks for that David. However, the later 120 bhp engine on the 3500kg chassis I would have thought to be no lighter than the original 115 bhp version - I could be wrong of course. Also I cannot find anywhere in the current (2007) Adria brochure that lists an AlKo chassis for this model, only the Renault Master chassis cowl - are you sure on this? Regards Ron Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
clubadria Posted October 9, 2007 Share Posted October 9, 2007 Hello Ron Yes the chassis is al-ko because we have a member with a vision with some issues if you go on another forum (motorhomefacts.com) you will be able to read all about this. But any Adria should know all of your questions in the first place ! Good luck if you are going to the dealers it might pay you to ask these questions and see if they know there product £50.000 is a lot of money to had over. Regards David Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RonB Posted October 9, 2007 Author Share Posted October 9, 2007 You have rather unusual faith in dealers David. Over the years every dealer that I've asked the question "what is the payload on the individual axles" has answered with a blank look! If you read my posting above you will see that I would have no intention of buying a vehicle with these type payload weights, I am just curious. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jjv Posted October 11, 2007 Share Posted October 11, 2007 I am currently looking to buy, and payload is important. Not because I want to load up to the gunnels, I want an adequate margin of safety. Swift group's smallest offering has a margin of 210Kg, add awning and a passenger (you might just want to take one) - you dont have a lot left. I asked a well known dealer about this and was told "dont worry about it, payloads are to do with HGVs, they are the ones police are stopping, they wont check a small motorhome" I give up. When I look at manufacturers brochures, it is not made clear what their quoted MIRO takes into account, I know from this forum, there are different standards they can use to make it look good. I have even phoned customer care departments and been given vague and even wrong info on one occasion. I give up again! Someone on the forum has said that the only way is to take your vehicle to a weighbridge and work it out yourself! - You surely dont think I'm going to buy one and then find out! I am suprised that a manufacturer who sells a motorhome advertised as a 2 berth, but has such a small payload that it cant reasonably support 2 people for a weeks holiday, has not been in court on a "not fit for purpose" rap. Maybe I should just stick with the caravan. Goog luck. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
clubadria Posted October 11, 2007 Share Posted October 11, 2007 It is possible to uprate the chassis on all of the adria to 3850kg on renault and 4000kg on the fiat there is of course a charge for this but at least it give's you an extra 350kg on the standard figure. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RonB Posted October 12, 2007 Author Share Posted October 12, 2007 Your dead right 11V. Adria, for instance, quote an allowance of just 144kg as 'habitation equipment' across their entire low profile range but do not say what this is. As an example just a passenger and a tank of fuel uses up that allowance completely. What about fresh water and gas, which best practice states should be included? That would add around another 140kg to the habitation figure and at the same time lower Adrias stated payload figures by the same amount. I keep quoting Adria here but there are a lots of other examples which make manufacturers published figures a farce and should not be relied upon. Also the above hasn't even broached the subject of individual axle payloads which in some cases is virtually non-existent. Yes, gross vehicle weights can be increased to allow an increased payload but their are penalties to be paid for this including licence, speed and road toll restrictions to name just three. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mel E Posted October 12, 2007 Share Posted October 12, 2007 ClubAdria, The subject of Renault Master payloads has arisen before on this forum. I assume that, if an Alko chassis is involved (though I didn't know there were any for the Renault), then MAM/GVW can possibly be raised above 3500 Kgs. On a plain vanilla Renault chassis (Or Opel/Vauxhall Movano/ Nissan Interstar, all built near Lyons), Renault are adamant that their chassis cannot be plated above 3500 Kgs. I assume what is happening is that the vehicle is being re-plated to the sum of the axle weights (around 3900 for the 120dci engine). Unfortunately this is not approved by Renault (other manufacturers tend to be more compliant) and so brings into question the validity of your insurance in the event of an accident. Mel E ==== Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Archived
This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.