pmitic Posted November 20, 2007 Share Posted November 20, 2007 I am about to import a new van from Urbano (Belgium) and the subject of speedometers and headlights came up. When I enquired about changing to UK spec I was told that this would not be necessary for the registration back in the UK. I proceeded to ring VOSA and they confirmed that an inspection is not an requirement as a motorhome is not classed as a single vehicle import (comerical). He then went on to say that it was legal to drive in the UK with a KMPH speedo and as long as beam benders were used then it would also be acceptable when a MOT became due. This contradicts the threads I have read recently in the forum. Any comments please. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Basil Posted November 20, 2007 Share Posted November 20, 2007 Clearly didn't import properly :-D :-D :-D Hi pmitic perhaps you could retry your post. Bas Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian Kirby Posted November 20, 2007 Share Posted November 20, 2007 Gone to get it already!! :-) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest JudgeMental Posted November 20, 2007 Share Posted November 20, 2007 Errr... I don't think so, you have been badly advised. "construction & use regs" require a MPH speedo. I registered a new van in April (Belgium import) and DVLA insisted on a speedo change. Best to search previous threads on this subject. it all depends on your local DVLA office BUT regs are clear in MPH requirement, whatever happens with the DVLA.office you deal with.... my Ford cost £280 including vat and fitting. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
derek500 Posted November 20, 2007 Share Posted November 20, 2007 pmitic - 2007-11-20 7:01 PM He then went on to say that it was legal to drive in the UK with a KMPH speedo I suppose, being pedantic that is correct. When I drive in the UK with my Spanish registered MH, with only a KPH speedo, I don't think I'm breaking the law. The same goes with my single reversing and fog lights being the wrong way round. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scotchjock Posted November 20, 2007 Share Posted November 20, 2007 I also imported new this year from Belgium. I have registered and am using the vehicle as it was built. My local MoT garage informs me that beam benders are acceptable if the light is deflected correctly. He also stated that a Kph speedo marked with a felt tip marker at 30,40,50,60,70mph equivalent would be acceptable. This has also been echoed by at least two dealers selling LHD imports. The vehicles are for sale with original Kph speedos and with a years Mot. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pmitic Posted November 20, 2007 Author Share Posted November 20, 2007 Judgemental was a little over eager with his response, just because he was ill advised he thinks that all others are. I even have a e-mail from vosa explaining the requirements but he might comment on that unfavourably. If I ask a policeman the way I have faith in is ability to do his job and therfore the same as from the man at VOSA. By the way its bad grammer to reply to a friendly request with the words "Err I don`t think so" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
davenewellhome Posted November 20, 2007 Share Posted November 20, 2007 Hi Paul. Despite what you may feel Judge's response to your query is correct. To register your imported vehicle in this country you will need it to meet construction and use regs. These require a MPH reading speedo where the numbers are visible at night as well as in daytime. The rear fog light also needs to be either on the centre line of the vehicle or the UK offside and the headlights should dip to the left. Your local VOSA/DVLA office might not insist on an inspection but plenty of private importers have had to go through one. D. Oh yes, I don't think you're in any position to condemn other people's grammar. ;-) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scotchjock Posted November 20, 2007 Share Posted November 20, 2007 So why are dealers able to sell second hand imported LHD vehicles with Kph speedos? I can quote several who are doing it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pmitic Posted November 20, 2007 Author Share Posted November 20, 2007 sorry I meant to say bad manners not bad grammer. Do I now ring the person at VOSA and tell him his job or what Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
colin Posted November 20, 2007 Share Posted November 20, 2007 pmitic - 2007-11-20 9:42 PM sorry I meant to say bad manners not bad grammer. Do I now ring the person at VOSA and tell him his job or what Having registered a couple of kit cars I can tell you that you could ring them up and get a different answer every time,(same seems to apply to any gov dept.) it seems when you come to register thats when you find out what you can get away with. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jackal Posted November 20, 2007 Share Posted November 20, 2007 The Judge may be right but I have no intention to change my recently imported/registered LHD model. Insurers may prove my decision foolhardy but in my experience with cars, in the event of a claim, they hardly ever use a fine-toothed comb to check out every detail. What I would say though is, having run mine for a month, I'd watch yourself on the Gatsos and speed cameras. 80KPH may well be easy to remember as 50MPH but I'm always erring on the side of caution on 40MPH and 30MPH. A homemade overlay has been suggested and I may even end up there myself if I get a bit of free time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest JudgeMental Posted November 20, 2007 Share Posted November 20, 2007 davenewell@home - 2007-11-20 9:24 PM Hi Paul. Despite what you may feel Judge's response to your query is correct. To register your imported vehicle in this country you will need it to meet construction and use regs. These require a MPH reading speedo where the numbers are visible at night as well as in daytime. The rear fog light also needs to be either on the centre line of the vehicle or the UK offside and the headlights should dip to the left. Your local VOSA/DVLA office might not insist on an inspection but plenty of private importers have had to go through one. D. Oh yes, I don't think you're in any position to condemn other people's grammar. ;-) Don't worry Dave, as it is becoming the norm on here. People ask for opinion and if the facts don't fit there needs they become insulting. There is a wealth of material on this matter. the DVLA is a postcode lottery, if you want to avoid a DVLA inspection don't go to Wimbledon to register. even then it depends who inspects on the day as to what they say. in my case it was the speedo no mention of headlights and dealer had moved fog lamp which was inspected as well " construction and use regs" require a UK registered vehicle to have MPH speedo. so if unlucky and you need to claim on insurance, don't be surprised if an astute accessor notice's this omission on your part and this could posibly prejudices your claim. these rules obviously do not apply to vehicles registered in other EU countries I saved over £10.000 importing my EuraMobil so £280 was hardly worth worrying about. BUT I waited about 4 weeks getting speedo fitted and finally getting registered. if I had known in advance I could have ordered speedo cluster in advance (with vin no) and had it registered in week of arrival. there was nothing personal; or intentionally misleading in my original post I only wish I had the same advice earlier. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian Kirby Posted November 21, 2007 Share Posted November 21, 2007 scotchjock - 2007-11-20 9:29 PM So why are dealers able to sell second hand imported LHD vehicles with Kph speedos? I can quote several who are doing it. Do you mean legally able, or physically able? The answer to the first is that they are not legally able to do so, and if they do they are breaking the law. The answer to the second is that as dealers they are able to register the vehicles directly onto the DVLA vehicle database. No one inspects, or asks whether they have made the necessary modifications, they are taken on trust. Probably, sometime in the future, someone will notice, wrists will be slapped, and that trust will be selectively withdrawn. Whether the dealers take this chance through ignorance of the requirement, or because it saves them the cost of a UK spec speedo and lights, I hesitate to suggest. Somehow, neither seems to create a very encouraging impression of the competence of the dealers concerned. Just think, you may have to rely on their advice for something important sometime! Hmmmm.Oh yes, it is the registration of the unmodified vehicle that is illegal, and not its use on UK roads. What has been said about using it is correct, it's just that someone signed a declaration that the vehicle complies with UK regs, and it doesn't. Have another read of the registration application form, then check the DoT P15 "How to Import a Vehicle" booklet, and bear in mind that ignorance of the facts provides no legal defence! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derek Uzzell Posted November 21, 2007 Share Posted November 21, 2007 As Brian says, the Department for Transports P15 boklet makes it plain what modifications to an imported vehicle may be necessary. Given the DforT's unambiguous advice (plus the quantity of in-depth research that has been done in the past by forum members), it's startling to me that people will still prefer to believe commercial vendors' contradictory explanations, particularly when it should be blatently obvious that such explanations are in the vendors' own interests. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pmitic Posted November 21, 2007 Author Share Posted November 21, 2007 On further investigation on this matter I have been inforn that the certificate of conformity allows for the uniterupted movement of goods sold within the EU. This eradicates the need for an inspection by VOSA and also allows for the vehicle to pass the MOT in the UK as long as the beam benders are fitted. As for the reversing light matter this is not deemed a problem as car are allowed to have either one or two fitted with no determined position. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mel E Posted November 21, 2007 Share Posted November 21, 2007 pmitic, I'm afraid Dave Newell is absolutely correct. I suspect you also misread his post - he was clearly referring to rear high intensity fog lamps and not to reversing lamps. The information you have on MoTs is, however correct. A LHD vehicle can legally pass the MoT using beam benders or masking tape. However to be UK road legal and comply with the UK Road Vehicles Lighting Regulations 1989, as amended, the headlamps are required to have a left side dipping pattern. So you may pass the MoT but your vehicle is not road legal in the UK. This may affect the payout of any insurance policy in the event of an accident, though of course, it may not. At present, the DVLA insists on an inspection (sometimes done by themselves or their agent and sometimes by VOSA) for most personally imported motorhomes. Finally, The Certificate of Conformity (I assume you mean the EC Whole Vehicle Type Approval Certificate or ECWVTA) does not have as wide applicability as your informant suggests. Motorhomes are not required to have one, anyway. And there are plenty of examples of things that do not get free movement across EU boundaries - e.g., alcohol, vehicle fuel, except that contained in the vehicle's fuel tank, tobacco products, and all motor vehicles, on which, uniquely, I believe, VAT must be paid in the country of registration rather than the country of origin, unless they are used vehicles as defined in the laws. Sorry this is such a minfield, but there are people on this forum who really do know what they are talking about. You will always find someone to contradict them, if that is what you seek. I have imported personally myself and have been providing a 10-page two-column Fact Sheet for MMM readers since 1998 - over 500 copies have gone out and I know many who have successfully imported using it and, so far, no-one who has had a serious problem. Have you sorted out the insurance issue for your collection trip back to the UK? Mel E ==== Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pmitic Posted November 21, 2007 Author Share Posted November 21, 2007 As to the insurance yes I have, the seller is issueing a 14 day insurance cover to enable me to 1. use the van for a few days to test everything and 2. to drive back to the UK and register it , for which may be straightforward or not after reading all the threads so far. For those who have taken the time to reply I thankyou. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest JudgeMental Posted November 22, 2007 Share Posted November 22, 2007 I have previously in this tread been criticized and insulted by this chap. I will still post my views for the benefit of all forum members. EU dealer "export plate " insurance is normally third party only, not even fire or theft. if you are comfortable driving a new van back to the UK under these circumstances all well and good. there has been talk for a while regards insurance situation changing and UK insurers being able to issue full cover on Vin number. but I don't think this has yet happened... the alternative's are: ask dealer to drive camper to ferry port, Ostende or Zebrugge? Borrow dealers trade plates and post back on your return. I know 2 Belgium dealers that do this. Have camper transported or driven by specialist transport company. It is also usual to insure your vehicle on Vin nnumber with your UK insurers. then when you return to the UK you are fully and comprehensively insured when you arrive on UK roads. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derek Uzzell Posted November 22, 2007 Share Posted November 22, 2007 Many wise words (and some not quite so wise!) about insurance for personally imported motorhomes on: http://forums.outandaboutlive.co.uk/forums/forums/thread-view.asp?tid=7598&start=1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mel E Posted November 24, 2007 Share Posted November 24, 2007 pmitic, You've never stated whether your purchase is new or used and what it's worth. So you may be quite happy to motor around Europe for 14 days with what amounts to limited Third Party cover only. I'm afraid Judge is dead right. Unless something has changed in the last couple of weeks or so, it simply is not possible to buy Fully Comp insurance in Germany for just 14 days. What you are buying is 14 days' Limited Third Party cover. Just a point: You wouldn't buy a house without understanding all the procedures (Estate Agent, Mortgage, Solicitor, Searches, HIPP) before you started. Yet you appear to have bought the second most expensive thing you'll ever buy without doing much research in advance. Then when you ask for help on this forum, you seem awfully ready to dismiss any information you get. Incidentally, of the list of dealers close to the coast that I have prepared for buyers, Urbano is the ONLY one about which I have had negative feedback and it's mainly been at the post-sales stage when all those promises come up for delivery. Mel E ==== Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest JudgeMental Posted November 24, 2007 Share Posted November 24, 2007 on the subject of using dealers trade plates: I had arranged for dealers to drive camper to Ostende approx a 40 min journey. But when I arrived at dealer he had put trade plates on, he handed me a document folder of insurance details and assured me he had cleared this with his insurers. I traveled back on these terms. even if I had to pay dealer to arrange one of his staff to drive to port I doubt that it would have been prohibitive. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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