cyclistkeith Posted November 21, 2007 Share Posted November 21, 2007 Hi I am new to the world of motorhomes and after some advice, so thanks to anyone who takes the time to read this and reply! I want to buy a vehicle (new or used) and have a budget of £31k. My needs are for it to sleep to adults and 2 kids and a decent sized Garage, I've no PX or need for finance so what and who should I buy from? Trade or Private sale!!! It seems dealers ar finding it slow, but the ones I have spoken to all wnat top dollar windscreen prices! I have looked at a few Cahaussons (Oddessy 92 on a 54 plate and a New Welcome model) A Geist Spirit 6650 and even thought of a new Swift 650G. Can anyone lay any advice my way! Many thanks, Keith Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
carioca Posted November 21, 2007 Share Posted November 21, 2007 hi keith & welcome how about a ci carioca 656 this has bunk beds across the rear for your kids front dinette with 2 belted travel seats, garage in rear can be used a half locker or full garage. full garage requires bottom bunk to be raised up revealing a space large enough for a scooter or a couple of pushbikes, or with bunk down permanant storage for outdoor table & chairs or whatever. not too expensive either (lol) (lol) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest 656 Posted November 21, 2007 Share Posted November 21, 2007 The 656 has 4 belts in the rear. 2 lap facing the rear and 2 full facing forward. You could get a pre facelift model for about 25k new - old price 28K. Mine does about 28 mpg @36mph. I paid 28k for mine last year and then spent 7k on extras. Yours for 30k Dave 656 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MandyAndy Posted November 21, 2007 Share Posted November 21, 2007 We have a Roller Team 600G also made by Trigano, it is on a Transit base, RWD with twin wheels. Large garage, 6 belted seats, fixed beds for 5 easily (we can get 3 kids laid feet to the front with room to spare). Separate shower, huge fridge freezer, we also had external gas point fitted with refillable tanks, BBQ point fitted to outer wall, SOG unit fitted and 4.5 meter awning. Got it new in March 30k, + extras from Geoff Cox, Derby, excellent small company run by family members so you always know who you will be contacting. Hope this helps Mandy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
panagah Posted November 21, 2007 Share Posted November 21, 2007 well we have the earlier 656 and have really enjoyed having it. How ever it depends on what size you want. I like the swift that you mention and have had a sneaky look my self. I was not quite tempted but thought it a nice van. It's slightly longer than the 656 carioca5. It also depends on what you want. If you want a new(ish) van there are plenty of decent quality budjet vans. However if alleged superior build quality was something thats important to you 30k is going to get you something 5-10 years old. What we done when we brought ours was to list what was absoloutly needed, then what we could do with out. stand by your guns for what you want if it is on your list. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest JudgeMental Posted November 21, 2007 Share Posted November 21, 2007 If happy with a LHD import a EuraMobil 660HB is within budget. http://www.euramobil.de/_produkte2008/profila_alkoven_start.html link is is to German site only as translated link to long to post here. just click on flag, bottom left for translated page Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jackal Posted November 21, 2007 Share Posted November 21, 2007 Keith, Save loads and import. With a lot of help from this forum, I did. It's not just about the money you'll save but more about getting a better van than you could afford, if you settle for haggling with a dealer over here. LHD or RHD is immaterial as you're higher up anyway and will probably use the van both here and abroad. Take it from me, if I can do it, anyone can. Do your research, decide on a van whose base van and accommodation suit your current and future needs, price it abroad (Belgium, France, Germany) establish contact with a dealer and although the rest may seem daunting, it really isn't. Our van would have cost us £42000 here but we got it for £32000 inclusive of all costs, abroad. A no brainer, really! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hughmer Posted November 21, 2007 Share Posted November 21, 2007 Hi there I'm surprised no one has mentioned payload yet, I don't have the means just now to check the vehicles you've been looking at so I don't know if you have already considered this. If not think carefully about the weight of things you'll be carrying in th garage+ passengers, toys etc. You may find your choice of vehicle is limited by the payload available. I don't have kids but I do have a motorbikeand a few other indispensables and find that with a full cargo of wine (as well) on the way back from France 1 ton of payload is just about right. This means I need a 4.5 ton truck. So I had to choose a model with 4 wheels at the back. I could have gone Alko double axle, but finally chose a MB 412 based Hymer (S660 with garage 2nd hand year 2000 which I imported from Germany) Good luck. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest JudgeMental Posted November 22, 2007 Share Posted November 22, 2007 My EuraMobil is 3500kg. I am diabetic and on a restricted license. we are a family of 4 (2 adults and 2 adult sized teenagers). when we go away. we carry all the stuff I have been carrying for years. 4 bikes, table chairs beach stuff small fridge/freezer . books, pc, laptop etc..... and we still manage to stay legal. my van is 6.6 m long. lightweight and GRP construction, 450 kg payload (before extras) 2 kingsize beds, massive garage, fully winterised with doublefloor. roof air and other extras. Not everyone has the choice of going for heavier vans or wants to. and it is possible to manage if you buy a modern vehicle with a reasonable payload.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hughmer Posted November 22, 2007 Share Posted November 22, 2007 As Judge says: heavier trucks are not everyone's cup of tea. I preferred zipping along at 70 mph in my old 3.3 ton Burstner. The heavier truck is much more ponderous and I'm very aware of how much more fuel it drinks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cyclistkeith Posted November 22, 2007 Author Share Posted November 22, 2007 Thanks for very much for some very interesting replies! I'm a cyclist who races at a pretty high level and I want a van to make traveling to events a little more comfortable when I take my family! Perhaps the odd weekend away as well as an occasional forray to Europe would be my plan. In terms of weight at the moment, I think it is more space I need! At the top end Bikes & Wheels are pretty light, just bulky. Today I took a day off and vistied a few dealers in the North, (Barrons, Ropers, Campbells etc.....) and saw some nice vans, with salesmen attempting to lure me into spending up to £38/40k and now I'm even more confused, I though car garages were difficult! I was struck that initially none want to discount the screen price by more than a grand, and I'm a cash buyer with no PX! Importing sounds interesting, I race in Belgium so perhaps I may look that way. And as for New Swift 650G (If I can commit to £35k) ticks most of the right boxes, althouh a Lunar @ £37k (I forget the model) I saw ticks all of them!! I'm feeling a bit all 8-) now! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thai Bry Posted November 22, 2007 Share Posted November 22, 2007 Importing sounds interesting, I race in Belgium so perhaps I may look that way.There are a couple of motorhome dealers who are based in near Belgium and they advertise in the MMM.RegardsThai Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clive Posted November 23, 2007 Share Posted November 23, 2007 We are going to look and test drive some FRANKIA models with garages on Saturday at Spinney Motorhomes in Cheshire. I understand that the best prices for Frankia are in the UK whereas the best prices for Hymer / Niesman are in Belgium / Germany. We shall see! C. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ike Posted November 23, 2007 Share Posted November 23, 2007 this is probably a silly question but here goes. If you buy from abroad what happens if, god forbid!, any problems arise. It was bad enough for us having to go from Glasgow to Preston when we bought from Campbells. Or do the big manufacturers have an arrangement with dealers in uk? We may be changing our van next year so such info would be useful. Thanks ike Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clive Posted November 23, 2007 Share Posted November 23, 2007 I understand that if the van was purchased within the EU then the manufacturers representatives in this country are obliged by their contract with the manufacturer to act on their behalf. On the other hand they won,t like you purchasing a van abroad and saving say 20% of the UK purchase price. Some van manufacturers have an EU wide price for their vans. Some don,t. You might ask why? But you can deal with a fair bit of minor warranty issues for a 20% discount. Its your money and its your choice. The UK distributors would rather you get very worried and stick to purchasing in the UK. Others on here will tell you it is not such a big deal if you do it right. Mel Eastburn has put together a document that lays out what to do and hopefully he will pop up and invite you to PM him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest JudgeMental Posted November 23, 2007 Share Posted November 23, 2007 ike - 2007-11-23 11:12 AM this is probably a silly question but here goes. If you buy from abroad what happens if, god forbid!, any problems arise. It was bad enough for us having to go from Glasgow to Preston when we bought from Campbells. Or do the big manufacturers have an arrangement with dealers in uk? We may be changing our van next year so such info would be useful. Thanks ike have brought van back to Belgium on two occasions. once for warranty work and once for awning replacement (my fault) I live in London so 1.5 hrs to tunnel and 1.5 hrs to dealer. last time (half term) we went on a Friday, spent day at dealer and 3 nights in the wonderful city of Brugge. I probably saved with extras 12k or so on UK price. so happy to do this when necessary. brownhills (EuraMobil UK dealer) are about 3 hrs drive away anyway. I think Belgium a better bet then Germany for this reason. another way, you can have warranty work done here and claim cost back from manufacturer. obviously will have to be agreed first. also possible to get UK agent to do work but I would rather not deal with them.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian Kirby Posted November 23, 2007 Share Posted November 23, 2007 ike - 2007-11-23 11:12 AM this is probably a silly question but here goes. If you buy from abroad what happens if, god forbid!, any problems arise. It was bad enough for us having to go from Glasgow to Preston when we bought from Campbells. Or do the big manufacturers have an arrangement with dealers in uk? We may be changing our van next year so such info would be useful. Thanks ike IkeIt is not a silly question, and the answer falls into two parts.First, if there is a problem with the base vehicle you should be OK. Fiat, Ford etc all provide quite good Europe wide warranties on their vans, so if the problem is mechanical you shouldn't run into difficulty wherever you happen to be. The only issue is that most UK warranties on offer are for 3 years (but with years 3, and possibly 2, insurance backed with somewhat reduced cover) whereas the standard Euro warranty seems to be two years backed by the base vehicle manufacturer. You pays your money etc!Then there is the converter's (Hymer, Burstner etc) warranty. Mainly, the valuable bit of this is a 5/6 year water ingress warranty. Provided annual (chargeable) ingress checks are undertaken and recorded in the warranty book, water ingress problems will be rectified under warranty. The problem arises, by whom? If your van is leaking, you'll want it fixed. What you'll pobably find is that most UK dealers for the converter will baulk at carrying out the warranty work. The reason is that they haven't had the profit on the sale, and most seem to complain that the hourly rates reimbursed by the converters don't equate to their commercial hourly rates. They regard this as a loss, which to an accountant it is, so they are liable to make excuses and hope you'll go elsewhere. You can't force them to act, because you have no contract with them, and the warranty is merely an extra contractual offer by the manufacturer. Therefore, your best bet overall, is to return the van to the dealer from whom you bought it. If you buy in Europe, you'll buy a LHD van, presumably because you intend spending a good deal of your time outside the UK. Provided you don't buy from too geographically remote a dealer, therefore, (which is a good idea for reasons I'll come to) returning the van to them for its annual ingress check - which is when any leakage is most likely to be spotted - say during a holiday trip, shouldn't be too much of a fag. If they do find a leak when checking, the worst you may suffer is some loss of use and an extra trip to get the work done, with possibly the need to return home via alternative means in the meantime. This may sound daunting, and it could happen, but they only offer 5/6 year warranties because they are fairly confident it won't leak in that timescale! Therefore it is a risk, but a fairly remote one. By using the foreign dealership in this way you maintain a relationship and, as he's the one who took the profit on the sale, problems and quibbles should be minimised.The odd thing is that whereas nearly all the equipment in motorhomes comes from a small group of manufacturers (Dometic, Truma, SMEV etc), all represented in UK, and all offering their own individual warranties, their standard warranty is for 12 months. Most seem happy to deal with customers direct on matters of warranty provided evidence of the date of purchase can be provided. However, the Germans, bless them, seem to have enacted legislation that requires the converter to warrant the finished product in the same terms as the base vehicle manufacturer. Since the base vehicles sold in Germany seem mainly to have a 24 months manufacturer's warranty, the vans from Germany seem to come with 24 month's warranty on all the installed equipment as well: the first year being backed by the equipment manufacturer, and the second year (at least in theory) having to be backed by the converter himself. How equipment defects arising in year two are actually handled I know not, but it seems another good reason for going back to the selling dealer for all those checks!The reason for not going too far from the Channel to buy, is that the return trip home with your new van is almost impossible to insure. You cannot, at present, buy any insurance for the new van (because it has not been registered in UK) until it actually arrives in the UK. This leaves quite a problem for that part of your journey back falling in mainland Europe. It is possible to obtain temporary export insurance in Germany, but this seems only to offer only the most basic form of third party cover. Thus, fire, theft and accident damage are uninsured, and at your risk. I believe any such insurance is unobtainable in France. From the UK channel port (or chunnel terminal) to your home is OK, and can be dealt with by insuring against the chassis No or VIN.There are at least 4 ways around this:1) Pay to have the van transported to the port. Can be expensive!2) Get the dealer to drive it to the port on his insurance. Done as part of the deal, potentially free, and some dealers in Belgium, and a couple at least in France, are fully familiar with the requirement!3) Borrow trade plates from the dealer and drive it home yourself (but I have no knowledge of what degree of insurance this would provide as you are not a member of the dealer's staff, are not a national of that country, and are not in the motor trade). However, this is potentially free, subject to the insurance caveat above.4) Buy through a UK intermediary, such as Bundesvan, who will assist you with choosing, bring the van back for you, register it, and deliver it to your home. This costs less than 1, but there is inevitably some extra expense for their time. However, you still make the lion's share of the saving between UK and mainland European prices, and you pay them in Sterling, so the exchange rate risk can be minimised and you won't need to open a Euro account. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ike Posted November 24, 2007 Share Posted November 24, 2007 Brian Thank you for taking the time to provide such a comprehensive reply to my (not silly) question. It has certainly provided us with much food for thought. If we ever go down that particular route I know where to come to for advice! Thanks again ike Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maddie Posted November 25, 2007 Share Posted November 25, 2007 Hi Keith, I have my Adria 660sp LHD for sale. It is the Jubilee edition so has many extra's. Has a big luton and double fixed bed, which means a huge garage. Please PM me and will send you more info and pictures. Cost £33.500 ono Kind regards Maddie Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mel B Posted November 25, 2007 Share Posted November 25, 2007 Make sure you measure the garage height carefully to make sure your bikes will fit in. We've got a Rimor Sailer 645TC with a fixed transverse rear bed but it has the lower version, not the normal high bed, consequently we can't put the mountain bikes in as they are, we have to remove the front wheels (quick release) which drops their height down sufficiently to get them in, they then stand on their rear wheel and the front forks, no problem and we just strap them in to the rear wall. We are more than happy that the bed is that bit lower as it makes getting in/out better for us, as we knew this from the start when we bought it, it wasn't a nasty surprises but for some it might be a bit too much hassle. You can also get securing racks for bikes inside garages, like the ones that go on the rear of the motorhome but are meant for inside a garage instead, worth considering again for your more expensive bikes as they won't bash together in transit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clive Posted November 25, 2007 Share Posted November 25, 2007 The Frankia 8400 QD we looked at had a garage door 48 inches tall. It weighs about 3.9 tonne and is on a 5 tonne chassis. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jonimac Posted November 26, 2007 Share Posted November 26, 2007 Keith, you've had some marvellous advice which is what I had when I sought it when buying my first motorhome in September. Please treat mine as a newcomer by comparison. We bought a CI Carioca 694 from Barrons Northwest. It is a 4 berth with a fixed bed. It cost us just a bit more than your budget but we had an awning fitted and also purchased a Safari Room to go with it. Incidentally the Safari Room has been fantastic. The bit that you may be interested in is that the 694 comes readily equipped with brackets for a cycle rack. So far so good for us newcomers, we've done over 1000 miles already and are getting a little more adept beach journey. Anyway, good luck and keep asking for advice. People here are most obliging. John Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian Kirby Posted November 26, 2007 Share Posted November 26, 2007 Since John mentioned bike racks, and also since your post implies a fairly hig spec bike - I really wouldn't put a decent bike on a rear rack. There is an obvious security issue, which for £1,000 plus bikes is a consideration, but the thing no-one ever seems to tell you about bikes on rear racks, is that they get absolutely plastered with everything the van hoovers up from the road as it travels! Even covered with a dedicated waterproof cover, and even after we'd "tailored" ours to a snug fit and closed most of the bottom of the bag, the bikes still emerged covered in dirt and fine grit. If it's wet, water, in the form of spray, seems to be drawn up into the bag and coats everything, and if it's dry it's dust that sucks up into the bag and coats anything and everything: so brakes, gearchanges, chains, blocks, cables and all else would need cleaning before your bike was in competitive race condition. I think carrying it internally, in a boot, as you originally stated, really is the only practical way to go. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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